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Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
Good morning Ahwatukee!...can I ask you what your name means? It's different - I always have to double-check to make sure I spell it right!
Good morning Ahwatukee!...can I ask you what your name means? It's different - I always have to double-check to make sure I spell it right!
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
Because it proves the false grace teachers wrong.
Because it proves the false grace teachers wrong.
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
You don't find that John was referring to agnosticts, not in the Bible, or history.
You have to believe what you think about 1 Jn : 1, because you know that if you accept the truth, it'll prove you wrong.
You don't find that John was referring to agnosticts, not in the Bible, or history.
You have to believe what you think about 1 Jn : 1, because you know that if you accept the truth, it'll prove you wrong.
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
I know...this is a stumbling block for sure. When I first heard it - I said this is heresy. My spirit on the inside was ok but my mind rebelled against it. It was in my church upbringing from day one.
Sometimes these strongholds are the hardest to get over because of our religious teachings. But I said - "Lord show me the truth." He circumvented the teacher I first heard about 1 John 1:9 and through a series of different teachers , He brought it all together and it is such liberty as you can see the beauty and magnificent work of our Lord. Now I look and say "Why didn't I see that before?" - but revelation truth is like that.
On the subject of forgiveness that we have in Christ now because of His precious Blood...here is what the scriptures say.....sometimes the truth in the gospel of the grace of Christ "conflicts" with what we have been religiously taught.
1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.
have been forgiven = perfect passive
perfect = The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed past action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present time. It is continuously happening in the present.
passive = voice = action is happening to you....you are not doing it
Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous completed state and that was put on them....not something they did.
Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins...
and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...it's all according to the riches of our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.
Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,
[SUP]14 [/SUP] in whomwe have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins
Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work.
...we have a great salvation in our Lord!
Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity.
I know...this is a stumbling block for sure. When I first heard it - I said this is heresy. My spirit on the inside was ok but my mind rebelled against it. It was in my church upbringing from day one.
Sometimes these strongholds are the hardest to get over because of our religious teachings. But I said - "Lord show me the truth." He circumvented the teacher I first heard about 1 John 1:9 and through a series of different teachers , He brought it all together and it is such liberty as you can see the beauty and magnificent work of our Lord. Now I look and say "Why didn't I see that before?" - but revelation truth is like that.
On the subject of forgiveness that we have in Christ now because of His precious Blood...here is what the scriptures say.....sometimes the truth in the gospel of the grace of Christ "conflicts" with what we have been religiously taught.
1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.
have been forgiven = perfect passive
perfect = The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed past action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present time. It is continuously happening in the present.
passive = voice = action is happening to you....you are not doing it
Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous completed state and that was put on them....not something they did.
Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins...
and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...it's all according to the riches of our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.
Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,
[SUP]14 [/SUP] in whomwe have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins
Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work.
...we have a great salvation in our Lord!
Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity.
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
( they are not agnostics - they are gnostics - 2 different groups of people)
There are dozens of scholars that dis-agree with you but you are free to believe what you want....in this link are about 7 sources and there are dozens more.
http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...ly-christian-justin-peters-5.html#post2692586
( they are not agnostics - they are gnostics - 2 different groups of people)
There are dozens of scholars that dis-agree with you but you are free to believe what you want....in this link are about 7 sources and there are dozens more.
http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...ly-christian-justin-peters-5.html#post2692586
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
No one says 1 John was written to gnostics except Prince and those who regurgitate his falsehood. The quote from his book that I provided above is where this whole fiasco started.
btw the word is gnostic, not agnostic.
No one says 1 John was written to gnostics except Prince and those who regurgitate his falsehood. The quote from his book that I provided above is where this whole fiasco started.
btw the word is gnostic, not agnostic.
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
If you are referring to me, you're being dishonest. I never said 1 John was not talking about gnostics. I said 1 John 1:9 was not addressed TO gnostics, as hyper grace teaches.
If you are referring to me, you're being dishonest. I never said 1 John was not talking about gnostics. I said 1 John 1:9 was not addressed TO gnostics, as hyper grace teaches.
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
There are no scholars who believe 1 John 1 was written to address gnostics themselves. That falsehood was made up by Prince, who is not a scholar.
There are no scholars who believe 1 John 1 was written to address gnostics themselves. That falsehood was made up by Prince, who is not a scholar.
