Is there a sabbath day for Christians?

[prove-all]

Re: Sabbath

Where is that command for Christians--Gentile Christians?


Nowhere.


.

the lords supper was done [on passover] back then.

1 Corinthians 11:20 (KJV)
When ye come together therefore into one place,
this is not to eat the Lord's supper.


a [new testement] not a new covenent, Jesus changed [the symbles], not the day.
and because of sheading his blood, [A Feast ] is commanded to be keep.

an this would be the first day of unleavened bread, now not to remove bread you eat.
one symble now is commanded to remove false doctrine[test and prove everything].

1Co 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you,
That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:

1Co 11:24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat:
this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

1Co 11:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped,
saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it,
in remembrance of me.

referring back to this...

Luk 22:15 And he said unto them, With desire I have desired to eat
this passover with you before I suffer: For I say unto you, I will not
any more eat thereof, until it be fulfilled in the kingdom of God.
Luk 22:17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said,
Take this, and divide it among yourselves:

Luk 22:18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine,
until the kingdom of God shall come.

Luk 22:19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them,
saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Luk 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying,
This cup is [the new testament] in my blood, which is shed for you.

Do what in remembrance of me? They were taking the Passover.
The Passover service also consists of the foot washing...

Joh 13:12 So after he had washed their feet, and had taken his garments,
and was set down again, he said unto them, Know ye what I have done to you?
Joh 13:13 Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.
Joh 13:14 If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet;
ye also ought to wash one another's feet.

Joh 13:15 For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.
Joh 13:16 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord;
neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him.

Joh 13:17 If ye know these things, happy are ye if ye do them.
and then Paul says this...

1Co 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth
the whole lump? Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump,
as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

1Co 5:8 Therefore let us [keep the feast],
not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness;
but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

And he said that to a Gentile church, to keep the feast of unleavened bread.

Nowhere is a Sunday morning Ishtar sunrise service taught in scripture
but the Passover and the Days of Unleavened Bread are taught.



sunday was [the first day of the week] to do [manual labor].


please give me one verse in the new testement that says
sunday was now the day of rest instead of the Sabbath.


http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...servers-nightmare-rather-than-proof-text.html

 

[prove-all]

the apostles keep this feast, commanded by Jesus, in rememberance of [His] sacrifice


Acts 12:3 (KJV)

And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also.
(Then were the days of unleavened bread.)

Acts 20:6 (KJV)
And we sailed away from Philippi after (the days of unleavened bread),
and came unto them to Troas in five days; where we abode seven days.

we are told to keep the feast day, first day of unleavened bread once a year.
we see that they even keep the whole week of festival

 

[prove-all]

Daniel 2 a vision of a great image representing four successive kingdoms.
History proves these to be the Chaldean Empire, followed by the Persian,
then the Greco-Macedonian, and finally the Roman Empire.

1 head of gold. Chaldean Empire. (626 BC-539 b.c)
Neo-Babylonian Empire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Babylonian_Empire

2 breast and arms of silver Medo-Persian Empire (550-330 b.c.)
Achaemenid Empire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achaemenid_Empire

3 belly and thighs of brass greco-macedonia-Alexander the Great (336-323 b.c.)
Alexander the Great https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_the_Great

4 the two legs of iron roman empire-capitals Rome and Constantinople.(31 b.c.-a.d. 476)
Roman Empire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Empire-


These four were to continue right up to the Second Coming of Jesus Christ.

Daniel 7, the prophet describes four beasts, representing four Gentile kingdoms,
but with special attention on the fourth—the Roman Empire.

This beast has 10 horns, which says “are ten kings that shall arise”
out of, or after, the Roman Empire (verse 24).

Daniel also describes a “little horn” which grew among the 10 horns
and uprooted the first three (verse 8).

The meaning of this prophecy is made plain in the book of Revelation.

in Revelation 13 discusses one beast—which represents the fourth, the Roman Empire.
John lived during the rule of the Roman Empire when he wrote the book of Revelation,
he had little to say about the three previous kingdoms. They were already fulfilled prophecy!

a beast with seven heads and 10 horns, one head of which received a deadly wound.

Historians agree that the Roman Empire existed from 31 b.c. to a.d. 476,
at which point the kingdom was crushed. It died. But its deadly wound was
healed as prophesied.

to be 10 resurrections to come out of that Roman Empire (just as Daniel said),
the first three of which were plucked up by the roots by the “little horn”

—suggesting that they were not altogether Roman, but nevertheless ruled within
the ancient Roman territory after the empire collapsed. And that’s what happened.



(first 3 horns)The three horns picture three governments
(the Heruli, the Vandals and the Ostrogoths)
and he shall subdue three kings.

