REVELATION
- Thread starter CLee622
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*** he could have been a little younger--- I would guess he was 28 when Jesus died--- so he was around 90 --- Revelation was written around 90 A.D.
It's assumed that John was imprisoned on Patmos when writing the revelation:
"Tradition" - he may have been imprisoned there but that can't be ascertained from his writing:
Rev 1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
It's quite possible he visited Patmos to preach the word at a much earlier time than his "traditional" imprisonment, he could quite easily have said "I was imprisoned/banished for the word of God" if that was the case.
"Tradition" - he may have been imprisoned there but that can't be ascertained from his writing:
Rev 1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
It's quite possible he visited Patmos to preach the word at a much earlier time than his "traditional" imprisonment, he could quite easily have said "I was imprisoned/banished for the word of God" if that was the case.
***Irenaeus (A.D. 180)---placed the writing of the book of Revelation near the end of the reign of Domitian who died in 95 A.D.----- also when you consider the spiritual condition of the 7 Churches (chapters 2 & 3) it is more in line with this later dating... article by Wayne Jackson---"When Was the Book of Revelation Written?"
Just to keep it in the Book of Revelation theme----I do believe in the Rapture, but unless we (the Church) can pull America back--(God's extreme Mercy) I feel God is going to intervene and when He does it will not be pretty---God will "allow" stuff to happen just like He does with backsliders----this Country will Shake like you cannot believe---I believe we are on a short time table and my prayer for the last month has been what Mercy God show us in the next few years will be "deep enough"---if not---judgment...
"Roman Prisoners
According to Pliny and Tacitus, the Romans often sent their prisoners to islands. Tacitus mentions three islands in the Sporades by name: Donusa, Gyarus, and Amorgus. That Patmos was not listed indicates that it was not a primary place for imprisonment at this time. It is not clear if John was imprisoned on Patmos or banished here to live."
Source:
Patmos (BiblePlaces.com) – BiblePlaces.com
According to Pliny and Tacitus, the Romans often sent their prisoners to islands. Tacitus mentions three islands in the Sporades by name: Donusa, Gyarus, and Amorgus. That Patmos was not listed indicates that it was not a primary place for imprisonment at this time. It is not clear if John was imprisoned on Patmos or banished here to live."
Source:
Patmos (BiblePlaces.com) – BiblePlaces.com
So tell me what it meansI only say those things because of what scripture itself says. Not because I'm making something up. What this thread is for. Let's have it then!
CLee622.... the woman you speak of is Israel as you stated... Look to Genesis 3:15 KJV ..the same.
The first chapter of Revelation is the Revelation of Jesus Christ.
The second and third chapters contain Letters written by Jesus Christ to the seven churches. The churches represent down through the ages the churches, denominations, other. The letters tell us all what is to become of each if they do not heed Jesus' warnings (if any).
Chapter 4 begins with John finding himself in Heaven. What he see is the throne and those around it. The elders represent the church that was Raptured. It is funny that the Church in chapters 1-3 is mentions 19 times. From chapters 4 thru 22, the Church is mentioned zero times. In Chapter 4, God turns his attention to Israel and HER people.
Now this is a beginning, do you have a specific question?
America is the key to the beast kingdom coming about.
The Bible says there is a certain nation that is responsible for causing the world to come together,that has the Babylonian spirit,religious diversity,anything goes multiculturism,that did trade with the whole world,lived deliciously,mingled herself with the seed of men,her sins have reached unto heaven,and would have the most influence in the world,and if you look at the nations of the world it is obvious who it is.
America does more to the cause of the beast kingdom coming about than any other nation,but they did not know to call it America,but she will have the Babylonian spirit,which even Babylon had a high revelation of God,which king Nebuchadnezzar proclaimed throughout his kingdom to acknowledge the God of Israel,for He is the God of gods,the greatest God,which Babylon rode on eagle's wings,but when king Nebuchadnezzar died his son blew it by taking the vessels out of the temple of the LORD,and praising false gods,and the kingdom stripped from them,and the eagle's wings were plucked,they lost the revelation of God,and they were made to stand upon the feet of a man,and a man's heart was given to them,they would then be known as the kingdom of man.
