The easy way to spot a false grace message

[LaurenTM]

Lauren - I am sorry you got so upset in the past. You have a lot of wounds, which I
was not aware of, I pray you have found healing in Christ for them.

I need to grow in grace and understanding. One thing I had hoped your psychology training
had taught you we are all on a spectrum from ok, handling things well, to off the charts.

I believe Christ calls us to walk with an open heart, healed, whole and loving.

Unfortunately loving also comes with principles attached, one of which is standing up for
righteous behaviour and condemning sin. God is pretty good at doing this.

So I encourage you sister, to gird up your loins, to walk in the victory Christ has brought us
and defend His gospel. The dualist view of life is not of God or healthy or something we want
to be regarded as Christs example.

Or are you ok that such a group should dominate and desire to crush, bully and expel all others?

LOL!

you are such a twisted little rodent

how does your wife do it?

you must medicate her and lock her in a cupboard

you have, without exception, the most split personality in these forums

Lauren - I am sorry you got so upset in the past. You have a lot of wounds, which I
was not aware of, I pray you have found healing in Christ for them.

if you are not aware of them, how do you know they are there?

listen...you try this every time I bother to address you...grow up

 

[Grace777x70]

We are definitely responsible for the "deeds done in the body" which have different consequences associated with them.

The truth is that the insulting of others, deceit, malice and slandering others in the body of Christ is just a destructive as living the homosexual lifestyle. These are in the same lists as the sexual sins.

I say that "all of these" cause destruction and all sinning distorts our view of God, others and ourselves. Sinning is deceitful and keeps us from seeing the beauty of the finished work of our Lord Jesus Christ.

This is why it is so important to learn how to walk according to the spirit and not the flesh. This is why we need an environment where we can safely discuss our thoughts on the scriptures so that we can grow together in Him.

 

[PeterJens]

Lol. I do agree it appears we are going round in circles, but in truth I am not, they might be.

The gnostic adventure of 2016 was interesting. You can go too far, but we do need to know
our foundations.

For me I am slowly learning EG & G7's slant on faith with unbelief leads to not being saved
theology. It guides their whole ethic and approval or disapproval of themes and concepts.

It is though a powerful approach, and emotionally very appealing. I have warmed to many
speakers who later I realised were sadly mistaken, and probably not christian.

What people are not aware of is it takes a long time to learn the complexities involved and
progress is very slow, but once achieved, blisteringly fast.

So we are called to be righteous, holy and pure, so let us go on to this in Christs strength,
Amen.

 

[LaurenTM]

like I said...don't engage

merry-go-round of insults, lies and to use someone else's expression...malice

 

[PeterJens]

LOL!
you are such a twisted little rodent
how does your wife do it?
you must medicate her and lock her in a cupboard
you have, without exception, the most split personality in these forums
if you are not aware of them, how do you know they are there?

listen...you try this every time I bother to address you...grow up

Lauren - I had hoped your heart in Christ had overcome your emotional antagonism.
Obviously not.

Lord, I ask for Lauren, that you might show her the truth of my love for her, and
Your love for her. I truly have no knowledge of this hatred and bitterness that
lies there, may You help her find healing and forgiveness through the cross, so
that she might arise, pure, blameless, washed in your blood, loving and kind to all
as a testimony to your death and resurrection, Amen

Please forgive me for the hurt I may have caused you, as I forgive any you
have caused me today or in the past. The Lord is King and His love stands
forever more, Amen.

 

[Stephen63]

But friend, I know my Lord and His word, I know Peter and listen to him. How is it I am called, empowered and guided to follow and walk, yet you call this evil and unbelief.

Because he's blaspheming the Holy Ghost within you. I think you know now what chance you have with converting him. Sorry, but it's true.

 

[preacher4truth]

Because he's blaspheming the Holy Ghost within you. I think you know now what chance you have with converting him.

^ This shouldn't be tolerated. That is outright blatant slander. It was a good decision to not respond to the author of this in the past as far as his other posts, but this isn't getting a pass. Back to ignoring the responses.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

This is very difficult language.
If a person said sin is ok, then obviously they would be attacked.

What is said is no one stops sinning. And to expect to stop sinning is heresy.

Exactly, and that was a point I was going to make about those who hold to a doctrine of ongoing sin, which means they teach a doctrine that says you can never stop sinning and thus by definition you will always be a servant of sin while in this world, which is false.

This false doctrine that says you can never stop sinning goes against what Jesus said he could do about making one free from sin and sinning, and what the apostles preached including Paul about being made free from sin. I have provided all the scriptures to prove these points, but the lies of the devil and the doctrines of men have convinced people they will never be made free from sin.

