Against OSAS: some of the best warnings to the churches!
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but they don't speak for themselves. different people interpret them in different ways.
take the first examples. The writer ignores the Scripture in context which says. "You are NOT in the flesh but in The Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwells in you." In other words no Christian is ever 'in the flesh' even though he may be tempted by the flesh
take the first examples. The writer ignores the Scripture in context which says. "You are NOT in the flesh but in The Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwells in you." In other words no Christian is ever 'in the flesh' even though he may be tempted by the flesh
How then do you explain THESE Scriptures?
'All that the Father gives to Me will come to Me, and him who comes to Me I will in no wise cast out. For I am come down from Heaven not to do my own will, but the will of Him Who sent
Me. And this is the will of Him Who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the Last Day,' (John 6.37-39)
But you do not believe (My Father's works) because you are not of My sheep. My sheep hear My voice and I know them, and they follow Me, and I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, and none shall pluck them from My hand. My Father who gave them to Me is greater than all, and no one IS ABLE to pluck them out of the Father's hand. I and my Father are one (John 10.27-30).
All have sinned and come short of the glory of God, being accounted as righteous by His grace FREELY through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, Whom God has set forth to be a propitiation through faith by His blood (Rom 3,23-25).
'Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you, so that you come behind in no gift, waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ,who will also confirm you unto the end, that you might be unreproveable in the Day of our Lord Jesus Christ.' (1 Corinth 1.6-8). (and this the corinthian church!)
'By grace you are saved, through faith, and that (gracious act) not of yourselves, it is the gift of God and not of doings, lest any man should boast, for we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them' (Eph 2.8-10).
'Being confident of this very thing, that he which has begun a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Jesus Christ' (Phil 2.6).
'Who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our doings, but according to His own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began, but now has been manifested by the appearing of our Saviour, Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the Gospel (2 Tim 1.9).
I am not ashamed, for I know Him Whom I have believed, and am persuaded that He is able to keep that which I have committed to Him against that Day (2 Tim 1.12).
But when the kindness of God our Saviour, and His love towards man appeared, not by works done in righteousness which we did ourselves, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, which He poured out upon us richly through Christ Jesus our Saviour, that being justified by His grace we might be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. (Titus 3.4-7).
Wherein God, being minded to show more abundantly unto the heirs of promise the immutability of His Counsel, interposed with an oath, that by two immutable things in which it is impossible for God to lie we may have a strong encouragement who have fled for refuge to lay hold of the hope set before us, which we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and entering into that within the veil, whither as a forerunner Jesus entered for us, having become a High Priest for ever after the order of Melchisedek (Heb 7.7-20).
Wherefore He is able to save to the uttermost them that come unto God by Him, seeing He ever lives to make intercession for them (Heb 7.25).
He has perfected for ever those who are being sanctified (Heb 10.14)
'All that the Father gives to Me will come to Me, and him who comes to Me I will in no wise cast out. For I am come down from Heaven not to do my own will, but the will of Him Who sent
Me. And this is the will of Him Who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the Last Day,' (John 6.37-39)
But you do not believe (My Father's works) because you are not of My sheep. My sheep hear My voice and I know them, and they follow Me, and I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, and none shall pluck them from My hand. My Father who gave them to Me is greater than all, and no one IS ABLE to pluck them out of the Father's hand. I and my Father are one (John 10.27-30).
All have sinned and come short of the glory of God, being accounted as righteous by His grace FREELY through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, Whom God has set forth to be a propitiation through faith by His blood (Rom 3,23-25).
'Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you, so that you come behind in no gift, waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ,who will also confirm you unto the end, that you might be unreproveable in the Day of our Lord Jesus Christ.' (1 Corinth 1.6-8). (and this the corinthian church!)
'By grace you are saved, through faith, and that (gracious act) not of yourselves, it is the gift of God and not of doings, lest any man should boast, for we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them' (Eph 2.8-10).
'Being confident of this very thing, that he which has begun a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Jesus Christ' (Phil 2.6).