Heruli - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia,
Vandals - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia,
Ostrogoths - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia,

they where not riden by the church
not of rome but in its territory

The VANDALS
A.D. 429-533
The HERULI,
Odoacer’s government,
A.D. 476-493
The OSTROGOTHS
A.D. 493-554

Three barbaric tribes did rule in the region before Justinian restored
the Roman Empire in a.d. 554 and effectively healed the deadly wound.

(4th horn) a “little horn”—a great false church
coming on the scene after three horns are plucked up.

I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints,
and prevailed against them;

The great church guided every succeeding resurrection of this Roman Empire
The last seven horns comprise a church-state relationship,

Holy Roman Empire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
the(un)holy Roman Empire, which began in a.d. 554—led by Justinian,
in Revelation 17

a beast with seven heads, but none of these heads is wounded.
a woman,the Bible symbolizes as a church, is riding the beast.
the little horn,given crown and white robe[false church]

She is called a whore in verse 1, and therefore symbolizes a great false church
which rides, or heavily influences, this political beast.

When Justinian recognized the supremacy of the pope in 554, the Roman Empire
was revived. And because of its close association with the great false church,
this empire eventually assumed the name Holy Roman Empire.

Counting Justinian’s empire, there have been six major, historically documented
resurrections of the so-called Holy Roman Empire—all of which have been heavily

the 7 unholy roman empire unions

The last seven heads, or resurrections, were prophesied to be guided by a great church.
That is how church and state get the name “Holy” Roman Empire.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Emperor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronation_of_the_Holy_Roman_Emperor

1st resurrection of the roman empire

Justinian in 554AD. the pope recognized as the supreme religious leader and empowered him.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justinian_I

Justinian the Great, was a Byzantine (East Roman) emperor from 527 to 565. During his reign,
Justinian sought to revive the empire's greatness and reconquer
the lost western half of the historical Roman Empire.

The cognomen Iustinianus which he took later is indicative of adoption by his uncle Justin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognomen

2nd resurrection - Charlemagne crowned by the pope in 800AD.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlemagne

Charlemagne reached the height of his power in 800 when he was crowned "emperor"
by Pope Leo III on Christmas Day at Old St. Peter's Basilica.

Called the "Father of Europe", Charlemagne united most of Western Europe
for the first time since the Roman Empire.

3rd resurrection - Otto the Great crowned by the pope in 962AD.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_I,_Holy_Roman_Emperor

Otto I (23 November 912 – 7 May 973), also known as Otto the Great, was German king
from 936 and emperor of the Holy Roman Empire from 962 until his death in 973.

Following the example of Charlemagne's coronation as "Emperor of the Romans"
in 800, Otto was crowned Emperor in 962 by Pope John XII in Rome.

4th resurrection - Charles V crowned by the pope in 1520AD.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_V,_Holy_Roman_Emperor

5th resurrection - Napoleon crowned by the pope in 1805
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon_I
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronation_of_Napoleon_I


6th resurrection - Hitler/Mussolini empowered by Pope Pius XII.

When Benito Mussolini became the Italian leader before World War ii,
he called his regime the Holy Roman Empire
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benito_Mussolini

As Benito Mussolini’s grip on Italy tightened during the 1920s,
he proclaimed the Holy Roman Empire restored.

In February 1929, Mussolini signed a pact with the Vatican, making Roman Catholicism
the only recognized religion in fascist Italy.

This agreement, known as the Lateran Treaty, delighted Pope Pius xi,
who spoke of Mussolini as “a man sent by Providence.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lateran_Treaty

The agreements included a political treaty which created the state of the Vatican City
and guaranteed full and independent sovereignty to the Holy See.

Mussolini commissioned the Via della Conciliazione (Road of the Conciliation),
which would symbolically link the Vatican City to the heart of Rome.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Pius_XII_and_the_Holocaust
Some post-war critics have accused Pius of either being overly cautious, or of "not doing enough,"
or even of "silence" in the face of the Holocaust.
hitler/mussolini empowered by pope pius xii - Bing images
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust

7th resurrection - forming in Europe now.

 

[prove-all]

the sabbath day

In the seventh chapter of the book of Daniel, the 25th verse of this prophecy,
it is stated that this hierarchy shall “think to change times and laws.”
Students of prophecy recognize this “little horn” as a great religious hierarchy.

Out of the original Roman Empire, symbolized by 10 “horns” growing out of the head
of a “beast,” are pictured the 10 resurrections of the Roman Empire that have continued
since its fall to the present, and are scheduled to continue until the coming of Christ.

How Time Was Changed

This same power is mentioned again in the 17th chapter of Revelation, here pictured
as ruling over the kings and kingdoms of the Earth, persecuting the true saints.

