E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
It was not ignorance, They did it out of fear.
And in doing so. They openly shared to the world who saw that they were ok with these judiasers..
An Often Overlooked Sign of the Last Days
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It was not ignorance, They did it out of fear.
And in doing so. They openly shared to the world who saw that they were ok with these judiasers..
Since Paul was here on the mission given him by our Lord and Savior, we have know of false charlatans and false brethren who have "crept in unawares" into congregations everywhere. This is hardly news if it was prevalent then.
Something all should be aware of and beware of is any apostasy being put forward by denominations of this age. I know, I really do, that Jesus Christ did not call Himself by any of the titled denominations today. One may only say He was of and taught of the faith of Abraham, not a denomination, rather a description of our faith.
Even the term, Judaism, was an unknown at the time our Lord walked His Earth. Judaism became the umbrella term for all the sects of the Children of Israel that developed after Christ, like all of the sects under the umbrella title of Christian.
Many today shy away from any influence Jewish or Hebrew, opting instead for traditions of non-Jew or non-Hebrew as commandment from God causing them to miss out by neglecting our roots from our patriarchs, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. When believers today can learn under the umbrella of truth, spirit and honesty, perhaps they will fellowship with less contention and more brotherly love under the auspices of the Holy Spirit. Until all learn this simple truth, we will continue in contention, mindless, and loveless. God is good all of the time, and His children try to be the same.
God bless all who are in Jesus Christ, amen.
Something all should be aware of and beware of is any apostasy being put forward by denominations of this age. I know, I really do, that Jesus Christ did not call Himself by any of the titled denominations today. One may only say He was of and taught of the faith of Abraham, not a denomination, rather a description of our faith.
Even the term, Judaism, was an unknown at the time our Lord walked His Earth. Judaism became the umbrella term for all the sects of the Children of Israel that developed after Christ, like all of the sects under the umbrella title of Christian.
Many today shy away from any influence Jewish or Hebrew, opting instead for traditions of non-Jew or non-Hebrew as commandment from God causing them to miss out by neglecting our roots from our patriarchs, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. When believers today can learn under the umbrella of truth, spirit and honesty, perhaps they will fellowship with less contention and more brotherly love under the auspices of the Holy Spirit. Until all learn this simple truth, we will continue in contention, mindless, and loveless. God is good all of the time, and His children try to be the same.
God bless all who are in Jesus Christ, amen.
Képhas: "a rock," Cephas, a name given to the apostle Peter
Original Word: Κηφᾶς, ᾶ, ὁPart of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Képhas
Phonetic Spelling: (kay-fas')
Short Definition: Cephas
Definition: Cephas (Aramaic for rock), the new name given to Simon Peter, the apostle.
Galatians 2:14 When I saw that they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas in front of them all, “You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew. How is it, then, that you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs?
Galatians 5 It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery. Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. ...
Galatians 2:21 I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”
Matthew 11: 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”
John 10:28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.
Luke 22:31 “Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift all of you as wheat.
James 1:13 When tempted, no one should say, “God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone;
Genesis 3:4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman.
Matthew 26:41 “Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak.”
Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.
E
ember
Guest
Originally Posted by ember
And here is a list describing the attributes of someone who actually may be called of God to minister in whatever capacity
Ten signs of a safe group/leader.
- A safe group/leader will answer your questions without becoming judgmental and punitive.
- A safe group/leader will disclose information such as finances and often offer an independently audited financial statement regarding budget and expenses. Safe groups and leaders will tell you more than you want to know.
- A safe group/leader is often democratic, sharing decision making and encouraging accountability and oversight.
- A safe group/leader may have disgruntled former followers, but will not vilify, excommunicate and forbid others from associating with them.
- A safe group/leader will not have a paper trail of overwhelmingly negative records, books, articles and statements about them.
- A safe group/leader will encourage family communication, community interaction and existing friendships and not feel threatened.
- A safe group/leader will recognize reasonable boundaries and limitations when dealing with others.
- A safe group/leader will encourage critical thinking, individual autonomy and feelings of self-esteem.
