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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#161
#161
GeneralArminius said:
The Doctrine is that someone who is in God's hands cannot be taken out.
If you become wicked and sinful you will be ashamed in Heaven when you get there.
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Every person in this room, If they make it to heaven. WIll be ashamed Because they will see themselves as the true sinner they are.

Thats why they will fall on their face. Why they will say things like their lips are undone (they know they are unclean) Collapse as dead (see Daniel and John)

Anyone who thinks they will get to heaven and be proud of their work and how good they were. Do not know God at all. and probably will not be in heaven.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#162
#162
Armini3 said:
that's because he repented...
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He never stopped being the son. He lost his fathers blessings, and help in this world. not his sonship
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#163
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
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#163
1 Corinthians 1:8-9 (NASB)

[SUP]8 [/SUP] who will also confirm you to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.
[SUP]9[/SUP] God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Ephesians 1:4 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love

Ephesians 5:26-27 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
[SUP]27 [/SUP] that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless.

Colossians 1:22 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—

Jude 1:24 (NASB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling, and to make you stand in the presence of His glory blameless with great joy,

Philippians 1:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.



 
C

Chuckt

Guest
#164
#164
eternally-gratefull said:

Every person in this room, If they make it to heaven. WIll be ashamed Because they will see themselves as the true sinner they are.

Thats why they will fall on their face. Why they will say things like their lips are undone (they know they are unclean) Collapse as dead (see Daniel and John)

Anyone who thinks they will get to heaven and be proud of their work and how good they were. Do not know God at all. and probably will not be in heaven.
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No I won't. I will be wearing the wedding garment which is the shed blood of Jesus Christ.

Exodus 12:7 And they shall take of the blood, and strike it on the two side posts and on the upper door post of the houses, wherein they shall eat it.
Exodus 12:12 For I will pass through the land of Egypt this night, and will smite all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the gods of Egypt I will execute judgment: I am the LORD.
Exodus 12:13 And the blood shall be to you for a token upon the houses where ye are: and when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and the plague shall not be upon you to destroy you, when I smite the land of Egypt.

Jesus is my passover and that lets me approach the throne of grace:

Hebrews 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

We are to come boldly unto the throne of grace and we did something wrong because it says, "that we may obtain mercy".

You can come with your own righteousness but it isn't your blood on the door that will save you. It wasn't works that saved the Israelites. It was the blood. Jesus is my righteousness and my passover lamb and because Jesus shed His blood, God's judgment will pass over me.
 
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John146

Senior Member
#165
Jan 13, 2016
16,756
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#165
Yes, for us, it's an example of a life spent on carnal living with inheritance and rewards at stake. Those that live carnally like the Corinthians were, will suffer the loss of rewards. That's why Paul talked about it in 1 Corinthians 3. Christians should strive like Paul, to receive a full inheritance. The prodigal's brother is an example of a man staying by his father and being obedient and receiving his full inheritance from the father.

eternally-gratefull said:
He never stopped being the son. He lost his fathers blessings, and help in this world. not his sonship
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John146

Senior Member
#166
Jan 13, 2016
16,756
3,562
113
#166
The prodigals brother is kind of like all the judgmental group accusing other believers for living carnally and they lose their salvation. "What business does God have in killing the fatted calf for them?"

eternally-gratefull said:
He never stopped being the son. He lost his fathers blessings, and help in this world. not his sonship
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HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

Senior Member
#167
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#167
John146 said:
The prodigals brother is kind of like all the judgmental group accusing other believers for living carnally and they lose their salvation. "What business does God have in killing the fatted calf for them?"
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IF the prodigal had not repented, he would have been lost, son or not.
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#168
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,430
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#168
John146 said:
Yes, for us, it's an example of a life spent on carnal living with inheritance and rewards at stake. Those that live carnally like the Corinthians were, will suffer the loss of rewards. That's why Paul talked about it in 1 Corinthians 3. Christians should strive like Paul, to receive a full inheritance. The prodigal's brother is an example of a man staying by his father and being obedient and receiving his full inheritance from the father.
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I liked your statement here as it lines up with what Paul wrote to the Corinthians.

Just an observation about the 2 sons:

I noticed that the elder son although he stayed in the house - he too didn't enjoy the inheritance as he said to his father - " you have never even offered me a goat for me to use ". It seems he too like the younger son - didn't know the love of the Father nor really knew him for who He really is. This is a great analogy as many outside the church are living - not knowing they are sons like the younger son. - The older brother is in the same boat as the younger one - not knowing the love of the Father nor experiencing the inheritance that is theirs.

There are many religious people that don't know the love of the Father nor what is theirs because they are in Christ now and are in fact in the very same boat relationally.

The son would have lost his life if he continued to live below his status but he would have died on this earth as the Father's son.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#169
#169
Chuckt said:
No I won't. I will be wearing the wedding garment which is the shed blood of Jesus Christ.

Exodus 12:7 And they shall take of the blood, and strike it on the two side posts and on the upper door post of the houses, wherein they shall eat it.
Exodus 12:12 For I will pass through the land of Egypt this night, and will smite all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the gods of Egypt I will execute judgment: I am the LORD.
Exodus 12:13 And the blood shall be to you for a token upon the houses where ye are: and when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and the plague shall not be upon you to destroy you, when I smite the land of Egypt.