In every possible manner, this power has changed time!

God begins the days at sunset, but “the little horn” has changed it so the world now
begins the day in the middle of the night by a man-made watch.

God begins the week with the ending of the true Sabbath, the seventh day of the week,
but the world begins the working week in the middle of the night, the second day of the week.

God begins the months with the new moons, but this “little horn” has induced the world
to begin the months according to a clumsy man-made calendar of heathen origin.

God begins the year in the early spring, when new life is budding in nature everywhere,
but ancient heathen Rome caused the world to begin the year in the middle of dead winter.

God gave His children a true rest day, designed to keep them continually in the knowledge
and true worship of the true God—a memorial of God’s creation—the seventh day of the week.

 

[prove-all]

Passover-Easter question

Polycarp and Passover-Easter question

After the death of the apostle John, a disciple of his, Polycarp,
waged a controversy over the Passover-Easter question with the
bishop of Rome, by then leader of the church started by Simon.

Still later, another disciple of Christ’s true Christianity,
Polycrates, waged a still hotter controversy over the same
Passover-Easter question with another bishop of Rome.

This theological battle was called the Quartodeciman Controversy.
Polycrates contended, as Jesus and the original apostles taught,

that the Passover should be observed in the new Christian form
introduced by Jesus and by the apostle Paul (1 Corinthians 11),

using unleavened bread and wine instead of sacrificing a lamb,
on the eve of the 14th Nisan (first month in the sacred calendar,
occurring in the spring).

But [the Rome church] insisted that it be observed on a Sunday.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quartodecimanism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easter_controversy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polycarp
he was a disciple of John the Apostle

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polycrates_of_Ephesus

 

[prove-all]

Re: Passover-Easter question

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sol_Invictus


Sol Invictus ("Unconquered Sun") was the official sun god of the later Roman Empire
and a patron of soldiers.

In 274 AD the Roman emperor Aurelian made it an official cult alongside the traditional Roman cults.

Scholars disagree about whether the new deity was a refoundation of the ancient Latin cult of Sol,[SUP][1][/SUP]
a revival of the cult of Elagabalus[SUP][2][/SUP] or completely new.[SUP][3][/SUP] The god was favored by emperors after
Aurelian and appeared on their coins until Constantine I.[SUP][4][/SUP] The last inscription referring to Sol Invictus
dates to AD 387,[SUP][5][/SUP] and there were enough devotees in the 5th century that Augustine found it necessary to preach against them.[SUP][6][/SUP]



The tradition, dating from the 12th century,[SUP][7][/SUP] that the near-solstice date of 25 December for Christmas
was selected because it was the date of the Roman festival of Dies Natalis Solis Invicti
(Birthday of the Unconquered Sun)


Both theories have supporters, with some claiming that the festival of Dies Natalis Solis Invicti was
later syncretized with Christmas[SUP][10][/SUP][SUP][11][/SUP][SUP][12][/SUP] and others saying that the Christian celebration may predate
the festival of the Dies Natalis Solis Invicti.[SUP][13][/SUP][SUP][14][/SUP]

 

[prove-all]

On 7 March 321, Constantine I, Rome's first Christian Emperor (see Constantine I and Christianity),
decreed that Sunday would be observed as the Roman day of rest:[5]


On [the venerable Day of the Sun] let the magistrates and people residing in cities rest,
and let all workshops be closed.

- so now a sabbath keeper can not sell items in the market, on the first work day of the week


In the country, however, persons engaged in agriculture may freely and lawfully continue their pursuits; because it often happens that another day is not so suitable for grain-sowing or vine-planting; lest by neglecting the proper moment for such operations the bounty of heaven should be lost.[6]


In 363, Canon 29 of the Council of Laodicea prohibited observance of
the Jewish Sabbath (Saturday), and encouraged Christians to work on
the Saturday and rest on the false Lord's Day (Sunday).

 

[prove-all]

Re: easter verses passover

The Origins of Easter sunrise service- from before rome

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Rite

Antiquity of the Roman Mass
It is still redolent of that liturgy, of the days when Caesar ruled the world
and thought he could stamp out the faith of Christ, when our fathers met together
before dawn and sang a hymn to Christ as to a God.


Ecumenical council - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
were convoked by Christian Roman Emperors, who also enforced the decisions
of those councils within the state church of the Roman Empire.


Another result of the council was an agreement on when to celebrate Easter
which is simply stated:

We also send you the good news of the settlement concerning the holy pasch, namely
that in answer to your prayers this question also has been resolved. All the brethren
in the East who have hitherto followed the Jewish practice will henceforth observe

the custom of the Romans and of yourselves and of all of us (who from ancient times)
have kept Easter together with you.[13]

- was changed to easter to observe a roman custume that dates way before
Christ born of a virgin , they did everything they could to stamp out or
incorperate into roman ways and change Gods.

