Muslims march in London chanting "butcher butcher the jews"

[Dude653]

Oh and it says to kill rebellious children too

 

[Sirk]

Our Old Testament tells us to kill homosexuals and and witches.....
By that do we assume that all Christians want to murder homosexuals and people accused of being witches? Of course not

Are christians running around waging jihad....using hospitals and children as trenches to hide in? Mass murdering people in the streets with bombs and guns? Trying to obtain chemical biological nuclear weapons to kill as many as possible? Are they mutilating their womens bodies and not allowing them to drive or get an education or to show an ankle? Are they indoctrinating their kids to hate and kill westerners?

Every Christian I know just wants to raise their family in peace and not have to worry about disease or some greasy dirtbag blowing them up in a shopping mall. But hey...if you wanna live like they do in some 3rd world crap hole and wipe your butt with your hand be my guest....just don't do it here.

 

[dcontroversal]

No one said that every Muslim wants to kill you.


Merely that Islam commands Muslims to kill you.


Why do you always change the point of a convo to make it seem silly?

A fine tactic of the left.......

 

[Yeraza_Bats]

Our Old Testament tells us to kill homosexuals and and witches.....
By that do we assume that all Christians want to murder homosexuals and people accused of being witches? Of course not

Before I get to Bible verses, I must ONCE AGAIN remind you that no one said "all Muslims will kill you", but that Islam commands war against the unbelievers, and teaches that Muslims must be gathered against the Jews.

As for the Laws in the Bible, yes death is what should come of sinners. The Law on Idolatry-

Deut 13:6-10

6 If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; 7 Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth; 8 Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: 9 But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. 10 And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the Lord thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

And here is what God Himself has said to the idolaters-

Jeremiah 3:11-25

11 The Lord said to me, “Faithless Israel is more righteous than unfaithful Judah. 12 Go, proclaim this message toward the north:
“‘Return, faithless Israel,’ declares the Lord,
‘I will frown on you no longer,
for I am faithful,’ declares the Lord,
‘I will not be angry forever.
13 Only acknowledge your guilt—
you have rebelled against the Lord your God,
you have scattered your favors to foreign gods
under every spreading tree,
and have not obeyed me,’”
declares the Lord.

14 “Return, faithless people,” declares the Lord, “for I am your husband. I will choose you—one from a town and two from a clan—and bring you to Zion. 15 Then I will give you shepherds after my own heart, who will lead you with knowledge and understanding. 16 In those days, when your numbers have increased greatly in the land,” declares the Lord, “people will no longer say, ‘The ark of the covenant of the Lord.’ It will never enter their minds or be remembered; it will not be missed, nor will another one be made. 17 At that time they will call Jerusalem The Throneof the Lord, and all nations will gather in Jerusalem to honor the name of the Lord. No longer will they follow the stubbornness of their evil hearts.18 In those days the people of Judah will join the people of Israel, and together they will come from a northern land to the land I gave your ancestors as an inheritance.
19 “I myself said,
“‘How gladly would I treat you like my children
and give you a pleasant land,
the most beautiful inheritance of any nation.’
I thought you would call me ‘Father’
and not turn away from following me.
20 But like a woman unfaithful to her husband,
so you, Israel, have been unfaithful to me,”
declares the Lord.

21 A cry is heard on the barren heights,
the weeping and pleading of the people of Israel,
because they have perverted their ways
and have forgotten the Lord their God.

22 “Return, faithless people;
I will cure you of backsliding.”

“Yes, we will come to you,
for you are the Lord our God.
23 Surely the idolatrous commotion on the hills
and mountains is a deception;
surely in the Lord our God
is the salvation of Israel.
24 From our youth shameful gods have consumed
the fruits of our ancestors’ labor—
their flocks and herds,
their sons and daughters.
25 Let us lie down in our shame,
and let our disgrace cover us.
We have sinned against the Lord our God,
both we and our ancestors;
from our youth till this day
we have not obeyed the Lord our God.”

And Jesus gives us the same teaching, when given a stone to kill the adulteress woman, He tells us "he who is without sin, cast the first stone".

If you read the entirety of the bible, the context is clear. This is why you do not see Christians going out and killing sinners.

Islam, on the other hand, has clear commands to kill the unbelievers and hypocrites. And no, the context does not change if you read into it. They are clear commands to make war with the unbelievers, and to be unyielding to them. This is why there has always been a problem with murder and violence in Islam.

