forgive future sin? Matt 18: 21,

[eternally-gratefull]

1 John 3:6
​

New International Version
No one who lives in him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen him or known him.

New Living Translation
Anyone who continues to live in him will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is.

English Standard Version
No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him.

Berean Study Bible
No one who remains in Him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has seen Him or known Him.

1 John 3:9
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New International Version
No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.

New Living Translation
Those who have been born into God's family do not make a practice of sinning, because God's life is in them. So they can't keep on sinning, because they are children of God.

English Standard Version
No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God.

Berean Study Bible
Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin, because God's seed abides in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.

Berean Literal Bible
Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God.


New American Standard Bible 4Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness. 5You know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin. 6No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him. 7Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; 8the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil. 9No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious:anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

The subject? Practicing sin. Who? Anyone. Saint or sinner.

Christians should not practice sinning. They will fall into sin, trip over a stumbling block & sin, sometimes are deceived & sin, but they shouldn't practice sin.

Barnes' Notes on the Bible
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin - This passage must either mean that they who are born of God, that is, who are true Christians, do not sin habitually and characteristically, or that everyone who is a true Christian is absolutely perfect, and never commits any sin. If it can be used as referring to the doctrine of absolute perfection at all, it proves, not that Christians may be perfect, or that a "portion" of them are, but that all are. But who can maintain this? Who can believe that John meant to affirm this? Nothing can be clearer than that the passage has not this meaning, and that John did not teach a doctrine so contrary to the current strain of the Scriptures, and to fact; and if he did not teach this, then in this whole passage he refers to those who are habitually and characteristically righteous.

See how dishonest people can be, they focus on a few words.. and reject the context.

John said plainly ,No one who continues in sin has ever seen him or known him. Is it that hard to understand?

Stephen has a problem.

He either teaches sinless perfection. to make the two passages agree, or he causes a contradition in what he is claiming.

Which is it?

 

[Stephen63]

All works of the flesh are "willful" sinning. When we have outbursts of anger - we are actively participating in it. The same goes for all the works of the flesh from malice, the slandering others in the body of Christ to hypocrisy, living a homosexual lifestyle, causing strife and division...etc.

The "willful sinning" talked about in Hebrews 10 is about the Hebrews going back to the temple for their sins being dealt with and thus rejecting the sacrifice of Christ for the forgiveness of sins. This is why there remains no more sacrifice for their sins because they are rejecting Christ's work.

Works-based believers like to try to use Hebrews 10 to bring fear to Christians but the reality is that we are safe in Christ's finished work on the cross and resurrection. There are many warnings which we should heed about living from the flesh and the destruction it brings in this life but that is a different subject then Hebrews 10.

Hebrews was written to Jewish christians, and, since it was written to christians, christians should obey the teachings of it.

How can you make one book mean it was specifically for one group?

Are the books written to Corinth just for them? Galatians? Ephesians? Philippians?

It's foolish to make a single determination of one book, & excuse all the rest.

Hebrews also state emphatically that christians can lose their salvation.

 

[Embankment]

I agree. And there is a difference between forgiving others and God forgiving us because of the blood of Jesus. We have the "Forgiver" inside of us and we in the New Covenant after the cross and resurrection forgive others because we have been forgiven.

Ephesians 4:32 (NASB)
[SUP]32 [/SUP] Be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also has forgiven you.


Colossians 3:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you.


Colossians 2:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions,

1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.

In This passage about forgiving 70x7
Jesus was explaining that it is not in someone's heart the ability to truly forgive someone. Most people can't see that. Everyone believes they could overlook something one or two times and be doing good.. To make the point clear, Jesus says, forgive someone infinite number of times? We can see we can't do that. Showing we are guilty before God and need a savior.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Hebrews was written to Jewish christians, and, since it was written to christians, christians should obey the teachings of it.

How can you make one book mean it was specifically for one group?

Are the books written to Corinth just for them? Galatians? Ephesians? Philippians?

It's foolish to make a single determination of one book, & excuse all the rest.

Hebrews also state emphatically that christians can lose their salvation.

