Sermon on the mount - life or legalistic junk

[PeterJens]

Acts 15:8 - So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, 9 and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

Amen
Therefore, since we have these promises, dear friends, let us purify ourselves from everything that contaminates body and spirit, perfecting holiness out of reverence for God.
2 Cor 7:1

Now that you have purified yourselves by obeying the truth so that you have sincere love for each other, love one another deeply, from the heart.
1 Peter 1:22

But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.
1 John 1:7

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
1 John 1:9

So there is an element of coming to faith, and what we do.
Walking in the light, obeying the truth, not doing things that contaminate us,
confessing our sins.

And our experience is our learnt behaviours, often lead us into lusts of the flesh,
and though in coming to faith much has been cleansed there is still much for us
to work through and resolve.

So Amen let us strive to live pure clean lives, Amen.

 

[Grandpa]

Do you remember that song back in the 90's 'No you Never gonna get it, never never gonna get it, You never gonna get it' ???

Why is it when I read certain peoples posts that song starts playing in my head?

 

[Ariel82]

Do you remember that song back in the 90's 'No you Never gonna get it, never never gonna get it, You never gonna get it' ???

Why is it when I read certain peoples posts that song starts playing in my head?

Because there is a voice that would like to think itself more powerful than God.

With God anything is possible, even those things we think will never happen: like someone truly understanding the gospel message.

 

[Jimbone]

Do you remember that song back in the 90's 'No you Never gonna get it, never never gonna get it, You never gonna get it' ???

Why is it when I read certain peoples posts that song starts playing in my head?

That's pretty vague. What exactly does "whoever" not get? I don't really care about the name, but what is the correction for whatever "thing" that they don't get? I'd like to know exactly what false teaching you are referring to.

 

[PeterJens]

That's pretty vague. What exactly does "whoever" not get? I don't really care about the name, but what is the correction for whatever "thing" that they don't get? I'd like to know exactly what false teaching you are referring to.

It is a kind of mockery, if you do not see just believe in Christ and all is
sorted faith, they regard as something too good to be true to be accepted
by many, so we are never going to get it.

It is the idea salvation is everything, rather than Jesus and communion with
Him is everything which they never seem get, ironic that...

 

[truthhurts]

Maybe you can't see reality here because you don't want to. Everything good that can happen to a human has happened because of the gracious(grace) acts of God. There is no balance with faith because faith comes from the graciousness of God. You do not produce your own faith any more then you produce your own body, we are given a measure of faith, we are given a Savior, we are given love, we are given a kingdom...all because of the grace of God that is an expression of His love for mankind.

Funny thing about grace only theologians like you, you always have to get personal and say silly and childish things to guys like me , like we don't get it because we don't want to get it and our reality is wrong.

Throw out faith as a condition to receive anything, including salvation from God and you will not please God, because the Bible clearly tells you without faith it is impossible to please him...

The hardest truth for grace only theologians like yourself is understanding that GRACE is God's part and FAITH in what he has given us already, even his son, is our part...There is always a GOD part and MAN part...God is covenant God...not a sugar daddy that loves us so much he gives us everything without question or needing anything back from us.

Even salvation must be appropriated through the GOD part and the MAN part. Jesus paid it and did it all for us, we never earn our salvation, or lose it like a set of car keys, when we miss the mark as a saint...however we must receive that sacrifice and grace through faith on our part. This is what Romans 1-4 is all about and it cannot be denied. Did it ever occur to you that faith is really the heart and matter of free will? You chose to or not to believe...that is faith and trust.

The prodigal son would have never went home unless he had the faith he would be received at least as a servant.

Saying grace alone saves you is a doctrine of devils, because it removes faith, which removes truth, which removes, heart induced belief.

Grace alone theology is simply mental assent and not a godly sorrow which produces repentance without regret leading to salvation, it is a worldly sorrow that leads to death and turns the grace of God into licentiousness and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.

 

[truthhurts]

The truth is without the grace of God in Christ - no one would be saved.

The grace of God is a manifestation of His great love for us.

Trying to separate grace from Christ, from truth, from faith is like trying to separate the wet from the water.

These are all from Christ Himself - grace. The Holy Spirit is called the Spirit of grace and the Spirit of Jesus Himself.

Be strong in the grace that is "in" Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] You therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

We are to fix our hope completely on the grace that is being brought to us at the revelation of Jesus Christ.

1 Peter 1:13
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Therefore, prepare your minds for action, keep sober in spirit, fix your hope completely on the grace being brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ.

We are to have our hearts established in grace which is only in Christ Himself.

Hebrews 13:8-9 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

[SUP]9 [/SUP] Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines. For it is a good thing that the heart be established with grace; not with meats, which have not profited them that have been occupied therein.

It is the word of His grace that is able to build us up and that brings us our inheritance that is in Christ to us.

Acts 20:32 (NASB)
[SUP]32 [/SUP] "And now I commend you to God and to the word of His grace, which is able to build you up and to give you the inheritance among all those who are sanctified.


Jesus Himself is the Truth.

Faith comes with the hearing of Christ Himself.

Romans 10:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.



The reality is - that grace, truth and faith are all from Christ Himself and all these things are of God.

We need to believe the message of Christ's finished work on the cross and resurrection and then we receive the abundance grace that is supplied in Christ. Romans 5:17

Grace is much more than the one singular event or definition you guys are trying to force it into.

 

[valiant]

Why is it on a forum web site, with believers who continually declare good works are the
fruit of a born again heart, it needs to be told good works do not earn salvation, continually,
at every opportunity lol

because of the odd bods who teach otherwise.

 

[truthhurts]

Still doesn't make any sense. Why can't you define grace?

You fight and rail against it but you can't even define what you are fighting against.

I believe God gives us faith by His grace. Without grace people would not have faith to be saved.

I hear you words and all in can see is you don't know what God's grace is or you would not speak as you do.

With your many words, I still see no rain.

Grace is admiting that everything God has given us, we don't deserve. Grace is agape love. Grace is blessing those who curse you. Grace is forgiving those who don't deserve it. Grace is laying your burdens at the foot of the cross and knowing God will take care of it.

Faith is given to us by the grace of God. We didn't earn it. It did not come from ourselves but from God. People who fight against grace want to claim they made and can increase their own faith, but it's a lie.

Their faith is not in God and God's grace, but in their own works and their own ability.

People who understand grace know that it is God who increases our faith and we each have a measure of faith.

People who understand agape love recognise that a weak brother who doesn't have as much faith as them, should not be ridiculed and made to feel less beloved by God.

Agape love reveals that no matter your measure of faith be it big or small, it is enough to do the good works and task God has created you for. This all by God's grace and love.

Why would you down play grace?

People who believe in grace alone are not delusional. They just recognize that repentance and faith are given to people through the grace of God.

However those "delusional" people you mention are often folks who fall under false doctrine of the WOF movement, but you are leading them to works salvation.

faith is grace!?!?!? Oh really....if that is true then you are saying that everyone that had relationship with God before Grace was realized by Jesus Christ was covered by grace...Your whole rebuttal is refuted by John 1.17 and Hebrews 11 and 12.

You see no rain, because you want it simply handed to you....

It is the glory of God to conceal a matter,
But the glory of kings is to search out a matter.

Start searching and stop defending...

 

[Stephen63]

*The foolish man twists the words of Jesus and acts on their own self-righteous works system and calls that acting on the words of Jesus.

I notice this slant on self-righteousness. There are a few here that will "imply" that all self-righteousness is based on a works system.

That, dear readers, is a lie.

Anyone, with works or without works, can be self-righteous. It is a matter of attitude & motive, not works or the lack thereof.

.....which brings me to the second implication..... if works makes you self- righteous in their eyes, then..... the absence of works..... in the doctrine.....does not.

Isn't it a coincidence that those that make these "self-righteous by works" claims are all done by those that those that don't believe it?

Just look at the threads..... who uses this word constantly?

Truthfully anyone can call you self-righteous..... but on CC, it's always the OSAS & HYP******ers.

The word I usually call them is "conceited", because several of them have a superiority complex that they're always right, they never apologize, & their sin don't stink, for they're forever forgiven.

Perhaps the readers now see a different group of self-righteous people..... those who add "self-righteous blame" to all of their posts.

 

[valiant]

Grace is much more than the one singular event or definition you guys are trying to force it into.

God's grace is an eternal even beginning when He chose us, continuing with our individual salvation, and ending when we are glorified as far as this world is concerned..

 

[notuptome]

I notice this slant on self-righteousness. There are a few here that will "imply" that all self-righteousness is based on a works system.

That, dear readers, is a lie.

Anyone, with works or without works, can be self-righteous. It is a matter of attitude & motive, not works or the lack thereof.

.....which brings me to the second implication..... if works makes you self- righteous in their eyes, then..... the absence of works..... in the doctrine.....does not.

Isn't it a coincidence that those that make these "self-righteous by works" claims are all done by those that those that don't believe it?

Just look at the threads..... who uses this word constantly?

Truthfully anyone can call you self-righteous..... but on CC, it's always the OSAS & HYP******ers.

The word I usually call them is "conceited", because several of them have a superiority complex that they're always right, they never apologize, & their sin don't stink, for they're forever forgiven.

Perhaps the readers now see a different group of self-righteous people..... those who add "self-righteous blame" to all of their posts.

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

All else is self righteousness. We are made righteous through the grace of God.

All our earthly works only show forth what God is doing in our hearts. Sanctification follows salvation it does not cause salvation.

Only God can make a heart pure and joyful.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[truthhurts]

God's grace is an eternal even beginning when He chose us, continuing with our individual salvation, and ending when we are glorified as far as this world is concerned..

God's saving Grace was set before the foundations of the world...it had nothing to do with predestination and picking who he gave it to.

 

[valiant]

I notice this slant on self-righteousness. There are a few here that will "imply" that all self-righteousness is based on a works system.

All CAN be self righteous, those who depend on works for salvation from the penalty of sin ARE self-righteous.

Anyone, with works or without works, can be self-righteous. It is a matter of attitude & motive, not works or the lack thereof.

We are all self-righteous at times before men, but only the believer in works for salvation is so all the time.

.....which brings me to the second implication..... if works makes you self- righteous in their eyes, then..... the absence of works..... in the doctrine.....does not.

being saved by grace does not make for self-righteousness, but we are such sinners that we can be actually self righteous even when saved by grace,

Isn't it a coincidence that those that make these "self-righteous by works" claims are all done by those that those that don't believe it?

It is automatic for the person who thinks he contributes towards his own ultimate salvation

Truthfully anyone can call you self-righteous..... but on CC, it's always the OSAS & HYP******ers.

you hurt because you have been spotted lol?

The word I usually call them is "conceited", because several of them have a superiority complex that they're always right, they never apologize, & their sin don't stink, for they're forever forgiven.

a person who is truly saved by grace might be aware that he might have something to boast of, but not before God (Rom 4.2)

Perhaps the readers now see a different group of self-righteous people..... those who add "self-righteous blame" to all of their posts.

a non sequitur

 

[valiant]

God's saving Grace was set before the foundations of the world...it had nothing to do with predestination and picking who he gave it to.

we were chosen before the foundation of the world and were thenceforward predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, with our names written in the Lamb's Book of Life

 

[PeterJens]

because of the odd bods who teach otherwise.

If I do not teach salvation by works what makes you think what I am sharing
is worthy of your disdain my friend? If you honestly dislike what I am sharing
fine, but I am perplexed if I do not teach what you say I do, and oppose it
there has to be a disconnect here, unless it is intentional ofcourse

 

[PeterJens]

Perhaps the readers now see a different group of self-righteous people..... those who add "self-righteous blame" to all of their posts.

The irony normally is you self righteous people condemning us poor honest sinners who
cannot help sinning, it is believers saying this of other believers who should be saying we
are free from the bondage of sin. It would make you wonder what spiritual experience have
they actually got if sin is so prevalent in their lives.

In my church there is always a group who came to christ, but still smoke, drink, live the life,
and never really make a break, yet they cannot quite be honest enough to give up. Are we
facing these same people who have now found a home which calls them believers, lol

 

[FreeNChrist]

"And He also told this parable to some people who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and viewed others with contempt:

“Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and was praying this to himself: ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other people: swindlers, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I pay tithes of all that I get.’ But the tax collector, standing some distance away, was even unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, the sinner!’

I tell you, this man went to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted.” Luke 18:9-14

 

[valiant]

If I do not teach salvation by works what makes you think what I am sharing
is worthy of your disdain my friend? If you honestly dislike what I am sharing
fine, but I am perplexed if I do not teach what you say I do, and oppose it
there has to be a disconnect here, unless it is intentional ofcourse

I did not say anything about you.

I answered the question Originally Posted by PeterJens "Why is it on a forum web site, with believers who continually declare good works are the
fruit of a born again heart, it needs to be told good works do not earn salvation, continually,
at every opportunity "

and my answer was 'because of the odd bods who teach otherwise'.

if you choose to be one of those odd bods it is up to you

 

[valiant]

The irony normally is you self righteous people condemning us poor honest sinners who
cannot help sinning, it is believers saying this of other believers who should be saying we
are free from the bondage of sin. It would make you wonder what spiritual experience have
they actually got if sin is so prevalent in their lives.

In my church there is always a group who came to christ, but still smoke, drink, live the life,
and never really make a break, yet they cannot quite be honest enough to give up. Are we
facing these same people who have now found a home which calls them believers, lol

you are not blamed for sinning. You are blamed for claiming to be able to keep from sin for weeks at a time, which is simply untrue.

I am watching for you to wriggle like a snake when you answer with your usual half truths