 

[Dude653]

Are christians running around waging jihad....using hospitals and children as trenches to hide in? Mass murdering people in the streets with bombs and guns? Trying to obtain chemical biological nuclear weapons to kill as many as possible? Are they mutilating their womens bodies and not allowing them to drive or get an education or to show an ankle? Are they indoctrinating their kids to hate and kill westerners?

Every Christian I know just wants to raise their family in peace and not have to worry about disease or some greasy dirtbag blowing them up in a shopping mall. But hey...if you wanna live like they do in some 3rd world crap hole and wipe your butt with your hand be my guest....just don't do it here.

I will agree with you on that point as most Muslim countries are the worst human rights **** holes on earth

 

[dcontroversal]

From now until the day when Jesus comes, Islam is going to be at the center of world events. The anti Christ comes from the middle east, and I would expect he will be a Muslim. How could the devil not be Muslim? He is after all the founder the Islamic cult of evil.

I agree....been teaching for about 7 years that the 12th IMAM/MADHI is the beast/little horn of Revelation/Daniel A.K.A. Anti-Christ so called....

Horus is Bel is Marduke is Merodach is Jupiter is Zeus is Allah is Satan...........

Jesus stated that the church at Pergamos was located where Satan's seat was located.....The Throne of Zeus was in Pergamos

Tells me Zeus was real as in Satan......historically speaking the false gods I named correspond with Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome and the god worshipped at the end of the age......

A continuing attempt by Satan to be worshipped in a man as God.....

 

[Sirk]

I will agree with you on that point as most Muslim countries are the worst human rights **** holes on earth

Then why on earth do you want them to export it here? Here in Mt we've had it pretty good for a long time. Now the Californians are moving in to escape the lunacy of california but bringing it right along with them. My dad used to say....no matter where you go, there you are.

No matter where a backwards indoctrinated muslim jihadist goes....there they are.

 

[JosephsDreams]

Oh and it says to kill rebellious children too

I guess you have not gotten to thew NT yet?
Jesus sets forth a new covenant there, if you have not heard.
You mentioning the OT in that context is erroneous.
In fact, if we still lived in OT times, you and probably just about every other liberal in America would be dead.

Sometimes I think the OT principals was not a bad idea...

 

[Yeraza_Bats]

I guess you have not gotten to thew NT yet?
Jesus sets forth a new covenant there, if you have not heard.
You mentioning the OT in that context is erroneous.
In fact, if we still lived in OT times, you and probably just about every other liberal in America would be dead.

Sometimes I think the OT principals was not a bad idea...

Even in the OT, like the verses I posted from Jeremiah, God calls on those who have committed offenses that call for execution to come back to Him and acknowledge their guilt, and that He would take them back.

The law is sin equals death, but the Bible makes it clear, we are not saved through the law but through grace, and all we must do is repent of our sins. That is why Christians dont kill sinners, as taught to us by Christ. We have all sinned, and right now we are being called to repent, so we are not in a position to hold anyone accountable. It is a clear contrast to Islam.

 

[dcontroversal]

Then why on earth do you want them to export it here? Here in Mt we've had it pretty good for a long time. Now the Californians are moving in to escape the lunacy of california but bringing it right along with them. My dad used to say....no matter where you go, there you are.

No matter where a backwards indoctrinated muslim jihadist goes....there they are.

Exactly why I live on 50 acres on a spring fed creek 30 miles nearest town, down a dead end 6 mile gravel road and a gauntlet of weapons and friends that one must go thru to get to me......9100 sq ft of nice cabins/houses (10) generate our own power, food plots for deer and turkey and about 80,000 rounds of ammo, 30 friends and only connected by sat tv and internet.....I have to drive to top of my hill (a 250 yard driveway) to get cell service and I am talkin 1 to 2 bars on the phone......

The U.S. will fall eventually and when it falls...it will be a civil war first and then an active invasion after an initial strike......Islam will sweep the planet under the beast.....it is coming.....sooner than later IMO

 

[Sirk]

so true. But then again liberals hate christians so I think its okay with them that in muslim countries they are viewed as beneath dogs.

 

[Smoke]

Before I get to Bible verses, I must ONCE AGAIN remind you that no one said "all Muslims will kill you", but that Islam commands war against the unbelievers, and teaches that Muslims must be gathered against the Jews.

