The Stone which the builders rejected

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I just read the bible for what it says.

No you don't. Where does it say the law was given a tombstone, or a dead mountain was given grace? That is your own twisted interpretation which is not based on the words of God.

The great mountain that was made a plain is referring to Satan in the previous chapter. If you read the context of the previous chapter of what is being spoken of in a mystery by the Spirit you might be able to grasp this, and how this happened after Christ was resurrected and Satan was cast down from heaven. But without the Holy Spirit (oil in your lamp) you cannot, and therefor you still stumble at the word being in darkness.
 
No you don't. Where does it say the law was given a tombstone, or a dead mountain was given grace? That is your own twisted interpretation which is not based on the words of God.

The great mountain that was made a plain is referring to Satan in the previous chapter. If you read the context of the previous chapter of what is being spoken of in a mystery by the Spirit you might be able to grasp this, and how this happened after Christ was resurrected and Satan was cast down from heaven. But without the Holy Spirit (oil in your lamp) you cannot, and therefor you still stumble at the word being in darkness.

What does this mean? Is this Satan?

Zechariah 4:6 KJV
Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the Lord of hosts.
 
At least I finally understand you. I don' t agree but I understand how you see it. Thank goodness because I thought you might be insane lol!

I'm not rolling the floor laughing at you, I'm praying that God will open your eyes and let you see the truth. I'm going to try once again to help show you the truth of that verse.

Zechariah 4:7 KJV
Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying , Grace, grace unto it.

Zerubbabel caused the great mountain to become a plain. Zerubbabel brings forth the headstone (grave marker) of the great mountain, the mountain is dead, it is laid low. Zerubbabel bringing forth the tombstone of the great mountain shouts grace, grace to the mountain.

Christ caused the mountain of keeping the law to become a plain, he abolished the law.
Christ brought forth the tombstone of law keeping.
Christ brought grace to the law.

Ephesians 2:15 KJV
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
 
At least I finally understand you. I don' t agree but I understand how you see it. Thank goodness because I thought you might be insane lol!
I'm glad you no longer think I'm insane lol. The key verse in undertanding those verses is here:

Zechariah 4:6 KJV
Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the Lord of hosts.

Not by might (my strength), nor by power (my ability) but by my Spirit..... To do what Stunnedbygrace? What does his spirit do that we can't do by might and power?
 
what temple was resurrected. give a metaphor or parable is used. and the other hand, what temple was tore down. (70 ad)

try new covenant. something man could not do him/her self. and that would be to save him/her self, from certain death. etc
 
what temple was resurrected. give a metaphor or parable is used. and the other hand, what temple was tore down. (70 ad)

try new covenant. something man could not do him/her self. and that would be to save him/her self, from certain death. etc

The new covenant made the mountain a plane. It made fulfilling the law a cake walk.... easy as love your neighbor.
 
The new covenant made the mountain a plane. It made fulfilling the law a cake walk.... easy as love your neighbor.
everyone has an opinion. but the question still remains , who did it save, the new covenant. and how did it save them. etc

by the way, what law. (acts 15)
 
everyone has an opinion. but the question still remains , who did it save, the new covenant. and how did it save them. etc

by the way, what law. (acts 15)

The new covenant with Israel saves everybody. But the new covenant was only new to the unbelieving Jews, the "new covenant" has been around since Abraham.

How did it save them... they believed God and it was counted to them as righteousness.

What law? - The 10 commandments.
 
The new covenant with Israel saves everybody. But the new covenant was only new to the unbelieving Jews, the "new covenant" has been around since Abraham.

How did it save them... they believed God and it was counted to them as righteousness.

What law? - The 10 commandments.
gentiles are saved in acts 10, are you trying to time freeze the bible.
 
gentiles are saved in acts 10, are you trying to time freeze the bible.
No I'm not trying to freeze time. The children of the promise have been around since Abraham and probably since Adam. The church has been around since the wilderness.

Acts 7:37-38 KJV
This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear.

[38] This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
 
No I'm not trying to freeze time. The children of the promise have been around since Abraham and probably since Adam. The church has been around since the wilderness.

Acts 7:37-38 KJV
This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear.

[38] This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
how will it be for filled, if you don t understand when a resurrection took place. your context t your point in time is twisted scripture.
 
how will it be for filled, if you don t understand when a resurrection took place. your context t your point in time is twisted scripture.

The old testament saints were raised when Christ died, but what does that have to do with the church in the wilderness or when the bible was written?

Matthew 27:51-53 KJV
And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

[52] And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

[53] And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
 
The old testament saints were raised when Christ died, but what does that have to do with the church in the wilderness or when the bible was written?

Matthew 27:51-53 KJV
And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

[52] And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

[53] And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Good evening KJV,

Just FYI, regarding the scripture you quoted above, those people who came out of the tombs did not resurrect into their immortal and glorified bodies, but resurrected back in their mortal bodies in the same manner that Lazarus or Tabitha did i.e. after resurrecting at some point they died again. When the resurrection of the church takes place, the dead will rise in their immortal and glorified bodies, followed by the living being changed and caught up.

So yes, according to the definition of the word anastasis those you mentioned did resurrect, but not unto eternal life. They will however resurrect unto eternal life when the resurrection of the church takes place. So far, Jesus is the only one who resurrected in that immortal and glorified body.
 
