WOMEN WHO EXERCISE AUTHORITY OVER MEN ARE A DISGRACE TO SOCIETY!!!
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R
ROSSELLA
Guest
I think you should read this article on GotQuestions.org
https://www.gotquestions.org/desire-husband-rule.html
Actually, sin entered the world through Adam and Eve. Eve did sin first, but she didn't make Adam eat the fruit. She gave it to him and he ate willingly. No where does it say she held a knife to his throat and told him to eat. No one sex is to blame.
Whether or not woman should have authority over men...the Bible does say that "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man." However, this is in the context of the church and Ephesians 5: 21 states " and you will submit to one another out of reverence for the Messiah.[SUP]"
[/SUP]The Bible does not say only men should submit to men and women to men, but not men sometimes to women. Submission should be done out of love and one wielding control shouldn't use it as a weapon against the other person.
Also, yes. Deborah wielded power. Mothers are given power over their male sons through the commandment for children to honor their parents. Esther wielded power as queen. Ana, as a prophetess, doubtless sometimes taught even men about the Lord. Women had power over their servants, male or female. Yet God never condemned Esther or Deborah for wielding power. Even Jesus obeyed Mary when she ordered Him to turn water into wine.
I don't know everything about the roles God intended for women. I don't know exactly when women should be allowed to have authority or allowed to teach. But I don't think God intended 1 Timothy 2:12 to apply in every situation. Otherwise, what if a female Christian met an unbelieving male? Could she not teach him about the gospel because she was a woman? I think God would want her to share the good news.
https://www.gotquestions.org/desire-husband-rule.html
Actually, sin entered the world through Adam and Eve. Eve did sin first, but she didn't make Adam eat the fruit. She gave it to him and he ate willingly. No where does it say she held a knife to his throat and told him to eat. No one sex is to blame.
Whether or not woman should have authority over men...the Bible does say that "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man." However, this is in the context of the church and Ephesians 5: 21 states " and you will submit to one another out of reverence for the Messiah.[SUP]"
[/SUP]The Bible does not say only men should submit to men and women to men, but not men sometimes to women. Submission should be done out of love and one wielding control shouldn't use it as a weapon against the other person.
Also, yes. Deborah wielded power. Mothers are given power over their male sons through the commandment for children to honor their parents. Esther wielded power as queen. Ana, as a prophetess, doubtless sometimes taught even men about the Lord. Women had power over their servants, male or female. Yet God never condemned Esther or Deborah for wielding power. Even Jesus obeyed Mary when she ordered Him to turn water into wine.
I don't know everything about the roles God intended for women. I don't know exactly when women should be allowed to have authority or allowed to teach. But I don't think God intended 1 Timothy 2:12 to apply in every situation. Otherwise, what if a female Christian met an unbelieving male? Could she not teach him about the gospel because she was a woman? I think God would want her to share the good news.
Two lessons that I have learned.
Mama is always right.
When I know Mama is wrong. Mama is still always right.
Back to the Op. If Georgie would take the time to actually study the scripture he uses to justify his position, he would find that if Barak had obeyed God's (delivered by the woman, Deborah) instructions, the victory would have been his. Instead, he chose to do it "his way", and the victory was given to a woman (the wife of Heber the Kenite). The moral of the story. When God sends a woman with a message to you, you need to pay attention to the message, not the woman.
Mama is always right.
When I know Mama is wrong. Mama is still always right.
Back to the Op. If Georgie would take the time to actually study the scripture he uses to justify his position, he would find that if Barak had obeyed God's (delivered by the woman, Deborah) instructions, the victory would have been his. Instead, he chose to do it "his way", and the victory was given to a woman (the wife of Heber the Kenite). The moral of the story. When God sends a woman with a message to you, you need to pay attention to the message, not the woman.
Who are these little foxes, where have they come from?They ruin the Vineyard!The habitation of Our Love!!!
