Word of Faith - a Look at what the Bible says!

[wanderer6059]

After reading all your post wanderer I find it interesting that your "towing" the wof party line with the same answers they teach you. So wanderer, perhaps you can explain why Timothy was not healed by the Apostle Paul at 1 Timothy 5:23? Paul was not a doctor but he did tell Timothy to use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thinge ofter infirmities.

Or how about at 2 Timothy 4:20, "Erastus abode at Corinth; but Trophimus have I left at Miletum SICK." Why was he not healed wanderer? Was it because he did not have enough faith? Or perhaps he had some secret sin in his life and he was out of the will of God? And did you notice I did not even bring up the Apostles Paul's so-called "throne in the flesh because I don't have to. Wof has a way of explaining that away as well.

Now, can you please explain why wof preachers and teachers wear glasses and even contact lenses? Why have some of them had operations for various problems, catch the flu or a cold? And here is quote form dad hagan, "My belief is that it is indeed God's will that His children walk in complete health. It is ALWAYS God's will to heal His chi8ldren." Apparently mr. hagin has not read Exodus 4:11. I suggest you read it for yourself mr. wanderer.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

brother if you read my post you will see 1 i never deny that sickness is real 2 that i believe in modern medicine(im an EMT) 3 Hagin himself believed in it to 4 see the scriptures i posted above

 

[HisHolly]

They think BC they can bring up folks who haven't had something done for them that that's somehow a reflection of what God won't do.. His will and word concerning us are documented.. what someone else has gone thru, denied, didn't believe, didn't ask for.. is on them

 

[wanderer6059]

Yeah, i know it well. I guess WoF doesn't like to spell it out, maybe telling....

not at all, i loath it. and wish it had no ties to us...

 

[HisHolly]

We are individually dealt with.. my relationship is no reflection of another's and it's silly to compare.. You don't even see you're speaking against God.. Where is His honor?

 

[bluto]

Ok wanderer, you quoted the following verse, "Matt 9:35: "Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness."

Jesus said this at John 14:12, "Truly, truly, I say to you he who believes in Me, the works that I do SHALL HE DO ALSO; AND GREATER WORDS THAN THESE SHALL HE DO; because I go to the Father." So can you wanderer expound on any of the greater works you have done above Jesus? What greater works do you think Jesus Christ is talking about?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

 

[HisHolly]

Where are yours?

Ok wanderer, you quoted the following verse, "Matt 9:35: "Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness."

Jesus said this at John 14:12, "Truly, truly, I say to you he who believes in Me, the works that I do SHALL HE DO ALSO; AND GREATER WORDS THAN THESE SHALL HE DO; because I go to the Father." So can you wanderer expound on any of the greater works you have done above Jesus? What greater works do you think Jesus Christ is talking about?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

 

[stonesoffire]

I can give an opinion on the greater works....have thought much about it.

The body of Christ altogether make up the greater works. And it's still all His work, working through us.

 

[HisHolly]

Being smug and arguing BC you think you know it all isn't piety .... picking like the Pharisees is all most are doing here... it's astonishing

 

[wanderer6059]

Ok wanderer, you quoted the following verse, "Matt 9:35: "Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness."

Jesus said this at John 14:12, "Truly, truly, I say to you he who believes in Me, the works that I do SHALL HE DO ALSO; AND GREATER WORDS THAN THESE SHALL HE DO; because I go to the Father." So can you wanderer expound on any of the greater works you have done above Jesus? What greater works do you think Jesus Christ is talking about?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

simple do what Christ did...

"Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

 

[nowyouseem033]

Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.'"

Jesus never told us to ask like beggars but to ask like sons and daughters. and i never said God would not heal, but if you don't believe it he won't, but its sill to think you can get something you don't even think is real. brother bring some scripture to the table, its funny but when you all argue with me i tend to be the only one bringing scripture, still no response to the verses i quoted earlier, so ill post them again

James 5:14-15: "Is any one of you sick? He should call the elders of the church to pray over him and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well.."

Isaiah 53:5: "He was bruised for our iniquities; The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, And by His stripes we are healed."

Mark 11:24: "Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."


Matt 9:35: "Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness."


Luke 6:19: "And the people all tried to touch him, because power was coming from him and healing them all."


Mark 5:34: "He said to her, Daughter, your faith has healed you. Go in peace and be freed from your suffering."


Exodus 23:25-26: “So you shall serve the LORD your God, and He will bless your bread and your water. And I will take sickness away from the midst of you. No one shall suffer miscarriage or be barren in your land; I will fulfill the number of your days."


Deut 7:15: "And the LORD will take away from you all sickness, and will afflict you with none of the terrible diseases of Egypt which you have known..."


Deut 30:20: "That you may love the LORD your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days...”


Joshua 21:45: "Not a word failed of any good thing which the LORD had spoken to the house of Israel. All came to pass."


Psa 89:34: "My covenant I will not break, Nor alter the word that has gone out of My lips."

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Psa 103: 1-5: Bless the LORD, O my soul; And all that is within me, bless His holy name! Bless the LORD, O my soul, And forget not all His benefits: Who forgives all your iniquities, Who heals all your diseases, Who redeems your life from destruction, Who crowns you with loving kindness and tender mercies, Who satisfies your mouth with good things, So that your youth is renewed like the eagle’s."


Psa 107: 19-20: "Then they cried out to the LORD in their trouble, And He saved them out of their distresses. 20 He sent His word and healed them, And delivered them from their destructions."


Psa 118: 17: "I shall not die, but live, And declare the works of the LORD."


Prov 4:20-23: "My son, give attention to my words; Incline your ear to my sayings. Do not let them depart from your eyes; Keep them in the midst of your heart; For they are life to those who find them, And health to all their flesh. Keep your heart with all diligence, For out of it spring the issues of life.


Isaiah 57: 19: " Peace, peace to him who is far off and to him who is near,” Says the LORD, “And I will heal him.”


Isaiah 58:8: "Then your light will break forth like the dawn, and your healing will quickly appear; then your righteousness will go before you, and the glory of the LORD will be your rear guard."


Jer 30:17: "For I will restore health to you And heal you of your wounds,’ says the LORD, Because they called you an outcast saying: This is Zion; No one seeks her.”


Mal 4:2: "But to you who fear My name The Sun of Righteousness shall arise With healing in His wings; And you shall go out And grow fat like stall-fed calves."


Matt 8:13: "Then Jesus said to the centurion, “Go your way; and as you have believed, so let it be done for you.” And his servant was healed that same hour."


Matt 8:16-17: "When evening had come, they brought to Him many who were demon-possessed. And He cast out the spirits with a word, and healed all who were sick, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet, saying: “He Himself took our infirmities And bore our sicknesses.”
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Matt 18:19: “Again I say to you that if two of you agree on earth concerning anything that they ask, it will be done for them by My Father in heaven."


Mark 11:22-24: "So Jesus answered and said to them, “Have faith in God. For assuredly, I say to you, whoever says to this mountain, ‘Be removed and be cast into the sea,’ and does not doubt in his heart, but believes that those things he says will be done, he will have whatever he says.
Therefore I say to you, whatever things you ask when you pray, believe that you receive them, and you will have them."


Mark 5:34: "And He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well. Go in peace, and be healed of your affliction.”


John 14:13-14: "And whatever you ask in My name, that I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything in My name, I will do it."


John 15:7: "If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you."


John 16:23-24: “And in that day you will ask Me nothing. Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you ask the Father in My name He will give you. Until now you have asked nothing in My name. Ask, and you will receive, that your joy may be full."


John 16:26-27: "In that day you will ask in My name, and I do not say to you that I shall pray the Father for you; for the Father Himself loves you, because you have loved Me, and have believed that I came forth from God."


Rom 4:17: "As it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations” in the presence of Him whom he believed God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did;"


Eph 6:10: "Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might."


1 Tim 6:12: "Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, to which you were also called and have confessed the good confession in the presence of many witnesses."


I Peter 2:24: "who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live for righteousness—by whose stripes you were healed."


I John 5: 14-15: "Now this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we have asked of Him."


III John:2: "Beloved, I pray that you may prosper in all things and be in health, just as your soul prospers."

I just find it funny how most the verses you do post are out of context majorly. Lol its one think to quote scripture, its another to quote scripture in its context rather than just searching up healing and posting EVERY VERSE THAT TALKS ABOUT IT. theres spiritual healing verses like Isaiah... oh wait you think its physical healing. lol thats why you got to read the context. Theres verses about Jesus healing ... oh wait your not Jesus are you? and to claim you have the same power would be known as having the gift of healing right? Something not everybody has. lol So do you have the gift then? James 5 calls ELDERS OF THE CHURCH .. to pray not CLAIM..

Do they even teach biblical theology and Rhema. ?

 

[wanderer6059]

I just find it funny how most the verses you do post are out of context majorly. Lol its one think to quote scripture, its another to quote scripture in its context rather than just searching up healing and posting EVERY VERSE THAT TALKS ABOUT IT. theres spiritual healing verses like Isaiah... oh wait you think its physical healing. lol thats why you got to read the context. Theres verses about Jesus healing ... oh wait your not Jesus are you? and to claim you have the same power would be known as having the gift of healing right? Something not everybody has. lol So do you have the gift then? James 5 calls ELDERS OF THE CHURCH .. to pray not CLAIM..

Do they even teach biblical theology and Rhema. ?

try explain how its out of context and ill show you how it is.

 

[PeterJens]

Does God send illness or is illness a consequence of the fall?

God sent illness upon Egypt in the ten plagues. In revelation the illnesses are sent as
judgement.