'Who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our doings, but according to His own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began, but now has been manifested by the appearing of our Saviour, Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the Gospel (2 Tim 1.9).
I am not ashamed, for I know Him Whom I have believed, and am persuaded that He is able to keep that which I have committed to Him against that Day (2 Tim 1.12).
But when the kindness of God our Saviour, and His love towards man appeared, not by works done in righteousness which we did ourselves, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, which He poured out upon us richly through Christ Jesus our Saviour, that being justified by His grace we might be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. (Titus 3.4-7).
Wherein God, being minded to show more abundantly unto the heirs of promise the immutability of His Counsel, interposed with an oath, that by two immutable things in which it is impossible for God to lie we may have a strong encouragement who have fled for refuge to lay hold of the hope set before us, which we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and entering into that within the veil, whither as a forerunner Jesus entered for us, having become a High Priest for ever after the order of Melchisedek (Heb 7.7-20).
Wherefore He is able to save to the uttermost them that come unto God by Him, seeing He ever lives to make intercession for them (Heb 7.25).
He has perfected for ever those who are being sanctified (Heb 10.14)
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Colossians 1
22. But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation— 23. if you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the Gospel.
You remove yourself from the hope of Christ when you believe it is YOU who are reconciling yourself. You are walking in unbelief and mistakenly think it’s your own efforts keeping you. Your faith is in your obedience. You believe you are doing the reconciling.
The Gospel - whoever believes in HIM will not die but will have everlasting life.
You do not believe Jesus can keep you. You don't have faith in Him alone. You are afraid to let go of your own understanding and it is impossible to please God in the flesh.
Romans 8:8
So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Does it occur to you that the flesh includes self-effort and pride in your own obedience? The Word tells us that the flesh doesn't please God at all.
Romans 8:3
For what the Law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son.
You keep telling people to do, do, do what God has already done. Whereas you should be encouraging others that Christ is faithful and to believe in Him that he is able to keep us from falling.
How do we know that we are walking in faith? Because JESUS IS KEEPING US FROM FALLING BACK INTO THE MINDSET OF THE WORLD which is about performance and appearances., i.e. "the pride of life".
We walk by FAITH in Christ Jesus, not by sight.
22. But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation— 23. if you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the Gospel.
You remove yourself from the hope of Christ when you believe it is YOU who are reconciling yourself. You are walking in unbelief and mistakenly think it’s your own efforts keeping you. Your faith is in your obedience. You believe you are doing the reconciling.
The Gospel - whoever believes in HIM will not die but will have everlasting life.
You do not believe Jesus can keep you. You don't have faith in Him alone. You are afraid to let go of your own understanding and it is impossible to please God in the flesh.
Romans 8:8
So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Does it occur to you that the flesh includes self-effort and pride in your own obedience? The Word tells us that the flesh doesn't please God at all.
Romans 8:3
For what the Law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son.
You keep telling people to do, do, do what God has already done. Whereas you should be encouraging others that Christ is faithful and to believe in Him that he is able to keep us from falling.
How do we know that we are walking in faith? Because JESUS IS KEEPING US FROM FALLING BACK INTO THE MINDSET OF THE WORLD which is about performance and appearances., i.e. "the pride of life".
We walk by FAITH in Christ Jesus, not by sight.
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God has not only promise eternal security, but He has provided it for us, but He has also promised and provided healing for us, but not every Christian receives it.
We can loose salvation, for those who believe in eternal security, have to throw out, Matt 25: 1--13.
Heb 6. And Heb 10. Plus the Biblical "IFs".
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Why do you think mobs of lost folk sought hard after Jesus, thronging around him, wanting only to touch him physically, some giving up everything just to be near him? Because virtue flowed from him. They knew he was the Light of Life and knew he could make them see the truth that sets men free SPIRITUALLY.
