Losing Salvation

[gb9]

He is misunderstanding and discounting that that verse is true. There are so many other scriptures that use the word 'if'.

their is also many verses that say God through Christ saves us. Titus 3 spells this out nicely.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

The law of grace is in respect to Christ's work of faith, it is not of our own-selves. It is of His three day labor of love. He is the just and justifier according to that work.

Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Faith without works is like grace without works.So works are required just no of our own selves least any man boast in false pride.

Can you show me where the law of grace is mentioned in scripture?

 

[KJV1611]

Since we all have sinned and continue to sin after we're saved, at what point do we lose our salvation? Is it a specific sin or a certain number of sins?

 

[WarriorForChrist]

This is the same bickering that happens all the time. I think people just need to agree to disagree including myself.

 

[PurerInHeart]

To one He will say, "Well done good and faithful SERVANT." And to another say, "You wicked and lazy servant."

 

[gb9]

That's not what the bible says.

yes it does say that. you just do want to see it that way. because you are glorifying self, not Christ.

 

[Grace777x70]

There is a way to lose your salvation ( as if it is "yours" that obtain it for you ).....but you have to be able to use a lot of imagination and have a very ,low opinion of our Lord's sacrifice and the integrity of our Father..( oh brother.. )

John 10:27-30 (NASB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;

[SUP]28 [/SUP] and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.

[SUP]29 [/SUP] "My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
[SUP]30 [/SUP] "I and the Father are one."

You have to be NOT a "no one"...so to works=based mindsets no one means every one else but ourselves.......this is nonsense..

All's you do is wrestle yourself out of Jesus' hand..then once you have Him beat..then you are ready to take on the Father. ( He's a little tougher but you will have experience now on how to pluck yourself out of His hand )

In order to scare Jesus and the Father first you must..I repeat MUST intimidate Them with your mighty power by verbally accusing Them....you can tell them that they lied when He said " I will never leave nor forsake you"

Then because you are in Christ...He is going to have to stop being a High Priest for you..( again God lied when He said He is a priest forever...)

His blood which He spilled for all sins that supposedly have been taken away..that has to stop too being efficacious ....Jesus has to stop being the Lamb of God.

Even in the Old Covenant the priest looked at the lamb for blemishes..not the guy who brought the sacrifice.. the Father looks at Jesus....He is our Lamb! He is spotless and blameless.

.."...as He is..so also are we in this world.."

It's all really ridiculous..our salvation is not based on us..it is based on Jesus and His finished work!..He is faithful and grace much more abounds around sin...it's just plain "spiritual ignorance that has gone to seed " to think of His perfect work and that somehow it revolves around us and what we do.

John 10:28 (NASB)
[SUP]28 [/SUP] and I "give" eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.

Romans 5:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the "gift" of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.

Romans 11:29 (KJV)
[SUP]29 [/SUP] For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

( Somehow some obscure passages of scripture that people take without looking at it in context nullifies all the vast proof of scriptures that speak otherwise of the integrity of God and HIs completed work....is it possible we have those scriptures interpreted wrong because we look through the wrong "lens"?...of course.. )

 

[Vdp]

If Salvation is based on not sinning then yes we can lose our Salvation by sinning.

If Salvation is based on being Baptized then yes we would need to be re-baptized again.

HeRoseFromTheDead does teach and believe we receive Salvation by being Baptized. Therefore every time we sin and lose our Salvation one does have to be Baptized again if one believes we receive Salvation by Baptism!

All those who teach Baptism is required for Salvation NEED to have themselves re-baptized to receive Salvation again.

Every time you sin ,HeRoseFromTheDead, and lose your Salvation you NEED to be Baptized again in order to receive your Salvation again.

Have you been re-baptized HeRoseFromTheDead? IF not, then you really do not believe we receive Salvation by Baptism!

IF Faith + Grace + Baptism = Salvation then every time you sin you need Faith + Grace + Baptism to receive Salvation again!

