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It almost seems like there are Christians out there who dont believe we should say "its a sin". I have no idea why they think this is God's will.
And yes, that is an accusation. But that really seems to be their argument. God told us sin leads to death. God loved us so much that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life.
Why is it hateful for us to stand on His word on this issue? What the singer is doing is wrong, his new message is wrong, and I pray that he comes back to the Lord and becomes an awesome testimony. But he is still in the wrong.
And yes, that is an accusation. But that really seems to be their argument. God told us sin leads to death. God loved us so much that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life.
Why is it hateful for us to stand on His word on this issue? What the singer is doing is wrong, his new message is wrong, and I pray that he comes back to the Lord and becomes an awesome testimony. But he is still in the wrong.
M
Unlike some on the forum who make up all this unbiblical nonsense about how to save sinners ..some of us have actually done the work and know very well how God works to humble folks unto a saving knowledge of Christ. Some seem they want folks to join a social club or group instead of surrender to The Lord God Almighty.
M
God gave us a whole nation (garden) to keep and shape in His image ...like Adam ..if we turn it over to the snakes ..then we bring shame upon ourselves and reject the will of God. Anyone that don't understand its our responsibility to shape our society in godliness ..is NOT HEARING God as they should.
Whenever I'm reading what folks been posting here...sorta makes me a wee bit sad. Fear, fire and brimstone is the remedy...those poor people will never be listening to none of yall if this is how they are shown the right path. I know yall mean well, but folks ain't getting shed of their sinful ways cuz folks are shouting at them. I'll be praying for them and for all yall
Job 28:28
And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.
Seems many people today have lost their fear of God. He is a loving God and a merciful God...but he means exactly what he says...Hell is real and it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of a living God. God knows exactly what it takes to reach every man. Sometimes it is fear like Mitspa has been saying. We have to hold up the word of God and speak his truth because that is the true love of God. I don't think God wants us to mislead anyone. God's way is holy and clean and he knows exactly how to reach everyone.
Anyhow, God bless you and I'll be praying for you and everyone else as well
Sorry if it came across that way...I wasn't trying to be rude...Just stating my beliefs about it...and some scripture from the word of God...but I'm sure if you reread your own post you can see how that might have sounded a little condescending and rude to some..Comments here are sometimes really hard to judge...Anyhow hope you have a good day, and I was sincere about praying for you and everyone else as well.
D
No, but believers can get off course for a good while. I did for a long time, and came back. I didn't get saved twice, and in the middle of confusion where I didn't know up from down and partied and hung out with bad people, conviction still showed up unexpectedly. If he knows God, God will bring him back to His ways in due time.
If this man makes the choice to come back to God, leave his own wisdom of whats right and whats wrong behind, and follows Him again, then absolutely. God can call us, but we still have to choose to follow Him. But right now, he is leading people down a bad path, and I do not want to encourage anyone anywhere that he is a good role model for those who want to follow Christ. He is taking the wrong road, one that leads away from God. It is not "hate" that makes me say that, it is the word of God. I also have fallen away from Him and did what I knew was wrong. And I hope that he will come back too. But right now, he is preaching the wrong message, and is not guiding anyone to the Lord.
I hear what you are saying...all I am saying is that often...those who want to shape society live in turmoil right where they are. If you can't get your own side of the street clean you have no business cleaning the other side and telling them they are doing it wrong.....and that goes for both sides of the isle.
I am not sure what you mean but I did not say "attracted to the same sex". Attraction is natural in the context of normality between those of the opposite sex. But in the attraction from a Biblical world view self-control is needed .
If a Christian is being tempted with homosexuality which Christ has saved them from is different too. The bible says being tempted is not a sin; unless Lust of that individual's heart is acted on. Jesus was tempted in all points as man YET HE did not sin.
The point is the term "gay Christian " is not biblical . There is no such thing. God saves of from our sin , not as we live a life in sin.
