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As far as I can see it, certain theology needs people to be able to choose God.
For them the sin of unbelief in Christ sends them to hell.
That will not work if people cannot choose.
By the way they do not believe people are lost in sin or blind, because Christ has
forgiven all sin for the whole world.
It is this part of their belief system they actually leave out sharing.
So when people argue like it is life and death over one issue, for them it might
very well be because their belief system collapses without it.
It is like when you suggest Jesus is God to a muslim, to believe this in their world
is a death sentence. It is why if people understand their culture, things are not
neutral or nice to believe, your own family may try and kill you if you believe them.
So when someone is particularly sensitive about something obscure, they are hiding
why this obscure issue is everything, though they will claim they are just like "normal"
believers, you can tell they are far from that.
For them the sin of unbelief in Christ sends them to hell.
That will not work if people cannot choose.
By the way they do not believe people are lost in sin or blind, because Christ has
forgiven all sin for the whole world.
It is this part of their belief system they actually leave out sharing.
So when people argue like it is life and death over one issue, for them it might
very well be because their belief system collapses without it.
It is like when you suggest Jesus is God to a muslim, to believe this in their world
is a death sentence. It is why if people understand their culture, things are not
neutral or nice to believe, your own family may try and kill you if you believe them.
So when someone is particularly sensitive about something obscure, they are hiding
why this obscure issue is everything, though they will claim they are just like "normal"
believers, you can tell they are far from that.
Proof of an accusation
Some love to make others feel guilty of some offence, insult or crime.
It is like hitting the eject button, or total full frontal confrontation.
If they do this to you, you know they have decided you are not giving in
to their propoganda, so they want to do the hatred and anger show, playing
the victim of this terrible criminal and evil person. Now ofcourse it could be
true, except this is a message forum and these are short statements of opinion.
It reminds me of the squid ink defence when in a hard place. Very lame.
Some love to make others feel guilty of some offence, insult or crime.
It is like hitting the eject button, or total full frontal confrontation.
If they do this to you, you know they have decided you are not giving in
to their propoganda, so they want to do the hatred and anger show, playing
the victim of this terrible criminal and evil person. Now ofcourse it could be
true, except this is a message forum and these are short statements of opinion.
It reminds me of the squid ink defence when in a hard place. Very lame.
As far as I can see it, certain theology needs people to be able to choose God.
For them the sin of unbelief in Christ sends them to hell.
That will not work if people cannot choose.
By the way they do not believe people are lost in sin or blind, because Christ has
forgiven all sin for the whole world.
It is this part of their belief system they actually leave out sharing.
So when people argue like it is life and death over one issue, for them it might
very well be because their belief system collapses without it.
It is like when you suggest Jesus is God to a muslim, to believe this in their world
is a death sentence. It is why if people understand their culture, things are not
neutral or nice to believe, your own family may try and kill you if you believe them.
So when someone is particularly sensitive about something obscure, they are hiding
why this obscure issue is everything, though they will claim they are just like "normal"
believers, you can tell they are far from that.
For them the sin of unbelief in Christ sends them to hell.
That will not work if people cannot choose.
By the way they do not believe people are lost in sin or blind, because Christ has
forgiven all sin for the whole world.
It is this part of their belief system they actually leave out sharing.
So when people argue like it is life and death over one issue, for them it might
very well be because their belief system collapses without it.
It is like when you suggest Jesus is God to a muslim, to believe this in their world
is a death sentence. It is why if people understand their culture, things are not
neutral or nice to believe, your own family may try and kill you if you believe them.
So when someone is particularly sensitive about something obscure, they are hiding
why this obscure issue is everything, though they will claim they are just like "normal"
believers, you can tell they are far from that.
This happened to me recently. I was said to have attacked someone and I tried to explain that me giving my thoughts and opinion of some scripture was not me attacking. It was just me giving my understanding. We're a strange lot aren't we?
E
Yeah, it is ok to tell people they are stupid. Call them names, Do all those things, and not just discuss the word.
The fact you puff up these people sickens me.
Because you know what we say is true, you have seen it, You have even called them out on it. And you even asked me to ignore peter.
Of course, now that I have, you are judging me for that.
I have thought of it like that bird that will lead away from the baby she wants to protect by fluttering around as if hurt. The predator follows after her and she flutters a bit further away from what she is trying to protect and the predator follows. She keeps repeating it until she tricks him away from what she is trying to protect by her acting hurt. Then she flies away once the predator is a sufficient amount away from her baby to most likely not find his way back. She confuses him from his goal until he forgets it was the goal. But the squid ink defense is better. Muddy it all just enough to protect what you want to protect.
How you think that to try to gently tell someone they were not being gentle or good in how they posted something (as I did with him) is to puff them up, I will never understand. By telling him I thought he was not speaking well to you is, in your mind, to puff him up. I've fallen down the rabbit hole. Or into the squid ink...
I'm not judging you for ignoring peter. We all got so sick of the back and forth that we all were praying BOTH of you would ignore each other for a time. We saw fault in the way BOTH of you spoke to each other and engaged with each other. The person who flings the first arrogance is at fault just as the person who shrieks for apology is at fault. Neither is walking in the Spirit.
