Obese patients face NHS surgery ban to save money

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M

Miri

Guest
#1
If you are over weight and live in North Yorkshire you might want to
move somewhere else.

Obese patients face NHS surgery ban to save money - BBC News


Don't know how they can justify this except for clinical reasons where it would
be more dangerous to operate. If someone is overweight but needs hip,
knee or back surgery and is in constant pain, then I can't see how they can
successfully lose weight if they are in agony when they move.

It also has economic repercussions, if you can't work because you are in
constant pain for example.
 
M

MadParrotWoman

Guest
#2
Wow this is opening a can of worms but..........they could begin by stopping doing unnecessary ops such as sex change operations and other cosmetic surgery (except where there has been an accident and someone needs correction surgery) an utter waste of money. God made us the way we are flaws included. I get angry that my money is wasted on such rubbish!

If they stop surgery for the obese they have to also stop it for smoking-related diseases, alcohol-related sickness and drug taking damage. It's opening a Pandora's box
 
Last edited:
U

Ultimatum77

Guest
#3
This is smart b/c obese patients 90% of the time do emotional eating b/c of some emotional problem/trauma they had in childhood....why do surgeries for people who are going to continue abusing themselves.....it's like giving a food gift card and telling an alcoholic not to buy beer...of course he's going to buy it until he decides he wants to change...the 10% weight loss is not a big deal....stop stuffing cheezits down your throat and get moving/eating more veggies...even by changing some dietary habits you can lose 5 lbs w/o even exercising but just drinking water avoiding sugary and oily/junk foods....Good on Yorkshire for not entertaining this waste of money until these patients get serious about their weight....

These people need to get serious and tackle the underlying issue whether its emotional trauma or just a plain lack of self control....and own their life so to speak....
 

JosephsDreams

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2015
4,313
467
83
#4
When I was actively counseling, probably about 65% of the people who were overweight had emotional psychological issues as opposed to physiological.
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#5
Wow this is opening a can of worms but..........they could begin by stopping doing unnecessary ops such as sex change operations and other cosmetic surgery (except where there has been an accident and someone needs correction surgery) an utter waste of money. God made us the way we are flaws included. I get angry that my money is wasted on such rubbish!

If they stop surgery for the obese they have to also stop it for smoking-related diseases, alcohol-related sickness and drug taking damage. It's opening a Pandora's box
That Pandora's Box was opened in 1948 though people are loathe to acknowledge it.
 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#6
Divorce almost any commodity (no matter how necessary) from market forces and you will get fewer people willing to provide the service and some form of triage.

How ironic. If you're fat, you're tossed to the back of the bread line.
 
M

Miri

Guest
#7
I think it's a good idea to get as physically ready for surgery as possible to
assist with recovery, eat well, try to lose a little weight, give up or cut down
on smoking drinking. This makes sense, but the above article suggests that's it,
tough no surgery unless you lose 10% body weight - then they might reconsider
in a year's time
.

A year is a long time to suffer in pain with no job, how is that going to help with
depression, finances, motivation to get help for emotional issues etc.

I am also really sceptical. I have a brother who kept putting on weight the doctors
eventually tested him and said he had an under active thyroid problem. But it took
at least 2 years to get a diagnosis.

Then he had a hernia so had surgery, a few months later the hernia needed doing
again as the original surgery didn't hold. Then he got pneumonia and was on steroids
for a long time to clear his lungs. As a result of all this he ended up putting on lots of weight
through no fault of his own.

He struggled for a few years after to try to lose it before discovering that the thyroxine
meds were set too low and he needed a higher dose. He felt demoralised and depressed and
the hospital told him if he could prove he could stick to a healthy eating plan by losing
2 stone, they would give him stomach bypass surgery (sort of they're way of admitting they
had made a bit of a mess of things medically), and that he could also have the loose
skin later removed. Also about the same time he developed a third hernia.

Anyway he struggled to do it but at last seeing some light at the end of the tunnel, he lost
2 stone and went back to the hospital. Guess what they told him that due to the weight loss
he no longer qualified for the stomach bypass surgery and they also refused him a third
hernia operation unless he lost more weight! So on one hand he was too fat but on the other
hand he wasn't fat enough!

