So what about the fourth commandment?

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Yonah said:
its sad and amazing the lengths folks will resort to, to rebel against the clear commands given by our Creator...
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I would agree ceremonial laws are not moral laws to keep people from killing each other.they are shadows pointing to the eternal rest when we do receive our new Bodies . We are not to judge one another in regard to shadows.

Shadows do not confer grace. Temporal shade, yes.Eternal rest ,no

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.Col 2:16
 
Yonah said:
ok but who said the Sabbath was our eternal rest?
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It is not figured in regard to these bodies of death even though we do experience that work of God somewhat now.

When we receive our new bodies it will be realized in whole . Today it make our yoke easy because we do rest in Him who secured the eternal price for our sin on our behalf as the lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
 
Have you Yonah received Jesus as your Lord and Savior? Because if you have the you are under Grace and not under the Law.

Why are you trying to put us True Children of God under the Law?

God said "Keep Holy the Sabbath", which we are doing. So why are you judging us?
 
beta said:
Since you understand which law Paul is talking about maybe you will be good enough to explain it to me ?
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look:
But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions,
and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
(Titus 3:9)
​

this is saying strivings over the law are unprofitable and vain. not that the Law is unprofitable and vain ((like you assumed i was 'saying' - though i did nothing at all but quote scripture, and added nothing)).
that is why i ask if you are having difficulty comprehending what the scripture says: because here you seem to wildly misinterpret what i thought was a pretty obvious and clear saying.

Yonah said:
posthuman said:
Are you having trouble understanding what the scripture says? What Paul is talking about?
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seems you and many others are....
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et tu, Yonah?

all i did was quote scripture.
and you say that by quoting it, i show myself to be "misunderstanding" and "wresting it to my destruction" ??

as it is said:
"what happened to you, dude? you used to be cool."

;)


it's been put 100 times for all of you. 70*7 times you have both been reminded of this:
in Christ we have been crucified, and are dead and freed from the law. it does not apply and it was given to the Jews in another covenant, which they broke. not to you or me. this is so that we can serve Christ by the spirit, not by the letter of written commands, because God is spirit, and His true worshipers worship Him in spirit.
this does not make us "lawless" but the scripture is fulfilled and God is 100% faithful to His word: in the hearts of His children He has inscribed His law. "His law" ≠ Torah. the Torah is a shadow of the law of God, and points to Christ. we have Christ and we obey Him from the heart. if we love the Lord and one another, we fulfill the all of God's law -- love also fulfills the sabbath just as it fulfills every command.

so why is striving about the law unprofitable, worthless and vain? because Torah is not what commends us to God. He has accepted us on the basis of faith working through love, through His grace, and He is able to make us stand. set your minds on what is unseen, not on what is seen, because your Father who is unseen is One, and by His spirit we are being made one with Him.
we are a people who are dead as far as the Law is concerned. no longer under it in any way whatsoever. but if you accuse that this makes us lawless, you deny the power of God to redeem and sanctify those whom He has chosen to make new, and accuse God of teaching His children iniquity.

striving about the law - in particular in this case about the sabbath of the Jews - is worthless and vain, because it is not by keeping this in any way shape or form that we are either sanctified nor justified before God. it's chasing shadows, ignoring the fact that the substance is come! arguing over the proper behavior of a corpse!

this is not about keeping ritual signs that were given to another people. this is about the reality that those signs were to remind those people of: that it is Jah who sanctifies, Jah alone.
 
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posthuman said:
if we love the Lord and one another, we fulfill the all of God's law -- love also fulfills the sabbath just as it fulfills every command.
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@ disciplemike

how, mike?

how does love fulfill the sabbath?

if you had love, but did not have the written ordinance, how would your love fulfill the command of the old covenant?
 
If Paul is telling us the truth when he says the Christian is not under the Law, has died to the Law, is released from the Law.

( Which I do believe he is telling us the truth ). - Then how is our relationship to be to the law in regards to the "good" that is in the ten commandments from the Old Covenant?

Live "from" the 10 promises instead of "by" the 10 commandments because we are now in Christ in the New Covenant. It's in the knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ and the grace of God that we live by now.

1) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will have no need for other gods because you have a loving Father who loves you deeply and unconditionally.

2) When you know Me ( Jesus ), the idols in life will fade like mist in the sun.

3) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will never stop speaking My name to establish freedom - My name is Jesus.

4) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will cease from your own works and rely totally on what I have already done for you.

5) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will be honored as fathers and mothers to nations.

6) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will restore life.

7) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will experience deep authentic relationships which you will treasure.

8) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will be established in abundance and generosity.

9) When you know Me ( Jesus ), you will be My witness.

