The Gap vs. New Creationism Propaganda

[Billyd]

Since you folks enjoy analyzing theory's on creation, here's a new one for you.

Moses was the author of the book of Genesis. God inspired him to write it. Each day is not the period of time that it took for activity to happen. It is the length of time that it took for God to show Moses the activity that happened. Remember that Moses, many years after the creation, wrote the first five books to a group of people who only understood time as cycles of the moon and sun. Most only understood time as the cycle of the sun. It makes perfect sense that the people accepted Moses's words as day by day, even though he was describing distinct periods of time.

 

[eph610]

I don't really care when He did it or how old it is. That really doesn't matter. He created it, no doubt. Evolution is bunk,no doubt.

The GAP just reveals satans fall and judgement. And satan doesn't want us to see this. Who really cares if it was one second or a billion years?

Grace,
This is where we disagree and its fine...The totality of GAP theory does not just talk about Satan & his fall, but it propagates old earth processes, that are rooted in Theistic & Secular Evolution doctrines. Certain parts of GAP theory justify evolution and even ardent GAP defenders suggest God used Evolution to create, make and form the Earth.

This is why I suggested you find what the founders of GAP theory total proposal was. It was created to give an answer to Darwin's theory, that had a scientific basis.

GAP is far more than just Satan and his fall....much more and now I see where we diverged and I am sorry for that...

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Since you folks enjoy analyzing theory's on creation, here's a new one for you.

Moses was the author of the book of Genesis. God inspired him to write it. Each day is not the period of time that it took for activity to happen. It is the length of time that it took for God to show Moses the activity that happened. Remember that Moses, many years after the creation, wrote the first five books to a group of people who only understood time as cycles of the moon and sun. Most only understood time as the cycle of the sun. It makes perfect sense that the people accepted Moses's words as day by day, even though he was describing distinct periods of time.

If I may without sounding judgmental. I disagree,

maybe they just took him literally..

And the evening and the morning were the first day......

I honestly can not see why anyone would assume this should be interpreted to mean a period of time of unknown length, of course, I have been wrong before..

 

[Gr8grace]

No life on earth died,, The first life which died was the animal God slew to cover the nakedness of Adam. And the groud was cursed. meaning things would smother the life out of the good seed, to kill it.. We see this today.. No flesh was eaten while ada was in the garden, The lion and the lamb would sleep together,

Scripture says when God restores the earth, this will happen again.. It will be as it was..

Now you mention the next restoration. And it will be as it was.

This is what God did for mankind after satans fall and judgement. The Idea of death was in mankinds creation because satan had already fallen before He created mankind.

And I agree with you, the restored earth for mankind didn't experience any plant death, physical death until Jesus Christ made 'coverings' for Adam and Eve.

Yep. But satan is spiritual not physical.. So the spiritual world suffered because of satan's sin, Not the physical..



Actually the term literally means dying you will die.. God spoke to adam, I am sure he told adam all about satan.. So I am not sure of your point. Physical death of life on earth did not need to occur for Adam to know or understand what it meant..

I agree. And those 2 deaths spoken to Adam is his spiritual death the moment he disobeyed and the second death was his physical death. Satan introduced spiritual death. Adam introduced physical death.

Your forgetting about plant life and animal life

No reason they had to suffer and die because of satans fall. That is just conjecture, I would not want to base a doctrinal belief based on what might be..

I believe plant life and animal life was restored to its original position. Upon Adams sin, they were cursed.

 

[DP]

Im hoping the OP I quoted knows that as well, though some people think the earth was formed Gen 1:1 then made void and formless later restored the earth, I'm not one who buys into that theory of restored earth

There's no Biblical proof that God's creation changed after the flood of Noah. We know man's longevity changed because God's Word tells us so, but not the other ideas you're supposing which is speculation.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Now you mention the next restoration. And it will be as it was.

This is what God did for mankind after satans fall and judgement.

Mankind had not yet sinned when satan fell. So to say he had to be restored does not make any sense.

The Idea of death was in mankinds creation because satan had already fallen before He created mankind.

Yes, In his mind, Not in reality.. There is nothing that states there was death of any type in the garden of eden or anypplace else on earth.

And I agree with you, the restored earth for mankind didn't experience any plant death, physical death until Jesus Christ made 'coverings' for Adam and Eve.

But there was before? this makes no sense, Where is the proof?

As I already said, The global flood model already explains completely the fossil record. so there is no proof of death pre- flood.. let alone pre-adam.

I agree. And those 2 deaths spoken to Adam is his spiritual death the moment he disobeyed and the second death was his physical death. Satan introduced spiritual death. Adam introduced physical death.