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L
LaurenTM
Guest
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
I don't think I have even had any discussion with your friend there, but I can address the thought in general if you don't mind
people who attack rather than discuss, are doing so from a perceived attack on themselves...psych 101
they cannot abide a different thought or idea because it assails their core beliefs
some people attack on a regular basis; those people, also have unresolved anger issues
they like to keep their finger on the red button and will employ other tactics such as lying, twisting what is said (including and sometimes especially scripture) and will also attempt to goad respondents into an argument in order to prove how 'right' they are
it's not all about the Bible; they would most likely do the same in any arena
see, when someone is sincere and operates out of that mindset, they have a hard time dealing with individuals who are duplicitous and insecure. I do know what I'm saying here and may be accused and called stupid
that will only prove my point
and then there is also the spiritual aspect of deceiving spirits and so on
all of the above is why we must keep our cool all the time. anger, if not dealt with, creates a vulnerability the enemy of our souls will take advantage of
my helpful hints for the day
I don't think I have even had any discussion with your friend there, but I can address the thought in general if you don't mind
people who attack rather than discuss, are doing so from a perceived attack on themselves...psych 101
they cannot abide a different thought or idea because it assails their core beliefs
some people attack on a regular basis; those people, also have unresolved anger issues
they like to keep their finger on the red button and will employ other tactics such as lying, twisting what is said (including and sometimes especially scripture) and will also attempt to goad respondents into an argument in order to prove how 'right' they are
it's not all about the Bible; they would most likely do the same in any arena
see, when someone is sincere and operates out of that mindset, they have a hard time dealing with individuals who are duplicitous and insecure. I do know what I'm saying here and may be accused and called stupid
that will only prove my point
and then there is also the spiritual aspect of deceiving spirits and so on
all of the above is why we must keep our cool all the time. anger, if not dealt with, creates a vulnerability the enemy of our souls will take advantage of
my helpful hints for the day
L
LaurenTM
Guest
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
while we are at it, who resurrected this old thread just to get things riled up again?
I question the motive on that one
while we are at it, who resurrected this old thread just to get things riled up again?
I question the motive on that one
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
All these sources say that 1 John was written to address some of the gnostic false teachings that were infiltrating the church.
Book of 1 John - Bible Survey
Intro to 1 John — Biblica
Who are the deceivers 1 John is written against, mentioned in 2:26? - Biblical Hermeneutics Stack Exchange
https://bible.org/seriespage/introduction-1-john
https://carm.org/gnosticism
Gnosticism
https://www.gty.org/resources/bible-...s/MSB62/1-john
There are literally dozens more but that should be enough to reveal the truth.
All these sources say that 1 John was written to address some of the gnostic false teachings that were infiltrating the church.
Book of 1 John - Bible Survey
Intro to 1 John — Biblica
Who are the deceivers 1 John is written against, mentioned in 2:26? - Biblical Hermeneutics Stack Exchange
https://bible.org/seriespage/introduction-1-john
https://carm.org/gnosticism
Gnosticism
https://www.gty.org/resources/bible-...s/MSB62/1-john
There are literally dozens more but that should be enough to reveal the truth.
L
LaurenTM
Guest
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
there are no gnostic believers here
hrftd is just waving that around like a red cape
and he knows it
that's what makes the entire thing so sick
I'm not into attacking people here, but reading many of his posts, the twisting of other people's words that he does is off the charts
there are no gnostic believers here
hrftd is just waving that around like a red cape
and he knows it
that's what makes the entire thing so sick
I'm not into attacking people here, but reading many of his posts, the twisting of other people's words that he does is off the charts
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
Why don"t you provide some specific examples for our edification, instead of just throwing out a blanket unsupported accusation? There is a small group here that does that to try to stir up trouble in order to shut down discussion that reveals the weakness of its position. We certainly don't want to view you as being part of that clique.
Thank you for your support.
Why don"t you provide some specific examples for our edification, instead of just throwing out a blanket unsupported accusation? There is a small group here that does that to try to stir up trouble in order to shut down discussion that reveals the weakness of its position. We certainly don't want to view you as being part of that clique.
Thank you for your support.
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
Brethren - don't fall for any of the "baiting" tactics as they are just "rabbit trails". Let's just give the scripture and info out and let it lie where it may.