Jesus makes people new SPIRITUALLY. Jesus keeps people SPIRITUALLY like a shepherd keeps his sheep. We are changed INWARDLY. The flesh doesn't ever, ever, ever change because the flesh cannot receive anything from God. It's impossible. Our carnal intellectual mind will never, ever, ever, ever reconcile with God. Surrender your own understanding and rest in God. He will take care of you and make you into His image.
Have faith in Christ alone.
Jesus makes people new SPIRITUALLY. Jesus keeps people SPIRITUALLY like a shepherd keeps his sheep. We are changed INWARDLY. The flesh doesn't ever, ever, ever change because the flesh cannot receive anything from God. It's impossible. Our carnal intellectual mind will never, ever, ever, ever reconcile with God. Surrender your own understanding and rest in God. He will take care of you and make you into His image.
Have faith in Christ alone.
you cannot demonstrate that God has provided healing for us, you simply cite Scriptures which suit you. The Scripture does not promise healing to us in this life. Consider how many of Paul's helpers were ill.
But He has promised ETERNAL LIFE to us NOW, and it IS eternal. See eg john 5.24. When He says eternal security He means the Christian is secure for eternity NOW. Not your garbled version of it,
As for the verses you cite, they are referring to non-Christians. It is simply you who interpret them incorrectly.
Who shall lay any charges against God's elect. It is GOD WHO justifies.
But He has promised ETERNAL LIFE to us NOW, and it IS eternal. See eg john 5.24. When He says eternal security He means the Christian is secure for eternity NOW. Not your garbled version of it,
As for the verses you cite, they are referring to non-Christians. It is simply you who interpret them incorrectly.
Who shall lay any charges against God's elect. It is GOD WHO justifies.
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Are you kidding me? You actually just posted scripture which reads the exact opposite of what you're trying to pass off as truth.
Matt 25: 1--13.
The oil in the lamps is the Holy Spirit. The ones who didn’t have oil were dependent upon what they already possessed of themselves. God says, “I don’t know you,” to our flesh. No flesh will ever be justified in his sight. Nobody will come to God saying, "Look what I have done," and be rewarded. Self-sufficiency is burned away. Our great reward is having Christ with and within us for eternity. Jesus is our reward.
God the Father only recognizes us by His Holy Spirit which dwells within us. No flesh inherits the kingdom. But we who are led by His Spirit already have His kingdom within us.
Heb 6. ~ again, are you kidding me? How do you believe that scripture confirms that your own obedience keeps you? It reads the total opposite of that.
For God tells us plainly in Hebrew 6:
Get past your immature stage (repentance) and grow up in Christ (faith in Him), stop laying down the foundations over & over again about repentance as if actions were faith in God and instructions about cleansing yourselves and talking about eternal judgment. It’s impossible for those who have their spiritual eyes opened, who have tasted the gift of life, who share in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the Word of God to fall away and be brought back again to repentance. That is like crucifying the Son of God over & over again and making his cross a public disgrace, as if it wasn’t enough the first time.
The Word is telling you that it is impossible to be redeemed and then unredeemed. It's impossible to be saved and then unsaved. It's impossible for the Cross of Christ not to be effective once and for all eternally.
Hebrews 10
We have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once and for all.
You are telling people Christ is not enough, that we have the ability to be holy when the Lord died so that He could make us holy and keep us holy.
How do you not see that's why men leaped for joy and shouted praises to God and some went even to their death proclaiming God is able and faithful to keep them? The thief on the cross next to Jesus said, "Lord, remember me." He recognized Jesus as Lord and was united with Christ forever. Because he proclaimed, "Lord!" He believed God.
And yet you want to continue to tell the world that they should listen to you and make themselves presentable to God over and over again and have faith in their own works.
Matt 25: 1--13.
The oil in the lamps is the Holy Spirit. The ones who didn’t have oil were dependent upon what they already possessed of themselves. God says, “I don’t know you,” to our flesh. No flesh will ever be justified in his sight. Nobody will come to God saying, "Look what I have done," and be rewarded. Self-sufficiency is burned away. Our great reward is having Christ with and within us for eternity. Jesus is our reward.
