The Rapture

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VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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No,Ishmael has nothing to do with Israel.

Galations specifically says that the children of Hagar have no inheritance.

The descendents of the Children of Hagar, are the Islamic enemies of Israel.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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Oh, gee! You are into the False Doctrine of Numerology too.
You haven't noticed how God uses numbers in the bible? 7 means something, so does 1, 2 ,3 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 ,16, 20, 22, 40, 1000, 10,000. If you don't understand this you're really missing out on a lot of valuable information.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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Be prepared to go through Great Tribulation.... remember to love not your life... fear not those that can kill the body....Put GOD above all things. The evil of this world have some great twists of the truth to entrap... but hold fast to the Testimony of the Good Shepherd and walk through the valleys of death and fear no evil... peace be with you all.
 

PlainWord

Senior Member
Jun 11, 2013
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I aint never seen donkey talk, therefore it can't happen, let me spiritualize it. The donkey refers to the tribe of Issachar which is the prophecy wing of the church, and it speaks on what the church should do like it says in the bible Issachar knew the times and what Israel ought to do.

You're welcome amills, I just spiritualized it for ya.

All jokes aside, I'm afraid of this type of spiritualizing when its not needed, the reason being is that as I showed above, you can come up with all types of interpretations that seem to make sense, but are actually non-sense and twisting them Scriptures.

Ima tell yall a Bible reading guide, here is the 101 course:

1. THUS SAITH THE LORD! - The Lord means what He says and says what He means.

2. Cross reference Scripture.

3. Know who is spoken to, and who is talking.

4. Know when things are spoken. This is where a lot of folks get tripped up, they take doctrine from the Old Testament, written to the Israelites of that day, not to the church.

5. If the literal sense makes sense, don't seek other sense. If its a symbolic, its usually very plain from the context and often its even explained.

These tips will get you far. Don't fall for the trap of the enemy saying you can't understand this and that or that you needa be some spiritual guru to know the hidden meanings of each verse.
Talk about the pot calling the kettle "black." Nobody allegorizes more than the pre-tribber.

Christ says that He returns immediately after the tribulation, you change it to before.
You add 2,000 year gaps all over the place.
You attribute works of Christ to works of the antichrist.
You take a phrase that says Christ's lives and reigns for 1,000 years and in essence say that Christ hasn't begun to live or reign yet implying that He's still dead.
You take a passage where those in Judea are told to flee and apply it to the whole planet.
You steal the comforts and blessed hope given to Timothy and the Thessalonians and take them for yourselves.
You take the promise of a quick return and make it the longest return in history.
You create classes of Christians based on works. Those who earned the rapture and those to be left behind and slaughtered.

To make matters worse, you take meanings that are clearly spiritual like the Kingdom and Temple and make them physical. Perhaps the most troubling thing is you throw away God's salvation sacrifice of His Son who shed His blood and died for us so that we could be atoned for our sins and have salvation when we die and you re-institute animal sacrifices as the way for future atonement. You find that Christ would have no problems reigning from the building where animal sacrifices were occurring.

I can think of little that's more repulsive, sickening and extra-Biblical than the pre-Trib doctrine. Sorry if that offends as it's aimed at the doctrine, not my brothers who fell for this nonsense.

 

tanakh

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2015
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Nope, its a literal temple. When you see Abomination of Desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet.
Also think about it like this: Jesus was a Jew, therefore the AntiChrist should be a Jew as well to fool everyone.
Please refer to my posting number 2588.

Jesus referred to his body as a Temple

He told the religious leaders that he would leave their house desolate
 
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Jan 21, 2017
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Christ clearly said that some standing there would still be alive when He returns. You allegorize this away too.

In all the prophesy about these "future" wars where horses and swords are mentioned, you and/or others allegorize them into planes, tanks and missiles. None of these prophesies discuss anything in our modern times like sky scrapers, planes, rockets, computers, etc. Instead first century weapons are discussed giving further credence to my position.


1st thing: Jesus referred to mount of transfiguration & acts 2
2nd thing: Good point honestly about the horses and swords.
 
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Please refer to my posting number 2588.

Jesus referred to his body as a Temple

He told the religious leaders that he would leave their house desolate
You can't do an abomination of desolation inside a human. Especially if that human is the temple of God meaning he/she has the HOLY GHOST!
 
Nov 23, 2013
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You can't do an abomination of desolation inside a human. Especially if that human is the temple of God meaning he/she has the HOLY GHOST!
How the heck do you abominate a building?
 
Nov 23, 2013
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1st thing: Jesus referred to mount of transfiguration & acts 2
2nd thing: Good point honestly about the horses and swords.
So are you admitting that Matthew 16:28 - Jesus coming in his kingdom happened at Pentecost?

Matthew 16:28 KJV
Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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If anyone can correct or add to this, please do. I think understanding this chapter is key to understanding the 2 witnesses in Revelation.

Food for thought: Only two people in the Old Testament never died, Enoch and Elijah.

The Two Witnesses do die at the hands of the Beast.

The Word of GOD tells us that the only exception to the following verse, are those still alive when He resurrects the Dead in Messiah, Jesus Christ:


Hebrews 9:27 (KJV)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:


Understanding that GOD MUST BE TRUE TO HIS WORD, it is obvious that the Two Witnesses are Enoch and Elijah.
 
Jan 21, 2017
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So are you admitting that Matthew 16:28 - Jesus coming in his kingdom happened at Pentecost?

Matthew 16:28 KJV
Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
Sure I admit that. Also notice matthew 17:1
 
Nov 23, 2013
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Sure I admit that. Also notice matthew 17:1
You realize that the kingdom Jesus is talking about in verse 28 is the same kingdom as verse 27.

Matthew 16:27 KJVFor the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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Food for thought: Only two people in the Old Testament never died, Enoch and Elijah.

The Two Witnesses do die at the hands of the Beast.

The Word of GOD tells us that the only exception to the following verse, are those still alive when He resurrects the Dead in Messiah, Jesus Christ:


Hebrews 9:27 (KJV)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:


Understanding that GOD MUST BE TRUE TO HIS WORD, it is obvious that the Two Witnesses are Enoch and Elijah.
Nobody alive at the rapture will have tasted death.
 

J7

Banned
Apr 2, 2017
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You realize that the kingdom Jesus is talking about in verse 28 is the same kingdom as verse 27.

Matthew 16:27 KJVFor the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

That is erchomai, not parousia.

This is why people become preterists. He means here AD70.
 

Bladerunner

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2016
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I think the two witnesses are.... 1 the law of God represented by Moses according to the letter of the law that shows all men are dead in our trespasses and sin and.... 2 the prophets represented by Elisa the Spirit of God, the law of faith .

The end times timing that works the best is that of the Amil no literal thousand year reign . The one time demonstration in respect to the temporal flesh ended when he disappeared into the clouds . God is not a man as us. Never was never could be. Eternal Spirit remains without mother or father beginning of Spirit life nor end thereof
Good then you will never see it (the millennium) when it gets here....HOWEVER....... Satan awaits patiently and the fiery Lake of Fire knows no indifference to whom may gather within its bosom!