Grace did not say it was written just to hebrews.

GRACE DESERVE AN APPOLOGY!! (the second time you have slandered today)

Hebrews does not teach salvation can be lost.. It would contradict Jesus..

 

[FreeNChrist]

Hebrews was written to Jewish christians, and, since it was written to christians, christians should obey the teachings of it.

How can you make one book mean it was specifically for one group?

Are the books written to Corinth just for them? Galatians? Ephesians? Philippians?

It's foolish to make a single determination of one book, & excuse all the rest.

Hebrews also state emphatically that christians can lose their salvation.

......Nonsense.

 

[zone]

 

[Grace777x70]

Grace did not say it was written just to hebrews.

GRACE DESERVE AN APPOLOGY!! (the second time you have slandered today)

Hebrews does not teach salvation can be lost.. It would contradict Jesus..

Naw...I don't need an apology. I expect things to be "twisted" by some. People are free to believe what they want. I just leave them in the hands of the Lord.

Even if they want to believe that Daffy Duck and Donald Duck are the 2 witnesses in the book of Revelation - then that is between them and the Lord. I would however say that I don't believe "in the birds" theory.

Just ignore these types and speak what we believe to be true in the gospel. All is well. The Lord will sort it all out. We can trust Him....

 

[trofimus]

Math 18:[SUP] 21 [/SUP]Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?”[SUP] 22 [/SUP]Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.

Is Not God telling Peter to forgive his brother for sins his brother has not even committed against him (future sin) yet? Since he is telling him to forgive his brother 70 X 7?

Thoughts?

Are there any other verses which you can think of which show God telling us to forgive others of not only past sin but future?

and finally, Would God asked us to do something he himself does not do?

Yeah, the problem of time always confuses me a little. Past, present, future, everything is one, its only our perception that makes it distinct from each other.

So to your question - yes, future included. And God sees us changed after we repent. Past included. Confusing right? But true.

 

[Enow]

How bout the readers digest version of all that?

You mean the Cliff Note's version?

Jesus did not command His disciples to forgive others if there was no danger of the Father not forgiving them. So there is an ongoing act of forgiving others as God the Father does to us.

Matthew 6:[SUP]9 [/SUP]After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.[SUP]10 [/SUP]Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.[SUP]11 [/SUP]Give us this day our daily bread.[SUP]12 [/SUP]And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.[SUP]13 [/SUP]And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.[SUP]14 [/SUP]For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:[SUP]15 [/SUP]But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

So asking Jesus and the Father to forgive you is not asking Jesus to die on the cross again to save you. It is all about maintaining proper fellowship with the Father the Son, of Whom the Father will always be the Father to you, no matter what.

 

[FreeNChrist]

You mean the Cliff Note's version?

Jesus did not command His disciples to forgive others if there was no danger of the Father not forgiving them. So there is an ongoing act of forgiving others as God the Father does to us.

Matthew 6:[SUP]9 [/SUP]After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.[SUP]10 [/SUP]Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.[SUP]11 [/SUP]Give us this day our daily bread.[SUP]12 [/SUP]And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.[SUP]13 [/SUP]And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.[SUP]14 [/SUP]For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:[SUP]15 [/SUP]But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

So asking Jesus and the Father to forgive you is not asking Jesus to die on the cross again to save you. It is all about maintaining proper fellowship with the Father the Son, of Whom the Father will always be the Father to you, no matter what.

I'll ask you the same question I asked another, why ask God for what you already have?

 

[lastofall]

sins are past when they are repented of, otherwise they remain left untouched without remission.

 

[Desertsrose]

​

Math 18:[SUP] 21 [/SUP]Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?”[SUP] 22 [/SUP]Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.

Is Not God telling Peter to forgive his brother for sins his brother has not even committed against him (future sin) yet? Since he is telling him to forgive his brother 70 X 7?

Thoughts?

Are there any other verses which you can think of which show God telling us to forgive others of not only past sin but future?

and finally, Would God asked us to do something he himself does not do?

No, this is incorrect. If we read with more context it becomes a little more clear. You're not automatically forgiven. Steps are taken first. The person must acknowledge their sin and ask for forgiveness.