You always look at salvation from a natural man viewpoint. You were not walking around spiritually in God's sight He seen you died in trespasses and sin, not in your physical life, in your spiritual life as in I Corinthians 2:14 and II Corinthians 4:3-4. 2:14 "The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned."
4:3-4 "And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. 4 In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God." The words "even if" are not a conditional clause.
EG when you learned and believed or had faith it's because the Father made you alive or caused you to be born again. Ephesians 2:5 "made us alive together with Christ" I Peter 1:3 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again"
Why must you hold on to your boasting of your faith over God's grace. Sure you can use natural example of why you can boast. Like if you run a race and win, you have the right to boast and it's not wrong. You're right, but that is a far cry from the saving grace of God, where there is no boasting for any reason, because faith is what you contribute to your salvation, it's your response to God's call to salvation, but God call or opens your eyes, from the blindness that satan has put on the natural man. John 3:3 "Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”
In those studies with friends and family, that you understood is the result of God's grace and making you alive or causing you to be born again so you can respond by your free will to the word of truth, the Gospel of your salvation and you believed in Him, were sealed by the promised Holy Spirit, Who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of His glory. Salvation always results in the praise of the Lord for what He has done for us, you can't do that if it on your faith, what would you praise the Lord for, He just responded to your faith, there is no need to praise Him.
As I've stated above, the misunderstanding of election or the Father choosing the Sons bride. Is because in the west, we pick our own bride, but in the near east, the father picks the bride. Remember Genesis 24 and how Abraham sent his servant to the land of his family to find a wife for Isaac, Isaac didn't not go to the land of Abraham's family. The servant asked about taking Isaac to the land of Abraham's family and Abraham said no, do not take Isaac back to the land of me family.
4:3-4 "And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. 4 In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God." The words "even if" are not a conditional clause.
EG when you learned and believed or had faith it's because the Father made you alive or caused you to be born again. Ephesians 2:5 "made us alive together with Christ" I Peter 1:3 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again"
Why must you hold on to your boasting of your faith over God's grace. Sure you can use natural example of why you can boast. Like if you run a race and win, you have the right to boast and it's not wrong. You're right, but that is a far cry from the saving grace of God, where there is no boasting for any reason, because faith is what you contribute to your salvation, it's your response to God's call to salvation, but God call or opens your eyes, from the blindness that satan has put on the natural man. John 3:3 "Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”
In those studies with friends and family, that you understood is the result of God's grace and making you alive or causing you to be born again so you can respond by your free will to the word of truth, the Gospel of your salvation and you believed in Him, were sealed by the promised Holy Spirit, Who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of His glory. Salvation always results in the praise of the Lord for what He has done for us, you can't do that if it on your faith, what would you praise the Lord for, He just responded to your faith, there is no need to praise Him.
As I've stated above, the misunderstanding of election or the Father choosing the Sons bride. Is because in the west, we pick our own bride, but in the near east, the father picks the bride. Remember Genesis 24 and how Abraham sent his servant to the land of his family to find a wife for Isaac, Isaac didn't not go to the land of Abraham's family. The servant asked about taking Isaac to the land of Abraham's family and Abraham said no, do not take Isaac back to the land of me family.
I pray because I don't know if He may grant them the same faith and repentance He granted me. You are the one assuming them lost and never to be granted faith and repentance. I am the one hoping and praying. I don't know who He will show the Son to. I don't know whose eyes He will open. He opened mine. He granted me faith and repentance. He unstopped my ears. He made me to see. How could I not want the same for them? Some will perish. I can't deal with the pain of that knowledge by saying I did something toward my saving. I just feel the pain when it comes, but I won't take any credit for having done something to save myself. If I made a good choice, it wasn't my doing.
E
I disagree, God did not make me alive while I was still dead because of sin.. He made me alive because he washed my sin away. (Justification porecedes regeneration, it has to in my view)
I came to God, because God drew me knowing I would respond.. I believed because I chose to. Not because he gave me some magic power to.
He calls many, but only few follow.. He does not call many, because he already knows no matter what he does. They will never respond.
There was grace in the OT.. God did not give Isreal the land, until the sin of the Ameritech was complete (there was no chance of anyone turning to God) as long as their was hope, he would not destroy them, same with soddom and Gomorrah.
E
I agree with everything but your last point.
God did not make me alive so I could chose him.. He did not unstop my dead ear. The HS convicts the WORLD of sin righteousness and judgment,
I chose to hear what the HS said, and believe it, this allowed him to teach me the gospel (about Jesus) and I chose to have faith in it.
No one will have an excuse. Because the HS convicts everyone,, they have to chose to agree.. The only unpardonable sin is disagreement.. It is rejecting what the HS came to do. Which was to convict you of sin, convict you of righteousness, and convict you (convince you) that you are judged because you have sinned.
God did not make me alive so I could chose him.. He did not unstop my dead ear. The HS convicts the WORLD of sin righteousness and judgment,
I chose to hear what the HS said, and believe it, this allowed him to teach me the gospel (about Jesus) and I chose to have faith in it.
No one will have an excuse. Because the HS convicts everyone,, they have to chose to agree.. The only unpardonable sin is disagreement.. It is rejecting what the HS came to do. Which was to convict you of sin, convict you of righteousness, and convict you (convince you) that you are judged because you have sinned.