- A safe group/leader will admit failings and mistakes and accept constructive criticism and advice.
- A safe group/leader will not be the only source of knowledge and learning excluding everyone else, but value dialogue and the free exchange of ideas.
CHUCKS RESPONSE:
This wouldn't be a Church leader because if wolves come into church, a safe Church leader would have to say, "Out!"
A safe Christian leader would hear heresy in Church and have to tell the non-Christians, "I forbid you to speak!"
A safe Christian leader would not only know the truth but be a salesman and not a consumer.
A safe Christian leader would not believe every person that comes into church:
1 John 4:1 ¶ Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
A safe Christian leader is Jesus and He will rebuke many people:
Isaiah 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.
The premise with trying to figure out what is safe and is not safe is neither here nor there.
John 2:24 But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
Jesus didn't trust all men so therefore he didn't commit Himself to people because He knew how sinful all human beings are:
Matthew 7:11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?
How would you like to think of the human race as evil?
The way to know a safe Christian leader is to know doctrine and that wouldn't exclude satan or his demons either but it eliminates everyone else.
Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
A safe leader would know the truth but the Bible says that everyone has been deceived.
A safe Christian is one that knows His bible:
Hebrews 5:12 ¶ For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
Hebrews 5:13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
Hebrews 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
When we show Christian maturity, we learn how to study the Bible ourselves and we have use our senses to discern both good and evil through Biblical exercise and not to trust in quizzes or tests because we trust in Jesus and not man because man is sinful.
Do you know why I use old commentaries? Because those men won't lie to me about modern day things because they are dead.
I don't know what gives Chuck, but I don't think you actually understood the above list.
Sounds like you have an axe to grind. As a church leader myself, I can assure you I have dealt with all kinds of people.
Some of the angriest folk, are the one that thought they should have been in my place cause they would do it better.
Do you just shut folks down when they question or are hurting or perhaps need spiritual help?
See, we have a very good example of folks who would love to teach in these forums, but this forum may be the only platform they have. They are the ones that try to shut everyone else up and no desire to even try to see another side; rather, they just label someone and move on. There is no Holy Spirit in what they post and they contribute nothing and go from thread to thread saying the same things because that is all they know.
If God treated us the way you suggest we should others, well, I think most of us would have given up a long time ago.
Cherry picking verses to make a point has never made a point for anyone other then to demonstrate a person holds to what they personally believe and can find verses they claim supports their view.
J
ji
Guest
It's all Good as long as we stay in God's Light,then even wolves also can see the light and turn into lambs...Saul was a wolf till he Became the Greatest Apostle Paul after getting blinded by God's Light.
Nice thoughts,God Bless
J
JesusIsAll
Guest
With regard to theological truth, the internet is a curse, overall, from what I can tell. You have some good ministries and sites like BibleHub, seminaries, but a vast number of cult websites, crackpot websites, YouTube "ministries" that are solely for gathering a following, to fleece the flock: everybody and their brother is suddenly a self-appointed minister. Then you have a matter of the internet providing a pulpit tares never before had, to mislead, whether on purpose or for their ignorance. Last, but not least, it's the devil's playground to pervert truth, bottom line.
You see this represented on message boards, but they not the biggest problem, when you have frauds out there, with thousands of followers. The web spreads big lies like wildfire. Somebody has a best seller book, filled with junk, sensational eschatology, and, before you know it, it has spread all over the web, and is taken as doctrinal truth. Like how many times have you heard of the Psalms 83 war, when there is no war in the psalm? Or America being under Jewish law of the shemitah or jubilee years? The Muslim antichrist? The list could go on and on, all lacking any harmonious, often even common sense, scriptural foundations. Many, many so-called ministries out there are merely exploiting sensationalism and fear, lies and fear never Godly foundations, this to get their hands in peoples' pockets, selling their books, DVDs or apocalypse survival stuff, or to earn web Adsense revenue. The most popular frauds, in turn, gain an enormous cult following of deluded believers, as their false prophecy spreads.