We can trust the Holy Spirit to guide us into the truth. If people still try to "bait" you -then just avoid them like Paul says.
These serve no purpose but to cause divisions and strife amongst us.
Romans 16:17-18 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
Brethren - don't fall for any of the "baiting" tactics as they are just "rabbit trails". Let's just give the scripture and info out and let it lie where it may.
We can trust the Holy Spirit to guide us into the truth. If people still try to "bait" you -then just avoid them like Paul says.
These serve no purpose but to cause divisions and strife amongst us.
Romans 16:17-18 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
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Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
Justin Peters hit the nail right square center... on the head! The only revealing he didn't do of those charlatans in the video clips is their connection to occult teachings of the "mystery schools", as that is where many of their false doctrines originate!
Justin Peters hit the nail right square center... on the head! The only revealing he didn't do of those charlatans in the video clips is their connection to occult teachings of the "mystery schools", as that is where many of their false doctrines originate!
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
When Justin Peters showed in those video clips how the WOF false prophets were trying to move the Godhead down to their own selves, he reminded us of how that was the sin that old serpent in God's Eden tempted Adam and Eve with, telling them they would become gods.
That has been the main battle all along during this world... those who think they can become their own god!
That is what paganism is about, and has been about from the start. They believe we, as creations from God can be little gods, and thus obtain the power to create instantaneous manifestations of nature upon the earth, even control the weather!
One of the exercises they teach is to visualize the things you want in your mind's eye, see yourself receiving them, and then simply will... them into existence! Some of them call this "mental creation". It's from the occult side of the fence folks, not from God.
And of course they preach the lie that if you're a Christian, you are supposed to be wealthy, because it's a way for them to receive YOUR money and they don't have to explain why they have five mansions with swimming pools and twenty Rolls-Royce cars, and 20 million dollar jet airplanes!
When Justin Peters showed in those video clips how the WOF false prophets were trying to move the Godhead down to their own selves, he reminded us of how that was the sin that old serpent in God's Eden tempted Adam and Eve with, telling them they would become gods.
That has been the main battle all along during this world... those who think they can become their own god!
That is what paganism is about, and has been about from the start. They believe we, as creations from God can be little gods, and thus obtain the power to create instantaneous manifestations of nature upon the earth, even control the weather!
One of the exercises they teach is to visualize the things you want in your mind's eye, see yourself receiving them, and then simply will... them into existence! Some of them call this "mental creation". It's from the occult side of the fence folks, not from God.
And of course they preach the lie that if you're a Christian, you are supposed to be wealthy, because it's a way for them to receive YOUR money and they don't have to explain why they have five mansions with swimming pools and twenty Rolls-Royce cars, and 20 million dollar jet airplanes!
L
LaurenTM
Guest
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
I answered you in the other thread where you basically said the same as above
I don't care how you view me, which is actually the opposite of how I think about other people. I care what people think and say,and how they feel
I have come to realize that none of that seems to matter to you
so why would I care? but that is why I do not care
maybe if you would quit your name calling and insults, it would get better for everyone here
I answered you in the other thread where you basically said the same as above
I don't care how you view me, which is actually the opposite of how I think about other people. I care what people think and say,and how they feel
I have come to realize that none of that seems to matter to you
so why would I care? but that is why I do not care
maybe if you would quit your name calling and insults, it would get better for everyone here
A
Ariel82
Guest
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
Quoted from Grace777
"
Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity."
I can do the above and still see that the verse applies to believers not Gnostic nonbelievers.
Quoted from Grace777
"
Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity."
I can do the above and still see that the verse applies to believers not Gnostic nonbelievers.
A
Ariel82
Guest
Re: Word of Faith: "Metaphysical" "Gnostic" "Cultic" "Not really Christian"-Justin Pe
Hey it was already being plastered all over the forum. Thought talking points would be better than constant thread derailment when others want to discuss a different topic....not sure if it's working or not.
Sides I kind of miss Stillwaters, wonder what he is up too.
while we are at it, who resurrected this old thread just to get things riled up again?
I question the motive on that one
Hey it was already being plastered all over the forum. Thought talking points would be better than constant thread derailment when others want to discuss a different topic....not sure if it's working or not.
Sides I kind of miss Stillwaters, wonder what he is up too.