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K
kaylagrl
Guest
Quote "Magenta, this is the reason women were not aloud to vote"
Apparently grammar wasn't what kept us from voting. I think you mean "allowed" not aloud.
Quote "they refuse any responsibility for sin, and blame everything on men or the devil."
Ummm,excuse me,I thought it was Gods job to judge the heart. What a foolish thing to say.
Quote " He was forced to accept responsibility for listening to his wife. "
And no man has ever listened to his wife since. Id call it a draw.And now men have driven in circles for ages because the refuse their wifes advice to "ask for directions"
Quote "Therefore a woman who honors her man with true grace and humility, being in subjection before the Lord and the congregation, will remain silent. Inturn, she is given some amount of responsability. "
Been argued to death here.I have female pastors in my family.No doubt in my mind they will hear "well done" when they reach their heavenly home. {and some already have}
Quote "She refuses to honor and obey authority"
Dangerous teaching when taken out of context and can put a woman in bondage no different than Muslim women.
Actually, you can make up whatever you want, but I will go by what the Scriptures say, for they explicitly state that sin entered the world through one man.
M
Mooky
Guest
Stop feeding the troll ,peeps.....it's obviously some under employed individual who gets off on us responding to his sick ideas...
Exactly, how did Eve commit spiritual adultery? What exactly is that anyway? There are many instances where a women exercise authority over men, especially in the workplace. A woman's desire for her husband is just that. Of course a woman should desire her husband and the husband should desire his wife. Your interpretation of scripture seems to be messed up. I also sense that you despise women.
G
Galatea
Guest
Of course the original post is incendiary, but there are Christians who subscribe to the teaching that women should not teach men in church. I am one of these old fashioned types. It is nothing for Christians to fall out about, though. I have read that people think I Timothy 2:9-15 was for the local congregation, in a certain context and not applicable today. But, I think it still applies to church government.
This is not a primary issue, but a secondary or tertiary one.
This is not a primary issue, but a secondary or tertiary one.
Sorry I missed this earlier in the day.
First, the OP didn't put so much as one Scripture verse up to post his position. There are plenty of threads on CC about women in ministry, which I have participated in here. They have been discussions of Scripture, not outright attacks on women. Like me! That's right - like me!
Magenta posted this right on page 1, so I will post again, before I leave this nonsense. Trolls need to go, just saying!
"Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned— 13 for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law.14 [FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Y[/FONT]et death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sinning was not like the transgression of Adam,[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif] who was a type of the one who was to come." Romans 5:12-14[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Yet, Paul says something different in 1 Tim. 2:12. So, is this an irreconcilable conflict, or has one of these pages been incorrectly interpreted and/or translated?
One only has to briefly look at Genesis, to see about the problem. First, God spoke only to Adam. So he got it first hand, and Eve got it second hand. That is why she was deceived! Because she had not heard the message directly from God, but second hand. In fact, Eve was not even created when God told "the man" this. Eve was not created until Genesis 2:21-22. So, the transmission of the command had to be faulty, on either Adam's part or when Eve received the message. (I'm not pointing any fingers, just trying to point out the obvious!)
"[/FONT]The Lord God took the man and placed him in the garden of Eden to work it and watch over it. 16 And the Lord God commanded the man, “You are free to eat from any tree of the garden, 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for on the day you eat from it, you will certainly die." Genesis 2:15-17
Now, Eve certainly knew the command, as Genesis 3:2-3 point out.
"The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat the fruit from the trees in the garden. 3 But about the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God said, ‘You must not eat it or touch it, or you will die.’” Genesis 3:2-3
Eve is deceived by the serpent, no ifs ands or buts.
However, Adam, who was directly commanded by God not to eat of the tree, ate anyway! This was really where the direct disobedience started, with Adam not with Eve. Adam could have stopped the whole thing, he knew what God had said, there was no serpent deceiving him, but he decided to disobey God. Verse 6 below could be called "The Fall."