And now somehow the words of Jesus Christ and the apostles have become like heresy if you hold fast to them.

 

[PeterJens]

like I said...don't engage
merry-go-round of insults, lies and to use someone else's expression...malice

Have you ever seen an interaction between a male bully and a pretty girl.

"Hello darling. Come over here and I can give you something you will like"
"No thanks dear, I am just off somewhere else."
"You slag, lying ******, you peice of *****, I should come over there and ***** "

Once you do something they do not like and get upset about, it just lets rip.

This short interaction reminded me of this.
It has nothing to do with the person sharing, but the heart of the respondant.

Jesus says what flows from the mouth the heart is full of.
I will always encourage anyone who brings glory to Christ and His principles, and
condemn those who oppose them. I can do not other, for this is our calling in Christ.

 

[Stephen63]

Something you've said here is a thing I've struggled with a lot.
It's where you said: some people are doomed by their decisions.
Here is the push and pull in my mind with it:
I would still be where I was unless He showed me His Son, gave me the gift of faith, kept me at all times, and a lot more.
So I am bothered by the thought that I made a good decision to believe and others are making a bad decision to not believe, because unless He had healed my blindness and gave me faith, I would still be one of those making a bad decision because I couldn't make any other decision. A man born blind can't just choose to see. He has to be healed of his blindness before he can see.

So I am bothered by the thought that I made a good decision and that man made a bad one so I'm going to heaven and he's going to hell, as if I had anything to do with being healed of my blindness. Something doesn't rest easily in my mind about it all. So there, you entered my crazy mind.

The Lord is faithful & no respecter of persons. He gives & deals equally with all people. There are times I'm filled with sorrow as a minister, when I see people in church who won't repent after they've seen the light. It's their right to choose, but that doesn't make us feel any better about it.

Make no mistake..... The same Holy Spirit that drew you in did the exact same thing for those that refused. Thank God you made Christ your choice!

BTW, That's the Holy Spirit entering your crazy mind, not me!

 

[Stephen63]

I see ISIT making his statements, & definitely upsetting some people. Yep, he's doing that. I won't back him, even though I agree with a few things he says.

But, I must ask this question: WHO made this thread last so long? This is post 391, & I don't think he wrote all of them.

WHO is responsible for all the fighting, the bashing, the bitterness, the hating, the name calling? Why, those wonderful people that thinks they're so right they'll fight to the death, of course. Yes, ISIT DID open this big can of worms..... but look who fell for it. Look at who is sling the worms.

Who is wrong, now? I don't like the way ISIT handled this, but what's wrong when we like how EVERYBODY ELSE handled it?

 

[PeterJens]

Because he's blaspheming the Holy Ghost within you. I think you know now what chance you have with converting him. Sorry, but it's true.

I would not go this far.
Jesus called blasphemy to call an obvious work of God of satan, in this case a healing of
a person which could only have been healed from the Lord.

I am always cautious to say how people are influenced or saying a work of grace is
something different partly because of this statement.

It is curious though, if someone criticises me of following instructions of Christ, and I say
these are the words of the enemy, am I doing the same thing? So I think we should avoid
this kind of idea, and I pray and hope we all are walking in grace and love with Christ.

If sincerity, truth love and hope are not in our hearts, what hope is there for us in Christ?

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

When we die - our flesh will not go to be with the Lord. Understanding the circumcision of Christ ( Col. 2:11) is vital to knowing that we are sealed with the Holy Sprit in our inner man in Christ. Knowing that the inner man of the heart - the new creation has been cut away from the flesh is paramount in growing up in the Lord.

To our natural humanistic minds - this truth of the new creation is all foolishness to us.

Romans 8:10-13 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yetthe spirit is alive because of righteousness.

[SUP]11 [/SUP] But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

[SUP]12 [/SUP] So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh—

[SUP]13 [/SUP] for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

Take up shooting heroin in your arms and you will see this "death" that Paul talks about. Keep eating ourselves to an obese size and we too will see this "death" manifested.

That is why it is so vital to learn to walk by the spirit - our real person that is in Christ and not give in to the lusts of the flesh to fulfill "it's" desires.
Romans chapter 7:14-23 shows the influence of the law of sin in our flesh which is against the inner man in Christ.

Had a banana, good to go!
It's the "are putting to death" part that grabs me.