Actually I disagree Adam introduced both to mankind and life on earth. Spiritual death means that the relationship between God and his physical creation was now broken, By proxy, Satan was given the domain of the earth, It is at the moment adam sinned in which all life began too die. Including the earth, We know, apart from God, this earth will eventually die.. The moment it started to die was the moment Adam said no God, I want to make my own decision and be my own God. I do not trust you.

I believe plant life and animal life was restored to its original position. Upon Adams sin, they were cursed.

I think scripture is clear. In 6 days God created all life on earth, Mankind was included in that creation..

the only question is, Did God have the power to do all that in seven days, My answer is, Is God limited in what way?

 

[DP]

The throne of God and Jesus may not be the same one. Jesus himself said, he simply that he saw Satan fall from Heaven like lightening. So how does this fit with GAP or the creation story?

Any answer to that would be speculation, regardless of the discussion being about the Gap idea.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

There's no Biblical proof that God's creation changed after the flood of Noah. We know man's longevity changed because God's Word tells us so, but not the other ideas you're supposing which is speculation.

why did mans longevity change? The reason it changed also changed things for all life on earth..

 

[Gr8grace]

I do not need the GAP to see this, That is my point, I see if fine apart from the GAP.. To try to limit that this is the only way we can see it is not being honest.. and is being closed minded.. "IMHO"

however I agree 100% with your first statement..

I worded that wrong. The GAP reveals satans fall and judgement and why God created mankind.

Why did God create man and what is our purpose?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I worded that wrong. The GAP reveals satans fall and judgement and why God created mankind.

Why did God create man and what is our purpose?

God needs a reason? (I try not to question God myself)

He created us to serve us,, and love us.. What did God say over and over, I want to give you everything and give you peace your hearts desire. etc etc etc. to read anythign else is to make conjecture, which I try not to do.

Some want us to think God created us to prove he is a loving God, and to prove Satan was the liar. I have no reason to deny this,, it may be true. then again it may not be true (even though this is what I was taught, ad what I believed most of my christian life)

But even if it is, The gap theory is not needed to prove it..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I worded that wrong. The GAP reveals satans fall and judgement and why God created mankind.

Why did God create man and what is our purpose?

GAP may reveals an aspect of what may be true,

It is not needed to reveal satans fall. or the reason God created mankind.

 

[DP]

I get what your saying for sure, maybe Gr8grace will speak more about the restored earth he was meaning...

When God first created the earth at Gen.1:1, and then caused a flood of old that ended Satan's rebellion, there also was a shaking of the earth (Jer.4:23-28; Heb.12:25-29) that drastically changed the earth. At Gen.1:2-9 we are shown more flood waters than with the flood of Noah, because God took waters off the earth to form today's sky, while with the flood in Noah's day rains came from the sky. Thus from Gen.1:2 forward represents a 'partial' restoration of the earth, howbeit one placed in bondage like Paul said (Rom.8:18-25).

In Rev.21 we are told there will be "no more sea" for God's future Kingdom time. Per Job 38, God originally made the sky as a garment covering around the earth. How are those two things related, even though they are about different times involving God's creation?

When God's future Kingdom comes, then we will see a major restoration of this earth, called a new heavens and a new earth. So just as Apostle Peter made distinction in 2 Peter 3 with three distinct earth ages or worlds involving the earth, we should also be aware of that per God's Word.

 

[DP]

Since you folks enjoy analyzing theory's on creation, here's a new one for you.

Moses was the author of the book of Genesis. God inspired him to write it. Each day is not the period of time that it took for activity to happen. It is the length of time that it took for God to show Moses the activity that happened. Remember that Moses, many years after the creation, wrote the first five books to a group of people who only understood time as cycles of the moon and sun. Most only understood time as the cycle of the sun. It makes perfect sense that the people accepted Moses's words as day by day, even though he was describing distinct periods of time.

Whether each day represented 1,000 years each or a 24 hour period, doesn't matter in relation to the Gap idea. So this thread is not a debate of how long the 6 days were.

 

[Gr8grace]

I think scripture is clear. In 6 days God created all life on earth, Mankind was included in that creation..

maybe I am not being clear? I totally agree. He brought it back from being waste and empty from His judgement upon satan.

the only question is, Did God have the power to do all that in seven days, My answer is, Is God limited in what way?

I believe at Genesis 1:1 He did it perfectly in the twinkling of an eye and the idea of death and evil was not in it.

