Why the dems have no room to complain about the electoral college

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zeroturbulence

zeroturbulence

Senior Member
#1
Aug 2, 2009
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I've seen several people mention that Hillary should have won because she had more votes..
Well... there are two important facts that these folks are not taking into consideration...

1) Both candidates concentrated their efforts on the swing states (those that have both a large number of electoral votes, and a large voter base for both candidates) and that handful of states are where the TRUE battleground for votes was! Hillary lost a lot of the swing states that she was projected to win by all the polls... and the media laughed at Trump when he said he would win Florida, Pennsylvania and Ohio!

2) The Electoral College FAVORS DEMOCRATS..
The democratic base (states that consistently vote democrat) is 242 electoral votes strong! That means that a democrat in theory would only have to fight for less than 30 electoral votes to win the election!
 
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hornetguy

hornetguy

Senior Member
#2
Jan 18, 2016
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Interesting observation.... I had not thought of it that way....
 
zeroturbulence

zeroturbulence

Senior Member
#3
Aug 2, 2009
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I have to digress a little... 242 as a democratic base is probably only on their best day. It's more likely around 200, but its still much more than halfway to 270.
 
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Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
#4
Nov 12, 2015
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It seems to me that the electoral vote is a pretty good safeguard against...conglomeration? Trump had to win a more nationwide acceptance - he had no conglomeration to rely on. He didn't have a starting number of 200. Not that I mean to say it was acceptance exactly - it was more resignation. I think most voters didn't like either choice. I think most thought that the two worst choices were given them.
 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#5
Feb 9, 2014
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Yep. In an uncharacteristically non-partisan move, I like the EC even though it inherently and heavily favors a Democratic outcome at present.

As I've been saying, good systems work insofar as the people are virtuous. The EC isn't just a good system- it's a great system.
 
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CharlieGrown

Guest
#6
#6
I think you're onto something there zero. I was watching the maps and was bothered but couldn't nail it down. Your points are the closes thing to an answer. Not saying the Electoral is flawed but no system is perfect.
 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#7
Feb 9, 2014
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I would love to see somebody propose a better system. I don't think it's humanly possible.
 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#9
Feb 9, 2014
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If Trump succeeds in policies, we could see a re-alignment of sorts in the EC though. I find that prospect very exciting.

Taking the Rust Belt is an amazing accomplishment. Keeping it? A total game change.
 
Sirk

Sirk

Banned
#10
Mar 2, 2016
8,896
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#10
Desdichado said:
If Trump succeeds in policies, we could see a re-alignment of sorts in the EC though. I find that prospect very exciting.

Taking the Rust Belt is an amazing accomplishment. Keeping it? A total game change.
Click to expand...
If we see a contract with black america like he is talking about and we see opportunity and hope pour into the into the inner city it will be a total game changer. The democrat party has been a party of despair. Trump is an expert in transforming run down communities into a thriving contributing people.
 
Sirk

Sirk

Banned
#11
Mar 2, 2016
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My hope is that all of the money we have spent into building roads, hospitals and schools in other nations will come home and be spent here.
 
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CharlieGrown

Guest
#12
#12
Well Trumps proposed lock down on exporting industry to foreign countries does correlate with the Rust Belt response in terms of manufacturing industry and so on...What in the world would H have done to those regions? They saw the hammer shot to further decline imo.
 
PrynceNY

PrynceNY

Banned
#13
Aug 16, 2016
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It's been proven she was rigging votes and discarding votes for trump. Not to mention dead people & illegals were voting for hillary. So it's amusing they try to say she had more votes as if that has any value after all she did & still lost. They need to accept she lost & move on.
 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#14
Feb 9, 2014
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This is what I'm REALLY excited about- a Republican seizure of the cities. Pittsburgh very nearly voted Republican (4% points), impoverished Buffalo suburbs turned, Detroit didn't show up for the Dems to the extent I thought, Green Bay went red (last I checked).

Really, if I were a Dem, I'd probably laugh off this Republican's excitement. But man oh man. There's a shot of turning cities Red. Believe me.

Sirk said:
If we see a contract with black america like he is talking about and we see opportunity and hope pour into the into the inner city it will be a total game changer. The democrat party has been a party of despair. Trump is an expert in transforming run down communities into a thriving contributing people.
Click to expand...
 
PennEd

PennEd

Senior Member
#15
Apr 22, 2013
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#15
zeroturbulence said:
I've seen several people mention that Hillary should have won because she had more votes..
Well... there are two important facts that these folks are not taking into consideration...

1) Both candidates concentrated their efforts on the swing states (those that have both a large number of electoral votes, and a large voter base for both candidates) and that handful of states are where the TRUE battleground for votes was! Hillary lost a lot of the swing states that she was projected to win by all the polls... and the media laughed at Trump when he said he would win Florida, Pennsylvania and Ohio!

2) The Electoral College FAVORS DEMOCRATS..
The democratic base (states that consistently vote democrat) is 242 electoral votes strong! That means that a democrat in theory would only have to fight for less than 30 electoral votes to win the election!
Click to expand...
One avenue that should be explored is state electoral apportioned vote, like Nebraska and Maine does. The 2nd most votes that Trump got in a state was CALIFORNIA!! Yet ALL 55 electoral votes went to Clinton. True, she also got a lot of votes in places like Texas and Florida, but it might reflect the electorate a little more.
 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#16
Feb 9, 2014
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#16
That or we let allow state regions to secede from one another. I'd love to see Upstate and Downstate NY split. After some rebuilding, Upstate would be an awesome place to live.

PennEd said:
One avenue that should be explored is state electoral apportioned vote, like Nebraska and Maine does. The 2nd most votes that Trump got in a state was CALIFORNIA!! Yet ALL 55 electoral votes went to Clinton. True, she also got a lot of votes in places like Texas and Florida, but it might reflect the electorate a little more.
Click to expand...
 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#17
Feb 9, 2014
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That and there is a culture code at work, here. As somebody who has spent a lot of time in the Rust Belt/Great Lakes, I can tell you that Social Justice Warrior political correctness really rubbed people the wrong way, there.

They connected more with the frank and direct talk from Trump.

CharlieGrown said:
Well Trumps proposed lock down on exporting industry to foreign countries does correlate with the Rust Belt response in terms of manufacturing industry and so on...What in the world would H have done to those regions? They saw the hammer shot to further decline imo.
Click to expand...
 
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CharlieGrown

Guest
#18
#18
Are you saying split the states, or just split the Electoral "states". That would be interesting but then what would you do with the EC vote value for each sub state? Like in Tx, if we split Austin and Dallas they could be of less value because they're less than the rest of the state (not to mention, they're always blue)....now i'm being unfair.
 
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Sirk

Sirk

Banned
#19
Mar 2, 2016
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#19
I love it when the adults are speaking!
 
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renewed_hope

Guest
#20
#20
Sirk said:
I love it when the adults are speaking!
Click to expand...
Its nice to hear yourself think without the arguing, am i right?

Which makes me wonder......why is it so quiet? Did you send the kiddos to the corner again? :p
 
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