Mary, the mother of God

Jordan9 · Mar 12, 2010

Swing and a miss! The Catholic Church admits that many of his writings are "spurious" to use the term. Indeed, if you had checked my link, you would have saw that his spurious epistles were all in one section, marked "Spurious" in coloured letters. The other epistles, however, are most certainly his. We're as sure they are his as we are that Paul's epistles were his.

Your link had some interesting stuff, but a lot of it was dubious. They are confused, it would seem, by the Trinity. Their comments about "the Father raising Jesus" and "Jesus raising Himself" remind me of an atheist attacking the doctrine of the Trinity.

QuestionTime · Mar 12, 2010

aspen said:

I don't know... John Paul seems to be suffering some discoloration...

Quest

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

I hope this verse is noticed:

Mary responded,
“Oh, how my soul praises the Lord.
How my spirit rejoices in God my Savior!...Luke 1:46-47

She clearly Calls God : my Savior

Jesus is the saviour of Mary.. She couldnt be saved but through Jesus... If she was Perfect and Holy, she wouldnt need a saviour... Only God is perfect..

For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. - Romans 3:23 .. Mary is no exception.. ALL is pretty Universal ALL, It cant be ALL if it weren't universal

Mary responded, “I am the Lord’s servant. May everything you have said about me come true.” And then the angel left her. .. Luke 1:38..

For he took notice of his lowly servant girl,
and from now on all generations will call me blessed. ... Luke 1:48 ... Its Gods wish to bless whoever he choses.. Doesn't mean that one should pray to them...or Communication with the dead as intercessory prayers

Why was she blessed???
You are blessed because you believed that the Lord would do what he said.” ....Luke 1:45....

For the Mighty One is holy,
and he has done great things for me...Luke 1:49...................... Nowhere does she say she is Holy.... THE Mighty One is Holy!!

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

I hope this verse is noticed:

Mary responded,
“Oh, how my soul praises the Lord.
How my spirit rejoices in God my Savior!...Luke 1:46-47

She clearly Calls God : my Savior

Jesus is the saviour of Mary.. She couldnt be saved but through Jesus... If she was Perfect and Holy, she wouldnt need a saviour... Only God is perfect..

For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. - Romans 3:23 .. Mary is no exception.. ALL is pretty Universal ALL, It cant be ALL if it weren't universal

Mary responded, “I am the Lord’s servant. May everything you have said about me come true.” And then the angel left her. .. Luke 1:38..

For he took notice of his lowly servant girl,
and from now on all generations will call me blessed. ... Luke 1:48 ... Its Gods wish to bless whoever he choses.. Doesn't mean that one should pray to them...or Communication with the dead as intercessory prayers

For there is only one God and one Mediator who can reconcile God and humanity—the man Christ Jesus........1 Timothy 2:5

Notice Humanity... When people die and leave the body are they Humans??? Just think of it! Are humans entities without a physical body??? Impossible.. Humans (men/women) are physical tangible.. they can be perceived with our senses.. ANd there is ONLY ONE MEDIATOR... The man Christ Jesus .... So when people say..ask Mary to pray on your behalf.... or any so called saint.. Well, they are not Humans to be any Mediator .. Its JESUS...
Human WITH JESUS..... (No other kind of Soul involved)

Why was she blessed???
You are blessed because you believed that the Lord would do what he said.” ....Luke 1:45....

For the Mighty One is holy,
and he has done great things for me...Luke 1:49...................... Nowhere does she say she is Holy.... THE Mighty One is Holy!!

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

loeza89 said:

Notice: A crowd was sitting around him, and they told him, "Your mother and brothers are outside looking for you
Mark 3:32

1 Mother and many brothers... Meaning Jesus came on earth through the woman (Mary)... And when they said brothers.. It was through some form of relation... Was Mary Virgin till her death???? How could people attribute some Humans in specific as Brothers??..Meaning Mary had other children through Joseph....

When Joseph woke up, he did as the angel of the Lord commanded and took Mary as his wife. But he did not have sexual relations with her until her son was born. And Joseph named him Jesus... Matthew 1:24-25.. ... Until means.. till that time!!

Unless Joseph had children through another womans (They would be called Half Brothers)... Point to Notice!!!!

