Did God "experience" death on the cross?

[AboundingGrace]

As Paul said, “In Him we live and move and have our being” (Acts 17:28)

I see your point, and well done.. but, with respect, it is helpful to know, as I learned just last year, that Paul speaking to the Greeks, was quoting from one of their writings about Zeus, thus the statement cannot be attributed solely to Paul, nor can it be ascribed to the Biblical God.

In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus-

"They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle
bellies!
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever, For in thee we live and move and have our being."

At some point Paul ceased to evangelize by using knowledge of Greek philosophy and endeavored instead to speak the plainness of the gospel. So that ones faith is not resting in the wisdom of men but in the knowledge of God.

 

[crossnote]

[h=2]Did God "experience" death on the cross?[/h]
Yes, in the same sense God experienced being a man.

 

[blondieindahouse]

You are confusing yourself. Jesus was made flesh and dwelt among us as a man, as we are (no sexism meant), He paid the ultimate sacrifice for us and spent three days in the grave. He Died so we don't have to. He was separated from life which is death. The whole of the new covenant rest on this, without it there is no covenant.
All of the big words used to try and show you have an intellect to understand more than anyone else is just that, big words. Jesus said 'unless you come as a child'
Mark 10:15
Assuredly, I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God as a little child will by no means enter it.”
This does mean that we accept what the father has done for us, if we cant understand how He does it dose that mean he has not done it?
We need to be humble before our God and accept what He is doing in our lives and the lives of those around us. we need to hold the truths as given to us in scripture and confirmed by the Holy Spirit that lives within us. When we accept his sacrifice as an offering for our sin "He shall see His seed"

The divine nature of God has never ceased. I am not confused.

 

[blondieindahouse]

Did God "experience" death on the cross?


Yes, in the same sense God experienced being a man.

Gods spirit has never ceased. Jesus > fully man fully God. The man died.

 

[fredoheaven]

This is to provide scripture references of the body, soul and spirit of our Lord Jesus Christ, being distinct from each other. I just don’t know if this help in comprehending the topic. Thanks.

Mathew 27:58 He went to Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus. Then Pilate commanded thebody to be delivered.

Acts 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

 

[fredoheaven]

To say that God experienced death is to say he died . How can you experience death without dying? Dont allow people to come in and mince words. It is the work of the enemy and it is heresy!


Those who are saved and reborn in Christ believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnate. We also believe that Jesus Christ died on the cross. If we say that God died on the cross, and if by that we mean that the divine nature perished, we have stepped over the edge into serious heresy. In fact, two such heresies related to this problem arose in the early centuries of the church: theopassianism and patripassianism. The first of these, theopassianism, teaches that God Himself suffered death on the cross. Patripassianism indicates that the Father suffered vicariously through the suffering of His Son. Both of these heresies were roundly rejected by the church for the very reason that they categorically deny the very character and nature of God, including His immutability. There is no change in the substantive nature or character of God at any time.

God not only created the universe, He sustains it by the very power of His being. As Paul said, “In Him we live and move and have our being” (Acts 17:28). If the being of God ceased for one second, the universe would disappear. It would pass out of existence, because nothing can exist apart from the sustaining power of God. If God dies, everything dies with Him. Obviously, then, God could not have perished on the cross.


Some say, “It was the second person of the Trinity Who died.” That would be a mutation within the very being of God, because when we look at the Trinity we say that the three are one in essence, and that though there are personal distinctions among the persons of the Godhead, those distinctions are not essential in the sense that they are differences in being. Death is something that would involve a change in one’s being.


We should shrink in horror from the idea that God actually died on the cross. The atonement was made by the human nature of Christ. Somehow people tend to think that this lessens the dignity or the value of the substitutionary act, as if we were somehow implicitly denying the deity of Christ. God forbid. It’s the God-man Who dies, but death is something that is experienced only by the human nature, because the divine nature isn’t capable of experiencing death.

Rc Sproul

the divine nature of Christ that is incapable of experiencing death. This is the link of Christ blood is God's blood. That God's blood is alive even the death of Christ. There's power in the BLOOD!

Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

 

[blondieindahouse]

I see your point, and well done.. but, with respect, it is helpful to know, as I learned just last year, that Paul speaking to the Greeks, was quoting from one of their writings about Zeus, thus the statement cannot be attributed solely to Paul, nor can it be ascribed to the Biblical God.

In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus-

"They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle
bellies!
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever, For in thee we live and move and have our being."

At some point Paul ceased to evangelize by using knowledge of Greek philosophy and endeavored instead to speak the plainness of the gospel. So that ones faith is not resting in the wisdom of men but in the knowledge of God.

RC Sproul wrote the article. Thank you for input input. You may want to do a OP . Id like to look into it.

 

[blondieindahouse]

the divine nature of Christ that is incapable of experiencing death. This is the link of Christ blood is God's blood. That God's blood is alive even the death of Christ. There's power in the BLOOD!

Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

Christ>fully man fully God.
Because He is both God and man in one person and because He was sinless, His sacrifice is sufficient to cover the sins of the world. The man died.

 

[fredoheaven]

Christ>fully man fully God.
Because He is both God and man in one person and because He was sinless, His sacrifice is sufficient to cover the sins of the world. The man died.

Yap, a Fully God and Fully man. The God-man!

God bless!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

This means that just as in the Old Testament, behind the veil where only the high priest could enter God's dwelling, He our new high priest tore that separating curtain away so that those in the holy place may now enter the most holy place- which is heaven- Gods dwelling place.

The veil symbolized the Adamic flesh. That is what kept man separate from GOD.