As for the Laws in the Bible, yes death is what should come of sinners. The Law on Idolatry-

Deut 13:6-10


And here is what God Himself has said to the idolaters-

Jeremiah 3:11-25


And Jesus gives us the same teaching, when given a stone to kill the adulteress woman, He tells us "he who is without sin, cast the first stone".

If you read the entirety of the bible, the context is clear. This is why you do not see Christians going out and killing sinners.

Islam, on the other hand, has clear commands to kill the unbelievers and hypocrites. And no, the context does not change if you read into it. They are clear commands to make war with the unbelievers, and to be unyielding to them. This is why there has always been a problem with murder and violence in Islam.

I just want to start out by saying that you and I interpret this portion of the bible the same. We both acknowledge that in the old covenant we were commanded to kill the unbeliever but we have different instructions now (new covenant).

This is not unlike many Muslims. They acknowledge why people think "all Muslims" believe in killing the unbelievers just like people who believe in the old testament law to this day are commanded to do the same. However, just as you and I believe in a new covenant and a new precedent created by the Savior Jesus Christ there are Muslims who believe that the passages that encourage death to the unbeliever are not for them today... That in order to understand the scripture we have to read it in context... They state the importance of understanding WHO it was written for and why.

Now, I'll be the first to admit I haven't read much from their "scriptures" nor do I wish to honestly. But I've seen Christians who accept the bible as a whole and who differ in belief from other Christians... from trivial (should we drink even a drop of alcohol) to pretty deep doctrine (the trinity). I can't put all Muslims in a box.

I appreciate you separating the individual (a Muslim not wanting to kill an unbeliever) from their faith (passage telling them to kill unbelievers not unlike our OC/OT).

 

[Dude653]

I guess you have not gotten to thew NT yet?
Jesus sets forth a new covenant there, if you have not heard.
You mentioning the OT in that context is erroneous.
In fact, if we still lived in OT times, you and probably just about every other liberal in America would be dead.

Sometimes I think the OT principals was not a bad idea...

That's kind of the point I'm trying to make. You have to look at things in their context. However I have not read the Quran so I can't really speak on. Maybe I will read it just so I can see for myself what it really says

 

[Sirk]

I just want to start out by saying that you and I interpret this portion of the bible the same. We both acknowledge that in the old covenant we were commanded to kill the unbeliever but we have different instructions now (new covenant).

This is not unlike many Muslims. They acknowledge why people think "all Muslims" believe in killing the unbelievers just like people who believe in the old testament law to this day are commanded to do the same. However, just as you and I believe in a new covenant and a new precedent created by the Savior Jesus Christ there are Muslims who believe that the passages that encourage death to the unbeliever are not for them today... That in order to understand the scripture we have to read it in context... They state the importance of understanding WHO it was written for and why.

Now, I'll be the first to admit I haven't read much from their "scriptures" nor do I wish to honestly. But I've seen Christians who accept the bible as a whole and who differ in belief from other Christians... from trivial (should we drink even a drop of alcohol) to pretty deep doctrine (the trinity). I can't put all Muslims in a box.

I appreciate you separating the individual (a Muslim not wanting to kill an unbeliever) from their faith (passage telling them to kill unbelievers not unlike our OC/OT).

Okay....but just for the sake of argument. Can you name one muslim country that treats everyone equally? Did you see the navy seal guy who asked his Iraqi counterparts what would happen to him if went into the general population? They told him that he would be kidnapped, tortured and eventually killed. He asked by who...they told him by the average Iraqi.

So the average Iraqi would kill torture you and kill you if you were in Iraq. That sort of flies in the face of what you say here.

So...if a Muslim man wearing a headscarf was walking down the street in your town...would he be treated the same? Would he be kidnapped tortured and killed? No, he wouldn't!

The middle east is a cesspool of barbarians who only understand violence and they need to be conquered and stamped out. I'm pretty sure that is exactly what the bible says that Jesus will do when He returns.

 

[Smoke]

Okay....but just for the sake of argument. Can you name one muslim country that treats everyone equally? Did you see the navy seal guy who asked his Iraqi counterparts what would happen to him if went into the general population? They told him that he would be kidnapped, tortured and eventually killed. He asked by who...they told him by the average Iraqi.

So the average Iraqi would kill torture you and kill you if you were in Iraq. That sort of flies in the face of what you say here.

So...if a Muslim man wearing a headscarf was walking down the street in your town...would he be treated the same? Would he be kidnapped tortured and killed? No, he wouldn't!

The middle east is a cesspool of barbarians who only understand violence and they need to be conquered and stamped out. I'm pretty sure that is exactly what the bible says that Jesus will do when He returns.

There will be exceptions to the rule though. I don't disagree about foreign Muslims who run an Islamic state entirely on their religious beliefs. It's why I would never allow my family to even visit those countries. Not on my watch. This is why I'm for Trump's temporary ban and "extreme vetting". I'm speaking about Muslims as a whole though (Muslims from all over the world). They aren't all the same. For someone to say that a Muslim MUST believe in killing the unbeliever if they claim to be a Muslim because their doctrine dictates it is like a Muslim telling a Christian who lives in the new covenant that we believe in killing unbelievers too. They can quote our OT scripture that commands us to do it, but we read the bible as a whole and acknowledge the OT/OC is not for us today. If a Muslim believes killing unbelievers is not for them to do today then I applaud them. It's one step closer to getting them out of that faith. I certainly don't want to accuse them of having a murderous heart when they truly don't.

 

[Magenta]

That's kind of the point I'm trying to make. You have to look at things in their context. However I have not read the Quran so I can't really speak on. Maybe I will read it just so I can see for myself what it really says

You could start here The Quran's Verses of Violence

 

[Sirk]

There will be exceptions to the rule though. I don't disagree about foreign Muslims who run an Islamic state entirely on their religious beliefs. It's why I would never allow my family to even visit those countries. Not on my watch. This is why I'm for Trump's temporary ban and "extreme vetting". I'm speaking about Muslims as a whole though (Muslims from all over the world). They aren't all the same. For someone to say that a Muslim MUST believe in killing the unbeliever if they claim to be a Muslim because their doctrine dictates it is like a Muslim telling a Christian who lives in the new covenant that we believe in killing unbelievers too. They can quote our OT scripture that commands us to do it, but we read the bible as a whole and acknowledge the OT/OC is not for us today. If a Muslim believes killing unbelievers is not for them to do today then I applaud them. It's one step closer to getting them out of that faith. I certainly don't want to accuse them of having a murderous heart when they truly don't.

But we have to be careful. I have a friend who used to bring all matter of person into his home with his wife and daughters. Didn't matter who it was or what they looked like. He'd pick them up on the side of the road or they'd be fresh out of jail or whatever. His purpose was to minister to them and share the gospel with them. One morning his wife awoke to one of them sitting next to her bed watching her as she slept. Do you think he still does that? Is that safe for his family? What if his daughter or wife was raped or murdered by one of them? Was it worth it?

 

[JosephsDreams]

Exactly why I live on 50 acres on a spring fed creek 30 miles nearest town, down a dead end 6 mile gravel road and a gauntlet of weapons and friends that one must go thru to get to me......9100 sq ft of nice cabins/houses (10) generate our own power, food plots for deer and turkey and about 80,000 rounds of ammo, 30 friends and only connected by sat tv and internet.....I have to drive to top of my hill (a 250 yard driveway) to get cell service and I am talkin 1 to 2 bars on the phone......

The U.S. will fall eventually and when it falls...it will be a civil war first and then an active invasion after an initial strike......Islam will sweep the planet under the beast.....it is coming.....sooner than later IMO

Well your set. Who knows when and how, but I think many people, maybe even a majority, agree that something is going to come down in the next x number of years.

 

[JosephsDreams]

I just want to start out by saying that you and I interpret this portion of the bible the same. We both acknowledge that in the old covenant we were commanded to kill the unbeliever but we have different instructions now (new covenant).

This is not unlike many Muslims. They acknowledge why people think "all Muslims" believe in killing the unbelievers just like people who believe in the old testament law to this day are commanded to do the same. However, just as you and I believe in a new covenant and a new precedent created by the Savior Jesus Christ there are Muslims who believe that the passages that encourage death to the unbeliever are not for them today... That in order to understand the scripture we have to read it in context... They state the importance of understanding WHO it was written for and why.

Now, I'll be the first to admit I haven't read much from their "scriptures" nor do I wish to honestly. But I've seen Christians who accept the bible as a whole and who differ in belief from other Christians... from trivial (should we drink even a drop of alcohol) to pretty deep doctrine (the trinity). I can't put all Muslims in a box.

I appreciate you separating the individual (a Muslim not wanting to kill an unbeliever) from their faith (passage telling them to kill unbelievers not unlike our OC/OT).

Its the Islamic doctrine that the last and final thoughts and writings of a particular subject are what is the most important and relevant.