Which Bible?

[hornetguy]

What's silly is you having to go there with your argument. The gospel can be preached in any language. We're talking about the pure words of God that have been preserved for all generations.

It's NOT silly... I'm going by what YOU said. You mentioned all the Filipino Christians who had not had the opportunity to have "the pure words of God"..... which implies that they are somehow lacking in knowledge, and the ability to grow in that knowledge.

I'm trying to get you to see that it is NOT a "translation" that ensures our salvation.... which is what most of the KJV-only folks imply. I could quote John146 or KJV1611 to prove it, but I think you know what I mean.

 

[John146]

What does this statement have to do with Hornetguy mentioning looking up earlier translation?

Who decides which words to go with and which meanings? God or you? This way ends up being you.

 

[John146]

It's NOT silly... I'm going by what YOU said. You mentioned all the Filipino Christians who had not had the opportunity to have "the pure words of God"..... which implies that they are somehow lacking in knowledge, and the ability to grow in that knowledge.

I'm trying to get you to see that it is NOT a "translation" that ensures our salvation.... which is what most of the KJV-only folks imply. I could quote John146 or KJV1611 to prove it, but I think you know what I mean.

Brother, I know salvation is not a translation issue. Most translations can lead people to salvation in any language. We are talking about more than that.

 

[Chester]

Heres one simple test to see if a version is inspired or not. Is Jesus God's one and only son or is he his only begotten son? Any version that says one and only son is not inspired... at least not inspired by God.

So you believe the original words given by the Holy Spirit to John were the English words "only begotten"?

 

[John146]

So you believe the original words given by the Holy Spirit to John were the English words "only begotten"?

Can you share with us what it should say?

Please, let's not elevate the originals more that God does. God allowed the original 10 commandments written by His own finger, mind you, to be destroyed by Moses. Did God panic, Oh no the originals! No, of course not. He allowed Moses to re-write them, make a copy of the original. Only Moses ever read the "originals". If God does not elevate the originals, neither should we.

I trust in God's promise that He would be responsible for preserving His words for all generations. If this is true, and it is, then where are they? Are they available to us?

 

[hornetguy]

If God does not elevate the originals, neither should we.

BINGO! Neither should we elevate the KJV as the "original" English language translation as being the only one that is "correct".

 

[John146]

BINGO! Neither should we elevate the KJV as the "original" English language translation as being the only one that is "correct".

Here's what God said about His word:

"for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name."

How does God view His word? God magnifies His word above His own name. Do you know one day that at that name every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that He is Lord"?

What should my view of God's word be? Any less? When most people don't believe they have the perfect word of God?

 

[hornetguy]

Here's what God said about His word:

"for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name."

How does God view His word? God magnifies His word above His own name. Do you know one day that at that name every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that He is Lord"?

What should my view of God's word be? Any less? When most people don't believe they have the perfect word of God?

Where is that scripture? It sounds to me as if it is referring to Jesus as the Word, but I would like to read it in context.

 

[John146]

Where is that scripture? It sounds to me as if it is referring to Jesus as the Word, but I would like to read it in context.

Sorry, Psalm 138:2

 

[eph610]

Where is that scripture? It sounds to me as if it is referring to Jesus as the Word, but I would like to read it in context.

Hornetguy,
The scripture he referenced is Psalm 138.2 and he is taking it way out of context

Here is the complete verse 2, not just John's cherry picked part...


Psalm 138.2
[SUP]2 [/SUP]I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

The Key word here is above, which in the Greek means according to, so proper rendering would be something like:



for thou hast magnified thy word according to all thy name.

So essentially it is not saying God places his word above his name, it is saying that we can have confidence in God's word because they are made complete according to his name..

John will rant and rave...but this is the true context I see here and was taught..

 

[John146]

So essentially it is not saying God places his word above his name, it is saying that we can have confidence in God's word because they are made complete according to his name..

John will rant and rave...but this is the true context I see here and was taught..

So we can have full confidence in His word because they are made complete according to His name....

Ok then, where is His word? Is God's word perfect and without error? Or is God talking about His word that has errors and is not perfect?

 

[Grace777x70]

Well, as I heard one guy years ago say about the KJV. If it was good enough for Paul and Silas - it is good enough for me. Poor guy didn't know the King James version ( notice the term - "version" ...selah ) was written in 1611 I guess...

The discussion that the King James "version" is the only true bible is the most ridiculous one that I have seen. God uses "words" prompted by the Holy Spirit to bring life and truth to people and He uses the scriptures to do it sometimes - in whatever language He has there at the time and He speaks Christ to them.

This is all just a diversion from the enemy to keep people from focusing on Christ.

That is my opinion on the subject. God preserves and honors His word above His name - The word is the Lord Jesus Christ. God preserves Him. - not a "version" of Him.

 

[eph610]

So we can have full confidence in His word because they are made complete according to His name....

Ok then, where is His word? Is God's word perfect and without error? Or is God talking about His word that has errors and is not perfect?

This truth eludes you because you approach it from a carnal mind....How you even came up this reply is beyond me....

Gods word[not Bible and Not Jesus here] and his name are equal....once you get out of the cult mind set you will begin to see this...

 

[hornetguy]

Hornetguy,
The scripture he referenced is Psalm 138.2 and he is taking it way out of context

Here is the complete verse 2, not just John's cherry picked part...


Psalm 138.2
[SUP]2 [/SUP]I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

The Key word here is above, which in the Greek means according to, so proper rendering would be something like:



for thou hast magnified thy word according to all thy name.

So essentially it is not saying God places his word above his name, it is saying that we can have confidence in God's word because they are made complete according to his name..

John will rant and rave...but this is the true context I see here and was taught..

Ok... that makes sense... thanks for the explanation.

I've not spent a lot of time in the Psalms... just the "memory verse" ones, mostly. I cannot see how they can be used to promote one translation over another in any way at all...

This whole argument, to me, is legalism taken to the nth degree....

 

[LaurenTM]

if every language is a tool to communicate ideas, then it is the ideas that are the word of God, not the language itself, just as much as what you are reading and hopefully comprehending right now is not the pixels on whatever screen you are looking at, but the message i am communicating to you.

The scriptures then, being written in an human language, all of which were confused at Babel long ago, are not the actual text themselves, but the message of God and His dealings with men - and whatever language your human mind comprehends them in, it is not the language that is key, but the substance of what is written. You can put these paragraphs into any translating tool, and if the tool is not corrupt, and the algorithm used is sound, then the message itself is not distorted, and the transmission of the idea itself remains just as sound.

You KJV-ites fail to recognize that a rose smells just as sweet, and is still a rose, even if you have no name for it, and that the grass and the sky and the seas are comprehended by people of every language, and even by babes and morons who have no language with which to speak of such things. Warm, wet, cold, love, fear, honor, embarrassment, endurance -- all these things transcend human speech -- but does the gospel of our risen Lord not transcend the base communication of mortals?

There is the forest, and there are the trees, but can a man be so stuck focused on the letters

T,

R,​

E,​

&​

E​

... so that he can see none of the actual living things in the glades?

this is good! THIS is REALLY good! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[LaurenTM]

If one reads the preface to the 1611 translation, you find that the translators purposefully used various English words to translate exactly the same Greek and Hebrew words, for the sake of the beauty of variation, as they felt it was equally valid - understanding the nature of language itself - and also believed it mirrored the diversity in God's own creation.

This was a departure from previous translations, and that fact, they specifically addressed in the preface. They wrote that ((paraphrasing)) if the king gives a speech, and it is translated into Dutch for the benefit of his subjects who do not comprehend the king's own native language, it remains the king's speech, no matter how skillfully or ineptly it is translated.
In keeping with this sentiment, they expressly wrote that they fully expected, desired and approved of continual revision to the work of translation in order to better transmit as it is the King's speech to His subjects, that they may comprehend it well.

Doesn't God Himself 'translate' His own message to you in ways that your own heart best understands? And doesn't the Spirit bear witness to your own hearts and souls in languages that can't be spoken?

again....you have outdone yourself sir!

and especially this:

Doesn't God Himself 'translate' His own message to you in ways that your own heart best understands? And doesn't the Spirit bear witness to your own hearts and souls in languages that can't be spoken?

 

[LaurenTM]

Hi Posthuman! You're right, it is the ideas that are the word of God and not the language itself. There are many different words or phrases that can be used in the English language to convey God's message to us. But man without inspiration from God is in no way capable of choosing those words, neither is the best translating tool.

Also could you show me the gospel in the stars? Can you use the stars or nature to explain how that I'm a sinner and that I need Jesus to save me from my sins?

how did God approach Abram?

really?

and there were no 10 commandments for how many years after that?

what if you were born an Israelite in captivity during the exile....

you cannot seem to picture God except in your own backyard



honestly, it seems you may want to limit God to YOUR OWN understanding!

 

[LaurenTM]

Here's what God said about His word:

"for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name."

How does God view His word? God magnifies His word above His own name. Do you know one day that at that name every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that He is Lord"?

What should my view of God's word be? Any less? When most people don't believe they have the perfect word of God?

again, you KJ only folks seem to really like to elevate yourselves above everyone else...you know?

as in, 'thank God I am not like everyone else'

 

[John146]

again, you KJ only folks seem to really like to elevate yourselves above everyone else...you know?

as in, 'thank God I am not like everyone else'

I truly apologize if that's what you get from me. I'd rather elevate the word of God and let it stand alone. The word of God is my final authority. I am thankful, however, that I can hold in my hands to read and study that is the perfect words of God without error in my language.

 

[eph610]

I truly apologize if that's what you get from me. I'd rather elevate the word of God and let it stand alone. The word of God is my final authority. I am thankful, however, that I can hold in my hands to read and study that is the perfect words of God without error in my language.

Do you ever stop and read or listen to how you speak?....The sure sign of Cult Membership is resolute, absolute scripted answers...

The word of God is my final authority. I am thankful, however, that I can hold in my hands to read and study that is the perfect words of God without error in my language.

Do you know how many people that are trapped in KJO cults say this same exact thing?

This one statement is the one I use to teach my staff on how to spot you folks, before you come in and do harm to sheep God has placed us to protect.....If someone hears this phrase they are alerted and will wait and watch, if the person begins the nonsense you start all the time, they or I will ask them to find another place to worship....because invariably it turns into I am better than you, because of the KJV and some now, including another on this site said, that I am headed to Hell for not using only the KJB...I don't need brothers and sisters like you damaging already fragile sheep with your message of superiority and ultimately hate....I have learned the hard way that you cannot try to talk reason with anyone like you and simply do not allow any form of KJ only people in my sphere....your theology on Bible version destroys not builds up and it is not Holy Ghost inspired, because it does not lift up or testify of Jesus

I think you are a decent brother, John and some of your other posts show me your heart, but since you are deep in deception over something as simple as Bible version...I cannot begin to even talk truth with you, because you are blinded by cultist elitism...