God the Father only recognizes us by His Holy Spirit which dwells within us. No flesh inherits the kingdom. But we who are led by His Spirit already have His kingdom within us.
Heb 6. ~ again, are you kidding me? How do you believe that scripture confirms that your own obedience keeps you? It reads the total opposite of that.
For God tells us plainly in Hebrew 6:
Get past your immature stage (repentance) and grow up in Christ (faith in Him), stop laying down the foundations over & over again about repentance as if actions were faith in God and instructions about cleansing yourselves and talking about eternal judgment. It’s impossible for those who have their spiritual eyes opened, who have tasted the gift of life, who share in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the Word of God to fall away and be brought back again to repentance. That is like crucifying the Son of God over & over again and making his cross a public disgrace, as if it wasn’t enough the first time.
The Word is telling you that it is impossible to be redeemed and then unredeemed. It's impossible to be saved and then unsaved. It's impossible for the Cross of Christ not to be effective once and for all eternally.
Hebrews 10
We have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once and for all.
You are telling people Christ is not enough, that we have the ability to be holy when the Lord died so that He could make us holy and keep us holy.
How do you not see that's why men leaped for joy and shouted praises to God and some went even to their death proclaiming God is able and faithful to keep them? The thief on the cross next to Jesus said, "Lord, remember me." He recognized Jesus as Lord and was united with Christ forever. Because he proclaimed, "Lord!" He believed God.
And yet you want to continue to tell the world that they should listen to you and make themselves presentable to God over and over again and have faith in their own works.
As for Jn 5: 24, you are looking at it from God's side, just like the false grace teachers only quote Col 1: 21--22, .
but leave out v23.
You false grace teachers also say about the scriptures that prove you wrong, "They are for the unbelievers ".
But they clearly tell us that they are for the Christians
Can't you see how erroneous your teachings are.
There are a lot of times in the original greek the "if" is actually a statement of it is fulfilled.....example:
Colossians 1:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.
A.T. Robertson - Greek scholar has this to say about Col. 1:23 and says that it is determined as being fulfilled in the Greek.
If so be that ye continue in the faith ([FONT="Gentium" !important]ei ge epimenete tēi pistei[/FONT]). Condition of the first class (determined as fulfilled),
A. T. Robertson Word Pictures in the New Testament.
Here is an example of this usage now....
" you are going to the bank..and I say to you.... If you are going to be at the bank...get me $100 bucks. - you going to the bank is treated as fulfilled already )
I'll take a check too...
Colossians 1:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.
A.T. Robertson - Greek scholar has this to say about Col. 1:23 and says that it is determined as being fulfilled in the Greek.
If so be that ye continue in the faith ([FONT="Gentium" !important]ei ge epimenete tēi pistei[/FONT]). Condition of the first class (determined as fulfilled),
A. T. Robertson Word Pictures in the New Testament.
Here is an example of this usage now....
" you are going to the bank..and I say to you.... If you are going to be at the bank...get me $100 bucks. - you going to the bank is treated as fulfilled already )
I'll take a check too...
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I go by your experience not your platitudes. You do not find them literally fulfilled in your church.
Matt 8.16-17 was speaking of Jesus, not in general and I Peter 2 was speaking of salvation. The only verse that holds water (Mark 16.9 on is not in the original text) is James 5, which promises salvation not healing. The healing is an extra hope.
Matt 8.16-17 was speaking of Jesus, not in general and I Peter 2 was speaking of salvation. The only verse that holds water (Mark 16.9 on is not in the original text) is James 5, which promises salvation not healing. The healing is an extra hope.
God's side is the one that matters. As for citing verses I recollect that Pauls words are to the visible church which contains both possessors and professors. The warning is for the latter.
Of course he warned people of the danger of a head belief and not a heart belief. That proves my teaching to be correct. Your erroneous teaching leaves many young believers in terror and unable to advance, to say nothing of yourself being in a hypocritical state.