So, I've come to the conclusion the web is, overall, very negative in terms of truth, that the web, as well as modern technology and media sucking up everybody's time in worldly pursuits: maybe modern gadgetry is the strongest vehicle in history for the devil's work? Those things modern people love may be the worst enemy, of millions. I'd never seen the rampant apostasy, prior to the proliferation of the web, where every crackpot devil has a soapbox and their false prophecy and gospels going around the world.
You see this represented on message boards, but they not the biggest problem, when you have frauds out there, with thousands of followers. The web spreads big lies like wildfire. Somebody has a best seller book, filled with junk, sensational eschatology, and, before you know it, it has spread all over the web, and is taken as doctrinal truth. Like how many times have you heard of the Psalms 83 war, when there is no war in the psalm? Or America being under Jewish law of the shemitah or jubilee years? The Muslim antichrist? The list could go on and on, all lacking any harmonious, often even common sense, scriptural foundations. Many, many so-called ministries out there are merely exploiting sensationalism and fear, lies and fear never Godly foundations, this to get their hands in peoples' pockets, selling their books, DVDs or apocalypse survival stuff, or to earn web Adsense revenue. The most popular frauds, in turn, gain an enormous cult following of deluded believers, as their false prophecy spreads.
So, I've come to the conclusion the web is, overall, very negative in terms of truth, that the web, as well as modern technology and media sucking up everybody's time in worldly pursuits: maybe modern gadgetry is the strongest vehicle in history for the devil's work? Those things modern people love may be the worst enemy, of millions. I'd never seen the rampant apostasy, prior to the proliferation of the web, where every crackpot devil has a soapbox and their false prophecy and gospels going around the world.
C
Chuckt
Guest
Ember,
I'm going to tell people the truth in love and let the chips fall where they may.
I'm not going to lie to them.
The wonderful thing about Christians being in independent churches is that they don't have to accept your leadership or anyone's leadership because we have our own leadership and my leadership is the word.
If you don't like what I said from the Bible then you may take it up with Jesus Himself.
Chuck
Keep faith in God Almighty. The internet is no more full of crackpots than are the countless denominations called Christian in this world today fulfilling well exactly what Jesus Christ said would be extant when He returns.
The Holy Spirit imparts truth to all who believe Jesus Christ, and though some may be temporarily deceived, they will never be taken out of His loving Hands.
All glory to God in the faith we have in Jesus Christ, amen.
The Holy Spirit imparts truth to all who believe Jesus Christ, and though some may be temporarily deceived, they will never be taken out of His loving Hands.
All glory to God in the faith we have in Jesus Christ, amen.
Strong words but not true. Those who teach otherwise are cursed? Apollos was not cursed. He was shown a better way than repent and be baptized for the remission of sins (Acts 2:38 message).
Yes, they both preached Jesus Christ crucified, but Peter was not revealed the full mystery that Christ taught the Apostle Paul. Peter still taught many things pertaining to the law.
Yes, they both preached Jesus Christ crucified, but Peter was not revealed the full mystery that Christ taught the Apostle Paul. Peter still taught many things pertaining to the law.
You're delusional to think that Peter and Paul proclaimed different gospels. Paul taught both Jews and Greeks. He was very serious about this because he repeated himself.
I am astonished that you are turning away so quickly from the one who called you by the grace of Christ to a different gospel, not that [there] is a different [gospel], except there are some who are disturbing you and wanting to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should proclaim a gospel to you contrary to what we proclaimed to you, let him be accursed! As we said before, and now I say again, if anyone is proclaiming a gospel [to] you contrary to what you have received, let him be accursed! Galatians 1:6-9
I have never said Paul and Peter taught two different gospels. What Paul taught was more excellent than Peter. It's called progressive revelation. The Lord revealed more of Himself to the Apostle Paul and what the cross meant. And I am well aware of Paul's words in Galatians. Here he is talking about adding on to the gospel message, in this case it was circumcision. If you add anything on the gospel other than grace by faith, you are perverting the gospel of Christ. One should not add works, baptism, etc..to the finished work of the cross.
This is totally crazy. The Pharisees didn't think the Gentiles should even be allowed to come near them. (shall I send you a link to "How to Read a Book?")
