So what about the fourth commandment?

[Zmouth]

No man has seen the Father, but men are able to see the Son.

John 14:8Philip said to him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us.” 9Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and you still do not know me, Philip? Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own authority, but the Father who dwells in me does his works. 11Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me, or else believe on account of the works themselves.

Paul stresses this same reality here:

Col 1:15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.

John pens it like this:

1 John 1:18 No one has ever seen God. But the unique One, who is himself God, is near to the Father's heart. He has revealed God to us.

C.

Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father. John 6:46

 

[posthuman]

3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

He seems to refute Jesus testimony that God was the Father and that He and the Father were one.

Jesus Christ was fully human and fully divine. the man Christ Jesus is the mediator.

For this reason he had to be made like them, fully human in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people.
(Hebrews 2:17)

​

just ask John.

"the Word became flesh and pitched His tent among us" ​

 

[Cee]

I love that you use "Christ Jesus" when discussing glorified Christ. It is uncommon.

I'd love to know your thoughts about why it is Christ Jesus instead of Jesus Christ now?

What idea do you think Paul is trying to reveal to his readers? Feel free to start another topic.

C.

Jesus Christ was fully human and fully divine. the man Christ Jesus is the mediator.

For this reason he had to be made like them, fully human in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people.
(Hebrews 2:17)

​

just ask John.

"the Word became flesh and pitched His tent among us" ​

 

[posthuman]

Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father. John 6:46

Jesus answered:
"Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?"
(John 14:9)​

it's no contradiction, either. would i be wasting my time teaching you why it's not?

 

[posthuman]

I love that you use "Christ Jesus" when discussing glorified Christ. It is uncommon.

I'd love to know your thoughts about why it is Christ Jesus instead of Jesus Christ now?

What idea do you think Paul is trying to reveal to his readers? Feel free to start another topic.

C.

thanks ♥

it's late now tho, C -- i'll talk tomorrow about it. good night

 

[Zmouth]

God says he is dead man because God is the one who is about to kill him. Keep reading.

But Abimelech didn't know better so God warned him first.

How does this have any relation to Abraham killing a man for telling the truth?

C.

Abraham lied to him. But note too that God told Abimelech that Abraham was a prophet. But the scriptures show otherwise that Abraham never heard God nor did God ever speak to him. It was the Angel that spoke to him.

Gen 12:11-13
11 And it came to pass, when he was come near to enter into Egypt, that he said unto Sarai his wife, Behold now, I know that thou art a fair woman to look upon:


12 Therefore it shall come to pass, when the Egyptians shall see thee, that they shall say, This is his wife: and they will kill me, but they will save thee alive.
13 Say, I pray thee, thou art my sister: that it may be well with me for thy sake; and my soul shall live because of thee.


Gen 12:19-20
19 Why saidst thou, She is my sister? so I might have taken her to me to wife: now therefore behold thy wife, take her, and go thy way.
20 And Pharaoh commanded his men concerning him: and they sent him away, and his wife, and all that he had.


So did Pharaoh kill him when he found out she was Abram's wife?

 

[Zmouth]

Jesus answered:
"Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?"
(John 14:9)​

it's no contradiction, either. would i be wasting my time teaching you why it's not?

Out of context. I am suprised you would even assume such considering John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Yet the Holy Ghost was before the man and the man was conceived of the Holy Ghost but yet some can't make the connection who the Father was.

 

[Cee]

Zmouth,

Are you a believer?

Here are the answers to your questions:

Abraham was spoken to by the Angel of the Lord.
Angel means messenger of God, this is God speaking through an Angel.
Abraham was scared they would kill him.
But no they didn't kill him.
Notice Abraham doesn't say the Lord say they will kill me.
This is just Abraham speaking out of worry.
As a result of this fear, he lies about his wife being his sister.
But it wasn't exactly a lie. Why? Because Sarai was actually his half sister.

C.

 

[TonyJay]

I love that you use "Christ Jesus" when discussing glorified Christ. It is uncommon.

I'd love to know your thoughts about why it is Christ Jesus instead of Jesus Christ now?

What idea do you think Paul is trying to reveal to his readers? Feel free to start another topic.

C.

If I may be so bold (sort of gatecrashing), so feel free to disregard me.

Christ, χριστός meaning Messiah.
I think Paul really wants to [FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]emphasise that Jesus is the Messiah.
Although He came in the flesh as a man He ascended into Heaven unequivocally as God.
He was God before to be sure but after His ascension (and consider the events through His life, to the cross, His burial and resurrection) there was no question.
Paul may also have be personally motivated here - remember, he tried to kill early Christians and destroy the movement. Then came the epiphany that changed his life forever.
I think the wonder and gratitude of that event changed him forever - and it showed in the rushed, enthusiastic prose of his letters.
Paul understood Jesus as a man (flesh) but he really understood Jesus as the Messiah (God) in ways that few others could.[/FONT]

 

[Cee]

Thank you for your comment. I wonder if it has something to do with this Scripture Paul wrote here also:

2 Co 5:16 From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer.

Christ also means Anointed One. And Holy Spirit is called the Anointing of God. I don't have crystal clear thoughts on this yet, but I am seeking God about it.