Of course he warned people of the danger of a head belief and not a heart belief. That proves my teaching to be correct. Your erroneous teaching leaves many young believers in terror and unable to advance, to say nothing of yourself being in a hypocritical state.
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Romans 3:10-12
[SUP]10 [/SUP]as it is written,“There is none righteous, not even one;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]There is none who understands,
There is none who seeks for God;
[SUP]12 [/SUP]All have turned aside, together they have become useless;
There is none who does good,
There is not even one.”
No one is Righteous.
No one understands.
no one seeks for God.
No one does good.
We must understand that left to ourselves none will ever go looking or seeking for God. No not even one.
Its God who goes looking for us. Its God who seeks us. Its God by His Grace gives us our Salvation. And it is God who Justifies us.
We by our self are worthless and can do nothing. We are nothing but sinners at best.
Everything we have is from the Grace of God. Everything we will receive is from the Grace of God.
Why do some teach its by what we do? Some teach its themselves who seek out God. Some teach its by their own efforts they receive Salvation.
We must understand its by Grace and not by Law that we walk with God.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]as it is written,“There is none righteous, not even one;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]There is none who understands,
There is none who seeks for God;
[SUP]12 [/SUP]All have turned aside, together they have become useless;
There is none who does good,
There is not even one.”
No one is Righteous.
No one understands.
no one seeks for God.
No one does good.
We must understand that left to ourselves none will ever go looking or seeking for God. No not even one.
Its God who goes looking for us. Its God who seeks us. Its God by His Grace gives us our Salvation. And it is God who Justifies us.
We by our self are worthless and can do nothing. We are nothing but sinners at best.
Everything we have is from the Grace of God. Everything we will receive is from the Grace of God.
Why do some teach its by what we do? Some teach its themselves who seek out God. Some teach its by their own efforts they receive Salvation.
We must understand its by Grace and not by Law that we walk with God.
There are a lot of times in the original greek the "if" is actually a statement of it is fulfilled.....example:
Colossians 1:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.
A.T. Robertson - Greek scholar has this to say about Col. 1:23 and says that it is determined as being fulfilled in the Greek.
If so be that ye continue in the faith ([FONT="Gentium" !important]ei ge epimenete tēi pistei[/FONT]). Condition of the first class (determined as fulfilled),
A. T. Robertson Word Pictures in the New Testament.
Here is an example of this usage now....
" you are going to the bank..and I say to you.... If you are going to be at the bank...get me $100 bucks. - you going to the bank is treated as fulfilled already )
I'll take a check too...
Colossians 1:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.
A.T. Robertson - Greek scholar has this to say about Col. 1:23 and says that it is determined as being fulfilled in the Greek.
If so be that ye continue in the faith ([FONT="Gentium" !important]ei ge epimenete tēi pistei[/FONT]). Condition of the first class (determined as fulfilled),
A. T. Robertson Word Pictures in the New Testament.
Here is an example of this usage now....
" you are going to the bank..and I say to you.... If you are going to be at the bank...get me $100 bucks. - you going to the bank is treated as fulfilled already )
I'll take a check too...
That is a typical false grace teachers statement.
The Greek tense for Col 1: 23 is, a continuous action.
The meaning for, Grounded and not moved, is, "To be continuously in the faith".
Jesus is only coming back for those who are,
living right, Matt 25: 1--13.
Who are watching and praying to be counted worthy, Lk 21: 36
Love Him, 1 Cor 16: 22.
That are holy and without blemish, Eph 5: 26--27.
Looking for Him, Heb 9: 28.
Purifies themselves, 1 Jn 3: 2--3.
Forget what JP said, when he said, "You don't have to be holy or faithful".
The of cause there are Heb 6: 4--6. Heb 10: 26--31,
You are saying God is a respecter of people, Because according to you it's God who seeks us, so those who get saved, must be the ones that God wants, and those who don't get saved, is because God didn't seek them.
Plus, you said everything we have is by grace, and that means those who don't have, is because God hasn't graced them.
The false grace teachers only give the God side of the Bible, and reject the part that says "we have to do".