He got so mad at them that he decided he would show them and then went on to lose half his
body weight slimming right down to a trim healthy size. They still refused him a hernia
operation unless it became stangulated. He still has the hernia and it often causes him
problems.

Also they now refuse surgery for the loose skin as he eventually lost the weight on his own. If he had
been given the stomach bypass they would have done it automatically.

He is now a healthy weight but struggles more than ever with his body appearance and
with the hernia. Basically he will have to wait until it becomes strangulated and it becomes an
emergency to get it done.

So to me the above article just seems yet another excuse to cut costs.
 
M

Miri

Guest
#8
Ah it looks like they are being forced to review the decision now. The link
was changed and updated 5 mins ago with new information.


could have seen obese patients refused surgery in an attempt to save money
is to be reviewed after national NHS bosses intervened.

A proposed restriction by the NHS Vale of York Clinical Commissioning Group
would have seen non-life threatening procedures delayed by a year for those with
a body mass index exceeding 30.

The rule would also apply to smokers.
NHS England, which can intervene as the CCG is under special measures, said
the group had agreed to rethink the move.

Under the move, obese patients in the Vale of York area could have secured a referral
in less than a year if they shed 10% of their weight.

Similarly, if smokers refused to quit they would face having procedures delayed for
up to six months, which could be accelerated if they stopped smoking for eight weeks.

The CCG said the proposals, announced as part of a package of measures being
considered to reduce costs, came at a time when the local system was under "severe
pressure".

The new rules would only apply to elective surgery for non-life threatening procedures,
for example hip and knee operations.

'No blanket bans'
But a spokesman for NHS England said: "Reducing obesity and cutting smoking not
only benefits patients, but saves the NHS and taxpayers millions of pounds.

"This does not and cannot mean blanket bans on particular patients such as smokers
getting operations, which would be inconsistent with the NHS constitution."
 

JosephsDreams

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2015
4,313
467
83
#9
I think it's a good idea to get as physically ready for surgery as possible to
assist with recovery, eat well, try to lose a little weight, give up or cut down
on smoking drinking. This makes sense, but the above article suggests that's it,
tough no surgery unless you lose 10% body weight - then they might reconsider
in a year's time
.

A year is a long time to suffer in pain with no job, how is that going to help with
depression, finances, motivation to get help for emotional issues etc.

I am also really sceptical. I have a brother who kept putting on weight the doctors
eventually tested him and said he had an under active thyroid problem. But it took
at least 2 years to get a diagnosis.

Then he had a hernia so had surgery, a few months later the hernia needed doing
again as the original surgery didn't hold. Then he got pneumonia and was on steroids
for a long time to clear his lungs. As a result of all this he ended up putting on lots of weight
through no fault of his own.

He struggled for a few years after to try to lose it before discovering that the thyroxine
meds were set too low and he needed a higher dose. He felt demoralised and depressed and
the hospital told him if he could prove he could stick to a healthy eating plan by losing
2 stone, they would give him stomach bypass surgery (sort of they're way of admitting they
had made a bit of a mess of things medically), and that he could also have the loose
skin later removed. Also about the same time he developed a third hernia.

Anyway he struggled to do it but at last seeing some light at the end of the tunnel, he lost
2 stone and went back to the hospital. Guess what they told him that due to the weight loss
he no longer qualified for the stomach bypass surgery and they also refused him a third
hernia operation unless he lost more weight! So on one hand he was too fat but on the other
hand he wasn't fat enough!

He got so mad at them that he decided he would show them and then went on to lose half his
body weight slimming right down to a trim healthy size. They still refused him a hernia
operation unless it became stangulated. He still has the hernia and it often causes him
problems.

Also they now refuse surgery for the loose skin as he eventually lost the weight on his own. If he had
been given the stomach bypass they would have done it automatically.

He is now a healthy weight but struggles more than ever with his body appearance and
with the hernia. Basically he will have to wait until it becomes strangulated and it becomes an
emergency to get it done.

So to me the above article just seems yet another excuse to cut costs.
I can tell you beyond a shadow of doubt, the better your diet is, the faster and better you'll heal. A person who has been on a raw vegan diet for at least 6 months will heal from anywhere to around 30% to 75% faster then the person on the SAD.
And a person who implements a raw vegan diet after certain injuries or surgery will heal aster then the average person, but not as quickly as the person who had been on it for a time.
 

