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FreeNChrist
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It isn't speaking to Jews under the Law, it's speaking to Christians under Gods grace.
The wages of sin is death...
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It isn't speaking to Jews under the Law, it's speaking to Christians under Gods grace.
God is God. God is One. He has One people. He calls them Israel. (not saying just the natural blood-line Israel). Not even all Israel is Israel. God's commandments are for God's people.
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Sorry but you missed the cross entirely. Gods people are under a new and improved program, better in every way. And we ain't ever going back to that old and obsolete program.
you must not listen to the words of the Messiah?
But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one dot of the Law to become void.
(Luke 16:17)
Now, take a peek out your window. Still see the earth?
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Sure its still serves Gods purposes. It continues to condemn those so foolish as to think they can be what God demands them to be apart from God Himself. And it still leads those who accept that reality to rightly seeing Jesus as their only hope.
When Jesus died on the Cross everything was completed.
The time of the Israelite's was finished and the time of the Gentiles started. We went from Law to Grace.
Yes we are to keep the Commandments of God, but not the commandments made by men like the Jewish people did for their Sabbath.
Jesus, when was asked about commandments, He quoted the Ten commandments and only two other Commandments.
All the man made commandments the Jewish people made up are not the Commandments we are to keep.
The time of the Israelite's was finished and the time of the Gentiles started. We went from Law to Grace.
Yes we are to keep the Commandments of God, but not the commandments made by men like the Jewish people did for their Sabbath.
Jesus, when was asked about commandments, He quoted the Ten commandments and only two other Commandments.
All the man made commandments the Jewish people made up are not the Commandments we are to keep.
maybe, one day, you will make it beyond your free ticket to heaven and realize that justification through Messiah is not the end. It is more like the beginning!
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Maybe one day you will stop working against Jesus by trying to place Christians under the Law that He came and freed us from.
clearly we don't agree on some things. I am not teaching anyone to obey the law for salvation. But I can tell you this, the Law of God IS freedom.
yes exactly. the torah commands stoning of sinners, and provides "thou shalt not" the torah is the doctrine of islam even today. they still stone wives, children, and reject Jesus. the gospel is a Christians way
Paul had a lot to say about Judaizers that were coming in and telling the gentiles to keep the law of Moses....just like we do today too.
Galatians 2:3-5 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised:
[SUP]4 [/SUP] And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:
[SUP]5 [/SUP] To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
We too are not going to giver place for an hour with this going back top the law for living. We have Christ now - the real thing. The law was a mere shadow of the real thing - Christ in us.
Galatians 5:1 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
Galatians 2:3-5 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised:
[SUP]4 [/SUP] And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:
[SUP]5 [/SUP] To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
We too are not going to giver place for an hour with this going back top the law for living. We have Christ now - the real thing. The law was a mere shadow of the real thing - Christ in us.
Galatians 5:1 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Clearly Christians are not under the Law. Period. The Law is neither the grounds of our acceptance before God nor the rule of our life. Under grace Jesus is Himself the divine directive in our lives, who guides and leads us from within…..and He is more than able. Your beliefs are an affront to God and to the cross of Jesus.
Jesus is the perfect Law that Gives freedom. if we are obeying Jesus, the law is already kept. Jesus perfected it.
"you have heard long ago that it was said....but I tell you" Jesus removed the authority of the mosaic law, perfected it and then said " obey my commands"
james 1:21-25 "21Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and the evil that is so prevalent and humbly accept the word planted in you, which can save you.22Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like someone who looks at his face in a mirror and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like. But whoever looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues in it—not forgetting what they have heard, but doing it—they will be blessed in what they do."