Because the celebration of Easter was tied to the spring equinox,

-the Roman Catholic Church considered this steady drift in the date of Easter undesirable
Roman calendar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Julian calendar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
by Julius Caesar in 46 BC, was a reform of the Roman calendar.

Gregorian calendar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The calendar was a refinement in 1582 to the Julian calendar

The motivation for the reform was to bring the date for the celebration of Easter
to the time of the year in which the First Council of Nicaea had agreed upon in 325.

-The Phoenician name was Astarte, the wife of the sun god,
Astarte - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Baal, the worship of whom is continually denounced in
the Bible as the most abominable of all pagan idolatry (1 Kings 22:53;

-and is a mystery going way back to the tower
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assur
a remnant city of the last Ashurite Kingdom.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marduk

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utu
Utu is the god of the sun, justice, application of law, and the lord of truth.

The Phoenician name was Astarte, the wife of the sun god,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astarte

Baal, the worship of whom is continually denounced in
the Bible as the most abominable of all pagan idolatry (1 Kings 22:53;

Ashteroth Karnaim was a city in the land of Bashan east of the Jordan River,
mentioned in Genesis 14:5 and Joshua 12:4
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashteroth_Karnaim

The name translates literally to 'Ashteroth of the Horns', with 'Ashteroth'
being a Canaanite fertitility goddess and 'horns' being symbolic of mountain pe

the title "Queen of heaven" as mentioned in Jeremiah has been connected
with both. (In later Jewish mythology, she became a female demon of lust;
for what seems to be the use of the Hebrew plural form ?Aštaro? in this sense,
see Astaroth).


“Sunday is our mark or authority...the church is above the Bible,
and this tranference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact.”
Catholic Record of London, Ontario, September 1, 1923.

 

[sparkman]

Re: Sabbath

Where is that command for Christians--Gentile Christians?


Nowhere.


.

You are correct. None. It was never on any of the sin lists of the Gentiles, neither did Paul provide any instructions to the Gentile congregations on either that or clean/unclean meat laws.

 

[Gigantor]

Re: Sabbath

Of course it is your choice regarding keeping or not the Saturday Sabbath. Yashua commanded us to keep the Sabbath and he hallowed it (made it Holy). Yashua and his disciples kept the Saturday Sabbath.

The Sabbath commandment contains elements not contained in any of the other commandments. It states the name of the Lawgiver (Yehovah), His territory (heaven and Earth), and His title (Creator). These three components comprise what is known as a seal, and lend authority to the law. The Ten Commandments gain their validity only from the royal seal of the Creator God embodied in the Sabbath commandment. Taking away the Sabbath is the legal act of dismissing Yehovah's authority.

 

[sparkman]

Re: Sabbath

Of course it is your choice regarding keeping or not the Saturday Sabbath. Yashua commanded us to keep the Sabbath and he hallowed it (made it Holy). Yashua and his disciples kept the Saturday Sabbath.

The Sabbath commandment contains elements not contained in any of the other commandments. It states the name of the Lawgiver (Yehovah), His territory (heaven and Earth), and His title (Creator). These three components comprise what is known as a seal, and lend authority to the law. The Ten Commandments gain their validity only from the royal seal of the Creator God embodied in the Sabbath commandment. Taking away the Sabbath is the legal act of dismissing Yehovah's authority.

So, are you claiming that keeping the Sabbath is required for salvation? It certainly seems like it.

 

[Euphemia]

Re: Sabbath

the lords supper was done [on passover] back then.

1 Corinthians 11:20 (KJV)
When ye come together therefore into one place,
this is not to eat the Lord's supper.


a [new testement] not a new covenent, Jesus changed [the symbles], not the day.
and because of sheading his blood, [A Feast ] is commanded to be keep.

an this would be the first day of unleavened bread, now not to remove bread you eat.
one symble now is commanded to remove false doctrine[test and prove everything].

1Co 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you,
That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:

1Co 11:24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat:
this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

1Co 11:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped,
saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it,
in remembrance of me.

referring back to this...

Luk 22:15 And he said unto them, With desire I have desired to eat
this passover with you before I suffer: For I say unto you, I will not
any more eat thereof, until it be fulfilled in the kingdom of God.
Luk 22:17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said,
Take this, and divide it among yourselves:

Luk 22:18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine,
until the kingdom of God shall come.

Luk 22:19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them,
saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Luk 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying,
This cup is [the new testament] in my blood, which is shed for you.

Do what in remembrance of me? They were taking the Passover.
The Passover service also consists of the foot washing...