C.

If I may be so bold (sort of gatecrashing), so feel free to disregard me.

Christ, χριστός meaning Messiah.
I think Paul really wants to emphasise that Jesus is the Messiah.
Although He came in the flesh as a man He ascended into Heaven unequivocally as God.
He was God before to be sure but after His ascension (and consider the events through His life, to the cross, His burial and resurrection) there was no question.
Paul may also have be personally motivated here - remember, he tried to kill early Christians and destroy the movement. Then came the epiphany that changed his life forever.
I think the wonder and gratitude of that event changed him forever - and it showed in the rushed, enthusiastic prose of his letters.
Paul understood Jesus as a man (flesh) but he really understood Jesus as the Messiah (God) in ways that few others could.

 

[TonyJay]

Thank you for your comment. I wonder if it has something to do with this Scripture Paul wrote here also:

2 Co 5:16 From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer.

Christ also means Anointed One. And Holy Spirit is called the Anointing of God. I don't have crystal clear thoughts on this yet, but I am seeking God about it.

C.

Yes indeed!

 

[disciplemike]

The New Covenant - written with the blood of Christ Jesus - if you don't get that, I can't convince you.

Who do you think wrote the first with His finger? If the Father hates sin so much, that His only begotten Son had to die, do you think He let His Son die, so we can continue to break commandments? No, no, no. Messiah HaMashiach paid the price we could not afford to pay, because the wages of sin is death. Read that. Not the wages of the law is death. The wages of sin is death.

 

[TonyJay]

Who do you think wrote the first with His finger? If the Father hates sin so much, that His only begotten Son had to die, do you think He let His Son die, so we can continue to break commandments? No, no, no. Messiah HaMashiach paid the price we could not afford to pay, because the wages of sin is death. Read that. Not the wages of the law is death. The wages of sin is death.

I think you should be very careful not to put words in my mouth.
I think you need to do me the courtesy of at least reading what I have written rather than trying to accuse me of things that I did not say.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Who do you think wrote the first with His finger? If the Father hates sin so much, that His only begotten Son had to die, do you think He let His Son die, so we can continue to break commandments? No, no, no. Messiah HaMashiach paid the price we could not afford to pay, because the wages of sin is death. Read that. Not the wages of the law is death. The wages of sin is death.

No, He sent His Son to die because mankind couldn't keep the commandments of the law. That is why Jesus was found in the flesh and satisfied the righteous requirements of the law on our behalf. Have you never read that the power of sin is the law? So, why would anyone want to put themselves back under it? Jesus did not come to perpetuate the law, but to fulfill it, bringing it to an end for those who are in Christ.

 

[disciplemike]

No, He sent His Son to die because mankind couldn't keep the commandments of the law. That is why Jesus was found in the flesh and satisfied the righteous requirements of the law on our behalf. Have you never read that the power of sin is the law? Jesus did not come to perpetuate the law, but to fulfill it, bringing it to an end for those who are in Christ.

good morning. I see you are still talking in circles. I will try to ask this again. if your jesus is "bringing an end to the law for those who are in Christ", does that mean you now are lawless? None of God's laws apply to you now? Please explain.

 

[disciplemike]

I think you should be very careful not to put words in my mouth.
I think you need to do me the courtesy of at least reading what I have written rather than trying to accuse me of things that I did not say.

where in that did I accuse you of saying something?

 

[TonyJay]

where in that did I accuse you of saying something?

You are very clearly trying to correct me about something I did not say.
More obviously you being obtuse about that fact.

 

[disciplemike]

You are very clearly trying to correct me about something I did not say.
More obviously you being obtuse about that fact.

the comments speak for themselves. I don't have to accuse.

 

[TonyJay]

Who do you think wrote the first with His finger? If the Father hates sin so much, that His only begotten Son had to die, do you think He let His Son die, so we can continue to break commandments? No, no, no. Messiah HaMashiach paid the price we could not afford to pay, because the wages of sin is death. Read that. Not the wages of the law is death. The wages of sin is death.

I did not say this but perhaps Paul himself can help you out:
There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,[a]who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
If you are prepared to read the whole of Romans to this point (and take in everything that it is saying) then you will realise that the "law of sin and death" that Paul is referring to is none other than Levitical law.
And Paul is unequivocally saying that "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death."
Simply put: believers are no longer under Levitical Law.

 

[Katy-follower]

I know the 7th day adventists put a lot of focus on Sunday being an "evil" day, since it was Rome that made it the official day of worship. But reality is it's just a day. If you want to fellowship on Saturday then so be it, but don't condemn those who choose to meet on Sunday or every day of the week. Anyway, Jesus is our sabbath rest.

I know a couple of Jews - they can't use electricity or travel on Shabbat, they have very strict observances. So if you're wanting to follow the Jews will you then focus on circumcision and kosher foods also?