Repentance: A Boast in the Flesh

[garee]

I would say to repent is a work. And we are not saved by repenting or kept by repenting as a work of us that we could do.
That would be a boast.

This is as if we did not first receive it from God who must turn us first towards Him, giving us spiritual ears so to hear His spiritual words that then we can repent. The man without the Spirit of Christ simply will not hear and therefore not truly repent. There is nothing that turned Him so that he could.


We begin with a work of the Spirit as the first work of God working in us and continual all the way to the end in the same manner. Answering an alter call does not make a person a Christian anymore than splashing water on their body. There is no work to include believing God that we can reconcile as coming after our own mind and heart. We are not to lean on our own understanding as if it came from God.

As Jesus said in John 6 This is the “work of God”, (and therefore not of us) that ye believe on him by Him whom he hath sent. It is not our work towards God by believing our own mind that does save .

Salvation it is not of ourselves lest any man boast and say it was there intellect making a good decision that saved them and not God giving us ears to hear.

Believing, having the faith of another as in this case is a work of God. Therefore no man can repent unless God does the first work of turning us by giving us ears to hear..


This is not only when we sin in unbelief when we do deny Christ. But also as we learn and repent of a doctrine we find is not working. That work is attributed to the same spirit of faith, Christ in us. For it is not only that he teaches us but he brings to mind the things he has taught us. This leaves our memory out of the equation, as a work we could do. He must increase as we continue to decrease . For a long time the words (and bring all things to your remembrance, “whatsoever I have said unto you”.) I seemed to gloss over that phrase .Then one day it seemed to jump out .that was a form of repenting as God turned me giving me a ear, I did believe his work wotking in me to both will and do His good pleasure. Which again was to believe God.

It’s not our hearts as the source of our own memory that gives us comfort. There is no room to boast in the flesh.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, “whatsoever I have said unto you”.

This leaves us no wiggle room to boast in any way of something we have received from God as if we had not of received it fully from Him.

I suggest below in regard to leaving our first love. We have left our relationship with the Spirit of Christ perhaps by boasting in another person, having faith in respect to them or again having it in respect to our own selves. To remember is to act or work in accordance to.Not simplt to recall a matter but move to perform it. In this case it is from where we have fallen by denying Christ the glory. It is that which should turn us so that then, seeing he did the first work of turning us we can repent and believe God , the first work of God working in us, as he said: and do the first works

I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent. Rev 2:2

 

[RobbyEarl]

All of it is wrong and has no biblical basis. There is nothing you can keep, there is nothing you can do. The only Hope we have is our faith in the work of the cross and nothing else.

 

[ladylynn]

Here is another post from JGIG - one of our members here which help us to "repent" of some beliefs that have been falsely mis-represented by well-meaning Christians. This looks like a Hebrews 12:15 situation which we need to be careful of.

Please read this carefully so that you can find out what is "really" being said so that we can stop having these false mis-representations being made by those that may not agree to a point or two. At the very least thee truth of what is believed should be told.

Why I am Hyper-Grace: Answering Five Common Objections

Is Hyper-Grace “dangerous” or “imbalanced”?

Author: Jeremy White/Thursday, August 21, 2014/Categories: Jeremy White, Top Picks


Introduction:

In recent times, a label has surfaced regarding what some view as a “dangerous” or “imbalanced” teaching of the grace of God. “Hyper-Grace” is now a term being used to suggest that there are some folks (such as myself) who “take God’s grace too far” and in so doing either ignore or minimize other significant teachings of the Bible.

What follows is an attempt to address a few of the most common “warnings” some have offered regarding those of us who make much of the finished work of Christ.

Objection #1: The Hyper-Grace Gospel is Unbiblical

For starters, you may be shocked to discover that “hyper-grace” is really the only adequate description for grace in the first place, according to the Bible. For example, when Paul wrote in Romans 5:20 that “…where sin increased, grace increased all the more” he was literally referring to God’s grace as “hyper.”

The Greek term for the phrase “increased all the more” (NIV) is huper-perisseuo which literally means “super-abounded.” Hyper is simply a transliteration of the prefix “huper” in Greek and means “above and beyond” in scope or quality. The term “perisseuo” refers to that which is “in far excess of what might be expected, superfluous or gratuitous.”