Jordan9 · Mar 15, 2010

Kool,

Mary needs a Saviour.

Yes, the Catholic Church completely agrees. Jesus saved Mary just as He saves all of us. Though while He saves us millenia after He was crucified, He saved Mary a few decades before He was. After all, God is outside of time.

Mary is a servant

Amen! Mary serves to point to Christ. As she said in the Gospels, "Do whatever He [Jesus] tells you." Our Virgin Mary still says that to us today. She points to her son, and tells us to do whatever He has told us.

One Mediator

Amen! Only Jesus, who is both God and man and who shed His blood for us at Golgotha is our mediator. Only He could fix the chasm that separated God and man.

Mary and the Saints are not mediators to God, but rather they pray to God for us and with us. Christ does not have two Brides or two Bodies, one in Heaven and one on Earth. He has but one, and all Christians are a part of it, whether they've left this life on Earth (which is nothing compared to the life that awaits us.)

The Catholic Church does not teach that anyone else can be a mediator between us and God. Mary and the Saints in Heaven are intercessors. They pray for us if we ask them, just like our fellow Christians here on Earth. Catholics and Protestants both pray directly to God and also ask their fellow Christians to pray for them. The difference is that Catholics don't restrict the term "Christians" to mean "only Christians on Earth."

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

aspen said:

Sounds good, God is also the Father and the Hoy Spirit!!

,And ONE God! She possibly wasnt the mother of the Father and the Holy Spirit. And even the Son who was existing before he came ..

..

God created everything through him,
and nothing was created except through him.... Mary was a creation..
Jesus created Mary......

Keep in mind its Gods provision to save people, His Love...thats why he came ..

The point is to Understand that God who came on earth as a man (HE HAD TO COME THROUGH A WOMAN ie. HUMAN .. so come as a man).. because he came for a reason.... To pay the price for mans sins... As mary herself says

....Oh, how my soul praises the Lord.
How my spirit rejoices in God my Savior!... Luke 1:46....
Who is the Saviour that is God.., The Father or the Holy Spirit? Its ONLY JESUS...

For God made Christ, who never sinned, to be the offering for our sin so that we could be made right with God through Christ... 2 Corinthians 5:21

Ofcourse Christ is Fully man Fully God.... Its all possible with God... (nothing is impossible)

People trying to put Mary as an important focus rather than the reason for Gods plan to provide a provision... that didnt stop mary to be blessed.... Any woman who had the privilege to Carry the Saviour is blessed... And it Happened to Be Mary (Gods wish) Speculating the reason of why her, its just a waste of time.. it had to be a woman and Through the Line of David at Gods time...., a blessing.. we all are blessed in one way or the other, some with different gifts, etc.... Carrying the Saviour is obviously a greater blessing... (an honour too).

Its explained here why He came.. and we should focus on this.. rather than stuff that just takes of the sole focus..
And furthermore, it is not angels who will control the future world we are talking about. 6 For in one place the Scriptures say,
“What are mere mortals that you should think about them,
or a son of man] that you should care for him?
7 Yet you made them only a little lower than the angels
and crowned them with glory and honor.
8 You gave them authority over all things.”

Now when it says “all things,” it means nothing is left out. But we have not yet seen all things put under their authority. 9 What we do see is Jesus, who was given a position “a little lower than the angels”; and because he suffered death for us, he is now “crowned with glory and honor.” Yes, by God’s grace, Jesus tasted death for everyone. 10 God, for whom and through whom everything was made, chose to bring many children into glory. And it was only right that he should make Jesus, through his suffering, a perfect leader, fit to bring them into their salvation.

Jordan9 · Mar 15, 2010

Kool,

No one is speculating why it is Mary. We are merely rejoicing that she (and St. Joseph) said "Yes," to God so that she could play a part of manifesting the Creator in His Creation.