 

[nowyouseem033]

He is misunderstanding and discounting that that verse is true. There are so many other scriptures that use the word 'if'.

do you understand that "if" does not mean "when" ?

if is used as a hypothetical not to be taken literal.

let me give you an example.
"if I want to go to buy some chocolate, that would mean I need money"

notice it is not to be taken literally. im saying if it were to happen NOT that this is wwhats happening.

please understand biblical contextualization

 

[PurerInHeart]

do you understand that "if" does not mean "when" ?

if is used as a hypothetical not to be taken literal.

let me give you an example.
"if I want to go to buy some chocolate, that would mean I need money"

notice it is not to be taken literally. im saying if it were to happen NOT that this is wwhats happening.

please understand biblical contextualization

IF I want chocolate I will have to buy it in order to get it. If is conditional- the condition is "I'll give you the chocolate IF you give me the money."

 

[PurerInHeart]

Matthew 25:30 The lazy servant lost his salvation. Both were His servants. But one did not DO the will of His Father.

 

[PurerInHeart]

I'm not trying to argue, just trying to help you see the truth.

 

[psychomom]

sigh

 

[Gr8grace]

I agree.... and I think that by "persevere" we are to continue in our walk with Christ... which does NOT mean we will never sin again, it simply means our shortcomings and failures are covered with the grace of God.

Like was stated earlier, it's when we willfully walk AWAY from God, no longer desiring a relationship with Him, that we lose our salvation.... the "unpardonable" sin. God will not FORCE forgiveness and salvation on us. If we CHOOSE to reject Him, that's unpardonable.

If a believer thinks that salvation can be lost............The believer has already walked away from the Lord Jesus Christ and no longer has an intimate SECURE relationship with the perfectly Honest God........

Rom 8~~38For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[notuptome]

We are saved by grace. Grace is unmerited and undeserved. We can never merit or deserve grace. Salvation is a gift, a gift given because God loves us not the we loved God.

Christ bought us with a price, His precious blood. We are no longer our own we are His. We were under the condemnation of sin and we were not able to escape sin. We are now under the righteousness of Christ and we cannot escape God.

To teach that we can effect our salvation in any fashion is to replace salvation with sanctification. Sanctification relates to service whereas salvation is solely about Christ and the atonement His blood provides for us. Christ Himself mediates the new covenant eternally before the Father in heaven. Accusing Christ of being unable to keep those who are His is just plain silly.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Grace777x70]

There are a lot of times in the original greek the "if" is actually a statement of it is fulfilled.....example

Colossians 1:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.


If so be that ye continue in the faith ([FONT="Gentium" !important]ei ge epimenete tēi pistei[/FONT]). Condition of the first class (determined as fulfilled),

A.T. Robertson Word Pictures in the New Testament.

Example in modern english....you went to the bank..and I say to you.... If you went to the at the bank...give me a $100 bucks.

I'll take a check too...

 

[PurerInHeart]

People just don't seem to understand that God only gives the gift of grace to those who obey Him. Nothing we could ever do could wash away even one sin, so it is not our obedience that saves- but God's grace. But we don't continue to receive it unless we continue to obey Him. HE says IF you confess your sins and have fellowship with Him then He will continue to cleanse you. How do people skidaddle right on over the word 'if'?

 

[Grace777x70]

Matthew 25:30 The lazy servant lost his salvation. Both were His servants. But one did not DO the will of His Father.

Here is a great grace-based teaching on Matthew 25. I use this website as it tackles obscure scriptures and it has comments on the bottom where people have asked questions. I think you will find that the truth of the gospel of the grace of Christ is truly freeing and brings life to all that hear it.

The Parable of the Talents (Matthew 25:14-30)

https://escapetoreality.org/2015/05/19/parable-of-the-talents-matthew-25/

 

[garee]

Faith without works is dead, a dead faith does not save you.

I would agree .Dead faith, as the kind of faith we would offer towards God produces dead works .It His faith that works in us, it is not of our own-selves. A distinction as to whose faith of God as the things of God or that of things of men as to which direction should be made. The binding direction must come towards from heaven . There is much confusion because of it.

Heb 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

 

[psychomom]

perhaps we don't understand what adoption meant in the ancient world?