Obedience & righteousness - extreme grace version

[eternally-gratefull]

Well this is an interesting, albeit naive, question. For one thing, people who are insecure in their faith seek to surround themselves with like-minded people. Some just have malevolent intent. For another thing, I have asked Grace777x70 many times if he is in some way affiliated with, or derives some sort of material benefit for directing traffic to, that website that he constantly links to (much, much more so earlier than now). I never once received a simple yes, or no in response. His words were always framed in ways that they could be interpreted more than one way.

But let your statement be ‘Yes, yes; no, no,’ and anything beyond these is from the evil one. Matthew 5:37​

There is one problem. The same problem many people have tried to show you since you got here.

You never ask Grace 777 WHat (doctrinaly) He actually believes. You base your whole basis for damning people on what everyone else says about them. And not on what they actually believe.

That's why you always say they believe things they do not believe. You can only get that from listening to someone else tell you that. And you place more faith in the one speaking against the person, than the person himself.

That's not only rude, and insincere, but and childish.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Quite the mess we have here.

 

[Gr8grace]

To someone like yourself who believes that a person can apostatize from the faith and still be saved, I can understand why the conditionality of fellowship with GOD being dependent upon walking in the light needs to be removed.

Angela needs to reflect upon the type of mind her academic exegesis of that verse appeals to.

You are incorrigible.

If you look a little closer(not even close, just read it).........in my first response on this specific matter, we agree!

It was just one verse being exegeted and it was correct. verse 6 gives the opposite when we are not walking in the light.

 

[JaumeJ]

What has lead you to think this? I have been in and out today, mostly out.......synopsis? Or rather not?

Quite the mess we have here.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Quite the mess we have here.

if someone wants to come at me based on what I actually believe, we have a basis in which we can have a peaceful discussion.

When someone comes at me making accusations I believe things I have never believed. We have a basis in which there will never be a logical, peaceful discussion.

Sadly, the second happens far to often, as I think you are seeing.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

The grace of God is not a license to sin...never was and never will be...it's the complete opposite..grace teaches us how to live godly and righteously in this present world. Those that say they are under grace and do not want to change..are in fact not under grace at all.

But this is a complete misrepresentation of the false-grace position, which teaches that a person can be saved without doing the will of GOD. When you say false-grace doesn't teach a license to sin, what it really means is that sin has consequences only in this life, but will in no way affect a person's inheritance of eternal life. So in terms of eternal life, false-grace has no restraint against the practice of sin, which is really just an implicit license to sin.

 

[JaumeJ]

It is certain all who may oppose you have at least part of what you have posted here in mind when they respond to your posts.

So it is with many others posting and debating, discussing, arguing and the like.........

It is a shame, but, after all this is a forum, and for many has nothing to do with the Body of Christ. Not for me though. I believe when two or more come together in the name of Jesus Christ in order to further His fame, it is spiritually importand.

God bless you, and all. I have been praying for you.

if someone wants to come at me based on what I actually believe, we have a basis in which we can have a peaceful discussion.

When someone comes at me making accusations I believe things I have never believed. We have a basis in which there will never be a logical, peaceful discussion.

Sadly, the second happens far to often, as I think you are seeing.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

What has lead you to think this? I have been in and out today, mostly out.......synopsis? Or rather not?

We've got two groups of people who both call the other group "unbelievers" -- yet both groups say Christ is their King.

I still cannot find a single, clear, issue which has divided the two groups.

We're dealing with frustrations that stemmed months ago (before I was participating) and have remained unresolved.

Personally, I'd like to move away from trying to determine "who said what and when", and move on to focus on more important matters like: What is it that's causing us to be in disagreement?

What once seemed like a matter of Hyper-grace vs Hyper-works now seems to be a matter of discerning who believes what (which is not up to any of us to discern).

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

You are incorrigible.

If you look a little closer(not even close, just read it).........in my first response on this specific matter, we agree!

It was just one verse being exegeted and it was correct. verse 6 gives the opposite when we are not walking in the light.