So far, I haven't really seen anything that would suggest that your position and that of the Catholic Church are incompatible. Thanks be to God! ( "The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one; I in them and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, so that the world may know that You sent Me, and loved them, even as You have loved Me." John 17:22-23.)

worldlover · Mar 15, 2010

this kind of topic must have a concrete basis and not just our basic reasoning so i'll shut my mouth on this and don't argue pls :]

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

Jordan9 said:

Finally, the woman said, “Well, whose spirit do you want me to call up?”
“Call up Samuel,” Saul replied.
12 When the woman saw Samuel, she screamed, “You’ve deceived me! You are Saul!”
13 “Don’t be afraid!” the king told her. “What do you see?”
“I see a god coming up out of the earth,” she said.
14 “What does he look like?” Saul asked.
“He is an old man wrapped in a robe,” she replied. Saul realized it was Samuel, and he fell to the ground before him.
15 “Why have you disturbed me by calling me back?” Samuel asked Saul.

What do you say about that? Contacting the dead,.. Talking to the dead.. although Dead in Christ (They havent resurrected...Until resurrection day..)...

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the Christians who have died (Greek the dead in Christ) will rise from their graves....I thess 4:16

Praying to God, is a communication with God...
Talking to any soul thats dead (In Christ or out of Christ is out of this eartly realm.. ) is justifiable?? How??...

Using examples like the transfiguration, etc.. (Matthew 17:1-11) well that was God who can do it.. Not man .. with God its possible.. was the purpose to demonstrate an act of asking the dead to pray on your behalf?...

As the men watched, Jesus’ appearance was transformed so that his face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as light. 3 Suddenly, Moses and Elijah appeared and began talking with Jesus.... Matthew 17:2

Do you see Moses and Elijah talking to a man who wasn't transformed?..... Jesus was also transformed!!!!

One can treat it more like a vision!!
Moses and elijah had no part in displaying any communication with Peter , James or John!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

communion of saints issue............. Where in the bible is any example of a person communicating with the dead to ask prayers for to God.. ???? Did anyone demonstrate that practice explicitly as people do? Any example of a human asking any dead person for prayers on their behalf in the bible?

Is going to the right destination when you ask a dead person to pray on your behalf , by making assumptions that they are in heaven?

Even the Rich man couldn't communicate to his brothers... in the parable of the rich man...

“The rich man replied, ‘No, Father Abraham! But if someone is sent to them from the dead, then they will repent of their sins and turn to God.’... Luke 16:30... Luke 16:30
Otherwise he himself would have gone and communicated...

Someone had to be sent for any sort of communication!!!

Unless you say that theres a 1 way communication from earth to the dead and not vice versa... ?? is that justifiable biblically???

How do you know that any dead person hears you when you pray (or communicate)? Is there any Proof in exact specifics for asking in the bible ?

Jordan9 · Mar 15, 2010

We believe that Christians in Heaven are alive. Like I said, there aren't "living Christians" and "dead Christians" but rather just "Christians" in Heaven and on Earth. We do not believe that the Christians in Heaven are "dead."

Catholics don't think heaven is a "dead" place. Catholics believe people in heaven are alive. (Mat 19:29, 25:46, Mat 10:17-22, Mk 10:30, Lk 10:25-30, Lk 18:18-30, Jn 3:15-16). We see Lazarus alive by Abraham's side (Lk 16:22). And at the transfiguration we see Moses and Elijah alive beside Jesus. (Mat 17:3) There seems to be a lot of conversing in Heaven in Revelation (i.e. Rev 4:10). The Church thinks heaven is a lively place with lots of singing and stuff. They don't think people in heaven are saying "Hey shut up with the singing will ya, I'm trying to sleep!!!" Jesus opened the gates to Heaven. "Graves of the dead were opened and they went into town to preach the Gospel." (Mat 27:52). Jesus said "Now he is a God not of the dead, but of the living; for to him all of them are alive." (Lk 20:39-40)

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

Jordan9 said:

1> We believe that Christians in Heaven are alive. Like I said, there aren't "living Christians" and "dead Christians" but rather just "Christians" in Heaven and on Earth. We do not believe that the Christians in Heaven are "dead."

So will they go back from heaven and go to earth and rise up ???????

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the Christians who have died[a] will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. Then we will be with the Lord forever..... 1 Thessalonian s 4:16...... THEN!!!!!!!!!