 

[Kaycie]

Matthew 11:14, Jesus says,
"And if you are willing to accept it, he (John the Baptist) is the Elijah who was to come."

it also says Jesus is the Moses to come, but they mean like Moses

 

[ladylynn]

To say that God experienced death is to say he died . How can you experience death without dying? Dont allow people to come in and mince words. It is the work of the enemy and it is heresy!


Those who are saved and reborn in Christ believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnate. We also believe that Jesus Christ died on the cross. If we say that God died on the cross, and if by that we mean that the divine nature perished, we have stepped over the edge into serious heresy. In fact, two such heresies related to this problem arose in the early centuries of the church: theopassianism and patripassianism. The first of these, theopassianism, teaches that God Himself suffered death on the cross. Patripassianism indicates that the Father suffered vicariously through the suffering of His Son. Both of these heresies were roundly rejected by the church for the very reason that they categorically deny the very character and nature of God, including His immutability. There is no change in the substantive nature or character of God at any time.

God not only created the universe, He sustains it by the very power of His being. As Paul said, “In Him we live and move and have our being” (Acts 17:28). If the being of God ceased for one second, the universe would disappear. It would pass out of existence, because nothing can exist apart from the sustaining power of God. If God dies, everything dies with Him. Obviously, then, God could not have perished on the cross.


Some say, “It was the second person of the Trinity Who died.” That would be a mutation within the very being of God, because when we look at the Trinity we say that the three are one in essence, and that though there are personal distinctions among the persons of the Godhead, those distinctions are not essential in the sense that they are differences in being. Death is something that would involve a change in one’s being.


We should shrink in horror from the idea that God actually died on the cross. The atonement was made by the human nature of Christ. Somehow people tend to think that this lessens the dignity or the value of the substitutionary act, as if we were somehow implicitly denying the deity of Christ. God forbid. It’s the God-man Who dies, but death is something that is experienced only by the human nature, because the divine nature isn’t capable of experiencing death.

Rc Sproul

I very much agree with RC Sproul and you too Blondie. I was in the Bible study room when this topic came up. There is much we do not know about the Incarnation but what we DO know is God cannot die. Jesus is God. The human body of Jesus died but He brought it back to life but as He is God, Jesus Christ the Son of God did not die.,but the physical body did. I don't understand it but I believe it.

 

[ladylynn]

Did God "experience" death on the cross?


Yes, in the same sense God experienced being a man.

​That is an excellent way to put it for my understanding. Thanks crossnote.

 

[blondieindahouse]

the JW say that Michael the angel swapped places with Christ on the cross, so that it was Michael who died, and not Jesus.
i suppose they can't stomach the fact of what He did for us, so that we could live.

but Christ says:

I am the Living One;
I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever!
And I hold the keys of death and Hades.
(Revelation 1:18)
​

so whether we can fathom it or not, the fact remains - Jesus Christ was, for a time, dead, and He is now risen!
not being able to comprehend something is never evidence that it is not so

Do you feel like a rock star using the JW heretical views to make your point? LOL They deny the deity and that is what makes them a cult. The irony in this is if you actually think the spirit of God died, that is heresy!

Christ > fully man fully God. His man nature died. His divine nature (God) did not die. God is spirit and forever..

 

[blondieindahouse]

Ummm no, "I" am affirming it.

John 8:24
"I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins."

 

[crossnote]

I would hold that God shared in the human attributes of man, such as experiencing thirst, hunger, tiredness etc.
So although God did not die, as God is Life eternal, as God incarnate He did experience the suffering and death as a human would.
This way the two natures of Christ (human and divine) are not separated from each other.

 

[ThomistColin]

Did God "experience" death on the cross?


Yes, in the same sense God experienced being a man.

And this was my point when I said that God experienced death. He felt the body die, just as He felt the flogging, the hunger, the thirst, the pain, the aches, the etc. He felt the body falter as He heaved Himself in pain to draw breath. God knows what it is to suffer and die. In this sense, God died on the Cross in that He experienced the death of His body. Just as someday I will die, in that I will experience the death of my body.

 

[crossnote]

I would hold that God shared in the human attributes of man, such as experiencing thirst, hunger, tiredness etc.
So although God did not die, as God is Life eternal; as God incarnate He did experience the suffering and death as a human would.
This way the two natures of Christ (human and divine) are not separated from each other.

And this was my point when I said that God experienced death. He felt the body die, just as He felt the flogging, the hunger, the thirst, the pain, the aches, the etc. He felt the body falter as He heaved Himself in pain to draw breath. God knows what it is to suffer and die. In this sense, God died on the Cross in that He experienced the death of His body. Just as someday I will die, in that I will experience the death of my body.

Yes, I agree.

 

[JaumeJ]

Jesus Christ and the Father are One. As is written the child born unto us would be called, wonderful, counselor, prince of peace, the everlasting Father, God Almighty.

When Jesus Christ came to us from God, He came to be just as we are so when He defeated the curse of the law, death, He would be justified and authorized to free all who are slaves to sin from sin. He was here as a man, thinking it nothing to be even with God.

He was glorified after He was raised by the Father from the dead, the firstborn of the dead, the firstborn of the resurrection, the Salvation of God (Yahweh.)

He died as a man; we all know God cannot die.........God bless all who are in Jesus Christ, for the Wonderful, and the Counselor dwells in you, and yo too will be raise if you sleep, unless His return is before you sleep. Praise our Salvation.......amen.

 

[FreeNChrist]

The veil symbolized the Adamic flesh. That is what kept man separate from GOD.

Adamic flesh? Meaning the human body?