"Then the woman saw that the tree was good for food and delightful to look at, and that it was desirable for obtaining wisdom. So she took some of its fruit and ate it; she also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made loincloths for themselves." Genesis 3:6-7
And you know the really shocking thing? When God found them, and called them out, Eve admitted she was deceived. I guess that would be the beginning of repentance, acknowledging you have sinned?
But when God confronted Adam, he did not admit his guilt, that he had broken a direct command from God, instead, he blamed the women. I don't know if they had personality disorders back in the Garden of Eden, but this sounds like the first one to me. Or, a spoiled toddler who failed to admit what he had done. Shame on Adam! Perhaps shame on all men, like this thread seems to imply about women? (Just joking, we are all responsible for our own walk with God!)
"Then He asked, “Who told you that you were naked? Did you eat from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?”12 Then the man replied, “The woman You gave to be with me—she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate.”
13 So the Lord God asked the woman, “What is this you have done?”
And the woman said, “It was the serpent. He deceived me, and I ate." Genesis 3:11-13
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]So, was only Eve punished for her deception? No! God gives them each punishment, and one of those things was gender roles. That's right, gender roles were totally a result of the Fall. There were no roles before the Fall, another thing men seem to forget, when they want "authority" over women. [/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]No wonder Paul addressed this in two places. One, a private letter to Timothy, who was having specific issues with the women in Ephesus, and Paul was helping Timothy deal with it in his church. The other, in Romans a more general theological treatise which points the finger not at Eve, not at any disruptive women, but squarely blames Adam for the Fall and everything that the Fall has brought, including sin and death. See above - Romans 5:12-14[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]I hope someone did not cover this, as I refuse to read another 7 pages of this kind of nonsense, I know some of you might be posting actual verses to defend your viewpoint, I have no quarrel with you. Regardless of where you stand on the issue of women in ministry. [/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]But to the OP, and his terrible slander of women, without even posting a single bible verse to support his claims, I will say, don't bother putting me down, unless you at least have the decency to post the BIBLE to defend this ridiculous and terrible abuse of women. Because, let's face it, there are no verses in the Bible to support abuse of women. What women were abused, you might ask? Well, me. I am a pastor, and I preach in my church. It doesn't get more simple than that! (I know he is generalizing, but he insults everyone, not just me, the way he words his post, the title.......)[/FONT]
First, the OP didn't put so much as one Scripture verse up to post his position. There are plenty of threads on CC about women in ministry, which I have participated in here. They have been discussions of Scripture, not outright attacks on women. Like me! That's right - like me!
Magenta posted this right on page 1, so I will post again, before I leave this nonsense. Trolls need to go, just saying!
"Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned— 13 for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law.14 [FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Y[/FONT]et death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sinning was not like the transgression of Adam,[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif] who was a type of the one who was to come." Romans 5:12-14[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Yet, Paul says something different in 1 Tim. 2:12. So, is this an irreconcilable conflict, or has one of these pages been incorrectly interpreted and/or translated?
One only has to briefly look at Genesis, to see about the problem. First, God spoke only to Adam. So he got it first hand, and Eve got it second hand. That is why she was deceived! Because she had not heard the message directly from God, but second hand. In fact, Eve was not even created when God told "the man" this. Eve was not created until Genesis 2:21-22. So, the transmission of the command had to be faulty, on either Adam's part or when Eve received the message. (I'm not pointing any fingers, just trying to point out the obvious!)
"[/FONT]The Lord God took the man and placed him in the garden of Eden to work it and watch over it. 16 And the Lord God commanded the man, “You are free to eat from any tree of the garden, 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for on the day you eat from it, you will certainly die." Genesis 2:15-17
Now, Eve certainly knew the command, as Genesis 3:2-3 point out.
"The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat the fruit from the trees in the garden. 3 But about the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God said, ‘You must not eat it or touch it, or you will die.’” Genesis 3:2-3
Eve is deceived by the serpent, no ifs ands or buts.