America does more to the cause of the beast kingdom coming about than any other nation,how can they be dismissed from being in the Bible.
1.Helped advance,advanced travel,and technology,which is needed to cause the world to be able to communicate with each other to come together.
2.Has religious diversity,and multiculturism,showing that all nations can get along despite their differences in their own country,which on the back of the dollar bill,out of many,one,which is necessary to further cause the world to come together.
3.Lives deliciously,and in pleasure,and there is no other nation on earth that lives as good as America,where even the homeless has it better than some people have it in other countries,being able to get help if they seek it,and can rise from that and be a millionaire,for it is possible,and catches people up in the flesh,and causes hypocrisy among people that say the Bible is true,not holding a high standard,as they allow worldliness galore,fleshy entertainment,idleness instead of being constructive,alcohol,drugs,cigarettes,pornography, homosexuality,and all around anything goes,which is needed to get the world to come together,causing people to depart from the Bible,hypocritical,and causes high selfishness,and arrogance,to where it affects the children to not obey parents,which children honoring their parents is the first commandment with promise,and breaks up families with their sinful ways that influence people.
4.Mingled themselves with the seed of men,which no other nation on earth does that to the degree of America,showing the world that all are accepted,and everybody can get along despite their differences,which is needed for world to come together for America makes them more compatible,and displays our differences should not matter.
5.Did trade with the world,World Trade Center,New York,United Nations headquarters,New York.
A lot of people do not understand the purpose of America,and once you know the purpose then you will know what is going on.
The purpose of America,and there is other nations along with them,but America influences the most,and they like it that way,is to bring back the old type systems like Egypt,Babylon,and mainly the lost city of Atlantis,where they believe in Atlantis they had occult powers but lost them through time,and they want to restore a type of kingdom based on the old systems that were in to the occult,nature worship,and witchcraft,where they had the soothsayers,and monthly prognosticators,wizards,magicians,stargazers,astrologers,and general all around harnessing nature for power.
They want to produce the New Age Christ which they do not believe he will help mankind until the nations agree to come together as one,and work together for peace on earth,and they believe that when he helps mankind that he will restore the hidden mysteries of the past,and they will get back the occult powers of the past,mainly the lost city of Atlantis.
On the back of the dollar bill it reads,announcing the conception of a new order of the ages,and they identify with the Egyptian pyramid,as well as the inner circle of freemasonry,for they are in to the occult,and things of that nature.
You can say they want to establish the New Atlantis,and bring back all the occult powers that they had in the past,for they favor that type of system better than the one now,and they had to do what they had to do to make it happen,for they are not what they appear to be at all times,but the Bible says that the man of sin will cause craft to prosper,and spread his occult ways through the entire earth,so sooner or later it has to happen,and God said He is going to gather all nations together,their governments,and the people that follow them,for they will be people of a baser sort then,so America cannot escape that,and there will be people in power over America that will dedicate to the cause of the occult being established worldwide.
So if all nations cannot escape,and will eventually be in support of the occult,America will be too,but people can easily see that America has more to do with it than any other nation on earth.
The Bible says there is a certain nation that is responsible for causing the world to come together,that has the Babylonian spirit,religious diversity,anything goes multiculturism,that did trade with the whole world,lived deliciously,mingled herself with the seed of men,her sins have reached unto heaven,and would have the most influence in the world,and if you look at the nations of the world it is obvious who it is.
America does more to the cause of the beast kingdom coming about than any other nation,but they did not know to call it America,but she will have the Babylonian spirit,which even Babylon had a high revelation of God,which king Nebuchadnezzar proclaimed throughout his kingdom to acknowledge the God of Israel,for He is the God of gods,the greatest God,which Babylon rode on eagle's wings,but when king Nebuchadnezzar died his son blew it by taking the vessels out of the temple of the LORD,and praising false gods,and the kingdom stripped from them,and the eagle's wings were plucked,they lost the revelation of God,and they were made to stand upon the feet of a man,and a man's heart was given to them,they would then be known as the kingdom of man.