"In the beginning was the word, the word was with God and the word was God.....and the word became flesh and made His dwelling among us." "
john 8:31-32 "To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. 32Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”
it is hearing and doing Jesus that saves and keeps the law, and brings freedom from sin " be not hearers only and so deceive yourselves, do what the word says" or Jesus " the wise man will hear him and do what hes saying, he will stand the test, the foolish man will hear only and not do, he is deceived into thinking his house has a foundation, but his house will be =destroyed.
the torah commands sinners to be stoned, and provides no freedom from the sin that lives in us, it only restrains sinners
I am disappointed you see it this way. Yeshua is the Savior. He is the Word made flesh. He is our example. He did not break any commandments. The Law of God is liberty. Keep in mind, the Messiah authored them all.
honestly I care very little if anyone is disappointed in me, because there is one whos approval I seek, His name is Jesus the Christ.
the 1st covenant cannot save. you are not hearing me, if we obey Jesus this happens the law says " do not commit adultery, if anyone is caught in adultery, surely they must be put to death, you shall gather round them and cast stones , purge the sin from among you" Jesus says when the law keepers brought a woman caught in adultery " let He who is without sin cast the first stone, then neither do I condemn you, now go and sin no more"
Jesus did not obey the mosaic law here, there is no dispute. you are not seeing grace , ( not the worlds deceptive grace without condition) but Gods true Grace. the law was " thou shalt not or you will die" it is all based on the command in eden. that's the law of sin=death. its only purpose was to lead the world to Jesus. if a person obeyed the law, inside, still they were sinners. the law is sent to sinful man, to restrain their sin. that is the first covenant, God came and lived with them in a tent as they crossed the desert and they adhered to all the law. yet look at it, they never became righteous, they continually angered God and he punished them over, and over untl finally they drove Him away and began inventing more laws, you do realize I hope that the law contaoins at least 400 separate commands? its not the 10 commandsments those are now and will always be relevant as our moral compass of what NOT to do.
Jesus made it perfect. do you see His teachings are different than the law? the law is the action, Jesus is the motive. the law is you will die if you do these things. Jesus is " you will live eternally if you obey my commands" the law is Judaism. when Jesus came, it is the Kingdom of God. " I desire mercy not sacrifice." Jesus removed the curses in the law, and made it perfect by elimuinating lust = you will never commit adultery. eliminate hat, and you will never murder ect. Jesus is about fixing the heart because all sin comes from within us and becomes action. the law restrained the actions, but left the heart hardened. why do you think Jesus was so harsh to the teachers of the law? the Pharisees and scribes?? they all are known for strictly meticulously keeping the law, yet Jesus condemned them harshly, and also they hated Jesus.
Jesus was above the Law, he showed this clearly by coming and being all about " you heard long ago, but now I tell you ...... inChrist the law remains, but now it gives freedom because it frees us inwardly and then our actions or " fruit" is acceptable to God. we aren't lusting constantly for our neighbors wife and restraining that lust, Jesus commands us to do all we need to do to not lust, if we do that, the sexual immorality disappears and our obedience comes from a pure, clean heart and then it is natural to simply do the right thing.
The more you learn Jesus, the less you even need to read law it is Just naturally kept because of Jesus commands. one is life, the other is death. I have nothing against you, just disagree on this particular issue. God bless you anyways and I hope you understand that were all coming together even if its a slow process, because of Love we press on
so much in his writings is evident that he struggled mightily to keep the judaizers from yoking believers to the Law. its like he and the apostles would set a church up on a solid foundation, and then as they journeyed on, behind them came the jews, still not understanding the kingdom had come and the pattern laid out in the old, was of no use anymore for those who belonged to Christ. The law isn't a bad thing its right and good and true, under it, mankind was dead because of our sin. thank God for Jesus
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Keep in mind that your attempts to place your own arbitrary limitation on God is entirely illegitimate. God is not locked into having to do things in the same way as He has in the past. He can and does change how He chooses to deal with mankind. And that is exactly what He has done through the cross. He changed everything.
But you are still clinging to the past. To what God has made obsolete. Why you would want to, I have no idea. It's like trying to force the judge to give you the lessor things contained in an old will, when he is trying to give you the better things contained in the new will...in the last will and testament. Such silly folly it is.
Whoever says "I know him" but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him,
but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him:
1 John 2:4-5 (ESV2011, MBM)
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