And then after that be judged????
And I saw a great white throne and the one sitting on it. The earth and sky fled from his presence, but they found no place to hide. 12 I saw the dead, both great and small, standing before God’s throne. And the books were opened, including the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to what they had done, as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up its dead, and death and the grave gave up their dead. And all were judged according to their deeds. 14 Then death and the grave were thrown into the lake of fire. This lake of fire is the second death. 15 And anyone whose name was not found recorded in the Book of Life was thrown into the lake of fire... Revelation 20:11-15

2> Catholics don't think heaven is a "dead" place. Catholics believe people in heaven are alive. (Mat 19:29, 25:46, Mat 10:17-22, Mk 10:30, Lk 10:25-30, Lk 18:18-30, Jn 3:15-16).

Think?????? On what basis? On the verses below? ... Look at them and tell me.... After they are judged? or before? It talks about eternal life.. and the Kingdom of heaven.. All souls are eternal.. some have eternal life and some eternal death.. but when? After judgement day or before?

Lets look at the verses to see if it talks about the environment of heaven:
And everyone who has given up houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or property, for my sake, will receive a hundred times as much in return and will inherit eternal life... Matt 19:29

But beware! For you will be handed over to the courts and will be flogged with whips in the synagogues. 18 You will stand trial before governors and kings because you are my followers. But this will be your opportunity to tell the rulers and other unbelievers about me.[a] 19 When you are arrested, don’t worry about how to respond or what to say. God will give you the right words at the right time. 20 For it is not you who will be speaking—it will be the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.
21 “A brother will betray his brother to death, a father will betray his own child, and children will rebel against their parents and cause them to be killed. 22 And all nations will hate you because you are my followers. But everyone who endures to the end will be saved..Mat 10:17-22

will receive now in return a hundred times as many houses, brothers, sisters, mothers, children, and property—along with persecution. And in the world to come that person will have eternal life...Mk 10:30

One day an expert in religious law stood up to test Jesus by asking him this question: “Teacher, what should I do to inherit eternal life?”
26 Jesus replied, “What does the law of Moses say? How do you read it?”
27 The man answered, “‘You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your strength, and all your mind.’ And, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’”[a]
28 “Right!” Jesus told him. “Do this and you will live!”
29 The man wanted to justify his actions, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”
Parable of the Good Samaritan
30 Jesus replied with a story: “A Jewish man was traveling on a trip from Jerusalem to Jericho, and he was attacked by bandits. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him up, and left him half dead beside the road.....Lk 10:25-30

Once a religious leader asked Jesus this question: “Good Teacher, what should I do to inherit eternal life?”
19 “Why do you call me good?” Jesus asked him. “Only God is truly good. 20 But to answer your question, you know the commandments: ‘You must not commit adultery. You must not murder. You must not steal. You must not testify falsely. Honor your father and mother.’[a]”
21 The man replied, “I’ve obeyed all these commandments since I was young.”
22 When Jesus heard his answer, he said, “There is still one thing you haven’t done. Sell all your possessions and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
23 But when the man heard this he became very sad, for he was very rich.
24 When Jesus saw this, he said, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the Kingdom of God! 25 In fact, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!”
26 Those who heard this said, “Then who in the world can be saved?”
27 He replied, “What is impossible for people is possible with God.”
28 Peter said, “We’ve left our homes to follow you.”
29 “Yes,” Jesus replied, “and I assure you that everyone who has given up house or wife or brothers or parents or children, for the sake of the Kingdom of God, 30 will be repaid many times over in this life, and will have eternal life in the world to come.” Lk 18:18-30

so that everyone who believes in him will have eternal life.
16 “For God loved the world so much that he gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life...Jn 3:15-16

[B]3> We see Lazarus alive by Abraham's side (Lk 16:22). And at the transfiguration we see Moses and Elijah alive beside Jesus. (Mat 17:3) There seems to be a lot of conversing in Heaven in Revelation (i.e. Rev 4:10).

And was that heaven?? Abraham's bosom was heaven????? So whats the relation here with men talking to the dead.. ...look at the provious post.. It shown no human (Peter james john) talking to Jesus or Elijah or moses in the transfigured state!!!!!!!!!!! Infact Jesus also went in the transfigured state to talk to them in that state!!!...