Jesus is my passover and that lets me approach the throne of grace:

Hebrews 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

We are to come boldly unto the throne of grace and we did something wrong because it says, "that we may obtain mercy".

You can come with your own righteousness but it isn't your blood on the door that will save you. It wasn't works that saved the Israelites. It was the blood. Jesus is my righteousness and my passover lamb and because Jesus shed His blood, God's judgment will pass over me.
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Sorry friend, When you look at your life, You will be horrified at how sinful you were.

I did not say you will not be saved, I said you will not be their puffed up as to how good you were.
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#170
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
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#170
eternally-gratefull said:
He never stopped being the son. He lost his fathers blessings, and help in this world. not his sonship
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Amen...well said... the works-based mindset says that the son was lost which means to them that they go to hell because that is part of their religious beliefs. They become "un-sonned" ( which is total religious nonsense )

The grace-based mindset focuses on what Jesus has already done in His finished work for them and sees the son as not living in the reality of who he really is in Christ and thus not inheriting the benefits that being in the kingdom brings while on this earth.
 
HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

Senior Member
#171
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#171
Grace777x70 said:
Amen...well said... the works-based mindset says that the son was lost which means to them that they go to hell because that is part of their religious beliefs. They become "un-sonned" ( which is total religious nonsense )

The grace-based mindset focuses on what Jesus has already done in His finished work for them and sees the son as not living in the reality of who he really is in Christ and thus not inheriting the benefits that being in the kingdom brings while on this earth.
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The lawless-grace-based mindset says that the prodigal son was found even though the father said he was lost. This mindset will turn anything on its head to avoid having to deal with the reality that salvation is not based on nature, but on the obedience of abiding in GOD.
 
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valiant

Senior Member
#172
Mar 22, 2015
8,025
124
63
#172
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
IF the prodigal had not repented, he would have been lost, son or not.
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LOL this is a PARABLE. Parables are not to be treated as analogies. The prodigal son was not a son of God. He was the son of his earthly father. He repented to his father. His father was not God. Therefore his relationship to his father was irrelevant from God's point of view.
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#173
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,430
0
#173
Romans 4:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] just as David also speaks of the blessing on the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:

Our enemy comes as "ministers of righteousness " but it is "their" righteousness and what "they do" and not on Christ's righteousness.

The enemy doesn't come and say " Sin all you want " - he says to create your own righteousness and thus not depend on His righteousness alone for salvation.

2 Corinthians 11:14-15 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to "their" works. ( notice that it is "their" works )

We are saved by grace through faith only. We are in Christ now and have been created in our inner man in righteousness and holiness. This is all God's doing! We are His sons and daughters because we are in Christ now and we are a new creation and we are partakers of His divine nature. 2 Peter 1:4

Titus 3:5-7 (KJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
[SUP]7 [/SUP] That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
 
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roaringkitten

Guest
#174
#174
We will always cry out "worthy is the Lamb", for He gave us eternal salvation! We didn't keep it ourselves, it was kept by the power of God(1 Pet 1:5) Note the focus in the following passage, it's all on the Lamb!

"And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands; Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing. And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." Rev 5:11-13
 
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HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

Senior Member
#175
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
113
#175
valiant said:
LOL this is a PARABLE. Parables are not to be treated as analogies. The prodigal son was not a son of God. He was the son of his earthly father. He repented to his father. His father was not God. Therefore his relationship to his father was irrelevant from God's point of view.
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What a strange thing to say. Parables are analogies.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#176
#176
roaringkitten said:
We will always cry out "worthy is the Lamb", for He gave us eternal salvation! We didn't keep it ourselves, it was kept by the power of God(1 Pet 1:5) Note the focus in the following passage, it's all on the Lamb!

"And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands; Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing. And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." Rev 5:11-13
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Amen,

We had no power to save ourselves

How can anyone think we have power to keep ourselves saved.

We have no power period. We are worthy of death. Thats all..
 
C

Chuckt

Guest
#177
#177
eternally-gratefull said:
Sorry friend, When you look at your life, You will be horrified at how sinful you were.

I did not say you will not be saved, I said you will not be their puffed up as to how good you were.
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Mercy is getting what you don't deserve because Jesus didn't come to call the righteous for heaven but sinners to repentance.

It isn't your blood that is on the door and if you try to come in your own righteousness then the angel of death won't pass over you.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#178
#178
Chuckt said:
Mercy is getting what you don't deserve because Jesus didn't come to call the righteous for heaven but sinners to repentance.

It isn't your blood that is on the door and if you try to come in your own righteousness then the angel of death won't pass over you.
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I agree 100%

Not sure you understand what I am saying though,
 
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John146

Senior Member
#180
Jan 13, 2016
16,756
3,562
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#180
You would never know the peace of God. You would never know if you've done enough to abide in Him. How do you know you're even saved? How do you know you're doing enough?

HeRoseFromTheDead said:
The lawless-grace-based mindset says that the prodigal son was found even though the father said he was lost. This mindset will turn anything on its head to avoid having to deal with the reality that salvation is not based on nature, but on the obedience of abiding in GOD.
Click to expand...
 
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