If, by the Spirit, we "are putting to death", this is ongoing as we follow and learn from this Spirit. So we should expect that we are in some error, but becoming more renewed and purified. So to attack over where one may not be "perfect in doctrine" is a useless exercise. No one has the complete mind of God yet. No one is completely perfected yet. No one grows up in this world, being taught its' ways, who doesn't have some leaven of men and some imperfection of understanding concerning Gods' mind on all matters. So if we rail against how someone currently sees something, we are really condemning ourselves as well. We are demanding from them a perfection that we ourselves do not even possess.

So knowing this should humble us and lead us away from the presumption that someone is not saved because they have some errors somewhere. This would mean no one is saved because ALL are "putting to death" by the Spirit. Or from the presumption that they are completely wrong and we are completely right. This should lead to bearing with each others imperfections and faults until the Holy Spirit brings us to unity. And He will ALWAYS do that if we are walking correctly, in love, even when we don't agree on some point. It is presumption, (which is arrogance), to halt all learning and conversing to argue one point, insisting that no good work can be done unless everyone first agrees on one point. If the past few years have not convinced anyone that it won't work to go that route, then I don't know what further I could say to get them to see it's futile. It's presumption, and it also brings pain to our brothers to have to put up with it when they want to hear what others have to say and want to try to understand where they are. But if no one can bear even the slightest harsh remark and silently forgive, they just turn every conversation into a bitter pill and will not bear the offense quietly and any conversation completely halts because they refuse to move on in forgiveness and refuse to allow anyone else to move on to a productive conversation. It just becomes shrieking about how this person or that person keeps assaulting them. Why not just ignore and forgive the offense 70x7 until they see they aren't going to disturb your peace or bring you to war? A general clue that you have become a great burden to your brothers is if you have stated a thing 50x or 100x, over the course of many months or years, and keep insisting on doing it still, even though nothing changes with the one you insist on having the same argument with. So one person has to be the one to begin letting offenses go. If it's best to stick to conversation with only those who don't stir up your flesh and make you a burden to everyone else (and you are a burden in this manner even IF you're right!), then do it. I can easily talk with someone I don't agree with while the same topic and talk with someone else just leads to bad. Same conversation over same topic, but it's easy to have with the one person but somehow impossible with another. But if I just insist on saying the same thing over and over and having the same fight with the same exact people in every single thread, I have become a burden that is heavy to bear to my brothers. They will start just glossing over my posts because they already know what the posts will say because they've heard it 50x or 100x. So even if I do say something new, they won't read it! I used to love talking with EG, grace777, and peter, but it is rare that I even look at their posts anymore because I don't want to read the same things 100x. It doesn't build me up. There's just no practical help for me in going over the same thing so many times. This is very sad that if someone has offended you, you can't bear it silently if you see they aren't going to stop. No one wants to hear someone complain about how someone has offended them for all eternity. Peter keeps saying he has being lied about and slandered, Eg keeps saying he has been lied about and slandered, and grace 777 keeps saying he has been lied about and slandered. It's a 24/7 news feed with no new news. Ever. And it's gone on for years now. But no one is willing to stop being a burden to all the other brothers in the threads. All forward conversation and movement had to stop years ago and all have had to listen to three men constantly proclaim how they have been offended, slandered and lied about. And until the day we all die, we have to keep hearing it. And not one of you can see what a burden you have become. And I love all three of you even though I agree with each of you on some things and don't agree with each of you on some things. And I used to love conversation with each of you but you each have now become a heavy burden. It brings me to tears many times. It's not good. And you don't have to announce to the entire forum that you are going to ignore someone. You just need to stop. Will someone please stop and determine to be the one to ignore any further offenses or past offenses so that you will become a joy and a help to us again? Please?

 

[gb9]

Exactly, and that was a point I was going to make about those who hold to a doctrine of ongoing sin, which means they teach a doctrine that says you can never stop sinning and thus by definition you will always be a servant of sin while in this world, which is false.

This false doctrine that says you can never stop sinning goes against what Jesus said he could do about making one free from sin and sinning, and what the apostles preached including Paul about being made free from sin. I have provided all the scriptures to prove these points, but the lies of the devil and the doctrines of men have convinced people they will never be made free from sin.

And now somehow the words of Jesus Christ and the apostles have become like heresy if you hold fast to them.

o.k. , so have you stopped sinning or not. if not then why not. I know you will not answer this.

you see, this is supposed to be a discussion forum. what is has turned into is a people yell at other people about not sinning, then will not respond to questions about the very thing that they just said.

ever heard the expression " practice what you preach" ? well, you certainly do not.

as a put up yesterday, anyone who claims not to sin, deliberately or not, it is not different in God's eyes, is a fake lair. that would be you.