So in Paul’s description of God’s amazing grace, he is literally saying that because of the abundance of sin in this world, God’s grace has super-abounded in order to rescue us from sin! Paul literally describes God’s grace as HYPER in this passage. It is super-abundant and unfathomably plentiful and powerful. In fact, a few verses later Paul would state that the very reason sin is no longer our master is because we are no longer under law, but under this hyper-abounding grace (Rom. 6:14)!

If this is what one means by “hyper-grace,” then count me in as one of the “grace-heretics!” It is a label that was applied to both Paul and Jesus by the Pharisees of their day, so I am more than happy to wear it in ours. As the late scholar D. Martin Lloyd-Jones famously pointed out (andthis is my paraphrase), "If people do not sometimes misunderstand and falsely accuse you of being soft-on-sin or against God’s law, you are not preaching the real gospel!"


Objection #2: Hyper-Grace Preachers are Soft on Sin

This is a common one, of course. The idea here is that because of our high esteem of the finished work of Christ and our insistence upon keeping our eyes fixated on Jesus as Author and Finisher of our faith (Heb. 12:2), we are either afraid to preach against sin or do not take sin seriously enough.

Far from being “soft on sin” – we who preach grace are extremely big on Jesus. Any gospel worthy of the hyper-grace label is a gospel which points all fingers toward Jesus rather than judgmentally pointing them at those He came to save.

There are definitely many contexts in which it is appropriate to talk about sin, warn about sin and preach against sin. I do this routinely in my preaching ministry, as do my friends who are also labeled as hyper-grace preachers. Sin is bad. It is ugly. It brings death to everything it touches. It grieves God. It makes us miserable. It comes with a variety of consequences.

No legitimate grace-preacher that I am aware of minimizes the reality that sin is evil, wrong, bad, unproductive and unfitting for a new creation in Christ. What we DO focus on, however, is the Answer to sin, which is Jesus – and the fact that His grace alone is precisely what delivers us from its penalty (death), its power (enslavement) and eventually even its very presence (when we live in the fullness of His heavenly kingdom one day).

I talk about sin all the time, but not as a means of manipulating, judging or condemning people. I talk about sin so as to help people understand both their daily and eternal need for Jesus as Savior and Lord. We hyper-grace preachers are simply standing with Paul on the promise that it is the grace of God which “teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts, and to live soberly, righteously and godly in the present age…” (Titus 2:11-13).

Paul taught that the power of sin is the law (1 Cor. 15:56). If a person wants to ensure that they will remain in slavery to life-dominating sin and addiction, one simple way to do that is to live under a law-based mentality. A grace-saturated life, however, frees us from the grip of sin’s mastery over us. Far from being soft on sin, we take sin very seriously. So seriously that we are pointing people unapologetically to the only Source of rescue from it! That Source is not trying harder to be a good person, culturally-espoused self-help tactics or pop-psychology.

That Source is Jesus Christ and the grace He alone offers.

Objection #3: Hyper-Grace Preachers Don’t Believe in Repentance

Not only do we believe in repentance, but we seek to understand and teach it thoroughly and accurately. In the New Testament, “to repent” is a translation of the Greek verb “metanoeo” meaning “to change one’s mind or perspective.”

Obviously, when we receive Christ, we have repented in the genuine sense of the term – changing our minds about our need of a Savior and receiving Christ.

Before Christ, we lived as self-sufficiently as possible, thinking that God would probably grade on a curve and accept us at least partly on the basis of our own best efforts and self-generated goodness. When we came to understand our spiritual bankruptcy and our desperate need for Christ’s forgiveness and new life, we repented (had a change of perspective) and received Christ by trusting in Him alone to rescue us.

Beyond this initial experience of “getting saved” (as we often call it), repentance is a daily lifestyle in which an ongoing “renewal of the mind” process is taking place within us. As we grow in faith and in our understanding of God through His Word and our union with His Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 6:17), we begin to replace old thinking with new thinking and false thinking with true thinking. This renewal of the mind (Rom. 12:1-3) is an integral part of the transformative process of the Spirit’s work in our lives. This is the essence of a lifestyle of repentance – taking false thoughts captive, making them obedient to (in conformity with) Christ (2 Cor. 10:5).

Paul affirmed in no uncertain terms that God’s kindness (His expressed grace toward us) is what leads to repentance (Rom. 2:4). Far from being anti-repentance, hyper-grace theology affirms repentance and the ongoing renewal of the mind as an integral part of what it means to follow Jesus under His New Covenant.