Tommy379

Notorious Member
Jan 12, 2016
7,589
1,152
113
#10
If you are over weight and live in North Yorkshire you might want to
move somewhere else.

Obese patients face NHS surgery ban to save money - BBC News


Don't know how they can justify this except for clinical reasons where it would
be more dangerous to operate. If someone is overweight but needs hip,
knee or back surgery and is in constant pain, then I can't see how they can
successfully lose weight if they are in agony when they move.

It also has economic repercussions, if you can't work because you are in
constant pain for example.
This what happens with single payer nationalized government run medicine...... Coming to Americain 2017.
 

Tommy379

Notorious Member
Jan 12, 2016
7,589
1,152
113
#11
I can tell you beyond a shadow of doubt, the better your diet is, the faster and better you'll heal. A person who has been on a raw vegan diet for at least 6 months will heal from anywhere to around 30% to 75% faster then the person on the SAD.
And a person who implements a raw vegan diet after certain injuries or surgery will heal aster then the average person, but not as quickly as the person who had been on it for a time.
I eat nothing but undercooked animal flesh and water and I heal like The Wolverine.
 

tanakh

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2015
4,635
1,041
113
77
#12
A cure for obesity could be a course of NHS Hospital food. Its so foul nobody would eat it.
 

JosephsDreams

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2015
4,313
467
83
#13
I eat nothing but undercooked animal flesh and water and I heal like The Wolverine.
Trust me T, you would cure like Wolverine X2 if you ate nothing but uncooked plant flesh.;)
 

Tommy379

Notorious Member
Jan 12, 2016
7,589
1,152
113
#14
Trust me T, you would cure like Wolverine X2 if you ate nothing but uncooked plant flesh.;)
But I enjoy having muscles like the Rock and picking up objects that weigh twice as much as myself.
 

JosephsDreams

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2015
4,313
467
83
#15
But I enjoy having muscles like the Rock and picking up objects that weigh twice as much as myself.
Okay, your still a relatively young guy. Have fun. There are certain delights in being strong and having a body like Adonis.
In about another 4 or 5 years, consider a change. You can probably get away with it til then.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#16
If you are over weight and live in North Yorkshire you might want to
move somewhere else.

Obese patients face NHS surgery ban to save money - BBC News


Don't know how they can justify this except for clinical reasons where it would
be more dangerous to operate. If someone is overweight but needs hip,
knee or back surgery and is in constant pain, then I can't see how they can
successfully lose weight if they are in agony when they move.

It also has economic repercussions, if you can't work because you are in
constant pain for example.
Yep the government will tell you people how much to weigh and who will live or die ... This is the kind of things many Americans hate about the whole socialized healthcare issue ... Never trust the government to run anything is our moto ... "Live free or die"
 
M

Miri

Guest
#17
A cure for obesity could be a course of NHS Hospital food. Its so foul nobody would eat it.

Thats so true, my aunt lost a stone while in a CICs bed (rehab) in July last year and
another stone while in hospital in the Autumn.
 

Oncefallen

Idiot in Chief
Staff member
Jan 15, 2011
6,057
3,365
113
#18
Thats so true, my aunt lost a stone while in a CICs bed (rehab) in July last year and
another stone while in hospital in the Autumn.
At first glance (without looking at the quoted post) I thought to myself, "she lost a stone?? what stone? Kidney stone, gall stone?

**facepalm**

Duh.............measurement of weight stone.

 

Desdichado

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#19
Yep the government will tell you people how much to weigh and who will live or die ... This is the kind of things many Americans hate about the whole socialized healthcare issue ... Never trust the government to run anything is our moto ... "Live free or die"
It'll be the means through which they regulate all behavior here in the good old Bureaucratic States of America.

Have a gun? No treatment for you. Supported traditional marriage at any point in the last 20 years? Well that chemo therapy might be a bit longer in coming, but don't worry! Uncle Sam will protect you!
 
M

Miri

Guest
#20
At first glance (without looking at the quoted post) I thought to myself, "she lost a stone?? what stone? Kidney stone, gall stone?

**facepalm**

Duh.............measurement of weight stone.



Sorry maybe I should have said 14 lbs! I forget not everyone speaks the queens English. :D