But that's the whole problem. False-grace teachers do that selective out-of-context exegesis to support their view that it's impossible for a believer to not walk in the light.

 

[Grace777x70]

Originally Posted by HeRoseFromTheDead

Well this is an interesting, albeit naive, question. For one thing, people who are insecure in their faith seek to surround themselves with like-minded people. Some just have malevolent intent. For another thing, I have asked Grace777x70 many times if he is in some way affiliated with, or derives some sort of material benefit for directing traffic to, that website that he constantly links to (much, much more so earlier than now). I never once received a simple yes, or no in response. His words were always framed in ways that they could be interpreted more than one way.

But let your statement be ‘Yes, yes; no, no,’ and anything beyond these is from the evil one. Matthew 5:37

There is one problem. The same problem many people have tried to show you since you got here.

You never ask Grace 777 WHat (doctrinaly) He actually believes. You base your whole basis for damning people on what everyone else says about them. And not on what they actually believe.

That's why you always say they believe things they do not believe. You can only get that from listening to someone else tell you that. And you place more faith in the one speaking against the person, than the person himself.

That's not only rude, and insincere, but and childish.

To reveal the malice and lies....here is what was said...

my post # 1322

Just giving people a grace-based view of Revelation 3....some people are interested in teaching on subjects....and people have thanked me for sending them to this site so that they could feed themselves .....so as I said before these posts are not for you but for others .

...and I have told you before that "no" still means "no" that I do not nor have ever received "material" benefit from giving people a grace-based view of scriptures by using this website...lol....this guy with the website has dissected a lot of the scriptures and has grace-based views.

I do however get great benefit from knowing people are being set free from religious views from man-made traditions and that they are being blessed with the grace and absolute love of our Lord Jesus and the Father for them!..that is why I share this great grace of the gospel of Christ.

again in post #1325

You can read my response again as I have highlighted it in blue in my previous post to you.

This is absolutely the last time I am going to answer you on your insinuations. I don't know what kind of malice you are attempting to convey.

I do not know what part of "no" you do not understand. I am not putting up the definition of the complicated word called "no" again.....this should suffice again for the last time....God bless you brother

The Lord bless you!...I am praying for you...I pray you grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus!.....

Then post #1332

So, you don't like the way I said 'no'...that I said other things while answering "no"?.........my goodness....so now you are dictating how to answer you?...and then to say if I don't answer the way you want....it's not godly or in love?....LOL.....I can see that I will have to keep my interaction with you to a minimum you keep your malice level from inflaming....

Here is the link...and eventually I finally had to put him on ignore..

http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...-confession-1-john-1-9-sin-confession-67.html


​

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

The grace of God is not a license to sin...never was and never will be...it's the complete opposite..grace teaches us how to live godly and righteously in this present world. Those that say they are under grace and do not want to change..are in fact not under grace at all.

But this is a complete misrepresentation of the false-grace position, which teaches that a person can be saved without doing the will of GOD. When you say false-grace doesn't teach a license to sin, what it really means is that sin has consequences only in this life, but will in no way affect a person's inheritance of eternal life. So in terms of eternal life, false-grace has no restraint against the practice of sin, which is really just an implicit license to sin.

Is this some word-twisting-in-action here, or what?

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

But that's the whole problem. False-grace teachers do that selective out-of-context exegesis to support their view that it's impossible for a believer to not walk in the light.

Does this mean you're a "false-grace" teacher today, HeRose?

That's how I read it.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

We've got two groups of people who both call the other group "unbelievers" -- yet both groups say Christ is their King.

I still cannot find a single, clear, issue which has divided the two groups.

We're dealing with frustrations that stemmed months ago (before I was participating) and have remained unresolved.

Personally, I'd like to move away from trying to determine "who said what and when", and move on to focus on more important matters like: What is it that's causing us to be in disagreement?

What once seemed like a matter of Hyper-grace vs Hyper-works now seems to be a matter of discerning who believes what (which is not up to any of us to discern).

there is one difference I think that divides us all.

