Seducing spirits and doctrines of devils

[simplifiedtruth]

Hello simplifiedtruth,

It is important to understand that the commandments that Jesus is speaking about is not regarding the ten commandments of the law of Moses i.e. to keep the law. But the commandments are to believe in the One whom God sent and to love one another. We are under a new covenant, which is not like the first covenant. For if the first covenant had been faultless, there would have been no need for a second covenant to replace it. Grace and the works of the law are at odds with each other. Through the grace of God we receive forgiveness of sin through faith in the Christ who provided salvation for us. If we count on our keeping the works of the law as a means of obtaining salvation, it will have the opposite affect, keeping us out of the kingdom of God. Here is what Paul had to say about being under the law:

"For when I tried to keep the law, it condemned me. So I died to the law--I stopped trying to meet all its requirements--so that I might live for God."

"God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God. Salvation is not a reward for the good things we have done, so none of us can boast about it."

"Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the works God requires?” Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”

Therefore, our salvation is not obtained by the keeping of ordinances and regulations, but by faith in Christ. And when anyone sins, if we confess our sins he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and cleanses us of all unrighteousness. If we are attempting to walk as Christ walked and are lead by the Spirit, then will not be living according to the sinful nature but will be sowing to the Spirit.

I am not talking about How we receive Jesus Christ as our Saviour or how we are forgiven. I am talking about being Obedient to the Faith by obeying the Words of Jesus Christ. You are very clearly wrong about keeping the commandments in obedience to the father. Jesus and Paul (same gospel) both taught that we obey the law and teach others to do the same (Rom 3:31, Matt 5:17-19).

You really are ignoring these words:

1. Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
2. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
3. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
4. Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

These particular verses are talking about the commandments of the Father in the Torah, not another law.

If we are to believe in Jesus Christ, we have to also believe in He's teachings which he commanded us to Obey:

Matthew 23:1-2 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 2Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: 3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not. (Moses seat is the reading of the Law).

Matthew 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. 24Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

Matthew 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

 

[ember]

so just what does Romans 3 really say? does it say we have to keep the law?


27Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith.

28For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.

29Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too,

30since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.

31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.


not according to Paul...you cannot take one verse out of context...

just wanted to demonstrate what happens when you string verses together to try and force them to say what they do not in fact, say

just for the benefit of any observers who may just read something without looking up the scripture

I'm not going to debate this nor do I wish to debate this with anyone because the verses do not say we have to keep the law to save us...they say the opposite

Shalom!

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

Yeah you can take a verse out of its original context and use it as Paul did, you just do it correctly.

 

[ember]

And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body. And be thankful.Colossians 3:15

Enter into his gates with thanksgiving, [and] into his courts with praise: be thankful unto him, [and] bless his name. Psalm 100:4

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

You can remove verses from their context and still remain in context to what you are expounding on,

After all Jesus comes in the volume of the books and said the scriptures testify of me.

In Moses here

Duet 18:18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him

In Christ here

John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.

In Moses again here

Duet 18:19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

In Christ again this way

John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken , the same shall judge him in the last day.

Skip a verse if you want here and show He spake by commandment

John 12:50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Touch upon Moses being a faithful servant and for a testimony of those things that would be spoken after Heb3:5

Again here in Acts

Acts 17:37 This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear.

Lets come back to the begining of Acts now speaking of the same

Acts 3:23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

Of his apostles (he that received you) receiveth me (and he that receiveth me) the one who sent even me because he gave them the words (given him)

John 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them

Spoken by him and confirmed by them also who heard him

Heb 2:1 Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.

Which is the word of this salvation in Christ as it als says,

Heb 2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

 

[ember]

as far as the east is from the west, so far has he removed our transgressions from us. Psalm 103:12

 

[ember]

19Therefore, brothers and sisters, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus,

20by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body,

21and since we have a great priest over the house of God,

22let us draw near to God with a sincere heart and with the full assurance that faith brings, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water.

3Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful.

24And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds,

25not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

HEBREWS 10

 

[simplifiedtruth]

so just what does Romans 3 really say? does it say we have to keep the law?


27Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith.

28For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.

29Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too,

30since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.

31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.


not according to Paul...you cannot take one verse out of context...

just wanted to demonstrate what happens when you string verses together to try and force them to say what they do not in fact, say

just for the benefit of any observers who may just read something without looking up the scripture

I'm not going to debate this nor do I wish to debate this with anyone because the verses do not say we have to keep the law to save us...they say the opposite

Shalom!

Are you reading my post or do you only see what you want to see ? As already said "I am not talking about How we receive Jesus Christ as our Saviour or how we are forgiven. I am talking about being Obedient to the Faith by obeying the Words of Jesus Christ. You are very clearly wrong about keeping the commandments in obedience to the father. Jesus and Paul (same gospel) both taught that we obey the law and teach others to do the same (Rom 3:31, Matt 5:17-19)."

You are talking about how we are justified through Christ, which is not what I am talking about.
Why do you ignore the verses I post that clearly states without a shadow of a doubt we are to teach and obey the Law/torah ? Are you preaching another Gospel ? Or are you confused about what I am saying ?

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

And this way in Abraham

As God said Abimelech

Gen 20:7 Now therefore restore the man (Abraham) his wife; for he is a prophet

God shown speaking by the prophets in this way

Hosea 12:10 I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, by the ministry of the prophets.

He used similitudes by the ministry of the prophets

How about in Abraham's case, can we observe such a thing?

Yes,

Gal 4:22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.

Which things are what?

Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory (Gasp!) for these are (Double Gasp!) the two covenants

1Cr 2:13 Which things also we speak, (Gasps again!) not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. (Gasps again!)