Joh 13:12 So after he had washed their feet, and had taken his garments,
and was set down again, he said unto them, Know ye what I have done to you?
Joh 13:13 Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.
Joh 13:14 If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet;
ye also ought to wash one another's feet.

Joh 13:15 For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.
Joh 13:16 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord;
neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him.

Joh 13:17 If ye know these things, happy are ye if ye do them.
and then Paul says this...

1Co 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth
the whole lump? Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump,
as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

1Co 5:8 Therefore let us [keep the feast],
not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness;
but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

And he said that to a Gentile church, to keep the feast of unleavened bread.

Nowhere is a Sunday morning Ishtar sunrise service taught in scripture
but the Passover and the Days of Unleavened Bread are taught.



sunday was [the first day of the week] to do [manual labor].


please give me one verse in the new testement that says
sunday was now the day of rest instead of the Sabbath.


http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...servers-nightmare-rather-than-proof-text.html

The church to which the Sabbath was spoken about was not all Gentile. There were many Jewish converts.

God doesn't intend for us top follow ancient laws for Israel. We are free in Christ, for Jesus is our Sabbath...we rest in Him.


.

 

[sparkman]

Re: Sabbath

The church to which the Sabbath was spoken about was not all Gentile. There were many Jewish converts.

God doesn't intend for us top follow ancient laws for Israel. We are free in Christ, for Jesus is our Sabbath...we rest in Him.


.

Euphemia, I am glad you noticed that

That's a fundamental logic problem that some Sabbath/festival keepers have. They don't realize that 'Gentile' churches were not all Gentiles, in fact they may have been predominately Jewish. Jews spread out all over, starting about the time of Antiochus Epiphanes in about BC 160. Some lived in these cities due to persecution in Jerusalem at that time, and others for economic opportunities.


Also, Paul may have been speaking of keeping the feast in a metaphorical sense, not a literal sense.

But, it doesn't matter. Jewish Christians were continuing to keep elements of their faith, including physical circumcision. Acts 21 is clear on this. These things were not requirements, but were matters of cultural preference.

It kept them in touch with their Jewish community and helped them to remain viable witnesses in their community.

I remember the Armstrongites telling me I Corinthians 5 proved Gentiles were observing the Feast...bogus

 

[Gigantor]

Re: Sabbath

It seems we can both agree that Salvation is by believing the Gospel> believing that God's Kingdom is coming to earth and will be ruled eternally by Yashua, the only begotten Son of the Living God and that Yashua is the Messiah that paid the death penalty for our sins, that he was in the grave 3 days and 3 nights, was resurrected and now sits at the right hand of God the Father.

Keeping the Sabbath is an important sign that one is on Yashua's same page, not that it is required for salvation. When referring to lawlessness Yashua refers to without Torah. We know that sin is defined at breaking God's Law (Torah). The criminal, executed next to Yashua, probably did not keep the Sabbath yet he acknowledged who Yashua was and was granted Salvation.

On the other hand it will come to pass that a One World (Beast) Government will institute a One World Religion and will demand that all worship the false god, image of the Beast, maybe on Sunday. Sunday worship could be the mark of the beast so all those unlucky Saturday Sabbath keepers will be given a choice, accept Sunday worship and you won't be executed and you can buy and sell otherwise execution awaits. It is my understanding that currently many European Labor organizations, in the name of workers rights, are demanding a government decreed "Day of Rest" and that day is Sunday.

 

[prove-all]

Germany’s Quiet Sundays’
For Germans, whether religious or otherwise, Sunday is a sacred day of rest.
That’s what the Wall Street Journal said in its Life & Style section on March 23.

“Germany holds to much the same Monday-to-Friday workweek rhythm as the rest
of the world, but on Sundays it skips a beat,” wrote Frankfurt-based assistant news
editor Sarah Sloat in her article
From the WSJ Expat Blog: Germany’s Quiet Sundays - WSJ

She continues:

This uber-efficient country, which puts more restrictions on Sunday activities
than nearly all of its neighbors, nearly shuts down. …

Opening Sundays to shopping is fiercely resisted .… Efforts by retailers and businesses
to loosen the rules have also been unsuccessful. But a blanket prohibition was lifted in 2006,
when states were allowed to designate a certain number of Sundays as open for shopping.
In Hesse, where Frankfurt is located, four are permitted each year.

So normal labor and commerce are tightly restricted on Sundays. But what if residents
want to spend their Sunday doing yard work around their homes? Sloat answers this:

Laws regulating shopping hours and noise levels mean stores shut, lawnmowers fall silent,
and woe unto him who flips the switch on an electric tool. … Sonntagsruhe is one term
they use. It simply means “Sunday rest.”