Is Gods salvation eternal. Secure, and never ending. (I call it gospel security in Christ)

Can Gods gift be lost. based on all kinds of differing criteria based on who you talk to (I call it gospel insecurity in self)

These are two different gospels. Paul said in galations 1. there is one gospel. anyone who teaches a different (in kind) is teaching a false gospel. And should be damned, That is a stern word.

so we both can not be teaching the way to heaven, since we teach different gospels.

Al the rest of the stuff (tongues, and times, how old the earth is, when the rapture will be, Is the KJV perfect etc etc, are fine to talk about. But have no salvic significance.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

We've got two groups of people who both call the other group "unbelievers" -- yet both groups say Christ is their King.

I still cannot find a single, clear, issue which has divided the two groups.

We're dealing with frustrations that stemmed months ago (before I was participating) and have remained unresolved.

Personally, I'd like to move away from trying to determine "who said what and when", and move on to focus on more important matters like: What is it that's causing us to be in disagreement?

What once seemed like a matter of Hyper-grace vs Hyper-works now seems to be a matter of discerning who believes what (which is not up to any of us to discern).

I second this. Let's get down to the real issues and put everybody on the spot to see what they really believe.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Does this mean you're a "false-grace" teacher today, HeRose?

That's how I read it.

Can you explain that to me? It doesn't make sense.

 

[PeterJens]

You never ask Grace 777 WHat (doctrinaly) He actually believes.

This unfortunately is not true. We asked him questions at the start and he never answered them other than posting web site responses. It was all propoganda and not what he actually believed. After time you realise for him, what he believes does not matter, he hides behind teachers and articles.

I know EG you constantly called me a liar, saying everything I contributed was false.

So we have little confidence in your position, as you easily get into the red mist. But the truth will always come out.
I am not afraid, because the Lord gives me the words to share at the right time.

Whoever can be trusted with very little can also be trusted with much, and whoever is dishonest with very little will also be dishonest with much.
Luke 16:10

 

[JaumeJ]

There are truly some in each group who believe the others are "lost." If you read my posts you will find I have condemned no one for how the Lord has come to them.

Apparently there are some earnest grace only folks who think if another believer mentions being obedient to God that person is under tha law.

Those hearing grace only folks call being eager for good works (given by God of course) are earning salvation, when even in the milk of the Gospel we know that faith will lead to good works.......

I have been told when Jesus spoke the sermon on the mount that it was only to Jews. This is scary, because Jesus even tells us He came for the lost sheepof Israel first, and if this be so, His preaching to them is the same gospel we have received from Him, and the Gospel the Jews received from Him is the same gospel we have received.

It would horrify me were I not convinced that our Father is in total control, not I, for I am not menitioned anywhere in the Word a a prophet who is come to change the thinking of the wayward, but the Holy Spirit will do this in the Father's time.

Until the Father's time, come, sweet Jesus, we are truly anxious for your blessed return, amen.

We've got two groups of people who both call the other group "unbelievers" -- yet both groups say Christ is their King.

I still cannot find a single, clear, issue which has divided the two groups.

We're dealing with frustrations that stemmed months ago (before I was participating) and have remained unresolved.

Personally, I'd like to move away from trying to determine "who said what and when", and move on to focus on more important matters like: What is it that's causing us to be in disagreement?

What once seemed like a matter of Hyper-grace vs Hyper-works now seems to be a matter of discerning who believes what (which is not up to any of us to discern).

 

[JaumeJ]

PW......a few hours ago you were bidding us fare-thee-well. NOw I bid all fate-the-well and with God's blessing I pray to see you all tomorrow.......we will work things out, well, God will........good night from here.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I second this. Let's get down to the real issues and put everybody on the spot to see what they really believe.

I hope you are sincere

But we have been asking you to do this for months now, to just ask us what we believe, and stop telling us what we believe.

.. And you have refused.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

This unfortunately is not true. We asked him questions at the start and he never answered them other than posting web site responses. It was all propoganda and not what he actually believed. After time you realise for him, what he believes does not matter, he hides behind teachers and articles.

This is the truth.