The Church thinks heaven is a lively place with lots of singing and stuff. They don't think people in heaven are saying "Hey shut up with the singing will ya, I'm trying to sleep!!!" Jesus opened the gates to Heaven. "Graves of the dead were opened and they went into town to preach the Gospel." (Mat 27:52). Jesus said "Now he is a God not of the dead, but of the living; for to him all of them are alive." (Lk 20:39-40)

and tombs opened. The bodies of many godly men and women who had died were raised from the dead. 53 They left the cemetery after Jesus’ resurrection, went into the holy city of Jerusalem, and appeared to many people....Mat 27:52-53

Appeared doesnt mean preach... or communicate!!!!!!!!!

Well said, Teacher!” remarked some of the teachers of religious law who were standing there. 40 And then no one dared to ask him any more questions.....Lk 20:39-40?????????

flyboy01 · Mar 15, 2010

aspen said:

You can't follow logic here, because in the end it doesn't make sense, Mary is not the mother of God, because God has no mother, Mary is the mom of flesh/human Jesus, who died, God did not die. You can't set up a logic analogy here, because it doesn't make any sense.

ProudLibertarian · Mar 15, 2010

She gave birth to Jesus! How is she NOT his mother!?

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

In Addition to the above:

Soul to Soul Communication!!!!!!!!!

When we pray to the Father in Jesus name: God hears our prayers!!
God knows people’s hearts, and he confirmed that he accepts Gentiles by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as he did to us.

People may be pure in their own eyes,
but the Lord examines their motives... Proverbs 16:2

O Lord, you have examined my heart
and know everything about me.
2 You know when I sit down or stand up.
You know my thoughts even when I’m far away.
3 You see me when I travel
and when I rest at home.
You know everything I do.
4 You know what I am going to say
even before I say it, Lord.
5 You go before me and follow me.
You place your hand of blessing on my head.
6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
too great for me to understand!............... Psalm 139...

God knows peoples thoughts and hearts... Even Jesus knows what the people were thinking before they said anything...

NOW!!!!!!!!!!!! Asking the dead to pray for you!!!!!!!!!!!!
Soul to soul communication!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HOW???
Humans have a Body Soul and Spirit!!! WHY Use a telephone, Sms, cellphone, any media if its so free to communicate via soul?????????
You can ask anyone around globe anyone relative for prayers by soul communication!!
How can souls know whats in ones heart???????????????????????????????? God knows whats in ones heart and thoughts!!
When you think you establish a communication to any dead person is it really reached???? DO they know whats in your hear??? God knows!! How would they?? God is all knowing!! Are souls automatically All knowing ?? If they were all knowing, would the soul have special features after leaving the body to know peoples heart and who is calling them via communication???????????? Where is it in the bible????????

You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it, so that the Son can bring glory to the Father. 14 Yes, ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it!....John 14:13-14... This is definitely known to work as its so clear!! ask the Father in Jesus name! simple communication.. God knows the heart and it works well... WHo else knows the hear other than God???? Man? Nobody has the power or ability..

But the Lord said to Samuel, “Don’t judge by his appearance or height, for I have rejected him. The Lord doesn’t see things the way you see them. People judge by outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart.”.... 1 Samuel 16:7 ... Who else can look at the heart????

Tell me!!

And the Holy Spirit helps us in our weakness. For example, we don’t know what God wants us to pray for. But the Holy Spirit prays for us with groanings that cannot be expressed in words

God sent him to buy freedom for us who were slaves to the law, so that he could adopt us as his very own children.6 And because we are his children, God has sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, prompting us to call out, “Abba, Father..... THE OUR Audience Addressed are the ones who are alive...They had a body Soul + Spirit...

Don’t you realize that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, who lives in you and was given to you by God? You do not belong to yourself, 20 for God bought you with a high price. So you must honor God with your body....1 Corinthians 6:19-20... So we are sure about people alive and having the Holy Spirit in the body, it being the temple... But when People die!! NO Body!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Does it mention anywhere no body and just the soul possessing the H.S.????

WHATS THIS ALL ABOUT?????? COMMUNICATION WITH THE DEAD STUFF Some of you BUY?????? Or is it being faithful to some set of belief that is there ??? Is it some kind of belief does one support to be loyal to a particular community/Church?? Or some set of tradition that was one started by someone and added to a system of belief?? Or the pride of being part of a particular church because it has been pulling through got generations to be one of the ancient ones???? Was such kind of soul communication ever displayed by any believer?? In fact the Original church were the ones mentioned in the bible... the Church of Corinth, etc.. the Original Jewish believers.... whats the issue about to have such a communication???????? Would one have that as a valid reason to justify them self by being loyal to a particular set of belief.... its so clear that God knows the heart.. and knows it all!!