Matthew 18:15-17

“If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector

.

And here's an example of someone pleading for forgiveness and the one offended doesn't forgive. Not a pretty sight.

Matthew 18:23-35
“For this reason the kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who wished to settle accounts with his slaves. When he had begun to settle them, one who owed him ten thousand talents was brought to him.

But since he did not have the means to repay, his lord commanded him to be sold, along with his wife and children and all that he had, and repayment to be made. So the slave fell to the ground and prostrated himself before him, saying, ‘Have patience with me and I will repay you everything.’

And the lord of that slave felt compassion and released him and forgave him the debt. But that slave went out and found one of his fellow slaves who owed him a hundred denarii; and he seized him and began to choke him, saying, ‘Pay back what you owe.’ So his fellow slave fell to the ground and began to plead with him, saying, ‘Have patience with me and I will repay you.’

But he was unwilling and went and threw him in prison until he should pay back what was owed. So when his fellow slaves saw what had happened, they were deeply grieved and came and reported to their lord all that had happened.

Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’

And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

When the person comes and asks for forgiveness, we must forgive just as Jesus forgives us when we go before Him and ask for forgiveness, confessing our sin. You're not cleansed of unrighteousness until you do confess.

If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

 

[FreeNChrist]

sins are past when they are repented of, otherwise they remain left untouched without remission.

How's your eyesight? (2 Peter 1:9)

 

[FreeNChrist]

​

No, this is incorrect. If we read with more context it becomes a little more clear. You're not automatically forgiven. Steps are taken first. The person must acknowledge their sin and ask for forgiveness.

.

And here's an example of someone pleading for forgiveness and the one offended doesn't forgive. Not a pretty sight.



And the lord of that slave felt compassion and released him and forgave him the debt. But that slave went out and found one of his fellow slaves who owed him a hundred denarii; and he seized him and began to choke him, saying, ‘Pay back what you owe.’ So his fellow slave fell to the ground and began to plead with him, saying, ‘Have patience with me and I will repay you.’

But he was unwilling and went and threw him in prison until he should pay back what was owed. So when his fellow slaves saw what had happened, they were deeply grieved and came and reported to their lord all that had happened.

Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’

And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

When the person comes and asks for forgiveness, we must forgive just as Jesus forgives us when we go before Him and ask for forgiveness, confessing our sin. You're not cleansed of unrighteousness until you do confess.

Have you considered the Cross??

 

[Enow]

Hebrews was written to Jewish christians, and, since it was written to christians, christians should obey the teachings of it.

The only thing a believer is to obey is to believe in Him for all things... to live as His and not just for salvation because the just shall live by faith in Him & all His promises to us in getting to know Him.

How can you make one book mean it was specifically for one group?

It is not, but often times than not, people ignore aligning all the scripture in the N.T. up with one another to see the truth in His words of what He is actually meaning.

Are the books written to Corinth just for them? Galatians? Ephesians? Philippians?

For Jews & Gentiles....

It's foolish to make a single determination of one book, & excuse all the rest.

Hebrews also state emphatically that christians can lose their salvation.

Now you are doing the same thing when John 6:39 says He will lose none of all the Father has given Him.

1 Timothy 4:1-2 testify that some believers will fall away from the faith, meaning, they had faith in Him, but had departed from that faith in Him. 2 Timothy 2nd chapter speaks of former believers where He still abides in them even if they are in iniquity that denies Him ( 2 Timothy 2:12-13 ) or no longer believe in Him any more ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) even though they still have His seal.

This is why God will judge His House first at the pre trib rapture event ( 1 Peter 4:17-19 ) as this will separate the vessel unto honor that is being received to the Marriage Supper from the vessels unto dishonor to be received later on.

So obviously, you are not reading the Book of Hebrew rightly in applying His words.

Hebrews 10th chapter is about how that one sacrifice for sins was enough, and yet if believers sin willfully after having that knowledge and still believe they need another sacrifice for sins or to keep receiving that same sacrifice for sins....then they are disgracing the blood of the New Covenant to treat the blood of the Son of God on par with the blood of goats and bulls that could never take away sins... then God will judge "His people" as they are still "His people".