Good evening KJV,

Just FYI, regarding the scripture you quoted above, those people who came out of the tombs did not resurrect into their immortal and glorified bodies, but resurrected back in their mortal bodies in the same manner that Lazarus or Tabitha did i.e. after resurrecting at some point they died again. When the resurrection of the church takes place, the dead will rise in their immortal and glorified bodies, followed by the living being changed and caught up.

So yes, according to the definition of the word anastasis those you mentioned did resurrect, but not unto eternal life. They will however resurrect unto eternal life when the resurrection of the church takes place. So far, Jesus is the only one who resurrected in that immortal and glorified body.

Acts 1:11 KJV
Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Jude 1:14 KJV
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

I have to go with the bible on this one. :)

Acts says Jesus left the same way he returns... He returns with 10,000's of his saints (10 represents Old Testament) so he left with 10,000's of his saints... Old Testament saints. Not up for argument - the bible says it and I believe it.:)
 
I'm glad you no longer think I'm insane lol. The key verse in undertanding those verses is here:

Zechariah 4:6 KJV
Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the Lord of hosts.

Not by might (my strength), nor by power (my ability) but by my Spirit..... To do what Stunnedbygrace? What does his spirit do that we can't do by might and power?

Honestly, I always wondered if the foundation spoken of was the law and prophets and the top stone was Jesus but I didn't give it much thought past that because it isn't by labored thought that the spirit of the word eventually is given to me.
 
But I do remember thinking before I left it that Jesus is really BOTH the foundation and top or finishing stone.
 
But I do remember thinking before I left it that Jesus is really BOTH the foundation and top or finishing stone.

As far as Zech 4 goes, look up the defintion of headstone in a dictionary. A headstone is a grave marker, is Jesus a tombstone? Jesus is the chief corner stone of the foundation but he's the HEAD of the body of Christ, not the headstone of the body of Christ.
 
I agreed that the definition could not mean tombstone in our very first discourse on this topic. It appeared you were arguing for it, then against it, and it further appears that you are now, once more, arguing for it to be correctly called a tombstone.

So I don't know if this is an actual language misconnect and English is not your first language or if the problem is on my end where I am having a lack of understanding for some odd reason or if you are defending something without making it clear what it is you are protecting - the few times I have seen this latter one happen, it was because someone was defending some certain doctrine and thought that to admit something to be true (that was apparently and clearly true to most people concerned) would damage that doctrine they adhered to or agreed with. The few times I've seen this last one happen, I honestly could see (but they couldn't) that to admit that certain truth would NOT, in fact, ruin and destroy their doctrine but they were very stubborn to the point that everyone thought there was a mental issue there when it was instead something else.

I can give a brief example. The one of these times, a man could not seem to understand what I meant when I said there were blocks of time between certain scriptures, even though it wasn't stated IN the scripture.

He kept insisting there was never, in a single place, an instance where there was a gap of time in between scriptures. When we tried to bring up Isaiah, where Jesus read from, and where He stopped, while at temple, and how there had been a gap of over 2,000 years and the gap was still going on, between where He stopped and the next verses, he was adamant that this was not so. Even tried to get him to admit that there was a gap of time between Genesis being written and Luke being written, but he insisted there was not. But I later came to find out that to admit to the true and simple thing we were stating would (in his mind) make the entire endtime doctrine he'd been taught be untrue and that it would crumble. So great was his defensiveness, which won out even over truth, that even when I gave him certain verses that could still protect his doctrine and keep it nailed up, (although my belief was opposite) he still would not unleash his jaw or admit a plain truth. And he seemed insane, but he was not. He was just scared. He wasn't even being arrogant, as some are. He was really just terrified because in his deep mind, he said, if A, then B, and I cannot tolerate B because it terrifies me, so I must lock my jaw on this and not let go until the danger to my sense of wellbeing passes.

So I don't know what our disconnect is, (which of the three things I mentioned) but you are not making sense to me even though you appear quite sane in your manner.
 
And there could be another reason, other than the three I am imagining, that has simply not occurred to me. I know that I have often noted a disconnect for a different reason also, which is that a man wants to be thought very clever and thinks that to cause some prior confusion and build up a tension of...perplexity, before he delivers the "punchline" will make him appear intellectually great to others. But that does not seem like you to me. You seem quite sincere and without some self-promoting agenda.
 
As far as Zech 4 goes, look up the defintion of headstone in a dictionary. A headstone is a grave marker, is Jesus a tombstone? Jesus is the chief corner stone of the foundation but he's the HEAD of the body of Christ, not the headstone of the body of Christ.

I did look up the definition in the Hebrew dictionary. (Not the English dictionary of course, because the man wrote it in Hebrew, so before I can try to translate his thought into the different language of English, I must look in the dictionary of his own language first for the word he used and then I can try to translate it equivalently to my own language.) So to look up the word he originally used, since I don't speak or understand Hebrew, I have to have someone to translate. And that is where the concordance comes in. It is a translator so I can look up the original word he used and see what it meant in his own language to then determine if perhaps the man who translated to English may not have used the best definition to convey the authors original intent.

By the way, even in English, a cap or top stone does not always mean a grave marker. It can mean in most English speaking persons minds a stone that completes a thing being constructed, which could be a stone fence or some stone construction other than a stone to write an epitaph on. And I say this having not even looked up these words in English, because English didn't even exist at the time the man wrote the verse, so English was in no way foundational to his writing. It is only foundational to my own understanding OF his writing.