Objection #4: Hyper-Grace Preachers Are Against Confession of Sin

This is one of the most common misrepresentations of hyper-grace theology. The Biblical term “to confess” simply means “to speak the same thing as” or “to agree with.” We teach that confession is important because we should yield our minds to agreement with God about everything He reveals – including, but not limited to, sin.

What we often also teach (and this is where the rub is with some people) is that confession is not about triggering any transaction between us and God that would issue forth more forgiveness, as though God were dispensing forgiveness in various doses based upon our confessions. Forgiveness of sin is something that was provided objectively ONE time by ONE act of grace through ONE Savior who shed His blood on the cross for us 2000 years ago. As the book of Hebrews repeatedly emphasizes, He is the “once for all” sacrifice for sin.

Confession of sin then, is about humility and walking in agreement with God – not about getting more forgiveness from Him. Some will suggest that God’s forgiveness is dispensed using a “two-tiered” approach. On one level, they say, God has forgiven our sins judicially and objectively through the cross. On the second tier, however, we need to confess our sins in order to receive “relational” or“experiential” forgiveness in order to maintain close fellowship with God.

This two-tiered approach is nowhere taught in the New Testament, and has only been popularized because of two basic levels of rationale. The first is based upon a misinterpretation of two passages in the New Testament, both of which have been clearly explained in books and sermons by a host of solid gospel teachers. These two passages are Matthew 6:12 (where Jesus appears to be commanding His followers to ask for God’s forgiveness) and 1 John 1:9 (which seems to link forgiveness to confession of sin).

In my book “The Gospel Uncut: Learning to Rest in the Grace of God” I deal with these passages quite clearly, as do other authors such as Bob George, Andrew Farley, Ralph Harris, Paul Ellis, Cathy Hildebrand and Andrew Nelson. I encourage you to investigate these writings for yourself in order to understand the context in which these passages were intended to be understood.

The bottom-line is this. We hyper-grace preachers DO value confession of sin. We also practice confession of sin in our own lives. However, we understand confession to be about agreeing with God concerning the foolishness of our sin rather than begging for forgiveness based upon a humanly-invented two-tiered approach to somehow "maintaining close fellowship" with Him.

Our fellowship with God was purchased unconditionally and irreversibly by Jesus at the cross. Once we receive that fellowship by simple faith in Christ, it is our eternal possession regardless of our recent performance or track-record. As I’ve written in my book, The Gospel Uncut:

"The way I now approach confession is to simply agree with God about the foolishness of my sin. I admit to Him that my sin hurts me as well as others and that it fails to bring glory to His Name. Often I am sorrowful over the foolishness of my actions. The Apostle Paul wrote that there is a “godly sorrow that brings repentance” (2 Cor. 10:7). When I know I have sinned, I humbly admit that my sinful behavior is out of step with my new nature and identity in Him, and I ask Him to help me rest in His completed work.

Now here comes the best part! After agreeing with God about my sin, I begin thanking Him for the fact that this sinful act was already forgiven at the cross. Understanding these realities has literally transformed my practice of confession, changing the experience from a guilt-ridden begging session into a dynamic, worshipful encounter in which my conscious mind (and behavior) is realigned with the grace and truth of Jesus.

So yes! By all means confess your sin to God! Agree with Him about sin and everything else He has revealed. But don’t think of confession as a means of obtaining something that Jesus Christ died “once for all” to secure for you. Remember that confession is about humility and the ongoing renewal of the mind process – and never about getting something from God that is already yours in abundance through the finished work of Christ.

If you are a believer in Christ, you are NEVER out of fellowship with God. Fellowship is an identity issue, meaning that you now share "all things in common" with God as a joint-heir with Christ (Rom. 8:17)! This never has been and never will be based upon your behavioral performance and is not something that you must confess sin in order to have reinstated! Because of Christ, you are always clean and God is always close!


Objection #5: Hyper-Grace Preachers are Against God’s Law

Some take this claim so far as to suggest that we even want to throw out or ignore the Old Testament. Wow! What wild imaginations these accusers have! The truth is that we are by no means antinomian (against the law of God), nor do we disbelieve or avoid teaching the Old Testament. Most of us actually esteem the power and purpose of God’s law so highly that we understand grace to be the only way of escape from its impossibly stringent demands.

Paul shared in Romans 3 and elsewhere that God’s purposes for the law were two-fold:

1) to stop our self-righteous excuses, minimizations and justifications of our sin and 2) to reveal our desperate need of a Savior by grace through faith. The entire thrust of Jesus’ Sermon on the Mount was to bury His very self-righteous audience under the weight of one inescapable reality: “Unless your righteousness surpasses that of the world’s most stringent law-keepers (the Pharisees and teachers of the law) you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven” (Matt.5:20).

That Jesus came to “fulfill” the Law (Matt. 5:17) means that He came to keep its demands perfectly because He knew that we couldn’t and wouldn’t. He fulfilled the stringent demands of the Law on our behalf as our Substitute so that His record of perfection could be credited to our spiritual account when we received Him by grace through faith. He did what you and I couldn’t and wouldn’t, and the Sermon on the Mount is a damning indictment of anyone who thinks they can measure up to God’s standards on their own effort.

And have you heard of this “cheap grace” idea? Sometimes the term is ripped off and redefined from Bonhoeffer’s vocabulary to insinuate that the hyper-grace movement has cheapened the grace of God by making it “too easy” for people to attain. After all, we live in a world where there’s no such thingas a free lunch, right? We certainly don't believe or teach that grace is cheap. It cost Jesus His life! But we DO agree with the New Testament that His grace is FREE to those who receive it freely by faith.

The truth of the matter is that hyper-grace teachers are not guilty of promoting cheap grace at all. Rather, our critics are often guilty of promoting cheap Law! Far from being anti-law, WE are the ones who esteem God's Law so highly as to conclude that there is no escape from its condemnation apart from faith in Christ alone! The Law is an all-or-nothing proposition. To stumble in just one aspect of keeping it is the equivalent of breaking all of it (James 2:10). The Law is a ministry of death and condemnation (2 Cor. 3:7-11). The Law is not the bad guy, however. It simply points out who the bad guys are (the world, the flesh and the devil)! The Law is holy and pure and designed to show us what sin is (Rom.7:7).

But living under Law cannot save, change or transform a single heart – only grace can! And this is why we are so adamant about never mixing a law-based mentality with a grace-based mentality toward spiritual life or growth under God’s New Covenant. The New Testament repeatedly affirms that our salvation and sanctification are either completely by law or completely by grace, but cannot be a result of mixing the two.


Conclusion:

With all of that said, the idea of trying to somehow “balance grace” with anything is ludicrous according to both Scripture and plain reason. Grace, by definition, is radically IMBALANCED in our favor! If it were not, it would cease to be grace on that very basis! The term “hyper-grace” is far from insulting! It is in fact the ONLY kind of grace taught, supportedand promoted in the Bible.

God understands that His grace is open to the possibility of abuse by those who might misunderstand it. He understands that people may take His grace for granted or even at times misrepresent it as a license to sin. Paul addressed those concerns very clearly, as did Jesus and the other New Testament writers.

However, the fact that grace is open to misinterpretation and the possibility of abuse does not give us license to water it down, explain it away or cheapen its glory by adding a single measure of law into it as an attempt to stay "balanced." There is nothing balanced whatsoever about the grace of God! We rejoice in that! We celebrate that! We proclaim that without apology!

May God reveal His hyper-grace more clearly to you in the days ahead! Feel free to chime in with your thoughts below.

(For a more exhaustive treatment of this critical subject, check out the book "The Hyper-Grace Gospel" by my friend Paul Ellis )


Why I am Hyper-Grace: Answering Five Common Objections
​

Now., as if the other post #343 by JGIG wasn't enough., THIS POST IS YET EVEN BETTER!!!! Wow and I've got to get me a copier!! I'm going to get this on my email and send it to all my friends and family. It took me yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrsssssssssssss to learn this about grace because it was such a shocking truth! To actually USE grace to actually be taught by and lean on His grace while on the journey seemed like an offence at the time I first heard. But as the Holy Spirit began to minister to my heart I repented and embraced His love for me. Now to see it written so well and concisely here for all to see the many aspects that are misunderstood and will be misunderstood when first hearing this awesome message of the gospel of grace (and that took me a looong time to work through on my own without benefit of other believers)

Thank you thank you for posting this and for those who wrote it and for those believers who continue to help others get untangled from the snare of the devil.... he who so tactfully uses condemnation and doubt of God's love and our unworthiness to defeat the believer making him/her a casualty of war when we are in fact and in truth the righteousness of God IN Christ., more than conquerors who already have the victory IN Christ., and who are always dearly beloved by our Father God.