Comparing spiritual things with spiritual requires you to move around while making those comparisons and have them confirm the same in those comparisons

Edit it to highlight the verses are being taken from here and there out of the contexts and used correctly

 

[ember]

39But we do not belong to those who shrink back and are destroyed, but to those who have faith and are saved. Hebrews 10

4In all my prayers for all of you, I always pray with joy5because of your partnership in the gospel from the first day until now,

6 being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.
Phil 1

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

Folks can quote to me the scripture all day I will not argue with it as I dont disaagree with any of the scripture, what I disagree with was peoples judgment that the verses cannot be removed from the contexts and used correctly.

They can be, and it can be demonstrated using that same means they seem to condemn.

 

[RobbyEarl]

Folks can quote to me the scripture all day I will not argue with it as I dont disaagree with any of the scripture, what I disagree with was peoples judgment that the verses cannot be removed from the contexts and used correctly.

They can be, and it can be demonstrated using that same means they seem to condemn.

It must be in context or you could say there is no God, but in in context it say's that the foll has said in his heart there is no God. You can't just take a verse and make a doctrine.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

It must be in context or you could say there is no God, but in in context it say's that the foll has said in his heart there is no God. You can't just take a verse and make a doctrine.

I am talking about removing verses (even sentences) within various paragraphs and/or books as Paul also did in Romans (as was shown earlier) and various other places to show a thing. It can be done, others condemn it then go off and string scriptures together elsewhere where they feel justify in doing so.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

It must be in context or you could say there is no God, but in in context it say's that the foll has said in his heart there is no God. You can't just take a verse and make a doctrine.

That would be handling the word of deceitfully. Also that would contradict multitudes of other scriptures. When comparing spiritual things with spiritual it will confirm the Truth and not contradict other parts of scripture. The context is in the whole of the message using multiple verses of scripture from many parts of the Bible, it is not building a false doctrine by misrepresenting a single verse.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

I am talking about removing verses (even sentences) within various paragraphs and/or books as Paul also did in Romans (as was shown earlier) and various other places to show a thing. It can be done, others condemn it then go off and string scriptures together elsewhere where they feel justify in doing so.

They condemn it because they do not understand the message, nor do they believe in it, neither can they receive it. Remember, it is written "they speak evil of things they understand not"

 

[simplifiedtruth]

I am talking about removing verses (even sentences) within various paragraphs and/or books as Paul also did in Romans (as was shown earlier) and various other places to show a thing. It can be done, others condemn it then go off and string scriptures together elsewhere where they feel justify in doing so.

2 Peter 3:14-18 Therefore, beloved, since you are waiting for these, be diligent to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. 15And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.17You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability. 18But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

They are twisting the scriptures into their own personal interpretation which Peter warned about.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

They condemn it because they do not understand the message, nor do they believe in it, neither can they receive it. Remember, it is written "they speak evil of things they understand not"

Thats possible in this case, afterall the NT is made up of quotes pulled out of the OT to prove Jesus Christ, who not only fulfilled those concerning himself (as they do testify of him) and are helpful in proving Christ also. So you can move from the OT into the gospels and into the epistles as they so lead us. Just as Jesus would speak in a parable, and we can see both parables and similitides and the Holy Ghost who teaches by way of comparison, and you gotta move to compare.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

2 Peter 3:14-18 Therefore, beloved, since you are waiting for these, be diligent to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. 15And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.17You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability. 18But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

They are twisting the scriptures into their own personal interpretation which Peter warned about.

I dont really know, I dont read them all too closely I try to avoid them as much as possible as I would any contentious person.

 

[simplifiedtruth]

Paul taught all scripture is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction and for instruction in righteousness that the man of God may be perfect, and warned about those who are ever learning but are reprobate concerning the faith, and resist the truth:

2 Timothy 3:Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. 8Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith. 9But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was.10But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience, 11Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me. 12Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.13But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.14But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 15And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Paul believed in in all the law and in prophets:

Acts 24:13 Neither can they prove the things whereof they now accuse me.14But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Paul kept the sabbath:

Acts 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
Acts 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.

Paul kept the Feasts and commanded to do so:

Acts 20:6And we sailed away from Philippi after the days of unleavened bread, and came unto them to Troas in five days; where we abode seven days.

Acts 20:16 For Paul had determined to sail by Ephesus, because he would not spend the time in Asia: for he hasted, if it were possible for him, to be at Jerusalem the day of Pentecost.

1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: 8Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

Paul stated we establish the Torah:

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

Paul taught from the Torah:

Acts 28:23 And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening.

Paul Obeyed the Torah:

Acts 21:24 Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.

Romans 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Paul took Delight in the Torah:

Romans 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

Paul taught us to imitate him:

1 Corinthians 4:16 Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.

1 Corinthians 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.

Jesus told us to repent from our sins and obey the law:

Matthew 4:7 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Matthew 5:17-19 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.20For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Luke 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Matthew 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

Matthew 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: 3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Matthew 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

Matthew 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Jesus warned against hypocrisy:

Luke 12:1 In the mean time, when there were gathered together an innumerable multitude of people, insomuch that they trode one upon another, he began to say unto his disciples first of all, Beware ye of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.

Jesus warned those who believe in him but don't keep the law:

Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.22On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’23And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

Jesus taught freedom from being a servant to sin:

John 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

John 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Sin is transgression of the Law:

1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

He that walks with Christ does not commit sin:

Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? 3Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? 4Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. 5For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: 6Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7For he that is dead is freed from sin.

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. 8He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

1 John 3:2 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him. 6He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Here is the solution when we sin and fall short:

1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

You can highlight the way, as Christ is the way

Acts 24:13-14 Neither can they prove the things whereof they now accuse me. But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.