If a Christian is being tempted with homosexuality which Christ has saved them from is different too. The bible says being tempted is not a sin; unless Lust of that individual's heart is acted on. Jesus was tempted in all points as man YET HE did not sin.
The point is the term "gay Christian " is not biblical . There is no such thing. God saves of from our sin , not as we live a life in sin.
I respect your opinion but it is not true your question you asked biblically "That would tend to suggest that people are indeed born gay, would it not ? ". That is human reason not the word of God. Nowhere in the Bible will you find God made dunkers , adultery's, liars etc...
If He did then how could HE be a righteous Judge?. Sin is that of the flesh which is very well defined in the Word of God Rom 1. And in other places. As far as being attacked for disagreeing I am not awere of that. But please know what I am going to say you can agree or not, that too is fine. But The Holy Spirit will not teach us anything against the words of Jesus. Matt 5,6, 7 our Lord Speaking tells us it is a heart issue not a birth issue.
You also asked could I ever see myself at any point choosing to be gay? No nor did I know what gay was until it was shown to me , as was drugs or alcohol or sex. These thing appealed to my flesh the sinful nature which is lust of thing against God.
The gay narrative suggest it is not the homosexuals fault for being gay; who would in their right mind choose this life style that is so destructive ? The something can be asked of the drug addict, gambler, drunker etc... We cannot justify a sin because the majority see it as abnormal then drinking and getting drunk. But we cannot dismiss drunkness either because both homosexuality and drunkness will not enter the kingdom of God.
all sin produces the same effect ...... death: The good news is Jesus came to save us from our sin.
But to suggest that one is born this way while purposefully over looking all of the many factors that could have contributed to any sinful act could be used to justify the sin one does and continues to do.
I was not born a drunk, nor a adulterer, nor fornicator I was born a sinner and willfully choose what sin I wanted to do. I was guilty and deserved to go to hell but Jesus Christ set me free. And what HE did for me HE can do for all.
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Your point is is human reasoning that is not founded in truth. How can one assume that what is perceived as natural feels when our feeling deceive us all the time? When our feeling go against the Word of God we obey the word of god and not act on our feelings . The reason why one feels vile, disgusted, and sick with shame is told to us in the bible. it called Condemnation. That is how sin works we have the false feeling produced by a lust of the flesh to do what God said do not do and when we willfully do that sin , we suffer Condemnation. These why the message of the Cross is so powerful IN Christ we do not have condemnation HE sets us free . My feelings do not change the word of God . having sex is natural act but self-control and obeying the word of God I have sex in the context that HE ordained it to be. I may have the nature feeling to reproduce but I do not use that feeling in a unnatural way or outside the ordination of God .
HE sets us free . My feelings do not change the word of God . having sex is natural act but self-control and obeying the word of God I have sex in the context that HE ordained it to be. I may have the nature feeling to reproduce but I do not use that feeling in a unnatural way or outside the ordination of God .
V
There seems to be a misconception that homosexual people are unaware Christians think their lifestyle is a sin. Calling out homosexuality as being "sinful" is almost universally understood by most homosexuals in the world who are familiar with Christian ideology. The real issue is that they don't perceive it to be a sin, where as most Christians do.
Reminding a sinner than their sin is sinful, seems redundant and ineffective. It's a superficial and not so efficient method of converting a homosexual lifestyle into a heterosexual lifestyle. If simply saying, "practicing homosexuality is a sin" helped people to NOT be gay, then there would virtually be a 0 population homosexual community. Obviously, "reminding" them of their sin isn't going to do much in the grand scheme of evoking change in their lifestyle.
So what is the better alternative? Show them love. Love one another. Show them how much God loves them. Remind them of Christ's sacrifice that He made on our behalf so that we could live together with our Father in Heaven. Pray and ask the Holy Spirit to speak through you to soften the hardness of their hearts, so they can be convicted by the Spirit of God and can see the error of their ways. If, by some small chance, they are unaware that their lifestyle is a sin, then of course explain why it is sinful by showing him/her the word of God. If they already know you think it's a sin, and all you do is say, "it's a sin!", you run a high chance of turning that person off and hardening their heart even more. They know this... tell them something they may NOT know... Even this isn't a guarantee you'll win them over, but you at least increase your odds significantly.