10) When you know Me ( Jesus ), your love which is My love flowing in and through you for your neighbor will bring restoration to this world.

The 10 commandments are now 10 promises fulfilled in us through relationship with our loving Father because we are in Christ.
 
garee said:
It is not figured in regard to these bodies of death even though we do experience that work of God somewhat now.

When we receive our new bodies it will be realized in whole . Today it make our yoke easy because we do rest in Him who secured the eternal price for our sin on our behalf as the lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
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thank you for that , however it did not answer the question
 
KenAllan said:
Have you Yonah received Jesus as your Lord and Savior? Because if you have the you are under Grace and not under the Law.

Why are you trying to put us True Children of God under the Law?

God said "Keep Holy the Sabbath", which we are doing. So why are you judging us?
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see here is another false accusation: please show me where I have "put " anyone anywhere or attempting to. what am I the one who has power over others? I think the question you need to ask is why do you feel threatened by this? after all if what you've been led to believe is true, nothing anyone says or does can change that right? now to address your first question, it seems a common tactic among those who hear someone proclaim something differing from what their belief is, they have a knee jerk reaction to it by question that persons relationship with our dear Savior, this is a response differing from the clear admonition in scripture that says to love your neighbor as yourself, now if you would like to now what I believe and why , I would be glad to share that with you.
 
posthuman said:


look:
But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions,
and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
(Titus 3:9)
​

this is saying strivings over the law are unprofitable and vain. not that the Law is unprofitable and vain ((like you assumed i was 'saying' - though i did nothing at all but quote scripture, and added nothing)).
that is why i ask if you are having difficulty comprehending what the scripture says: because here you seem to wildly misinterpret what i thought was a pretty obvious and clear saying.



et tu, Yonah?

all i did was quote scripture.
and you say that by quoting it, i show myself to be "misunderstanding" and "wresting it to my destruction" ??

as it is said:
"what happened to you, dude? you used to be cool."

;)


it's been put 100 times for all of you. 70*7 times you have both been reminded of this:
in Christ we have been crucified, and are dead and freed from the law. it does not apply and it was given to the Jews in another covenant, which they broke. not to you or me. this is so that we can serve Christ by the spirit, not by the letter of written commands, because God is spirit, and His true worshipers worship Him in spirit.
this does not make us "lawless" but the scripture is fulfilled and God is 100% faithful to His word: in the hearts of His children He has inscribed His law. "His law" ≠ Torah. the Torah is a shadow of the law of God, and points to Christ. we have Christ and we obey Him from the heart. if we love the Lord and one another, we fulfill the all of God's law -- love also fulfills the sabbath just as it fulfills every command.

so why is striving about the law unprofitable, worthless and vain? because Torah is not what commends us to God. He has accepted us on the basis of faith working through love, through His grace, and He is able to make us stand. set your minds on what is unseen, not on what is seen, because your Father who is unseen is One, and by His spirit we are being made one with Him.
we are a people who are dead as far as the Law is concerned. no longer under it in any way whatsoever. but if you accuse that this makes us lawless, you deny the power of God to redeem and sanctify those whom He has chosen to make new, and accuse God of teaching His children iniquity.

striving about the law - in particular in this case about the sabbath of the Jews - is worthless and vain, because it is not by keeping this in any way shape or form that we are either sanctified nor justified before God. it's chasing shadows, ignoring the fact that the substance is come! arguing over the proper behavior of a corpse!

this is not about keeping ritual signs that were given to another people. this is about the reality that those signs were to remind those people of: that it is Jah who sanctifies, Jah alone.
Click to expand...

well I will explain my response , but first I nee dot say that I see things different then many do here, does that mean I'm right and your wrong, no I as many others are a student of scripture and am trying to understand and do as our Savior told us not only by word but by deed as well, I am no better then anyone and I see the many on here as loving servants to the living God as I am, to address why I quoted that text... please forgive my I get a little too zealous and forceful in my responses its something about me that needs work.. anyway, the meaning of that response is this, ive studied into the writings of Paul and have discovered many things he wrote I misunderstood for years, the scriptures you posted are just that , scripture, however how one understands them can change how one applies them, Paul discussed 7 different "laws" all of which with some study can be readily identified and understood in their proper context, anyway I mean no offense to anyone here and apologize for any offense and ask forgiveness, I am just trying to get close as I can to god, and I don't always ascribe to the traditional beliefs most have readily accepted, and I never mean to thrust my way of thinking on anyone, not to say that some of the things ive posted don't seem that way. simply put I consider all who love our Savior my brother or sister, even if they do not consider me such.
 
Some people say that if you do the two great commandments, you don't have to follow the other commandments.
How does that even work?

Consider this: Scripture also says, in the commandments, to honor my father and mother.
I can say I love God and love my neighbor. I can say I praise and pray and study every day. I can say I honor my parents.
But if I don't do what my Father tells me to do, am I really loving and honoring Him?

Remember, western thinking is visual, perceptional. What does it look like?

Hebrew thinking is dynamic, functional. What does it do?
This is why most all Hebrew words have a root word that is a VERB, not a noun or adjective.
 
posthuman said:


look:
But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions,
and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
(Titus 3:9)
​

this is saying strivings over the law are unprofitable and vain. not that the Law is unprofitable and vain ((like you assumed i was 'saying' - though i did nothing at all but quote scripture, and added nothing)).
that is why i ask if you are having difficulty comprehending what the scripture says: because here you seem to wildly misinterpret what i thought was a pretty obvious and clear saying.



et tu, Yonah?

all i did was quote scripture.
and you say that by quoting it, i show myself to be "misunderstanding" and "wresting it to my destruction" ??

as it is said:
"what happened to you, dude? you used to be cool."

;)


it's been put 100 times for all of you. 70*7 times you have both been reminded of this:
in Christ we have been crucified, and are dead and freed from the law. it does not apply and it was given to the Jews in another covenant, which they broke. not to you or me. this is so that we can serve Christ by the spirit, not by the letter of written commands, because God is spirit, and His true worshipers worship Him in spirit.
this does not make us "lawless" but the scripture is fulfilled and God is 100% faithful to His word: in the hearts of His children He has inscribed His law. "His law" ≠ Torah. the Torah is a shadow of the law of God, and points to Christ. we have Christ and we obey Him from the heart. if we love the Lord and one another, we fulfill the all of God's law -- love also fulfills the sabbath just as it fulfills every command.

so why is striving about the law unprofitable, worthless and vain? because Torah is not what commends us to God. He has accepted us on the basis of faith working through love, through His grace, and He is able to make us stand. set your minds on what is unseen, not on what is seen, because your Father who is unseen is One, and by His spirit we are being made one with Him.
we are a people who are dead as far as the Law is concerned. no longer under it in any way whatsoever. but if you accuse that this makes us lawless, you deny the power of God to redeem and sanctify those whom He has chosen to make new, and accuse God of teaching His children iniquity.

striving about the law - in particular in this case about the sabbath of the Jews - is worthless and vain, because it is not by keeping this in any way shape or form that we are either sanctified nor justified before God. it's chasing shadows, ignoring the fact that the substance is come! arguing over the proper behavior of a corpse!

this is not about keeping ritual signs that were given to another people. this is about the reality that those signs were to remind those people of: that it is Jah who sanctifies, Jah alone.
Click to expand...

Ahhhh....'the sabbath of the Jews' ! There we have it !
last time I read the Bible it said : ....it is 'the sabbath of the Lord' .....
why are you taking it from God and giving it to man to do with as he likes ? that is 'stealing from God' and we know the consequences for that !
Friend, you consider this 'useless wrangling about law to no profit - I think it's called 'short-sightedness, not knowing which law was abolished and which was not.
 
disciplemike said:
Some people say that if you do the two great commandments, you don't have to follow the other commandments.
How does that even work?

Consider this: Scripture also says, in the commandments, to honor my father and mother.
I can say I love God and love my neighbor. I can say I praise and pray and study every day. I can say I honor my parents.
But if I don't do what my Father tells me to do, am I really loving and honoring Him?

Remember, western thinking is visual, perceptional. What does it look like?

Hebrew thinking is dynamic, functional. What does it do?
This is why most all Hebrew words have a root word that is a VERB, not a noun or adjective.
Click to expand...

Sadly many think they can get by with 'lipservice and call it spiritual' not having to follow through with actions....that is a deception to their own hurt Jas 1v22.
 
disciplemike said:
Some people say that if you do the two great commandments, you don't have to follow the other commandments.
How does that even work?
Click to expand...

GALATIANS 5:14 All of Moses' Teachings are summarized in a single statement, "Love your neighbor as you love yourself."

whether we understand it or not, do you agree this is true?
 
just keep reading in chapter 5.
Paul mentions some characteristics of a person who is walking "in the flesh".
idolatry is one. why would your neighbor care about your idolatry?
 
Worshiping the Law is Idolatry.

Worshiping your Pride is Idolatry.

Chose to Worship Jesus instead.
 
PaulMack said:
Romans 14:5-6
[SUP]5 [/SUP]One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. [SUP]6 [/SUP]He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord
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So why did you leave off the next sentence ?
And he that regards not the day, to the Lord he does not regard it.....even though the Lord commands us to keep it ? what does that tell you ? could it be you are stealing God's own holy time from Him and doing in it what you will ?
 
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