 

[PeterJens]

Lauren -
Or are you ok that such a group should dominate and desire to crush, bully and expel all others?

Short answer is yes, because she is one of them, lol, at least sometimes ... she is not sure
depending on the mood and the time of day...

 

[Grace777x70]

I completely agree stunnedbygrace that we should ignore and forgive others.

What I don't agree with is allowing foul behavior allowed to be still done by others as if it doesn't matter - which is why we have some people on ignore. The mods knew in the wisdom of God we would need these ignore buttons.

This is not a church setting here where there are elders that would take these people aside to ask them to stop this bad behavior or they must leave the assembly before others get infected with the bitterness and malice. Hebrews 12:15 and Romans 16:17.

I understand your heart in this and it is a good one... - but a matter of church discipline to protect the others can only be truly done in a real church environment and unfortunately not in here.

I forgive the child molester from his foul behavior but I don't allow him in my house if there is no repentance of his behavior.

The reason why the same things are posted when a certain topic comes up is to help the new ones that come to CC. If people can't do this without the malice and insults from the others - then this is a very sad place to be in and it is in no way Christian in practice.

That's why I have chosen not to interact with those that continue to insult others.

It's ok to agree to disagree. There are many of us that can do that while still respecting them and not insulting them because they have a different belief than we do on a subject.

I just post what I believe and leave it in the Lord's hands. All of us only know in part and we really need each other but we need to exhibit respect for others in order for this to be done in practice.

 

[PeterJens]

Had a banana, good to go!

Thankyou for this. I just try and understand people and their approach.
I believe I now understand both EG and G7.

Praise the Lord, I do not have sin to repent of, or my walk is empty, or I am
not saved, or I am commiting sin worse than being gay, or my experience with
Christ is not delusion, but rather Christ in me is glory, and Praise to His name.

I am called to follow and obey, and in obedience purified and refined by the Holy
Spirit.

I wish EG & G7 well and blessing in this gift of grace that wells up in my heart.
I will never understand how an honest truthfull observation is an insult or a lie,
but then maybe I am not very bright, but God loves me, so Amen.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

o.k. , so have you stopped sinning or not. if not then why not. I know you will not answer this.

you see, this is supposed to be a discussion forum. what is has turned into is a people yell at other people about not sinning, then will not respond to questions about the very thing that they just said.

ever heard the expression " practice what you preach" ? well, you certainly do not.

as a put up yesterday, anyone who claims not to sin, deliberately or not, it is not different in God's eyes, is a fake lair. that would be you.

Yes this is a discussion forum, that is a Bible discussion forum. But somehow my threads end up being about what others think of me instead; as you just called me a fake liar. (based on what?) Truth is you guys cannot argue against the Truths I've shown in the words of God so being unable to refute the Truth you do what you do best; and that is to pack attack the poster, make false accusations, bear false witness, call names, make smart comments, and try to prop up the usual straw man in order to try to discredit the messenger, but without even addressing the multitudes of scriptures by which I confirm the Truth.

So unless you can prove the words of God wrong which I preach, perhaps it's best just to bite your lip.

 

[PeterJens]

My advice about G7 - pompous

A child molester analogy. Really. Boy you are upset, but cannot let it out.
I suggest you vent before you explode, lol

I suspect after so many years of repression and control all we see is the machine
without the heart that drives it...

 

[FreeNChrist]

Yes this is a discussion forum, that is a Bible discussion forum. But somehow my threads end up being about what others think of me instead; as you just called me a fake liar. (based on what?) Truth is you guys cannot argue against the Truths I've shown in the words of God so being unable to refute the Truth you do what you do best; and that is to pack attack the poster, make false accusations, bear false witness, call names, make smart comments, and try to prop up the usual straw man in order to try to discredit the messenger, but without even addressing the multitudes of scriptures by which I confirm the Truth.

So unless you can prove the words of God wrong which I preach, perhaps it's best just to bite your lip.

That's just your inflated ego talking. 1 John 2:1 alone destroys your whole belief system.

"I am writing this to you so that you will not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate who pleads our case before the Father. He is Jesus Christ, the one who is truly righteous."

Notice what it doesn't say. It doesn't say that if we sin we are not really Christians, and it doesn't say that if we sin God rejects us and takes back our salvation. It says that we have an Advocate with the Father if we sin. Of course neither we or God wants us to sin, but if we do, Gods got it covered.