 

[UnderGrace]

I would like to second what LadyLynn has stated.

I am so appreciative Grace 777 and JGIG that you have stepped out and once again declared the truth of God's grace and love.

Paul taught abounding grace this we know and is undisputed, it is up to each one of us to lean into this teaching and believe.

Clark Whitten makes this claim (on page 28 of his excellent book Pure Grace)

The “saved by grace but perfected by human effort” (Lordship) teaching has produced a church that is, in Whitten’s words, “judgmental, angry, hopeless, helpless, dependent, fearful, uninspired, ineffective, and perpetually spiritually immature.”

He’s right. The idea that sanctification is something we produce is a stone cold grace-killer.

That fact that these men/women who teach grace, the very reason any of us are saved and can know God,

come under such contempt and misunderstanding makes me think a line is being drawn for this generation,

God's Grace or Human Effort, which side will you choose?

Thank you for posting this Grace777. JGIG what a blessing to my heart to read this morning!! You are an amazing writer sister. While reading the posts here., the differences are so stark that the power of the written words and the use of them for good shows out like a beacon. What a tool! Write on and on sister JGIG and be encouraged your labor is not in vain here. I pray many many people read these words and learn the truth for the on going message of Gospel of Jesus Christ to go out and many be saved.

I was thinking that for the years I've been on CC and the times I've questioned if my financial support is wise., reading posts and links such as yours and the other one I'm about to "post quick reply" to would make all my questions dissolve. I am truly blessed to be associated with believers like you who expound and explain and re-explain for the sake of those who need it the truth of the gospel of grace. I would never have met you guys and been uplifted each day if we didn't meet here on CC.

So for all the times it was a trial and all the times it was a blessing I'm thankful for CC and the opportunity to meet other Christians from all over who are brothers and sisters in Christ and who share and preach and teach the truth of the gospel of grace and truth that Jesus brought. Much love to you guys from someone who was healed by the power of His love and grace.

 

[PeterJens]

All of it is wrong and has no biblical basis. There is nothing you can keep, there is nothing you can do. The only Hope we have is our faith in the work of the cross and nothing else.

Strong language. Let us look at the word "life"

For whoever wants to save their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will save it.
Luke 9:24

If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even their own life—such a person cannot be my disciple.
Luke 14:26

Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.
John 3:36

Anyone who loves their life will lose it, while anyone who hates their life in this world will keep it for eternal life.
John 12:25

Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
John 17:3

“Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments.”
Matt 19:17

Conclusions

We need to give up our lives here and follow Christ and His kingdom.
Out loyalty is not to our family, but to Christ.

Now this speaks of a decision and a choice and obedience and walking.

Nothing here is passive and just let it happen.

 

[RobbyEarl]

You should learn the meaning of the Cross and how it pertains to grace and how by faith in it allows the Holy Spirit to produce fruit in your life. Glad you learned grace, now learn where it comes from and why you have it. Praise God, I am thankful for you and I mean to show nothing but love. But, now that you are walking learn how to run. Praise God.

Everything we have is provided by the means of the cross. Keep seeking and looking, not that I am the man or know it all, I am still learning. I am a vile and ungodly man even though I am filled with the Holy Spirit. I need the Cross

God bless

 

[ladylynn]

I would like to second what LadyLynn has stated.

I am so appreciative Grace 777 and JGIG that you have stepped out and once again declared the truth of God's grace and love.

Paul taught abounding grace this we know and is undisputed, it is up to each one of us to lean into this teaching and believe.

Clark Whitten makes this claim (on page 28 of his excellent book Pure Grace)

The “saved by grace but perfected by human effort” (Lordship) teaching has produced a church that is, in Whitten’s words, “judgmental, angry, hopeless, helpless, dependent, fearful, uninspired, ineffective, and perpetually spiritually immature.”

He’s right. The idea that sanctification is something we produce is a stone cold grace-killer.

That fact that these men/women who teach grace, the very reason any of us are saved and can know God,

come under such contempt and misunderstanding makes me think a line is being drawn for this generation,

God's Grace or Human Effort, which side will you choose?

The line has always been there imo. There are those believers who came to the end of themselves (like me) who condemned other believers before getting a revelation about the love (grace) of God just like they do here. I was not taught on how to love others from a true heart. I had no idea how to do this never having really known abounding grace from God personally., and instead I was like those "Crusaders" who thought they were fighting for God's righteous kingdom.

So I needed to swipe them all who disagreed with me down with the sword of God's truth!! swoooshhhh!!!! wackkk!!! hackkk!! went my mighty sword of "truth" OH GACK I remember my self righteousness and my deep anger as I thought I was "contending for the faith" as I hacked and wacked my brothers and sisters in Christ.

I look back and am ashamed of my foolishness. How could I have thought such anger was of God? I was blind but now I see. There will always be those who are walking in the grace of God in Christ and those who have yet to hear about it.

 

[PeterJens]

You should learn the meaning of the Cross and how it pertains to grace and how by faith in it allows the Holy Spirit to produce fruit in your life. Glad you learned grace, now learn where it comes from and why you have it. Praise God, I am thankful for you and I mean to show nothing but love. But, now that you are walking learn how to run. Praise God.

Everything we have is provided by the means of the cross. Keep seeking and looking, not that I am the man or know it all, I am still learning. I am a vile and ungodly man even though I am filled with the Holy Spirit. I need the Cross

God bless

Amen. We all need the cross. The cross means we can know purity, love, righteousness.

Jesus's words mean we have the victory and can walk in it. We have passed from death to life.

What is confusing is the idea we are slaves to sin and never free, we are children of God,
but never have a hearts transformed so we are the same on the inside and the outside.

Does God love you? Not a robot incapable of walking as Christ walked, but a sinner who can
be as beautiful and full of grace as Christ is.

We are righteous, if we repent, confess and believe in the cross for the forgiveness of our sins.
Now many who have walked in christianity for their whole lives have not entered into this.

All they have known is trying to be righteous but never seeing Christ, trying to obey, but always
failing. How fantastic is Christ, struck me when I saw how he spoke and lived and how little I
understood any of it or was willing to even try. It was this that overwhelmed me, that in my
failure I was still loved and known.

No sin or lifestyle is too high or distant that Christ cannot transform, Halleluyah.

 

[PeterJens]

Repentance - giving up life and depending on Christ

You have made known to me the paths of life; you will fill me with joy in your presence.
Acts 2:28

But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
Matt 7:14

The seed falling among the thorns refers to someone who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, making it unfruitful.
Matt 13:22

Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
Matt 11:29

It is by seeing the door and the path and running to enter it that we begin the path
to life. In one sense we have already passed from death to life, but we have to abide.

I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.
John 15:5-8

This is all about being, staying, acting, doing. Everything in life is about this, every moment
is a heartbeat in time. So repent and abide in Christ walking in obedience.

 

[LaurenTM]

just my impression from reading a few posts this am

some people here think that browbeating others will turn them into a mini-me

however, that just usually turns up the volume on resentment

I would like to thank all you of you who understand GRACE, understand that it is not HYPER, and who with patience and kind words try over and over to explain that you do not sin, you do not try to attain or keep salvation by works and you ENCOURAGE rather than discourage

the main difference I see between those who claim hyper grace and those who refute this false heresy hunter claim, is that the hyper claimers all, with no difference that I can see, claim the other side continues to sin

this, is perhaps the biggest lie of all as the so called hypers have stated over and over that is not true and have gone to great lengths to prove otherwise

I am not hyper anything except when I drink 2 cups of Tim Horton's coffee cause it's java and that puts me on edge. I only drink Columbian at home. Nice dark roast with no bitter edge. but I digress.....

apparently, once a person has swallowed the false hyper bait, they swim off with it in all directions shooting fellow believers and claiming they need to repent

now there is another interesting sidenote.

repent, in biblical terms, does not mean beat your chest and swear up and down you will never sin again

if you change your mind, as scripture says we should, then, and maybe it is only obvious to me, but it becomes OBVIOUS you are going stop your old way of life

as scripture states a number of times that God Himself repented, changed His mind, and the same word is used with reference to other such useage of the word, how is it, no really, HOW IS IT??? that hyper snipers insist, despite PROOF to the contrary, it means something else?

 

[PeterJens]

I was not taught on how to love others from a true heart. I had no idea how to do this never having really known abounding grace from God personally., and instead I was like those "Crusaders" who thought they were fighting for God's righteous kingdom.

I am interested in this confession. Jesus commands us to love each other as He loves us.
He tells us to clean our hearts, for focus on being righteous, pure, holy, called to live to God.

Christ says we are to forgive from the heart, be honest, answer so our yes is yes and our no
is no.

So previously you were not listening to Christ, so how are you now?

You talk of anger, which is inappropriate, but how does this apply to anyone else?

I easily pass over your words because they do not echo with my heart or my emotional
experience, so I wonder who you are addressing.

 

[PeterJens]

HOW IS IT??? that hyper snipers insist, despite PROOF to the contrary, it means something else?

Do not forget

 

[PeterJens]

My son, do not make light of the Lord’s discipline, and do not lose heart when he rebukes you,
because the Lord disciplines the one he loves, and he chastens everyone he accepts as his son.
heb 12:5-6

 

[PeterJens]

For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.
1 Cor 3:11-15

 

[PeterJens]

Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.
Rom 12:2

 

[PeterJens]

And we all, who with unveiled faces contemplate the Lord’s glory, are being transformed into his image with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.
2 Cor 3:18


But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body.
Phil 3:20-21

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

A word of warning

"The spiritually immature cannot discern between good and evil"

Anyone who teaches this is denying the work of the Holy Spirit in a believer.
The reason we come to faith is because we can discern Christ is good and we are sinners in
need of faith and communion with Him, so that our sins can be forgiven and we can walk in
righteousness and purity.

A more accurate statement would be the christians who are jaded with a faith that in their
lives has failed them, can no longer tell the difference between good and evil.

Peter, it is a verse - the word of God - that the spiritually immature can not yet discern between good and evil. To say it isn't true is to not agree with God. You've done this before. Like when you claimed that it was not true that if we have anger in our heart, we have already murdered. If you would like verses for what someone says so that you can look it up yourself, just ask. Sometimes we might not give it because we just assume others will know what verse we are talking about. So you just need to ask: can you give me a verse for this?

And as to that article - it was getting at something you might not yet have seen - that religious people can do a lot of things in their church and use these things to hide behind while not seeing their inside - selfishness, bitterness, ambition, pride of life, etc. Surely you have seen this before...

 

[PeterJens]

Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God—this is your true and proper worship.
Rom 12:1

 

[eternally-gratefull]

that religious people can do a lot of things in their church and use these things to hide behind while not seeing their inside - selfishness, bitterness, ambition, pride of life, etc. Surely you have seen this before...

There was a group of them in scripture, they were called pharisee.. The jews had a massive problem with this self righteosness. Saddly, the church has the same issue, and has had it for 2000 years now.

 

[PeterJens]

Peter, it is a verse - the word of God - that the spiritually immature can not yet discern between good and evil. To say it isn't true is to not agree with God. You've done this before. Like when you claimed that it was not true that if we have anger in our heart, we have already murdered. If you would like verses for what someone says so that you can look it up yourself, just ask. Sometimes we might not give it because we just assume others will know what verse we are talking about. So you just need to ask: can you give me a verse for this?

And as to that article - it was getting at something you might not yet have seen - that religious people can do a lot of things in their church and use these things to hide behind while not seeing their inside - selfishness, bitterness, ambition, pride of life, etc. Surely you have seen this before...

Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of people in their deceitful scheming. Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will grow to become in every respect the mature body of him who is the head, that is, Christ. From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.
Eph 4:14-16

Now you can take the above teaching and twist it to mean people cannot tell the difference
between good and evil but this is not what they are talking about.

And as far as anger is concerned, Jesus is addressing anger against believers.

In your anger do not sin”: Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry,
Eph 4:26

Anger focused on an individual is where the danger lies.

Was Jesus ever angry?

"Surely you have seen this before.."

I am not to judge other believers and their motivations. I am called to forgive and forget,
to look for the best in others and walk on in love.

Now for those who do not know the Lord, I am here just to show them love and support them
in their weakness. I literally do not care why they are doing something, just that I have the
opportunity to share and praise the Lord.

All this article was doing is condemnation, and not speaking from the place of victory and love.