However, Adam, who was directly commanded by God not to eat of the tree, ate anyway! This was really where the direct disobedience started, with Adam not with Eve. Adam could have stopped the whole thing, he knew what God had said, there was no serpent deceiving him, but he decided to disobey God. Verse 6 below could be called "The Fall."
"Then the woman saw that the tree was good for food and delightful to look at, and that it was desirable for obtaining wisdom. So she took some of its fruit and ate it; she also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made loincloths for themselves." Genesis 3:6-7
And you know the really shocking thing? When God found them, and called them out, Eve admitted she was deceived. I guess that would be the beginning of repentance, acknowledging you have sinned?
But when God confronted Adam, he did not admit his guilt, that he had broken a direct command from God, instead, he blamed the women. I don't know if they had personality disorders back in the Garden of Eden, but this sounds like the first one to me. Or, a spoiled toddler who failed to admit what he had done. Shame on Adam! Perhaps shame on all men, like this thread seems to imply about women? (Just joking, we are all responsible for our own walk with God!)
"Then He asked, “Who told you that you were naked? Did you eat from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?”12 Then the man replied, “The woman You gave to be with me—she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate.”
13 So the Lord God asked the woman, “What is this you have done?”
And the woman said, “It was the serpent. He deceived me, and I ate." Genesis 3:11-13
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]So, was only Eve punished for her deception? No! God gives them each punishment, and one of those things was gender roles. That's right, gender roles were totally a result of the Fall. There were no roles before the Fall, another thing men seem to forget, when they want "authority" over women. [/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]No wonder Paul addressed this in two places. One, a private letter to Timothy, who was having specific issues with the women in Ephesus, and Paul was helping Timothy deal with it in his church. The other, in Romans a more general theological treatise which points the finger not at Eve, not at any disruptive women, but squarely blames Adam for the Fall and everything that the Fall has brought, including sin and death. See above - Romans 5:12-14[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]I hope someone did not cover this, as I refuse to read another 7 pages of this kind of nonsense, I know some of you might be posting actual verses to defend your viewpoint, I have no quarrel with you. Regardless of where you stand on the issue of women in ministry. [/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]But to the OP, and his terrible slander of women, without even posting a single bible verse to support his claims, I will say, don't bother putting me down, unless you at least have the decency to post the BIBLE to defend this ridiculous and terrible abuse of women. Because, let's face it, there are no verses in the Bible to support abuse of women. What women were abused, you might ask? Well, me. I am a pastor, and I preach in my church. It doesn't get more simple than that! (I know he is generalizing, but he insults everyone, not just me, the way he words his post, the title.......)[/FONT]
K
kaylagrl
Guest
Quote "we have experienced all of these problems sense they were given the right to vote"
Them womens got the right to vote,thats when it allll went down the crapper
Quote "Now, many women in our society support abortion"...
Maybe not as many as liberal media is trying to sell us,or Hillary would be in office now and not a dude.
Quote "Divorce is just as rampant in the church. There is no difference between the church and the world."
Id grant you that but if you're leaving women alone to hold the bag on that you're living in a fantasy world. Takes two.
Quote "The only way women have gained control is through force of sexual intimidation"
Id be seriously entertained to hear your explanation of this "sexual intimidation"
Quote "and tempting man inorder to control him, which is witchcraft."
So man should have no self control at all. Just like an old hound dog,whatever gets him goin just go to town huh?
I believe that most of us have forgotten that there will be a final judgement for all of us. At that time, we will not be blacks or whites, rich or poor......neither male nor female. But we will have one thing in common: we will all be sinners wanting entrance into heaven. Whether we are male or female here on earth , does it really make any difference??
Georgie,
I don't mean to be disrespectful, but since you don't seem to be responsive to any of the very reasonable points other members have brought up...
Why do your posts give me a picture of Gollum clinging onto his long-lost (and now only imaginary) ring, repeatedly chanting, "My Precious!"...
[video]https://youtu.be/SjYDDlt-EZU[/video]
(Sorry... can't get the video to post, apparently.)
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