Not By Works
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First example that I thought of and then thought of the Corinthian example of those who have works of wood, hay and stubble yet saved so as by fire.......then I thought of David and him speaking of his salvation in the present tense and his Murder of Uriah and adultery with Bathsheba or Peter denying the Lord three times and on and on and on.....
Jesus while on the earth with his saved, immersed disciples identified as a church at least twice said there were NONE GOOD save GOD and the bible states there is NOT a JUST man upon the earth that does GOOD and sins not.....what they ALL fail to understand is that any work or fruit produced is produced by JESUS through us as a living sacrifice....HE is working through us to accomplish HIS good will........exactly why WORKS do not save, but are the results of the SALVATION we possess by FAITH.....
Jesus while on the earth with his saved, immersed disciples identified as a church at least twice said there were NONE GOOD save GOD and the bible states there is NOT a JUST man upon the earth that does GOOD and sins not.....what they ALL fail to understand is that any work or fruit produced is produced by JESUS through us as a living sacrifice....HE is working through us to accomplish HIS good will........exactly why WORKS do not save, but are the results of the SALVATION we possess by FAITH.....
To me it's not the process of good works it the reason for them.
There are many people who do good works.
If you think about footballers or famous people who do lots for charity and give a lot of money away.
Then there people who are not famous and don't have money but still do good works.
Yes they do good works but one thing is missing and that is Jesus.
Jesus died for a purpose and purpose was not to do good works on his behalf but to forgive us of our sins and reconcile us back to the Father.
The Holy Spirit come to convince/convict us of unbelief in Jesus.
When we repent of that then we place faith in Jesus.
Then we walk the way Jesus has asked us to, that's what we seek, we seek to be like him.
All in this world can do good works and some who don't believe can do better works than those who do.
Its faith in Jesus that counts, forgiveness of sins as a result of his death then our works will reveal a loving Father, those who do good works but have no faith don't reveal the Father but those who do believe and do good works have to opportunity to reveal the Father.
Just like Jesus did, believe in me is to believe in the Father. Then your sins are forgiven and we are going to party for eternity.
There are many people who do good works.
If you think about footballers or famous people who do lots for charity and give a lot of money away.
Then there people who are not famous and don't have money but still do good works.
Yes they do good works but one thing is missing and that is Jesus.
Jesus died for a purpose and purpose was not to do good works on his behalf but to forgive us of our sins and reconcile us back to the Father.
The Holy Spirit come to convince/convict us of unbelief in Jesus.
When we repent of that then we place faith in Jesus.
Then we walk the way Jesus has asked us to, that's what we seek, we seek to be like him.
All in this world can do good works and some who don't believe can do better works than those who do.
Its faith in Jesus that counts, forgiveness of sins as a result of his death then our works will reveal a loving Father, those who do good works but have no faith don't reveal the Father but those who do believe and do good works have to opportunity to reveal the Father.
Just like Jesus did, believe in me is to believe in the Father. Then your sins are forgiven and we are going to party for eternity.
I have read was it a stake or cruxifx.
I believe it was a crucifix.
You mention symbolism, to me that's not a point to argue.
Whether it be a stake or crucifix in a sense it does not matter (to me anyway) and it's not a hill to die on.
Jesus died on a hill, the Son of God taking our sins upon him.
For me that's a hill to die on.
I believe it was a crucifix.
You mention symbolism, to me that's not a point to argue.
Whether it be a stake or crucifix in a sense it does not matter (to me anyway) and it's not a hill to die on.
Jesus died on a hill, the Son of God taking our sins upon him.
For me that's a hill to die on.
OK.....here is our first few exchanges......
YOU--->What does Revelation 3 reveal about working for Salvation?
YOU--->Does this apply to us all or just to the churches?
ME-->It does not reveal anything about working for salvation.............I am assuming you are speaking of the VERBIAGE applied unto the churches of in ASIA and any reference to the loss of the candlestick is indicative of them losing their authority collectively as a church....it has ZERO to do with salvation.....
In the grace you are, having been saved OUT OF FAITH and that NOT of YOURSELVES..IT is the GIFT OF GOD and NOT OF WORKS lest any man should BOAST
IF it is of works it is NO LONGER GRACE
God's word does not contradict itself....if salvation is based upon works then the above verse references CONTRADICT a working for salvation.....
PAUL was clear....
FAITH plus WORKS to gain, finish or maintain SALVATION is a false, double cursed different gospel which has NO POWER to save and ALL who believe it are BEWITCHED and FOOLS......
end of story!
ME--->It is applied collectively unto ANY and ALL churches of the LORD.....any reference to having the candlestick STIRRED AWAY is applicable unto their authority in the eyes of GOD as a church........a church is a body and will be judged as a body....!
YOU--->Are you replying to the Words in Revelation 3? Are you creating your own Gospel based on a verse here or a verse there? There is no contradiction... just spiritual blindness on your part.. But is is worrying that you have just wrote a piece of heresy and you can not see it.
YOU then quoted Revelation, Ephesians and Titus
ME-->Based upon your last two posts....not quite pal..............it seems obvious that most Brits do not understand the word CONTEXT......there are a few...but so far it seems that most do not....!