Anyone considering undertaking outdoor chores or home improvements will be in
for a surprise. Regulations limit noise levels, forbidding the use of electric tools
like drills and leaf blowers, as well as hammering, sawing and loud music.

At recycling containers, it’s even prohibited to throw away glass jars and bottles
on Sunday because of the noise. Heavy trucks are banned from German roads on Sunday
… to relieve streets and cities of noise and traffic, and to give drivers a break.

The wsj article makes only a passing and vague mention of the influence of “churches”
on Germany’s reverence for Sundays. But there is one specific church which lies at
the very heart of why Germany “skips a beat” on Sundays: Roman Catholicism.

the Brussels-based European Sunday Alliance, a network of dozens of religious
and nonreligious organizations from 27 European nations whose purpose,
according to its website, is to “raise awareness of the unique value of synchronized
free time for our European societies.”

At the helm of these crusaders for Sunday rest is the Roman Catholic Church.

On March 3, the European Sunday Alliance met in Brussels with politicians from
all around the European Union for a “Call for Action” about banning Sunday work.
European Sunday Alliance - EP Interest Group on Work-Life Balance Meets:

The press release for the meeting says:

Stop Sunday Work Now! … Europe is not only an economic but also a social and
cultural community. … The “economization” of Sundays and public holidays
deepens social divisions at the expense of workers and their families.

The common weekly day of rest is a clear and visible sign for the reconciliation
of personal, family and professional life. … We need a Europe-wide Sunday protection.
[T]he European Sunday Alliance draws attention to Sunday as the common weekly day
of rest which enables EU citizens to live their citizenship together.

Why does this Sunday alliance exist and work so arduously to influence Europe’s
labor laws? Why is the Catholic Church so adamant about instituting a Continent-wide
day of rest? And why must it be Sunday instead of another day of the week?

In large part, it is because it was the Catholic Church—in intentional violation
of biblical teachings—that appointed Sunday as a day of rest and worship.

The Vatican is proud of the success it had in this colossal feat, and Sunday rest
has become a mark of the Catholic Church’s authority.



This truth is best explained by the Vatican’s own:

¦“Sunday is a Catholic institution and its claim to observance can be defended only on Catholic
principles. … From beginning to end of Scripture there is not a single passage that warrants thet
ransfer of weekly public worship from the last day of the week to the first”
(Catholic Press, August 1900).

¦“Of course the Catholic Church claims that the change was her act. … And the act is a mark of her
ecclesiastical authority in religious things” (letter from the office of Cardinal Gibbons, Nov. 11, 1895).

¦“The church is above the Bible; and this transference of Sabbath observance from Saturday to Sunday
is proof positive of that fact. Deny the authority of the church and you have no adequate or reasonable
explanation or justification for the substitution of Sunday for Saturday in the Third—Protestant Fourth—
Commandment of God” (The Catholic Record, Sept. 1, 1923).

¦“Perhaps the boldest thing, the most revolutionary change the church ever did, happened in the
first century. The holy day, the Sabbath, was changed from Saturday to Sunday. ‘The day of the Lord’
(dies Dominica) [or “Sunday”] was chosen, not from any direction noted in the Scriptures, but from the church’s sense of its own power. …


People who think that the Scriptures should be the sole authority, should logically …
keep Saturday holy” (Saint Catherine Catholic Church Sentinel, May 21, 1995).


The March meeting, and the European Sunday Alliance’s ongoing efforts are bringing the Vatican-
influenced EU closer to declaring Sunday as the official Continent-wide day of rest. Any steps in that
direction should alarm religious liberty watchers, those concerned about a failure
to separate church and state, and anyone familiar with Catholicism’s violent history.

 

[prove-all]

In 2005, when Pope Benedict xvi stressed the importance of Sunday worship for Europe and the world,

In August, Pope Benedict xvi made Germany the destination of his first trip abroad.
On Sunday, August 21, as part of the World Youth Day celebration, the pontiff conducted a mass with
over 1 million people where he stressed the importance of Sunday worship: “Sunday is a free day .…
Yet this free time is empty if God is not present,” he said.


Pope Benedict perceives the secularist moral vacuum that has plagued Europe since the time of
the Enlightenment. … But it seems Benedict wants to fill that vacuum—the old Roman way.
That way was never sympathetic to the idea of the public voluntarily accepting its tenets.
Rather, as even a cursory study of history will reveal, it was imposed by force. … Pope Benedict
is committed to reinstating the active observance of the Roman Catholic Church’s chief icon: Sunday.

He knows that to popularize religion in Europe, he has to reintroduce a means of promoting what
marketers call brand loyalty. The most historic brand the pope can offer to bond the people together
is the ancient day of worship, fashionable since Babylon, the old day of the sun—Sunday.