Israel were often sent illnesses against them when they rebelled.

Paul talks of judgement for not eating the breaking of bread in the right manner.
Ananias and Sapharia were judged and died.

Illness is also just part of mortal existance in a fallen world. We must bear these
burdens for a time because we are saved despite problems, where love and forgiveness
overcomes evil and being a victim of others sins. It is what it means to follow Christ,
to love the fallen and lost, because they are just like us.

 

[trofimus]

if you don't believe in healing today, you won't be healed(atleast on the supernatural side, modern medicine will still do its part.) .

If you do believe in healing "today", it does not follow you will be healed.

Have you heard about the apostle Paul, Timotheus, Trophimus?
All of them were not healed, even though they travelled with the apostle or were the apostle!

"Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me.
But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness."
2Cor 12:9

If God would heal the Paul, it would not be perfect!

I hope you dont want to say Paul did not have faith in healing. Or that the disease cannot be God´s will and have purpose in Christian life.

 

[CharlieGrown]

not at all, i loath it. and wish it had no ties to us...

"ties" is the appropriate description.

 

[stonesoffire]

1Co 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

1Co 11:30 For this cause manyare weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

How many of us would of been offended by these words of Paul whe he wrote them to the Corinthians?

 

[LaurenTM]

prosperity gospel =/= WoF

they are two different things, PG is the distortion fo the WoF and is wrong yes. but that is not what we believe, we believe God will provide what He has said He would, not riches, but necessity

so since your thread was closed due to the inflamatory nature of it and the name calling etc, you have now come on this thread and are using it the way you used the thread you started

but it's everyone else, right?

and by the way, this forum takes a strong stand against WOF...you stated they just call it doctrine

you should be reminded that this is what they actually think about it:

A) WoF is not a denomination, it is a doctrine

B) Most of orthodox Christianity (including the Admin team of this site) would consider WoF at best to be bad doctrine, and at worst to be outright heresy

there seems to be a disconnect with what people actually say and what you perceive

don't be confused, WOF is not an accepted biblical doctrine

stating you believe God will provide ignores everyone in bad situations, in poverty or famine but I expect to read that type of thing because in my experience with WOF defenders in various forums, they handily forget that Christianity is not confined to the United States

 

[nowyouseem033]

wanderer6059 the lack of exegetical discernment and simple contextual understandings is truly incredible. I actually dont know where to start. Understand scripture in its context. Half the verses you posted are of Christ healing which no one denys at all. Afterall he is God. 2 verses are talking of spiritual healing not physical healing so again please understand the context. James 5 is a structural approach and command to pray for healing not a claim it gift of healing type thing. And the rest of the OT scriptures are talking of an new kingdom. WHich is not here yet, but will be at the return of Christ.

 

[garee]

No, this is not any wonder.

Do you now what is the wonder?

That people who are taught God wants them healthy, even people preaching such things, masters in these doctrines, do not get healed and die by various diseases because of their strong faith and the lack of medical treatment.

This is the wonder.

Yes strong in a faith having it in respect to their owns self. Its why the JW's refuse blood transfusion.


God does not heal by human hands, as a will . He gives them the ability to go to school and learn .

Act 17:25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things.

The word worshiped in that case is only used once, it where we get the word therapeutic .

2323 therapeuo {ther-ap-yoo'-o}
from the same as 2324; TDNT - 3:128,331; v
AV - heal 38, cure 5, worship 1; 44
1) to serve, do service 2) to heal, cure, restore to health

Listen to the doctors you never know you might be entertaining a angel as a messenger from God, as a way of God healing .

 

[wanderer6059]

I just find it funny how most the verses you do post are out of context majorly. Lol its one think to quote scripture, its another to quote scripture in its context rather than just searching up healing and posting EVERY VERSE THAT TALKS ABOUT IT. theres spiritual healing verses like Isaiah... oh wait you think its physical healing. lol thats why you got to read the context. Theres verses about Jesus healing ... oh wait your not Jesus are you? and to claim you have the same power would be known as having the gift of healing right? Something not everybody has. lol So do you have the gift then? James 5 calls ELDERS OF THE CHURCH .. to pray not CLAIM..

Do they even teach biblical theology and Rhema. ?

you know the context of the word pray, you ask someone you don't know, some one you personally know you are much more assertive, especially if what you are asking for they have said previously they would give. if my dad said ill give you $20 tomaro, and tomaro comes i'm gonna say "please let me have that $20 you said i could have"

 

[bluto]

Where are yours?

I ask him the question first and was waiting for an answer then I would tell him what I think Jesus meant. Instead, you "buttted" in without waiting for the answers to play themseoves out. You then make an asinine post about "some of us are like the Pharisees." Instead of hiding under your desk making "snide" remarks why don't you get into the battle like your commanded to and contribute to the cause of Christ by confronting false teachings in whatever form it takes?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto