Don't choke the BABY! Let new Christians drink their milk before you force feed them

[seed_time_harvest]

Let's start with
1. foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God.

a. What are dead works?

B. Why do we need to repent of them?

C. What is meant by faith towards God?

I believe what you mentioned 1of them about learning of God's love, compassion ,mercy, and grace is part of the answer to C...having faith towards God.

Dead works are works done with will power,the person Is not joined to CHRIST and are trying to gain righteousness In GOD's eyes on their own and although they may sin less than their neighbor,they are not perfect and will come up short of GOD's glory because GOD will only accept perfection.

We need to repent because God Is righteous and TRUE and no one can come to JESUS unless GOD draws them,In other words,the person can't go to church and simply repeat some words that are not heart felt and get saved.IE...I want to Impress this girl so I'll say these words and get saved or I want to Impress my parents so I'll repeat these words and get saved.

No,your repentance must be true,genuine.

Faith must be In GOD,faith pleases GOD.IE...

The person can't see GOD but they can see the storm.GOD says,believe my word and take the step towards this grace through faith.

The person looks around and sees the storm and starts to sink.like Peter did.

 

[newlightseven]

one has to first read the bible in its entire context. I say this with love so that you all will have rewards in heaven. If one was to read it in parts one would say SEE ALL WORKS ARE DEAD. But if you read it in it's full context you will see that is not true. Some in here are a little confused. All work isn't dead work. There are works that give glory to god and witness to your salvation and gains you rewards in heaven. Dead works are works that do not bring glory to God. We are to repent of those dead works NOT THE WORKS THAT CHRIST HIMSELF SAID WE SHOULD DO. Christ left us with gifts and when he return he will reward you for what you have done. He also says because you have done this and this enter into my kingdom. There is also the verse about building upon the foundation of Christ. See believing in Christ is the foundation many want to stop there and not have any precious substance gold, silver, stones or anything. What is that like? that is like taking the gift of salvation that was given to you and digging in a hole and hiding it there because you reaped where you did not sow. So what shall the master do when he returns he shall take away even that gift that was given to you because you were unfruitful. That's why he cursed the fig tree because it had no fruit. We must bear fruit in all seasons.

The harvest is the world, I say this so no one will be deceived.

 

[Stephen63]

I think it is possible to get sideways even after having believed and understood. I don't think the Galatians just never believed to begin with. I think they just got lured back and yoked again and needed some help.

I remember when I had trouble where I actually stopped reading the ot for a while because I would get a firm grip but then begin to slip back into what I must do whenever I read ot.

Even now, I have to remember sometimes that if I begin to wonder when reading if if I really should be doing some outward thing, that I am slipping back out of seeking the Spirit of the words for inside and viewing it as law for the outside. It takes some practice of feeling the pull and rejecting it before it simmers down. It's a battle going on there between the flesh gravitating to law and the spirit gravitating to Spirit.

There are some differences between the moral law & the sacrificial system, which were only a shadow of things to come.

Perhaps it was some of the moral law you were dealing with that put this "draw" on you.

 

[Ariel82]

God wants us to do good work but only after we are established as beloved children who knows that our works are done for love and not to earn our place as children.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

1 Corinthians 3
And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ. I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able; for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men?

Hebrews 5
For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food. For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe. But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Hebrews 6
​ Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this we will do if God permits.

It is important to understand the distinction between the purpose of I Cor 3:1-3 and Heb 5:11-6:1-3.

1 Cor is written to the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord (1 Cor 1:2).

In 1 Cor 3:2, Paul indicates he fed them with milk because they were not able to feed on solid food. The implication is that Paul would like to feed them meat, but they are not able to bear it. In 1 Cor 2:7, there is an indication that Paul was able to speak wisdom to some. However, in chapter 3, Paul wrote to those who were still carnal.

1 Cor 3:3 tells us why the believers were unable to feed on the meat of the word: they were carnal which resulted in envy, strife, and divisions.

The reason the Corinthian church was carnal is explained in chapter 1:


1 Corinthians 1:

11 For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.

12 Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.

13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?


The believers were followers of men rather than followers of the Lord Jesus Christ.



Hebrews was written concerning what God had spoken in time past unto the fathers by the prophets (Heb 1:1) and that in these last days God spoke by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things (Heb 1:2).

Unto whom did God speak by the prophets? He spoke to the children of Israel, the Hebrew nation.


Heb 4:10-11 speaks of the rest afforded to those who enter into rest through ceasing from their own works.


Heb 4:14-16 tells us of our great High Priest Who passed into the heavens; He was touched with the feeling of our infirmities as He was in all points tempted like as we are yet without sin; and we now are able to come boldly unto the throne of grace to obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.


In Heb 5:4, 6, 10 we see that Jesus is a greater high priest than Aaron and Melchisedec.


And in Heb 5:11, we see that many things need to be said but they cannot be uttered because of dullness of hearing.


Then we have the verse (Heb 5:12) which indicates the need to learn the first principles of the oracles of God. And in Heb 6:1-3 the Hebrews are encouraged to graduate from the principles of the doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity; and they are warned not to go back to repenting through works, move away from the doctrines of baptisms (cleansing rites/rituals), laying on of hands, resurrection and eternal judgment.



Corinthians was written to point out error in those who looked away from our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ to follow other men. Those who follow men will be carnal, divisive, contentious, full of envy.

Heb 5:11-6:3 warns the believer to not turn from the Lord Jesus Christ / go back to Judaism.

 

[Depleted]

Never read it like that...,the meat is being able to discern between good and evil. The milk is the foundation that Paul says he says "not lay again the foundation" which implies they have already been laid thus the milk he refers to earlier.

(Lightbulb just went off over my head.)

Ohhhhhh!!! The writer of Hebrews is sneaky. I always thought that was a "therefore, we're not" thingy because if he was going to, he'd jump right into those teachings, right?

I just read the next two chapter. Original thought was, "Yeah, but all he does is talk about Melchizedek and how Jesus did the full of the shadow that was the OT. Nothing about dead works, faith in God, laying on of hands, resurrect--"

Whoops! Jesus returning again is about the resurrection. Oh, oh, oh! That whole deal with Abraham and Melchizedek was about not doing dead works (Abraham tithed the guy after owing him bigtime, which was definitely a "live work,") and faith in God. And, oh, oh, oh -- OT sacrifices were all about baptizing (blood was applied to the altar for a reason), and laying on of hands. (The priest had to hold onto the sacrifices -- all varieties of sacrifices -- altar, waves, all of them.)

Sneaky! Really sneaky, unless you happened to be the Hebrews of that time when they truly caught the significance of the OT to see how Jesus pulled THAT off.

How about that! As many times as I've read NT, I never caught on to any of that, until I spent two years studying all the tabernacle stuff in the Pentateuch. It sunk in. (It finally sunk in! And they say there are no miracles today. lol) And, good thing it sunk in, because I totally missed it at surface level for so many years.

This won't come as a big surprise to you, but... gee! You're right! It's in there. lol

This is truly cool! Thank you!

 

[Ariel82]

Glad you caught it....can I borrow your notes on the tabernacle symbols? I was daydreaming about ice cream that day.

 

[Depleted]

There are some differences between the moral law & the sacrificial system, which were only a shadow of things to come.

Perhaps it was some of the moral law you were dealing with that put this "draw" on you.

Ah, but it's not different. The Law is both the moral system and sacrifice. The two are interconnected knowing no one can keep the moral, so we have to repent. The only thing that has changed is the sacrifice. No longer need cute little lambs. We got The Lamb, who is also the Scapegoat and Lion. There was a once-and-for-all sacrifice for God's kids. His name is God/Jesus. He did what we cannot and in doing that sent the Spirit to give us our enabler-of-moral law so we don't take for granted that the king came down to be a baby to save who God will save.

Really cool. Hebrew explains how it's connected. (Sorry if that sounds stupid to you. I JUST figured this out. lol)

 

[Depleted]

Glad you caught it....can I borrow your notes on the tabernacle symbols? I was daydreaming about ice cream that day.

Sorry. Didn't write it down. Just spent a couple of years reading it on what felt like a repeat loop when reading Exodus, Leviticus and Numbers. lol

 

[royalscot]

15 Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant Hebrews 9



Justified by Faith
15 We ourselves are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners;16 yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.
17 But if, in our endeavor to be justified in Christ, we too were found to be sinners, is Christ then a servant of sin? Certainly not!18 For if I rebuild what I tore down, I prove myself to be a transgressor.19 For through the law I died to the law, so that I might live to God.20 I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.21 I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose.



28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.Galatians 3: By Faith, or by Works of the Law?



6 he says:
"It is too light a thing that you should be my servant
to raise up the tribes of Jacob
and to bring back the preserved of Israel;
I will make you as a light for the nations,
that my salvation may reach to the end of the earth."


salvation has nothing to do with repentance. you would need an old covenant for your stand in repentance.