Hence his promotion of that old Roman brand in his recent addresses. … If we understand how
the church has enforced this day in its past history, we should be very alarmed.


Benedict is no longer the church’s frontrunner, but his successor and
other Catholic officials are committed to the same ambitions that drove him.

 

[prove-all]

“Where did Sunday originate?

Not with the Roman Catholic Church, but with the pagan religion of the Roman Empire,
long before there was any Catholic Church! It is the day on which the ancient pagans
assembled at sunrise, faced the east (as they do Easter Sunday morning today),
and worshiped the rising sun.

It was Constantine, emperor of the Roman Empire, not a pope, who made Sunday
the official so-called ‘Christian day of rest.’ But it was enforced—people were caused
to accept it universally—by the Roman Catholic Church!”
History proves this to be absolutely correct!

Constantine changed the official day of worship to Sunday during
the Nicene Council of a.d. 325.

In a letter regarding the council, Constantine spoke of the enforcement of Sunday worship for Easter services: “At this meeting the question concerning the most holy day of Easter was discussed, and it was resolved by the united judgment of all present that this feast ought to be kept by all and in every place on one and the same day.”

This statement was directed at those who kept the Passover—one of God’s seven annual festivals commanded in Scripture—rather than Easter, and kept it several days before Easter. “[F]irst of all, it appeared an unworthy thing that in the celebration of this most holy feast we should follow the practice of the Jews. … Let us then have nothing in common with the detestable Jewish crowd …. t has been determined by the common judgment of all, that the most holy feast of Easter should be kept on one and the same day” (emphasis mine throughout).



In other words, Easter was to be kept on Sunday, and the “Jewish” Passover
—which is actually God’s biblically commanded assembly—was expressly forbidden


In another letter, specifically regarding Sabbath worship, Constantine wrote, “Forasmuch, then, as it is no longer possible to bear with your pernicious errors, we give warning by this present statute that none of you henceforth presume to assemble yourselves together. We have directed, accordingly, that you be deprived of all the houses in which you are accustomed to hold your assemblies: and our care in this respect extends so far as to forbid the holding of your superstitious and senseless meetings, not in public merely, but in any private house or place whatsoever. Let those of you, therefore, who are desirous of embracing the true and pure religion, take the far better course of entering the Catholic Church .… [F]rom this day forward none of your unlawful assemblies may presume to appear in any public or private place. Let this edict be made public.”

This was confirmed at the Council of Laodicea almost 40 years later in a.d. 363.
At that conference, it was determined, “Christians must not Judaize by resting
on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honoring the Lord’s Day. …
But if any shall be found to be Judaizers, let them be anathema
[cursed and excommunicated] from Christ.”

There you have it: historical proof of the enforced observance of Sunday. To assemble
together on any other day for a religious observance was unlawful.

Today, many Sunday-observing “Christians” admit that the Sabbath was changed.
Notice the question posed to the Catholic Church in the book Catholic Doctrinal
Catechism, written by a Catholic priest with the intention of defending Catholic doctrine:

“Question: Have you any other way of proving that the church has power to institute
festivals of precept? Answer: Had she not such power, she should not have done that
in which all modern religionists agree with her—she could not have substituted the
observance of Sunday, the first day of the week, for the observance of Saturday,
the seventh day, a change for which there is no scriptural authority.”

As Christians today, are we to heed what a great church has admittedly
changed—or what is divinely inspired in the Bible?

-Pope Alexander iii made this stunning decree at the Council of Tours in a.d. 1163:
“Whereas a damnable heresy has for some time lifted its head in the parts about Toulouse,
and already spread infection through Gascony and other provinces, concealing itself like
a serpent in its folds; as soon as its followers shall have been discovered, let no man afford them refuge on his estates; neither let there be any communication with them in buying and selling: so that, being deprived of the solace of human conversation, they may be compelled to return from error to wisdom.”

Notice that people were forbidden to buy or sell with these “heretics” because of what
they believed. Bible prophecy says those who refuse a “mark” will be unable to buy
or sell in the near future.

Pope Innocent iii ruled the Catholic Church in the early 1200s. Though he admitted it
was all right for the common people to study the Scriptures themselves, he nevertheless
warned, “It is not proper for you to hold your meetings in private, nor to act as preachers,
nor to ridicule the priests. Remember that men must have a special training before they
can understand the deep things of Holy Scripture. The priests are trained for this purpose.

Listen to them. Respect even the most ignorant of them. Beware of thinking that you alone
are correct, and despising those who do not join you” (History of the Christian Church, 1879).

