The truth behind the Law

[beta]

be careful though.. We can not live up to Gods commands,, He demands perfection. But yes, we are to obey,

Anyone who commits one sin, no matter how small, is considered by the law to be lawless.

Now who is preaching the 'letter of the law' we have been released from ? One mistake and we are done ? Come out of OT mentality friend...not yet heard of grace-forgiveness-compassion etc etc until we have learned and been perfected ?
In the NT Love is first...law is second, but always together !

 

[Rainrider]

rainrider, you are using Jewish terms in making your case. TO remain intellectually honest in your discussion you should disclose if you are affiliated or associated with:

1) Hebrew Roots Movement
2) PSALM 119 ministries
3) Orthodox Jew
4) Messianic Jew

Are you a born Jew?

If you are affiliated with any of these fellowships or movements and not born Jewish you are a modern day gentile Judiazer and has Paul showed a false teacher.

You need to stop the deception and cease and desist from steering those free in Christ back to the law for their salvation.

I await your reply.

As I hold to none of the above, I don't see what it matters. I am not censored with your faith. If you would take the time to read a bit more than what you see fit to find your own points, then you would know full well that I am nothing more than a man looking to better understand a topic. To use a phrase in the manner you have is both wrong, and misleading.
I can already see that even if every had read the ground rules, not many have any intent on staying with them.
So please, if you are just going to call names, run other down for what they understand, and not look at what they say, Stop posting. Thank you ever so much, for your cooperation.

 

[Rainrider]

I don't understand why threads like this exist... they go against the principle of the 10 and 2 and the whole bible for that matter.

Ever stop to think that not every one see it that way? There may well be some that are seeking to learn something from this.

 

[Ahwatukee]

I don't think you will find me ever saying the Law will save you. As of yet, I don't think I have seen anyone say that. Well other than you.

You don't have to say it verbally! By your promoting of the law you are saying it. And that because by trusting in your own efforts you are not trusting in Christ's finished work on the cross, who fulfilled the law completely and perfectly on your behalf. Below is an example of what you are believing:

"Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness.’ "

In the example above, when they find out that they will not inherit the kingdom of God, their own words give them away when they say, "did we not." We can't inherit the kingdom of God by our own works, which is what those in the example are trusting in. For everyone who is trusting in their own works, in that day Jesus will say to them that He never knew them because they will not have trusted in Him, but in their own efforts.

 

[beta]

I may have missed it, but all I ever saw in any of that was Moses telling the people what God said.... not God speaking directly to the people.

But when you check out the scriptures I quoted you must surely see that only the 10 have survived being eternal and have come down to us today ? No Sir...God spoke to the people personally, like talking to you and me today...we should never refuse to hear Him as they did at Sinai...sadly some still do and cause a lot of grief and misunderstanding in christianity.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Ever stop to think that not every one see it that way? There may well be some that are seeking to learn something from this.

If what they are learning is to try to keep the law, this is something that is detrimental to salvation. For anyone whose trust is in the keeping of the law, is not trusting in Christ who kept it for them and by doing so they will not inherit the kingdom of God.

 

[Willie-T]

But when you check out the scriptures I quoted you must surely see that only the 10 have survived being eternal and have come down to us today ? No Sir...God spoke to the people personally, like talking to you and me today...we should never refuse to hear Him as they did at Sinai...sadly some still do and cause a lot of grief and misunderstanding in christianity.

OK. If you want to believe He did. But, I still can't find that written down anywhere.

 

[Rainrider]

Way I see it the Law exists whether you like or not
And though we no longer need to put the heathens to death
There's consequences when the Law is transgressed
Even for atheists they cannot escape though they do not believe

I mean here is a wise and foolish example
Let's say I go and lose my virginity to your wife
Then let's say you catch us in bed, shall I be excused that I'm not under Law?
Or should I really not be too surprised if you take away my life?

Or let us say I go and become a thief
And I'll steal everything from you
Will grace be shown to me as many claim is their belief?
Or is it more likely I'll be put into prison until I repay every piece?

Or let us go even to the utter extreme
And pretend I am moved to follow other gods
On the Judgement Day to whom would I make my appeal?
Athena, Vishnu, and Allah can't save you because they're not even real.

Now the Law cannot save you, it's only there to teach
And to bring death and painful consequences when there is a breach
Only Jesus full of justice and mercy can grant your reprieve
And for that God's grace is simply that in Jesus you must believe

I like the way you think.
There is one thing that should be added. The price of sin is death. If a person should be put to death, then when judgment day comes, you can bet they will be. We don't need to, nor should we. People use the off the wall things from the law to try and pin others down to be say yes or no. If you answer Yes, then you are seen as a lost soul, and trust me, the fall out from a yes answer will be never ending. If you simply answer NO, then look out. Now you are a lair, or teach against your own teaching, and once more the fall out will be never ending. Read the NT, you will see the same kind of thing was used to try and trap Yeshua.

 

[Rainrider]

Yes it does, because you faith is in the Law not the all sufficient sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

No it does not.

 

[Rainrider]

I thought rainrider was trying to preach THE RIGHTEOUSNESS of CHRIST and was against those who will try to justify themselves by the LAW...for even Romans clearly states that GOD has turned all over to disobedience so that HE alone will be exalted for HIS WORK and MERCY.

As well, since the LAW already says and declares none righteous, there is no one who does good and never sins, how can anyone open their mouth before GOD and say otherwise?

All mouths will be silenced and the whole world accountable to GOD.
To be just when HE judges and the justifier of all whose faith is in HIS SON


Both of these mentioned in Romans, should clearly bring one to understanding Paul's opening recap letter preaching the RIGHTEOUSNESS of GOD which is now made known which is from faith to faith...

Thank you seeing that I have said that more than once. At lest I know someone is really looking at what is said from both sides.
May you be blessed in many ways for that.
I think you should get at lest 5 rep. points my self.

 

[Rainrider]

Do you require women in your household to stay outside in the backyard for 7 days during their menstrual cycles?

If you do not your guilty of breaking every law you seem to think you need to follow...If you come back and tell us that the hygiene laws are not for today, you are still guilty of breaking the all of the law, because you did not keep the hygiene laws...

James 2.10-CJB-
[SUP]9 [/SUP]But if you show favoritism, your actions constitute sin, since you are convicted under the Torah as transgressors.

[SUP]10 [/SUP]For a person who keeps the whole Torah, yet stumbles at one point, has become guilty of breaking them all. [SUP]11 [/SUP]For the One who said, “Don’t commit adultery,” also said, “Don’t murder.” Now, if you don’t commit adultery but do murder, you have become a transgressor of the Torah.

As I live a lone, that question once more fails to put me a corner that I have no way out of. I am not responsible for the action of others, so once more, this simply doesn't apply to me. Thanks for your effort.

 

[Rainrider]

There is no law for the Christian, all things are lawful.

Live as you will, if it feels good do it. that kind of thinking?

 

[Rainrider]

Abraham was not under the Law....so why are you?

Once more we are not reading what is placed before us. So Please take your time, go over every word I have written, and show me just once I said we are under the law.

 

[Rainrider]

I wish that I could do all that I say and know.
But I can't.
Therefore I am always left to this...MY FAITH in HIS FAITHFULNESS and my FAITH that HIS WORD and PROMISES are steadfast and sure...

and they are...
That is why MY HOPE is in HIM...that HE will complete the GOOD work HE began in me...even when I can't see any good in what I do but that HE alone is MY GOOD...

Add to that the gratefulness that He will not judge by the thoughts of man, rather by what He finds in our hearts.

 

[Rachmiel]

I like the way you think.
There is one thing that should be added. The price of sin is death. If a person should be put to death, then when judgment day comes, you can bet they will be. We don't need to, nor should we. People use the off the wall things from the law to try and pin others down to be say yes or no. If you answer Yes, then you are seen as a lost soul, and trust me, the fall out from a yes answer will be never ending. If you simply answer NO, then look out. Now you are a lair, or teach against your own teaching, and once more the fall out will be never ending. Read the NT, you will see the same kind of thing was used to try and trap Yeshua.

Well thanks for the compliment
And I have indeed read the New Testament
In fact in full I have read the whole Bible twice
And now I have begun again to try to make it thrice

This an interesting topic for me to read and digest this
For I am now in the middle of reading through Leviticus
A lot of people get weary reading the Books of Law, it makes them tense
But if you relax and think about it, a lot of it is actually just common sense

And no, I'm not trying to say the Law is going to save anyone from Judgement
Otherwise there'd be no point in Aaron making sacrifices for atonement
Even in the Torah it is not the burning of rams' fat that saves
But rather it has always been up to God and his grace.

 

[PerfectlyImperfect]

Just give yourself time my friend. He will remind in His time, and rest a sure, He will find a way to give you what you need, when you need it.

I know he will!

 

[PerfectlyImperfect]

As I hold to none of the above, I don't see what it matters. I am not censored with your faith. If you would take the time to read a bit more than what you see fit to find your own points, then you would know full well that I am nothing more than a man looking to better understand a topic. To use a phrase in the manner you have is both wrong, and misleading.
I can already see that even if every had read the ground rules, not many have any intent on staying with them.
So please, if you are just going to call names, run other down for what they understand, and not look at what they say, Stop posting. Thank you ever so much, for your cooperation.

Honestly, I thought you posted this to see how the passages fit into our teachings, not for us to debate the words themselves, but I could wrong. I know personally I believe in God's words, but I strictly go off what he himself teaches me and shows me on the inside if that makes sense. And everything he shows, comes right back to his word.

 

[Dan_473]

Mat 5:17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.
Mat 5:18 “For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

I am going to start by asking, how does this passage fit your teachings?

Hi Rainrider!

I think the "till all is fulfilled" at the end of 28 relates to the "but to fulfill (the law and the prophets)" at the end of 27.

So, I think Jesus is saying that he will fulfill the law and the prophets, I think that's probably sometime around his death, resurrection, or the coming of the Spirit.

Is that what you're asking?

 

[Rainrider]

be careful though.. We can not live up to Gods commands,, He demands perfection. But yes, we are to obey,

Anyone who commits one sin, no matter how small, is considered by the law to be lawless.

You are right we can not live up to the standers set down by that understanding. We all fall short of His glory, That is why, (sorry I am not using all caps out of disrespect for you. I am just hoping that every one will see it.)
HIS GRACE IS THERE FOR US ALL!!!!!!!!!!!

I do hope everyone will read that.

 

[Meggido]

No it does not.

then stop preaching the law....