For God So Loved the World
16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

 

[Ariel82]

You mean when people preached "Repent the Kingdom of God is at hand." they got it wrong?

Matthew 4v17
From that time Jesus began to preach and to say, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”

 

[newlightseven]

The bible is clear, faith works is dead. One can't claim to believe in him and then do not have works because they are not believing in his word when he told them to do good works.

The people that believe him Believe in his work, plus do the work of repentance, love, mercy and charity.

The bible clearly says that those who are unfruitful will be taken from the olive tree and put in the fire.

 

[Ariel82]

The bible is clear, faith works is dead. One can't claim to believe in him and then do not have works because they are not believing in his word when he told them to do good works.

The people that believe him Believe in his work, plus do the work of repentance, love, mercy and charity.

The bible clearly says that those who are unfruitful will be taken from the olive tree and put in the fire.

Sorry that isn't even sippy cup material. Would you care to to start a different thread about the meat or the fruit or faith without works?

We are still focusing on making bottles of milk.

 

[samuel23]

Growing in the Lord is demonstrated by being able to discern the true instructions of God from that which is false. At the present moment 95% of bible teachers do not even recognize that they are teaching a demonic doctrine about the return of Christ that is called the pre-trib rapture. That is not even up to the milk stage...that is drinking poison. I hear people crowing about what a great man or woman of God someone is and all this great experience they have and how they are used of God...and then they start teaching the Devils version of Christ return...I don't buy it. If they were really that connected to God then they would have recognized the witness of the Spirit that they are teaching a lie.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

There are some differences between the moral law & the sacrificial system, which were only a shadow of things to come.

Perhaps it was some of the moral law you were dealing with that put this "draw" on you.

I'm trying to remember an example...can't think of one without going searching. But things like... a certain day you could do no work on. And my penchant is to think: I read my bible most days and every single morning I get up and the first thing I do is spend time with God, but maybe I need to not work ever on Sunday, and maybe I shouldn't go anywhere where people ARE working on sunday, like to a restaurant...just a pull of going to the outside with the law instead of seeking the spirit of the word for my inside. You've never felt that odd pull?

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Growing in the Lord is demonstrated by being able to discern the true instructions of God from that which is false. At the present moment 95% of bible teachers do not even recognize that they are teaching a demonic doctrine about the return of Christ that is called the pre-trib rapture. That is not even up to the milk stage...that is drinking poison. I hear people crowing about what a great man or woman of God someone is and all this great experience they have and how they are used of God...and then they start teaching the Devils version of Christ return...I don't buy it. If they were really that connected to God then they would have recognized the witness of the Spirit that they are teaching a lie.

Oh, yuck Samuel. There have been many godly men who believe in our gathering together prior to the tribulation. And other godly men who don't believe it. You're making it a salvation issue and saying they are teaching the doctrine of satan? That's not good, Samuel.

 

[samuel23]

I am not making it a salvation issue because I really do not know, however this is a very critical doctrine, it is called the "blessed hope", it is what all the church is waiting for, the biggest event of the church, the actual return of Christ to gather the believers. To reject Jesus literal teaching on this subject and accept a teaching that could have only come from Satan, has to be a horrible thing in the sight of God. Millions of souls could be lost when Christ does not return pre-trib and Christians find their selves in the tribulation with the Antichrist trying to kill them...pre-trib is an end time deception from Satan designed to cause many souls to fall away.

 

[Willie-T]

You mean when people preached "Repent the Kingdom of God is at hand." they got it wrong?

Matthew 4v17
From that time Jesus began to preach and to say, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”

Are you even sure you really know what John and Jesus were telling people (Jews) to do when they said for them to "repent?"

 

[Stephen63]

I'm trying to remember an example...can't think of one without going searching. But things like... a certain day you could do no work on. And my penchant is to think: I read my bible most days and every single morning I get up and the first thing I do is spend time with God, but maybe I need to not work ever on Sunday, and maybe I shouldn't go anywhere where people ARE working on sunday, like to a restaurant...just a pull of going to the outside with the law instead of seeking the spirit of the word for my inside. You've never felt that odd pull?

Oh yeah..... there's conviction of sin, & conviction of righteousness. I've felt both when reading the OT.

 

[Ariel82]

Are you even sure you really know what John and Jesus were telling people (Jews) to do when they said for them to "repent?"

No, but I am sure what God means when He tells me I need to repent.