Me-->SAVED UNTO is not SAVED BY<----man you would think you guys would have a better grasp on English....another working for cake taker from the U.K.......must be the Anglican coming out in you..
YOU-->Rich coming from you the author of this thread.
Me-->In response to your Titus quote-->
Quote the part of that verse that states that works save........we will wait for it.....doubtful though because it does not say that works save........again CONTEXT......here I will help you open your eyes....
Me-->I then quoted 18 verses that state we are saved by faith or forgiven by faith with NO works attached
You--->You should seek to open your own eyes... you are in error and defending yourself. Why should one be careful to maintain good works?
Me-->Ok....let us try this one more time....do you understand English? .....Do you understand the RESULT of one's action?
Faith into the work of Christ IS WHAT SAVES A MAN....end of story.......
THE RESULT of the FAITH and SALVATION one ALREADY POSSESSES <----any work produced and or fruit.
THE WORKS/FRUIT do NOT SAVE, KEEP SAVED or FINISH OFF SALVATION.........
FAITH plus WORKS to GAIN, FINISH, KEEP salvation = a false GOSPEL other than the GOSPEL PAUL preached.....it is DOUBLE CURSED, FAKE, a FRAUD and has NO POWER
GALATIANS 1 and 3
YOU-->You then responded to the 18 verses I posted dealing with salvation by faith void of works.....So now you have created a no works post? Oh my.... this is obscene. To all that read this forum please do not adhere to this heresy. This man can save his explanation for this false teaching for GOD. Why not go and add no works in reply to the Messiah's message to the churches? Let us see how that reads.... or not!!!
You--->You then responded to my last quote...Even if the Messiah sends a message that is contrary to your belief will you continue to teach heresy.
THE rest ALL can read...........so.......come to your own conclusion pal.....faith alone saves...end of story....any work or fruit are the results of..........SAVED UNTO......NOT BY!!!!!!
YOU--->What does Revelation 3 reveal about working for Salvation?
YOU--->Does this apply to us all or just to the churches?
ME-->It does not reveal anything about working for salvation.............I am assuming you are speaking of the VERBIAGE applied unto the churches of in ASIA and any reference to the loss of the candlestick is indicative of them losing their authority collectively as a church....it has ZERO to do with salvation.....
In the grace you are, having been saved OUT OF FAITH and that NOT of YOURSELVES..IT is the GIFT OF GOD and NOT OF WORKS lest any man should BOAST
IF it is of works it is NO LONGER GRACE
God's word does not contradict itself....if salvation is based upon works then the above verse references CONTRADICT a working for salvation.....
PAUL was clear....
FAITH plus WORKS to gain, finish or maintain SALVATION is a false, double cursed different gospel which has NO POWER to save and ALL who believe it are BEWITCHED and FOOLS......
end of story!
ME--->It is applied collectively unto ANY and ALL churches of the LORD.....any reference to having the candlestick STIRRED AWAY is applicable unto their authority in the eyes of GOD as a church........a church is a body and will be judged as a body....!
YOU--->Are you replying to the Words in Revelation 3? Are you creating your own Gospel based on a verse here or a verse there? There is no contradiction... just spiritual blindness on your part.. But is is worrying that you have just wrote a piece of heresy and you can not see it.
YOU then quoted Revelation, Ephesians and Titus
ME-->Based upon your last two posts....not quite pal..............it seems obvious that most Brits do not understand the word CONTEXT......there are a few...but so far it seems that most do not....!
Me-->SAVED UNTO is not SAVED BY<----man you would think you guys would have a better grasp on English....another working for cake taker from the U.K.......must be the Anglican coming out in you..
YOU-->Rich coming from you the author of this thread.
Me-->In response to your Titus quote-->
Quote the part of that verse that states that works save........we will wait for it.....doubtful though because it does not say that works save........again CONTEXT......here I will help you open your eyes....
Me-->I then quoted 18 verses that state we are saved by faith or forgiven by faith with NO works attached
You--->You should seek to open your own eyes... you are in error and defending yourself. Why should one be careful to maintain good works?
Me-->Ok....let us try this one more time....do you understand English? .....Do you understand the RESULT of one's action?
Faith into the work of Christ IS WHAT SAVES A MAN....end of story.......
THE RESULT of the FAITH and SALVATION one ALREADY POSSESSES <----any work produced and or fruit.
THE WORKS/FRUIT do NOT SAVE, KEEP SAVED or FINISH OFF SALVATION.........
FAITH plus WORKS to GAIN, FINISH, KEEP salvation = a false GOSPEL other than the GOSPEL PAUL preached.....it is DOUBLE CURSED, FAKE, a FRAUD and has NO POWER
GALATIANS 1 and 3
YOU-->You then responded to the 18 verses I posted dealing with salvation by faith void of works.....So now you have created a no works post? Oh my.... this is obscene. To all that read this forum please do not adhere to this heresy. This man can save his explanation for this false teaching for GOD. Why not go and add no works in reply to the Messiah's message to the churches? Let us see how that reads.... or not!!!
You--->You then responded to my last quote...Even if the Messiah sends a message that is contrary to your belief will you continue to teach heresy.
THE rest ALL can read...........so.......come to your own conclusion pal.....faith alone saves...end of story....any work or fruit are the results of..........SAVED UNTO......NOT BY!!!!!!