Calvinism - Another Heresy

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Calmador said:
I was talking about Calvinism theology. One of the beliefs of Calvinism is that God gracefully chooses people and people can't resist God. And people can't say no to God when God chooses them to believe.
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When you go to an art show you pick the pieces that resonate with your sense of beauty and you bring the home like a long lost treasure.

God likewise reached into His chest, pulled out His heart ( the mountain of God ) and proliferated it. Then selected the pieces that brought Him the greatest sense of Joy and Beauty.
 
You asked me does God predestine?

A:yes (foreordain / predestine)

By what right?

I didn't really understand this question, but I answered his right to do what he wants.

Then you asked me if he deserved the right to do what he wants....

I am genuinely baffled by this question. Am I being thick?
 
Depleted said:
And someone answered your question earlier too. ;-)

As for your old church? Not very reformed. We don't wonder. God spoke. He made promises. He also said who he wanted, (and got), often enough it's not a problem. We learn to trust him through him. Any wondering done is aimed at others.
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Everything is predestined in terms of what's in the Bible and what's here on Earth. God knew the past, knows the present, and knows the future. That doesn't mean we stop ministering to others, though. Jesus instructs us to make disciples of the nation's. God doesn't create someone just to send them straight to hell after. People end up in hell, yes. But that's of their own doing. Their free will got them in that situation. If Calvinism was real, then that contradicts free will. And we know we have free will.
 
maxwel said:
Calvinism:

- Having to do with Calvin Klein.

- Usually something to do with underwear.

- People debate it a lot.

- Underwear seems to be both controversial and poorly understood.



* I stay out of these debates, as I'm not experienced in debating the finer points of underwear... although I will concede it's an important topic.
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Your third sentence reminded me of a meme I saw recently.. it was of a twig/tree stick. And under the image were the words "Here is a photo to show that people will argue about anything on the Internet". It's kind of like the pop/soda debate. Some of the comments were actually pretty clever.
 
jsr1221 said:
Your third sentence reminded me of a meme I saw recently.. it was of a twig/tree stick. And under the image were the words "Here is a photo to show that people will argue about anything on the Internet". It's kind of like the pop/soda debate. Some of the comments were actually pretty clever.
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Oh yeah can't do away with precious free will.

Romans 3:10-12English Standard Version (ESV)

10 as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”

Paraphrasing you: If free will was real, then that contradicts the bible. And we know the bible is inerrant.
 
jsr1221 said:
Your third sentence reminded me of a meme I saw recently.. it was of a twig/tree stick. And under the image were the words "Here is a photo to show that people will argue about anything on the Internet". It's kind of like the pop/soda debate. Some of the comments were actually pretty clever.
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So... you saw a meme of a stick, saying "people will argue about anything on the internet"?



- Is it your contention that people actually WOULD argue about a stick?


- Would you maintain that a stick has no properties valuable enough to induce argumentation?


- Lets just get to the bottom of this; are you FOR the stick, or AGAINST it?

: )
 
eternally-gratefull said:
I think this is where we get into trouble, trying to label people. Then we thiink we know what they believe, and 99 percent of the time, we are wrong (there has been alot of that in here lately))

when In reality, If you do not follow ALL of calvin's theology, you are not truly a calvanist. It seems everyone wants to label people under two camps. Calvin or arminian, when in reality, so many people are neither. Its an argument or point of reference which needs to go by by!!

I think we should stand on what we believe, and discuss this, and not what some guy who has been dead for awhile believed.

We can discuss him if we want, But unless we get our "preconcieved" notions, or biases in check, there will be no real discussion.
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The labels are already there but if somebody doesn't want to be labeled them the best thing they can do is deny the label.
If someone acquiesce is to a label and then obviously it represents what they are.
It's not a matter of standing in what we believe it's a matter of standing on the truth of what God's word says and should always be.
 
StanJ said:
In actuality only Calvinism with its tulip Doctrine is taught. Arminianism is not taught, but some of its principles I realized by those who read scripture and rightly divide the word of Truth. Those same people are the ones that teach against Calvinism because they've already seen the reality of scripture.
Calvinism or Reformed Theology is definitely taught, but the tenets of arminianism are not taught, they are discovered in God's Word.
The difference? The first is eisegesis and the second is exegesis.
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You know, this post might mean a lot more if you had actually once posted the Bible about it. So what is it called when people mouth and saying something is not in the Bible, but they do not post correctly what they are debating against, and certainly never post a Scripture to support what you are saying? Maybe hypocrisy? Just guessing, you understand!

Whether Calvinism is formed from eisegesis or exegesis won't be apparent until you start supporting your views. As I said, knew of the most Biblically based books I have read is "What is Reformed Theology?" By RC Sproule.

I could never be a full Calvinist simply because of the whole infant baptism issue. I've been a Pentecostal and Baptist my whole Christian walk, and after 36 years, I am not going to change that. Also the Bible doesn't support it, except in the vaguest way, in Acts 16.

I'm still eclectic in my theology, but certainly, reading different theologians and then looking the Scriptures up in context has given me a lot to chew on.

I'm going to try and post some corrections on the misconceptions about Calvinism which I know I certainly had. However, I still have to wrap presents and do a lot more Christmas stuff, before we leave. So, no idea when I will do this.

But, since I do understand hermeneutics quite well, I will assure you I will only do exegetics. I have no iron in this fire, except hoping people will understand each other better, and, oh yes, loving one another as Christ loved the church!
 
jsr1221 said:
Your third sentence reminded me of a meme I saw recently.. it was of a twig/tree stick. And under the image were the words "Here is a photo to show that people will argue about anything on the Internet". It's kind of like the pop/soda debate. Some of the comments were actually pretty clever.
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Hey, it ain't soda nor pop, it's coke;).
 
maxwel said:
So... you saw a meme of a stick, saying "people will argue about anything on the internet"?



- Is it your contention that people actually WOULD argue about a stick?


- Would you maintain that a stick has no properties valuable enough to induce argumentation?


- Lets just get to the bottom of this; are you FOR the stick, or AGAINST it?

: )
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i'd just like to put that the meme in question should correctly be interpreted as a "post" not a "stick"

yours,
- post -









be92729cd40e373ac9c009f1b1913d05.jpg
 
maxwel said:
So... you saw a meme of a stick, saying "people will argue about anything on the internet"?



- Is it your contention that people actually WOULD argue about a stick?


- Would you maintain that a stick has no properties valuable enough to induce argumentation?


- Lets just get to the bottom of this; are you FOR the stick, or AGAINST it?

: )
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It was just an image of that object with those words under it. I think you may have thought too much into it. Haha. It was basically saying people will argue over the fact if it's called a stick or a twig. Meaning if people will argue over that, they will argue over anything.
 
Marano said:
Oh yeah can't do away with precious free will.

Romans 3:10-12English Standard Version (ESV)

10 as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”

Paraphrasing you: If free will was real, then that contradicts the bible. And we know the bible is inerrant.
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Romans 3:10-12 does not apply in this context. Free will doesn't contradict the Bible because free will is real. I have the free will of whether or not to stay in bed all day. I have the free will of whether or not to believe in God. I don't know what you're trying to get at and/or if you misinterpreted my point. But you have the free will to interpret it how you want.
 
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