I cannot convince you of that; only God can, but that is how modern believers today read Hebrews 10th chapter as if sinning willfully was about any other kinds of sins when it was really about rejecting the truth that there is no more need for another sacrifice for sins when they seek it in the Mass or in communion when communion is supposed to be done ONLY in remembrance of Him.

Hebrews 6th chapter is about how no one saved can be saved again as in, no one born again can be born again. Once that foundation is laid, it cannot be undone, but what we build on that foundation will be judged ( 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 ) just as in Hebrews, the metaphors of life from the rain has been given to the plants and has grown that it cannot be undone, but briars and thickets have grown that will be done away with. If you read the beginning of that chapter as to why those in repentance need not again be baptized by water or go through the ordinances that new believers go through because it is not necessary when they are already saved. That is why it is impossible, because Jesus is not going to crucify Himself again when any brother has been led to repentance, because he is still a brother, having His seal.

But again, only He can help you see the meaning of His words in Hebrews as lining up with the rest of scripture that no one can lose their salvation, but not every one is looking to Jesus Christ as their Good Shepherd to run that race by helping them lay aside every weight & sin to abide in Him.

May God cause the increase...

 

[Desertsrose]

Have you considered the Cross??

Amen, and only the cross. This is John the apostle speaking after the cross. Shall I rip John's teaching from the scriptures? And shall I rip our Lord's own words as well?

 

[FreeNChrist]

Amen, and only the cross. This is John the apostle speaking after the cross. Shall I rip John's teaching from the scriptures? And shall I rip our Lord's own words as well?

You mean this John?

1 John 2:12 - "I am writing to you, dear children, because your sins have been forgiven on account of His name."

 

[seed_time_harvest]

So does this brother who sins against the person have to repent and ask for forgiveness? Or, is it all good?

Under grace
1.)Love GOD.
2.)Love your neighbor.

When your neighbor has been offended,go to your neighbor and make It right.

 

[p_rehbein]

Well...........yes...........uh, er, and NO

After the death, burial and resurrection of Christ, and HIS payment for the sins of man on the cross, the PAYMENT FOR ALL SINS WAS PAID.

Sins ARE NOT FORGIVEN until the sinner REPENTS, ASKS FOR FORGIVENESS, and THEN AND THEN ONLY IS THE BLOOD APPLIED! The idea that everyone's sins are ALREADY FORGIVEN is such a dangerous teaching as to lead many a person astray, and apart from God.

THE PRICE FOR THE FORGIVENESS OF SIN IS ALREADY PAID...........ONCE..........FOR ALL TIME, but------if the sinner DOES NOT repent and ask for forgiveness.............HE IS NOT SAVED, NOR ARE HIS SINS FORGIVEN. He will DIE IN HIS SINS, and be lost for all eternity.

People need to understand this........or risk eternal damnation.

I think the point is being missed here with all the bickering.
Before Jesus paid the price for our sin no sin was forgiven. After Jesus paid the price with death and resurrection all sins are forgiven.

 

[FreeNChrist]

Well...........yes...........uh, er, and NO

After the death, burial and resurrection of Christ, and HIS payment for the sins of man on the cross, the PAYMENT FOR ALL SINS WAS PAID.

Sins ARE NOT FORGIVEN until the sinner REPENTS, ASKS FOR FORGIVENESS, and THEN AND THEN ONLY IS THE BLOOD APPLIED! The idea that everyone's sins are ALREADY FORGIVEN is such a dangerous teaching as to lead many a person astray, and apart from God.

THE PRICE FOR THE FORGIVENESS OF SIN IS ALREADY PAID...........ONCE..........FOR ALL TIME, but------if the sinner DOES NOT repent and ask for forgiveness.............HE IS NOT SAVED, NOR ARE HIS SINS FORGIVEN. He will DIE IN HIS SINS, and be lost for all eternity.

People need to understand this........or risk eternal damnation.

Colossians 2:13
"When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins"