Woman Pastor Explains Her Abortion

[Smoke]

There is always a danger in pregnancy. Her overriding issue wasn't the danger to her it was the child was severely disabled and likely to die at birth. We absolutely can judge murder to be wrong. The only question to be asked in this debate is if the baby is a human being. Nobody is guaranteed a breath in life, or what the quality of that life will be. My sister had twin girls. One died at 8 months in the womb. She was told the death of the one would likely result in severe devepmental problems for the other. My sister didn't even consider the possibility of destroying her daughter.
Today, my niece is a very healthy, happy 25 year old, that has offered the world so much.
The Lord decides life and death and what the value of a person is. If you believe an unborn baby is a human being, how can you ever be for giving someone the right to kill her?

I want to be perfectly clear here that although I'm judging her actions as wrong, being a horrible sinner myself, I in no way judge her Position in Christ. That is for God alone.
But how ridiculous to say we can't judge behavior as being wrong.

And then all the doctors came in the room together, stood around the bed, and told me that my baby was severely developmentally compromised; that she would die at birth, if not before, after a very short, excruciatingly painful few minutes of life; and that continuing the pregnancy to full term would be very dangerous for me.

For me it was important that the baby not experience pain, and that we have a little ability to say our goodbyes in as safe and loving way as we could.

I'm not sure if you made an honest error, your reading comprehension isn't the greatest, or if you talked to this woman individually and she specifically told you "The overriding issue was that my child was severely disabled and likely to die." From what she wrote, the issues was her daughter would die at before, or before birth, her daughter would experience an excruciatingly painful moments in her short life, in addition to it being "very dangerous" for her.

It's important to hear/read what is spoken/written and not interpret with our filters people's motives and mindset. It was clear that she had a compassionate heart for her daughter and didn't want her daughter to experience excruciating pain only for her to die anyways. She wanted to say goodbye on her terms and spare her child from agony as well as prevent future problems for herself. She also has a son to mother too... You can make the case God could have performed a miracled and saved her daughter, but you can't make a case her "overriding issue" was only that her child had developmental issues and was likely to die... especially when she writes of her dangerous of carrying to full term.

 

[Sirk]

If a woman was legitimately sexually assaulted, you would be offended if she called out the predator because "they do not have hard evidence to prove it"?

I am only offended by a woman making a false accusation. Are these women making false accusations? Only they and Trump know definitively. The proof or lack thereof doesn't equate to it not happening. The worst thing we could do is accuse people of lying or being paid to make false accusations when they may have legitimately been victimized.

If they haven't...is it fair rush to judgment and stain a man with it.....likewise, if he has, is it fair to rush to calling the women liars? The court of public opinion is just that....opinion...and people put too much stock in their own opinions. Those opinions often go hand in hand with what massages the little child inside the best.

That said...the coverage that seems to dominate the airwaves and peoples vocabulary is the "sexual predator" version. Is it any wonder....we live in a society of the perpetually offended.

 

[Smoke]

If they haven't...is it fair rush to judgment and stain a man with it.....likewise, if he has, is it fair to rush to calling the women liars? The court of public opinion is just that....opinion...and people put too much stock in their own opinions. Those opinions often go hand in hand with what massages the little child inside the best.

That said...the coverage that seems to dominate the airwaves and peoples vocabulary is the "sexual predator" version. Is it any wonder....we live in a society of the perpetually offended.

I think even if Trump is found reasonably innocent in a court of law, there is a terrible stigma attached. I would agree. I also agree that people think their opinion is fact. It's unfair to assume Trump is guilty of assaulting women when there isn't any proof, and it's unfair to call out his accusers as liars.

I guess I'm guilty of doing what I'm saying because I think my opinion, that people shouldn't assume guilt or innocence without knowing the facts, should be the gold standard.

 

[Sirk]

I think even if Trump is found reasonably innocent in a court of law, there is a terrible stigma attached. I would agree. I also agree that people think their opinion is fact. It's unfair to assume Trump is guilty of assaulting women when there isn't any proof, and it's unfair to call out his accusers as liars.

I guess I'm guilty of doing what I'm saying because I think my opinion, that people shouldn't assume guilt or innocence without knowing the facts, should be the gold standard.

Knowing human nature like I do...I'm relatively sure that Trump has had a hankerin for the ladies in his day. I'm thinking that these days he is content with what he has going on....his wife and kids and grandkids. But that's just my opinion. I don't think the guy has abused women. On the other side of the human nature coin....he has probably offended these women in some way but not criminally.

 

[Utah]

I'm not sure if you made an honest error, your reading comprehension isn't the greatest, or if you talked to this woman individually and she specifically told you "The overriding issue was that my child was severely disabled and likely to die." From what she wrote, the issues was her daughter would die at before, or before birth, her daughter would experience an excruciatingly painful moments in her short life, in addition to it being "very dangerous" for her.

It's important to hear/read what is spoken/written and not interpret with our filters people's motives and mindset. It was clear that she had a compassionate heart for her daughter and didn't want her daughter to experience excruciating pain only for her to die anyways. She wanted to say goodbye on her terms and spare her child from agony as well as prevent future problems for herself. She also has a son to mother too... You can make the case God could have performed a miracled and saved her daughter, but you can't make a case her "overriding issue" was only that her child had developmental issues and was likely to die... especially when she writes of her dangerous of carrying to full term.

You're new to CC and your ignorance shows it. Not only is PennEd very well read, but more importantly, he's one of greatest beacons of Christian light and love most people will ever see, and your condescending tone towards him has no place here or anywhere else. So you're an abortion apologist; I'm a sanctity-of-life apologist. Who do you think God sides with regarging this issue. Rhetorical question. Welcome to CC.

 

[Amazing-Grace]

I'm not sure if you made an honest error, your reading comprehension isn't the greatest, or if you talked to this woman individually and she specifically told you "The overriding issue was that my child was severely disabled and likely to die." From what she wrote, the issues was her daughter would die at before, or before birth, her daughter would experience an excruciatingly painful moments in her short life, in addition to it being "very dangerous" for her.

It's important to hear/read what is spoken/written and not interpret with our filters people's motives and mindset. It was clear that she had a compassionate heart for her daughter and didn't want her daughter to experience excruciating pain only for her to die anyways. She wanted to say goodbye on her terms and spare her child from agony as well as prevent future problems for herself. She also has a son to mother too... You can make the case God could have performed a miracled and saved her daughter, but you can't make a case her "overriding issue" was only that her child had developmental issues and was likely to die... especially when she writes of her dangerous of carrying to full term.

Your comments suggest she could or should not trust God with her daughter. It is not up to us to decide when anyone dies - only God can do that, anything else is murder.

 

[Persuaded]

I'm not sure if you made an honest error, your reading comprehension isn't the greatest, or if you talked to this woman individually and she specifically told you "The overriding issue was that my child was severely disabled and likely to die." From what she wrote, the issues was her daughter would die at before, or before birth, her daughter would experience an excruciatingly painful moments in her short life, in addition to it being "very dangerous" for her.

It's important to hear/read what is spoken/written and not interpret with our filters people's motives and mindset. It was clear that she had a compassionate heart for her daughter and didn't want her daughter to experience excruciating pain only for her to die anyways. She wanted to say goodbye on her terms and spare her child from agony as well as prevent future problems for herself. She also has a son to mother too... You can make the case God could have performed a miracled and saved her daughter, but you can't make a case her "overriding issue" was only that her child had developmental issues and was likely to die... especially when she writes of her dangerous of carrying to full term.

Yea right. She was so compassionate that this lady who claims Christianity and serves as a pastor took her daughters life out of the hands of the God who creates all life and murdered her.

I pray she will confess her sin to God and ask His forgiveness and then confess to her church and ask their forgiveness and then resign her place as pastor.

 

[Utah]

Yea right. She was so compassionate that this lady who claims Christianity and serves as a pastor took her daughters life out of the hands of the God who creates all life and murdered her.

I pray she will confess her sin to God and ask His forgiveness and then confess to her church and ask their forgiveness and then resign her place as pastor.

Let's not forget she took great pains to attack Trump. She's a political hack pure and simple.

 

[Amazing-Grace]

I often ponder which aborted baby would have grown up to discover the cure for cancer or some other deadly disease. We deserve all we get.

 

[Sirk]

Let's not forget she took great pains to attack Trump. She's a political hack pure and simple.

The dark side of human nature. To use your own failure and sin to attack someone else.

 

[Socreta93]

I often ponder which aborted baby would have grown up to discover the cure for cancer or some other deadly disease. We deserve all we get.

I always think of that. Potential is always the number 1 thing that is murdered. A baby can grow up to be whatever good or evil but there always hope for the child to be what it can potentially be

 

[Persuaded]

I often ponder which aborted baby would have grown up to discover the cure for cancer or some other deadly disease. We deserve all we get.

Or the one who would be a great soul winner and teacher of the Word?

 

[Fenner]

I doubt God will refuse to hold a person accountable because there wasn't any "proof" to their crimes/sins. God knows, even if there was no evidence or proof left by the predator. God knows when a woman makes a false accusation as well. I'm not God, nor do I pretend to have His knowledge over matters I wasn't directly involved in... from these threads, it sounds like people think they were in fact with Trump/the accuser because they are blasting the accusers without any caution that they might be telling the truth.

I don't know what the truth is. I'm not saying they're not telling the truth. I don't know. Believe me I'm not a Trump or Hillary supporter.

 

[breno785au]

I think there is a difference between someone saying things like, "I don't want a child, I'm not ready for a child, I can't financially support a child, etc, etc." and having an abortion because it's an easy way out compared to serious medical issues where lives are at stake. One thing I didn't like in the article was her saying it's her personal decision. It's a family decision, I don't like how men can be kept out of the equation when it comes to such things.
When my wife miscarried, I was also in deep angst over what had happened but I also could never say as much as my wife since it was her body that went through it.

 

[Angela_grace]

Abortion is wrong period. Nothing more to add to it. It is murder and a very painful way to be killed. Even if a child will not survive long let him/her live the little that they are able. I mean come on if one learned that their daughter or son had cancer and would not live long is it right and justifiable for that parent to kill their child so that wouldn't have to suffer? And if it is matter of being dangerous for the mother aren't we called, as Christians, to love others more than ourselves? It is sad that nowadays mothers consider their lives more important than their child's.

 

[Smoke]

You're new to CC and your ignorance shows it. Not only is PennEd very well read, but more importantly, he's one of greatest beacons of Christian light and love most people will ever see, and your condescending tone towards him has no place here or anywhere else.

I never made a personal attack on Penned, nor was I trying to be condescending. If he feels I was, I'll gladly apologize as that wasn't the tone I had when I responded. Now then, my being new to CC doesn't change the fact this pastor made no mention of an "overriding" reason or the fact she addressed other factors for why she and her family made this decision. I objected to his assumption, reading into her words and ignoring certain portions of her post, or whatever misunderstand he had that led him to write what he did.

So you're an abortion apologist; I'm a sanctity-of-life apologist. Who do you think God sides with regarging this issue. Rhetorical question. Welcome to CC.

I think God isn't on the side of assuming or knowing people's heart. Just as Penned, you're making an unfair assumption. His may have been by accident, yours is deliberate and shows your ignorance of my views. Ignorance isn't a bad word or an insult, it just means to be uninformed or misinformed. I'm not an "abortion apologist", in fact, I never made a personal stand about the issue of abortion. I only said it's unfair to say that "the overriding issue" was something that the pastor didn't say. She deliberately and explicitly stated her reasons which included more than the "overriding" issue he stated. I even said he has a case if he said God could step in and save her daughter, but he doesn't have a case in labeling "overriding" reasons on her behalf unless she explicitly stated so (which she didn't).

Thanks you for the kind welcome.

 

[Smoke]

Your comments suggest she could or should not trust God with her daughter. It is not up to us to decide when anyone dies - only God can do that, anything else is murder.

She could or should not trust God? I'm not sure I understand what you're asking or saying.

As for it not being up to us when anyone dies, I never made a statement in support or against that notion.

 

[Smoke]

Yea right. She was so compassionate that this lady who claims Christianity and serves as a pastor took her daughters life out of the hands of the God who creates all life and murdered her.

I pray she will confess her sin to God and ask His forgiveness and then confess to her church and ask their forgiveness and then resign her place as pastor.

Your prayer should be that she realize it was a sin if in fact it is a sin. You and I could agree that it is a sin, but she obviously felt what she was doing was the best course of action.

The old covenant was all about the letter of the law, the new covenant focuses on the spirit. If this pastor accepts Christ as her Lord and Savior, there is no doubt she is forgiven if what she did was in fact a sin. Assuming she is a Christian, she is no more/less dirty than you or I are. Without the atonement of Christ, we would all be unworthy of being with our Father in Heaven. I'm glad she appears to accept Christ as her Savior, even if she had poor judgment. I'm glad God is merciful and that we have an avenue to be made clean by the blood of His son Jesus Christ. There is a difference between premeditative sin and sinning out of ignorance. I'm grateful God can read our hearts to know if we truly wanted to rebel against Him or if we simply errored thinking we were making the best decision when we really weren't.

 

[Smoke]

Abortion is wrong period. Nothing more to add to it. It is murder and a very painful way to be killed. Even if a child will not survive long let him/her live the little that they are able. I mean come on if one learned that their daughter or son had cancer and would not live long is it right and justifiable for that parent to kill their child so that wouldn't have to suffer? And if it is matter of being dangerous for the mother aren't we called, as Christians, to love others more than ourselves? It is sad that nowadays mothers consider their lives more important than their child's.

Does this apply to tubular pregnancies as well? There have been rare occurrences of tubular pregnancies that were fruitful.

 

[breno785au]

Abortion is wrong period. Nothing more to add to it. It is murder and a very painful way to be killed. Even if a child will not survive long let him/her live the little that they are able. I mean come on if one learned that their daughter or son had cancer and would not live long is it right and justifiable for that parent to kill their child so that wouldn't have to suffer? And if it is matter of being dangerous for the mother aren't we called, as Christians, to love others more than ourselves? It is sad that nowadays mothers consider their lives more important than their child's.

Have you considered the woman in this article has another child that needs it's mother, and also a husband?