 

[Gigantor]

Thank you for posting this information as it is another illustration of Who Did It> the illegitimate transfer of "solemnity" (Catholic Term) from Saturday (7th Day) to Sunday (1st Day).
Daniel 7:25 And he (Anti-Christ) shall speak [FONT=Trebuchet, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.[/FONT]

[FONT=Trebuchet, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The Law of the 7th Day Sabbath>>The Roman Catholic Church has successfully deceived most churches into Sunday worship.
The Time>> We have also been deceived into abandoning Yehovah's reckoning of time. The 24 hour day was changed from starting at sundown to starting at 12:01 (Midnight). The new year went to Jan 1st rather from Yehovah's month of the Aviv ( Barley ripe in Jerusalem). We have been deceived into using a Solar year of 365 days instead of Yehovah's Lunar based month.
This is anti-christ!

[/FONT]

 

[sparkman]

Re: Sabbath

It seems we can both agree that Salvation is by believing the Gospel> believing that God's Kingdom is coming to earth and will be ruled eternally by Yashua, the only begotten Son of the Living God and that Yashua is the Messiah that paid the death penalty for our sins, that he was in the grave 3 days and 3 nights, was resurrected and now sits at the right hand of God the Father.

Keeping the Sabbath is an important sign that one is on Yashua's same page, not that it is required for salvation. When referring to lawlessness Yashua refers to without Torah. We know that sin is defined at breaking God's Law (Torah). The criminal, executed next to Yashua, probably did not keep the Sabbath yet he acknowledged who Yashua was and was granted Salvation.

On the other hand it will come to pass that a One World (Beast) Government will institute a One World Religion and will demand that all worship the false god, image of the Beast, maybe on Sunday. Sunday worship could be the mark of the beast so all those unlucky Saturday Sabbath keepers will be given a choice, accept Sunday worship and you won't be executed and you can buy and sell otherwise execution awaits. It is my understanding that currently many European Labor organizations, in the name of workers rights, are demanding a government decreed "Day of Rest" and that day is Sunday.

Defining sin as transgressing the Torah is not a correct interpretation of I John 3:4. Hamartia (sin) is anomia (rebellion). This verse identifies the behavior with the motivation. I John is about the spirit of the antichrist, which is what's being discussed here..rebellion against God is the spirit of the anti-Christ.

If you define breaking the Torah as sin, then you must hold that those who don't become physically circumcised, offer animal sacrifice, and fail to put their wives and daughters out of the home during their menstrual cycle are in in sin.

I usually don't discuss this verse because the Torah included spiritual and moral principles, and transgressing those are sin, but the Torah itself is not applicable. Transgressing inapplicable things is not sin.

Again, Christians are led by the Spirit. They are not under the written code. Romans 7:1-7, II Corinthians 3, Acts 15, Galatians 3 and 4 and Ephesians 2:13-15 are clear in teaching that the Old Covenant is not applicable anymore. Neither are the Sabbath and festivals (Colossians 2:16-17) and clean/unclean meats (Mark 7, Romans 14).

By the way the assignment of Sabbath-breaking to the "Mark of the Beast" is something that the SDA Joseph Bates taught. There is no reason to believe this.

Sin is any moral transgression. Scripture is replete with lists of those. Nine of the Ten Commandments are moral in nature. The Sabbath is a ceremonial or ritualistic aspect of the Law, not a moral law.

The Sabbath was a sign under the Old Covenant, just as physical circumcision was. Christians are under the New Covenant, and the covenant signs are different. Baptism and the Lord's Supper are the signs of the New Covenant.

Salvation is not by believing your version of the gospel. Salvation is by placing one's faith in Jesus Christ and his atoning sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins. The saved person repents of sin and turns toward Christ in faith. Knowledge of the millennial reign is likely to come before or after, but it is not the true gospel. The reference to the Kingdom of God involves the reign of God as the authority over one's live. There is an eschatological fulfillment of this in the future Millennial reign but that is not the primary focus.

Your view regarding the Beast is basically just regurgitated Armstrongism. He had no qualifications as a prophet. In fact, he likely practiced incest with his daughter. He has no authority and did not represent God.

 

[Euphemia]

Re: Sabbath

Keeping the Sabbath is an important sign that one is on Yashua's same page, not that it is required for salvation.

False! God is not looking for signs from us, and neither should we. That we exemplify and take on the character of Jesus Christ is what we ought to be doing. That is sign enough!

If you need a sign, it would behoove you to know Mark 16:17-18:
These signs will accompany those who have believed: in My name they will cast out demons, they will speak in new tongues; [SUP]18 [/SUP]they will pick up serpents, and if they drink anything deadly, it will not hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will get well.”


You are making a huge mistake, making works the be-all and end-all. We cannot be righteous through works. If we have accepted His gift of salvation through faith, then we are on the same page with Jesus (abiding in Him) by knowing Him through His word, and walking with Him.


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