MahogonySnail · Mar 15, 2010

Jesus was the first IVF born baby. yeah? Mary was not really the biological mother, but was merely a test tube for Jesus.

Actually I disagree with what I just said. I think Mary's DNA and biology was passed onto Jesus, so technically, she is the mother of the son of God.

Without getting too graphic, but we need to hear it, God's sperm fertilized Mary's egg and produced baby Jesus. That's what happened. I don't believe God provided his own sperm and egg and simply placed it in Mary to produce a God, but that Mary's egg was actually fertilized and in that way Jesus was brought about in the normal human way.

VW · Mar 15, 2010

MahogonySnail said:

mary is of the blood-line of david, according to the prophecies.
joseph is also of the blood-line of david, even though his seed was not part of the progeny.
but in fact, jesus is the son of god, as his testifying to caused the people to try to stone him several times.

Kool_uday85 · Mar 15, 2010

MahogonySnail said:

With God everything is possible... going to think details are mere speculations..

The angel replied, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the baby to be born will be holy, and he will be called the Son of God. 36 What’s more, your relative Elizabeth has become pregnant in her old age! People used to say she was barren, but she’s now in her sixth month. 37 For nothing is impossible with God.

God can make something from nothing!!!

MahogonySnail · Mar 15, 2010

He could have, but if he would have done that with HIs Son he would have made him suddenly appear out of nowhere instead of making him be born of a virgin in the normal way.

Jordan9 · Mar 15, 2010

Kool,

I don't see how any of the Scripture you posted was relevant to the discussion at hand.

As for "soul communication" I've never heard that term. The Christians in Heaven have no body, (because the resurrection of the body comes at the End Times) but they are able to hear our prayers. Do you really think that when your saved loved ones die, they forget about you? God is Love, and to be in His presence, one must be love, too. I've seen nothing to suggest that Christians in Heaven forget about their families and fellow Christians. If anything, they would be more sensitive to our suffering and praying with us so that we can join them.

"I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone ...This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth." (Tim. 2:1-4)

However, protestants say that those who have gone on to the afterlife are dead. You are denying the Grace of God; for the Scriptures say the saved shall have eternal life. You're saying they are cold and dead though. You are speaking as a non-believer does.

Christians in Heaven are closer to God than we are. The Scripture tells us that the prayers of a righteous man avail much. What creature is more righteous than someone sanctified by God and in Heaven (where there is no evil) with him?

Saints are serious prayer warriors. I don't think that praying with the Saints detracts from the worship of God anymore than praying with friends detracts from worship of God, which I do a lot. Saints are not all knowing, but they know a heck of a lot more about this spiritual game than me. They are creatures. This does not take away the tremendous benefit we can get from communing with them. Catholics think "their intercession is their most exalted service to God's plan. We can and should ask them to intercede for us and for the whole world" (Catechism 2683)

Scripture says we were "all baptized into one body" (1 Corinthians 12:13). Christians are one body which is not divided by death or anything else (Rom 8:38-39). Christians in heaven are still members of that body of Christ? We are invited to honor the "heroes" of the faith (Heb 6:12, 11:1-40, Jas 5:10-11). I honour those heroes and I feel a unity with them.

I feel as if I am repeating myself now, though. If you'd like some websites, Kool, I can give you some. But there is only so many different ways to articulate what I am saying.

Mary, the mother of God

Jordan9

Guest

QuestionTime

Senior Member

Kool_uday85

Guest

Kool_uday85

Guest

Kool_uday85

Guest

Jordan9

Guest

Kool_uday85

Guest

Jordan9

Guest

worldlover

Guest

Kool_uday85

Guest

Jordan9

Guest

Kool_uday85

Guest

flyboy01

Guest

ProudLibertarian

Banned

Kool_uday85

Guest

MahogonySnail

Banned

VW

Banned

Kool_uday85

Guest

MahogonySnail

Banned

Jordan9

Guest