Thanks for the back and forth EG. Been a pleasure and pleasant.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

When God first created the earth at Gen.1:1, and then caused a flood of old that ended Satan's rebellion, there also was a shaking of the earth (Jer.4:23-28; Heb.12:25-29) that drastically changed the earth. At Gen.1:2-9 we are shown more flood waters than with the flood of Noah, because God took waters off the earth to form today's sky, while with the flood in Noah's day rains came from the sky. Thus from Gen.1:2 forward represents a 'partial' restoration of the earth, howbeit one placed in bondage like Paul said (Rom.8:18-25).
.

This is not true, Most of the water from Noahs day came when the fountains of the great deep were broken up.. We know there are subteranian waters far below the earth, in fact, in recent years, we see that they are much deeper than science thought possible


There is not enough water in the sky to flood the earth.. and cover even the smallest mountains, let alone be 15 cubits above the tallest mountain.

 

[DP]

Grace,
This is where we disagree and its fine...The totality of GAP theory does not just talk about Satan & his fall, but it propagates old earth processes, that are rooted in Theistic & Secular Evolution doctrines. Certain parts of GAP theory justify evolution and even ardent GAP defenders suggest God used Evolution to create, make and form the Earth.

That idea is completely... false.

The Gap idea does not propagate processes rooted in man's theory of evolution. It's actually just the opposite, because there's a time gap in the fossil record which geologists know about that evolutionists don't like to discuss much.

 

[garee]

Since you folks enjoy analyzing theory's on creation, here's a new one for you.

Moses was the author of the book of Genesis. God inspired him to write it. Each day is not the period of time that it took for activity to happen. It is the length of time that it took for God to show Moses the activity that happened. Remember that Moses, many years after the creation, wrote the first five books to a group of people who only understood time as cycles of the moon and sun. Most only understood time as the cycle of the sun. It makes perfect sense that the people accepted Moses's words as day by day, even though he was describing distinct periods of time.

It was not a private interpretation as a personal opinion or heresy of Moses who was not there as the beginning of all things doing the work of faith creating the universe by believing (faith) he could and therefore speaking the words and it became sight. As he informs us in 1 Peter first things first seeing he alone is the Alpha and Omega.

Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.2Pe 1:20

He defines a day as 12 hours of darkness and 12 hours of light. If we cannot trust his terms as he defines them, then how would we look to prophecy without a time keeper the sun and the moon to know the appointed times and seasons? Words have meaning attached to them , or else we would be in the Tower of Babel.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

maybe I am not being clear? I totally agree. He brought it back from being waste and empty from His judgement upon satan.

You are clear. this is the part we disagree with,,

There was no reason to bring anything back,, Nor is there any proof this is what happened. it is just a theory.

I believe at Genesis 1:1 He did it perfectly in the twinkling of an eye and the idea of death and evil was not in it.

Thanks for the back and forth EG. Been a pleasure and pleasant.

I believe Genesis 1: 1 is the event that God explained starting in Vs 2 (its original state was void and without form) and God spent 6 literal days putting it all together to make what he said in verse 1,,

Now, Was it created because of the fall of satan? Maybe, Was it created because God wanted to serve a newer creation? Maybe,, Maybe both.

But we do not need an earth which was already there for millions of years to make either case possible.

And thank you,, It is nice not being judged because of our belief.. And to have at least a civil discussion.. That is rare lartely in CC.. Used to be that way all the time..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

That idea is completely... false.

The Gap idea does not propagate processes rooted in man's theory of evolution. It's actually just the opposite, because there's a time gap in the fossil record which geologists know about that evolutionists don't like to discuss much.

There is no time GAP.. Science has prety much proven that the fossil record was made in the time period of a year during the great flood.

 

[BeyondET]

When God first created the earth at Gen.1:1, and then caused a flood of old that ended Satan's rebellion, there also was a shaking of the earth (Jer.4:23-28; Heb.12:25-29) that drastically changed the earth. At Gen.1:2-9 we are shown more flood waters than with the flood of Noah, because God took waters off the earth to form today's sky, while with the flood in Noah's day rains came from the sky. Thus from Gen.1:2 forward represents a 'partial' restoration of the earth, howbeit one placed in bondage like Paul said (Rom.8:18-25).

In Rev.21 we are told there will be "no more sea" for God's future Kingdom time. Per Job 38, God originally made the sky as a garment covering around the earth. How are those two things related, even though they are about different times involving God's creation?

When God's future Kingdom comes, then we will see a major restoration of this earth, called a new heavens and a new earth. So just as Apostle Peter made distinction in 2 Peter 3 with three distinct earth ages or worlds involving the earth, we should also be aware of that per God's Word.

DP you have no idea what I was saying in response to post 201#
not to be mean at all buddy but really.