America does more to the cause of the beast kingdom coming about than any other nation,how can they be dismissed from being in the Bible.
1.Helped advance,advanced travel,and technology,which is needed to cause the world to be able to communicate with each other to come together.
2.Has religious diversity,and multiculturism,showing that all nations can get along despite their differences in their own country,which on the back of the dollar bill,out of many,one,which is necessary to further cause the world to come together.
3.Lives deliciously,and in pleasure,and there is no other nation on earth that lives as good as America,where even the homeless has it better than some people have it in other countries,being able to get help if they seek it,and can rise from that and be a millionaire,for it is possible,and catches people up in the flesh,and causes hypocrisy among people that say the Bible is true,not holding a high standard,as they allow worldliness galore,fleshy entertainment,idleness instead of being constructive,alcohol,drugs,cigarettes,pornography, homosexuality,and all around anything goes,which is needed to get the world to come together,causing people to depart from the Bible,hypocritical,and causes high selfishness,and arrogance,to where it affects the children to not obey parents,which children honoring their parents is the first commandment with promise,and breaks up families with their sinful ways that influence people.
4.Mingled themselves with the seed of men,which no other nation on earth does that to the degree of America,showing the world that all are accepted,and everybody can get along despite their differences,which is needed for world to come together for America makes them more compatible,and displays our differences should not matter.
5.Did trade with the world,World Trade Center,New York,United Nations headquarters,New York.
A lot of people do not understand the purpose of America,and once you know the purpose then you will know what is going on.
The purpose of America,and there is other nations along with them,but America influences the most,and they like it that way,is to bring back the old type systems like Egypt,Babylon,and mainly the lost city of Atlantis,where they believe in Atlantis they had occult powers but lost them through time,and they want to restore a type of kingdom based on the old systems that were in to the occult,nature worship,and witchcraft,where they had the soothsayers,and monthly prognosticators,wizards,magicians,stargazers,astrologers,and general all around harnessing nature for power.
They want to produce the New Age Christ which they do not believe he will help mankind until the nations agree to come together as one,and work together for peace on earth,and they believe that when he helps mankind that he will restore the hidden mysteries of the past,and they will get back the occult powers of the past,mainly the lost city of Atlantis.
On the back of the dollar bill it reads,announcing the conception of a new order of the ages,and they identify with the Egyptian pyramid,as well as the inner circle of freemasonry,for they are in to the occult,and things of that nature.
You can say they want to establish the New Atlantis,and bring back all the occult powers that they had in the past,for they favor that type of system better than the one now,and they had to do what they had to do to make it happen,for they are not what they appear to be at all times,but the Bible says that the man of sin will cause craft to prosper,and spread his occult ways through the entire earth,so sooner or later it has to happen,and God said He is going to gather all nations together,their governments,and the people that follow them,for they will be people of a baser sort then,so America cannot escape that,and there will be people in power over America that will dedicate to the cause of the occult being established worldwide.
So if all nations cannot escape,and will eventually be in support of the occult,America will be too,but people can easily see that America has more to do with it than any other nation on earth.
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Look at Chapter 4 of Revelation--- the Rapture takes place---- come up hither ( verse1)---- things that happen during the Tribulation (things which must be hereafter)-----notice the 24 elders are robed and crowned--- they represent 12 Old Testament and 12 New Testament leaders----this also points to the Rapture having taken place---robed and crowned ( verse 4)...
Greetings JesusRules1
Though this would appear to be a very convincing post, America is not Mystery, Babylon the great, the woman who rides the beast. God has provided pertinent characteristics, which we must apply in order to arrive at a proper conclusion as to the woman's identity.
1). The woman you saw is that great city that rules over the kings of the earth
At the time that John was receiving this information from the angel, Rome was that city that ruled over the kings of the, then known world. America would not come into existence for another 1600 years. In addition, the scripture specifies that the woman is a city, where America is a nation.
2). This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits. 10They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for only a little while. 11The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.
The seven heads are seven hills upon which the woman sits:
In the scripture above, the seven heads of the beast are symbolic representing seven hills on which the woman sits. Since we have already seen that the woman is a city, then combined with the scripture above, she is a city that sits on seven hills. Again, America is neither a city nor does it sit on seven hills. Rome was literally build on and is famous for her seven hills.
The seven heads are also seven kings
Regarding these kings, the angel tells John the following:
* Five have fallen = five kings have already ruled and gone
* One is = king number six was currently ruling at the time that John was receiving this information
* The other has not yet come, but when he does come he must remain only for a little while = King number seven was future to John and in the past to us.
The fact that America did not even exist at the time that the angel was revealing this information and that five of those kings had already ruled and gone and that king number six was currently ruling, tells us that this could not be referring to America, but to an existing city at the time that John was receiving this information.
"With her the kings of the earth committed adultery, and the inhabitants of the earth were intoxicated with the wine of her adulteries.”
That the kings of the earth commit adultery with the woman is obviously not speaking of literal adultery, but spiritual adultery, just as it was said of Israel when she worshiped the god's of the nations around them. She was said to be an adulterous people, playing the prostitute. Here in the verse above, that the kings of the earth commit adultery with her, the figurative meaning according to Strong's is "to be unfaithful to Christ, while posing as His true follower." The same applies for the inhabitants of the world who are said to be intoxicated with the wine of her adulteries i.e. they engage in her adulterous practices. Therefore, the woman represents a city that is also the headquarters of a religious system.
Rome is that city that sits on seven hills. Rome/Vatican is that counterfeit church whose religious practices contain those of the mystery religions of Babylon.
Queen of Heaven worship: Transposed upon Mary
Mother and son worship: Transposed upon Mary and Jesus
The Eucharist: Resembles Mithraism with the belief that Jesus enters the wafer with transubstantiation taking place, where they believe that they are literally eating the flesh and blood of the Lord. According to their doma, if anyone says that the receiving of the Eucharist is only symbolic and not the literal flesh and blood of the Lord, then let them be anathema.
The Miter hat: The pope, as well as the bishops, wear the Miter hat, which stems from the priests who worshiped Dagon, the fish god.
The woman was dressed in purple and scarlet:
Purple and scarlet are the colors worn by Rome's bishops and cardinals.
That all of this information is pointing to Rome, is meant to point us to the Rome's Vatican, the headquarters of her, adulterous, counterfeit church and her Babylonian religious beliefs and practices. Constantine was Rome's first Pope, not Peter. Because of this, the seat of the pope holds both political and religious authority. According to Roman Catholicism, they alone are the true church and everyone outside is a heretic and lost. Their counsels and dogmas require all people to belong to the RCC and to come under the authority of the pope.
For hundreds of years, Pope's controlled kings and wielded their armies under the threat of ex-communication or anathema. Since the late 1700's they have not had the power to enforce their counsels, dogmas and catechism's upon the inhabitants of the earth. But when that antichrist comes, I believe that he will provide the pope of that time with the power to enforce his authority upon the inhabitants of the earth as taking on the part of the false prophet.
Currently there are over 1.2 billion Catholics. You can image what will happen when that pope/false prophet begins to perform those satanic miracles, signs and wonders on behalf of the beast. Those who are devout will become even more devout and those false christian sects in the world will be deceived because of those miraculous signs and will merge with that last day, one world religious system,with the pope/false prophet as its leader.
Rome with her Mystery Babylon headquarters, which sits on seven hills, is the woman who rides the beast.
Though this would appear to be a very convincing post, America is not Mystery, Babylon the great, the woman who rides the beast. God has provided pertinent characteristics, which we must apply in order to arrive at a proper conclusion as to the woman's identity.
1). The woman you saw is that great city that rules over the kings of the earth
At the time that John was receiving this information from the angel, Rome was that city that ruled over the kings of the, then known world. America would not come into existence for another 1600 years. In addition, the scripture specifies that the woman is a city, where America is a nation.
2). This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits. 10They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for only a little while. 11The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.
The seven heads are seven hills upon which the woman sits:
In the scripture above, the seven heads of the beast are symbolic representing seven hills on which the woman sits. Since we have already seen that the woman is a city, then combined with the scripture above, she is a city that sits on seven hills. Again, America is neither a city nor does it sit on seven hills. Rome was literally build on and is famous for her seven hills.
The seven heads are also seven kings
Regarding these kings, the angel tells John the following:
* Five have fallen = five kings have already ruled and gone
* One is = king number six was currently ruling at the time that John was receiving this information
* The other has not yet come, but when he does come he must remain only for a little while = King number seven was future to John and in the past to us.
The fact that America did not even exist at the time that the angel was revealing this information and that five of those kings had already ruled and gone and that king number six was currently ruling, tells us that this could not be referring to America, but to an existing city at the time that John was receiving this information.
"With her the kings of the earth committed adultery, and the inhabitants of the earth were intoxicated with the wine of her adulteries.”
That the kings of the earth commit adultery with the woman is obviously not speaking of literal adultery, but spiritual adultery, just as it was said of Israel when she worshiped the god's of the nations around them. She was said to be an adulterous people, playing the prostitute. Here in the verse above, that the kings of the earth commit adultery with her, the figurative meaning according to Strong's is "to be unfaithful to Christ, while posing as His true follower." The same applies for the inhabitants of the world who are said to be intoxicated with the wine of her adulteries i.e. they engage in her adulterous practices. Therefore, the woman represents a city that is also the headquarters of a religious system.
Rome is that city that sits on seven hills. Rome/Vatican is that counterfeit church whose religious practices contain those of the mystery religions of Babylon.
Queen of Heaven worship: Transposed upon Mary
Mother and son worship: Transposed upon Mary and Jesus
The Eucharist: Resembles Mithraism with the belief that Jesus enters the wafer with transubstantiation taking place, where they believe that they are literally eating the flesh and blood of the Lord. According to their doma, if anyone says that the receiving of the Eucharist is only symbolic and not the literal flesh and blood of the Lord, then let them be anathema.
The Miter hat: The pope, as well as the bishops, wear the Miter hat, which stems from the priests who worshiped Dagon, the fish god.
The woman was dressed in purple and scarlet:
Purple and scarlet are the colors worn by Rome's bishops and cardinals.
That all of this information is pointing to Rome, is meant to point us to the Rome's Vatican, the headquarters of her, adulterous, counterfeit church and her Babylonian religious beliefs and practices. Constantine was Rome's first Pope, not Peter. Because of this, the seat of the pope holds both political and religious authority. According to Roman Catholicism, they alone are the true church and everyone outside is a heretic and lost. Their counsels and dogmas require all people to belong to the RCC and to come under the authority of the pope.
For hundreds of years, Pope's controlled kings and wielded their armies under the threat of ex-communication or anathema. Since the late 1700's they have not had the power to enforce their counsels, dogmas and catechism's upon the inhabitants of the earth. But when that antichrist comes, I believe that he will provide the pope of that time with the power to enforce his authority upon the inhabitants of the earth as taking on the part of the false prophet.
Currently there are over 1.2 billion Catholics. You can image what will happen when that pope/false prophet begins to perform those satanic miracles, signs and wonders on behalf of the beast. Those who are devout will become even more devout and those false christian sects in the world will be deceived because of those miraculous signs and will merge with that last day, one world religious system,with the pope/false prophet as its leader.
Rome with her Mystery Babylon headquarters, which sits on seven hills, is the woman who rides the beast.
I think he probably came out screaching...
I read somewhere that he was going to be boiled in oil but was exiled to Patmos instead