Reminding a sinner than their sin is sinful, seems redundant and ineffective. It's a superficial and not so efficient method of converting a homosexual lifestyle into a heterosexual lifestyle. If simply saying, "practicing homosexuality is a sin" helped people to NOT be gay, then there would virtually be a 0 population homosexual community. Obviously, "reminding" them of their sin isn't going to do much in the grand scheme of evoking change in their lifestyle.
So what is the better alternative? Show them love. Love one another. Show them how much God loves them. Remind them of Christ's sacrifice that He made on our behalf so that we could live together with our Father in Heaven. Pray and ask the Holy Spirit to speak through you to soften the hardness of their hearts, so they can be convicted by the Spirit of God and can see the error of their ways. If, by some small chance, they are unaware that their lifestyle is a sin, then of course explain why it is sinful by showing him/her the word of God. If they already know you think it's a sin, and all you do is say, "it's a sin!", you run a high chance of turning that person off and hardening their heart even more. They know this... tell them something they may NOT know... Even this isn't a guarantee you'll win them over, but you at least increase your odds significantly.
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K
People need to spread the Gospel as they feel called to do. All this arguing accomplishes nothing.People need to do as they feel the Lord is speaking to them and let others do the same. The Bible says the Gospel will not return void. As long as you are sharing the truth of the Gospel with them,the work is being accomplished. That covers people who are outside the church. But the OP wasn't about that.It was about a Christian who has backslidden and believes that God is ok with his sin. He needs to step down from ministry and get right with the Lord. We're not talking about someone outside the church that doesn't know, we're talking about someone who does know the truth. And that is what the OP is about. He needs to step down until he gets right with God,period.
V
I wasn't speaking about the OP directly. I just read page after page of people who are hyper sensitive when someone says that maybe telling them it's a sin when they already know what you think is not really fruitful. It's one thing if the person sincerely had no idea it was sinful, it's another when they know what Christian culture and the views there within already but they believe differently.
I also think many people are one trick ponies... they use their go-to move which is just to state "homosexuality is a sin". That doesn't seem to be beneficial at all. I just encourage people to add to their repertoire of other and more effective teaching methods and tools from the bible that homosexual people might be unaware of... I can assure you, they very well know most Christians think it's a sin.
As for allowing people to spread the gospel, I fully agree. Often times though, contempt to a peculiar lifestyle is easily masked behind cheap, generic, and empty cliches such as "homosexuality is a sin!" I've seen it in my own personal life, people (one trick pony) who do so out of spite/contempt rather than because they were called on by God to deliver a message. Surely God would have his disciples deliver a more fruitful message than one they have heard a thousand times over.
I also think many people are one trick ponies... they use their go-to move which is just to state "homosexuality is a sin". That doesn't seem to be beneficial at all. I just encourage people to add to their repertoire of other and more effective teaching methods and tools from the bible that homosexual people might be unaware of... I can assure you, they very well know most Christians think it's a sin.
As for allowing people to spread the gospel, I fully agree. Often times though, contempt to a peculiar lifestyle is easily masked behind cheap, generic, and empty cliches such as "homosexuality is a sin!" I've seen it in my own personal life, people (one trick pony) who do so out of spite/contempt rather than because they were called on by God to deliver a message. Surely God would have his disciples deliver a more fruitful message than one they have heard a thousand times over.
M
Not sure what point your making other than you think others sound like they are wrong and you seem to think you have a better way? I would just ask if you have actually ever preached the gospel to a sinner and seen them delivered by Gods Power? Have you ever ministered to sinners in the Name and Calling of Jesus Christ? If not? Maybe you don't really understand the work of the Holy Spirit in the process of a true conversion from sin to Christ?