What you have said HeRose is correct. It was those Pharisees who were proclaiming to be believers, who were clinging to the Law of Moses and trying to mix the covenants. Those Pharisees were the one's claiming that the Gentile believer's must be circumcised and that they must obey the law of Moses. Regarding this, scripture is very clear, as can be seen from following:
"But some believers from the party of the Pharisees stood up and declared, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the Law of Moses.”
This scripture says there were thousands of believers in Christ that were zealous for the Law and they did not like Paul's teaching of grace through faith only. James and the other elders said that they were true believers in Christ but were zealous for the Law.
Thousands being against the message of the true gospel of the grace of Christ that Paul preached must have been daunting for Paul to walk in to.
Acts 21:20-22 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And when they heard it they began glorifying God; and they said to him, "You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed, and they are all zealous for the Law; ( have believed is in the perfect tense )
[SUP]21 [/SUP] and they have been told about you, that you are teaching all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] "What, then, is to be done? They will certainly hear that you have come.
Thousands being against the message of the true gospel of the grace of Christ that Paul preached must have been daunting for Paul to walk in to.
Acts 21:20-22 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And when they heard it they began glorifying God; and they said to him, "You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed, and they are all zealous for the Law; ( have believed is in the perfect tense )
[SUP]21 [/SUP] and they have been told about you, that you are teaching all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] "What, then, is to be done? They will certainly hear that you have come.
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Man, are you EVER going to learn to actually "read"?
Every one of the Jewish "Believers" was originally a member of SOME faction of Judaism. Paul, himself was one of the most prominent Pharisees in the country before becoming a "Believer." Once they became a Believer, you can bet your bottom dollar that the Pharisees had nothing, at all, to do with them.... just as they did with Jesus whom these men now followed.
You've got to learn to get past simply seeing a particular word you have been trained to be sensitive to, and then just shutting off your brain from that point, on.
Acts 7:37-38
37 This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, "A Prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; Him shall ye hear."
38 This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the Angel Which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
KJV
I don't see a disconnect of God's Plan of Salvation that was to come through His Son between the OT and NT Books, and really neither did the prophet Stephen there whom the unbelieving Jews stoned to death.
The word "church" (ekklesia) simply means the congregation of believers. Jesus was promised to those of the OT, it just wasn't time yet for His coming to die on the cross. Per Paul in Gal.3, we of Faith on the Promise like Abraham have become the spiritual children of Abraham. Christ using Peter to build His Church upon represents what God's concept of His Church was to become all along, as prophesied to those in the OT. That doesn't show a disconnect from the OT saints, it shows what God told the OT saints who believed would be fulfilled in Jesus Christ.
Paul did this to win them over to Christ, opposed to alienating them. Paul certainly was not preaching circumcision and obedience to the Law of Moses to obtain salvation, but just the opposite. All one as to do to verify this is to read the letters to the Romans and the Galatians.
Understanding that is difficult for those who don't study their OT Books to enough depth. That Scripture is too often misused to try and condemn God's laws that our Lord Jesus didn't nail to His cross. Our Lord Jesus nailed the 'ordinances' in the law to His cross, not all of God's laws. See 1 Timothy 1 with Paul showing us what the law was made for which is Christian doctrine.
Gen 49:10
10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.
KJV
"Shiloh" is name representing our Lord Jesus.
God chose the tribe of Judah to be keeper of His law and lawgiver all the way to the time of Christ's 2nd coming.
And if one goes back to study the history of Christ's Church in the western Christian nations, one will find that established right among God's people in those lands. It's still in effect for today also, although there are many false prophets in the Churches trying to fool believers that is no longer so, like guides of tours to Washington, D.C. who hide the facts of why images of Moses with the tablets were carved on the doors of the U.S. Supreme Court building, etc.
Still, these things were commanded of us Gentile believers as agreed to by Paul in Acts 15, and these things still are part of God's laws:
Acts 15:28-29
28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
KJV
According to Paul's teaching in 1 Tim.1 though, we know there are other things involved that were written in God's laws that we as Christians are also to refrain from, like murder, thefts, perjury, man laying with man, adultery, etc.