Not By Works

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Ariel82

Guest
God gives us the seed (the gospel or the message about His kingdom) to plant..,others water...but to God's glory is the increase.

Fyi..,the gospel message was completed when Jesus rose from the grave and ascended to heaven after dying on the cross for our sins....NOT upon completion of the written BIBLE.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
the bible stateS that Jesus is the bride and we get married to him... SO THERE FOR WE ARE MARRIED TO THE CHURCH ...............




WHERE BY YOU CAN DIVORCE ...................END OF STORY SISTER........
No....Jesus is the bridegroom..the church is His bride. We are body parts of the Church.,,maybe an eye or a mouth or a hand or a liver or a white blood cell, etc.

You can't divorce your own body...but you can cut your self off from the life giving nourishment (abiding in Christ, walking with the Holy spirit, prayer, worship ,etc) or become cancerous (greedily stealing from your siblings or attacking them) and be cut off and destroyed,

Cancer treatment is different from divorce,
 
May 12, 2017
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That isn't true because we do not "sow" Jesus seed into others lives.

Jesus tells us what the seed in this parable is...

Matthew 13
18 “Listen then to what the parable of the sower means: 19 When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in their heart. This is the seed sown along the path.
THis is not the definition of the seed Ariel...

Mark 4.14-
[SUP]14 [/SUP]The sower sows the word<<<<<<<<The seed is the word....who is the word Ariel?....I defined it and you are fighting , because it goes agaisnt tradition and doctrine....

The soil is your heart, the seed is Jesus, we share/sow the seed of Jesus with everyone......
 
May 12, 2017
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God gives us the seed (the gospel or the message about His kingdom) to plant..,others water...but to God's glory is the increase.

Fyi..,the gospel message was completed when Jesus rose from the grave and ascended to heaven after dying on the cross for our sins....NOT upon completion of the written BIBLE.
and I said as much....
 
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Ariel82

Guest
THis is not the definition of the seed Ariel...

Mark 4.14-
[SUP]14 [/SUP]The sower sows the word<<<<<<<<The seed is the word....who is the word Ariel?....I defined it and you are fighting , because it goes agaisnt tradition and doctrine....

The soil is your heart, the seed is Jesus, we share/sow the seed of Jesus with everyone......
No I am fighting it because it's wrong. The only person who can place the Seed in the heart of humanity is God.

We sow the message or the "word of the kingdom". We do NOT sow JESUS himself. That happens when people are given the Holy Spirit, which happens after the MESSAGE or the Gospel has been sowed in fertile soil that brings forth FRUIT. THE FIRST FRUIT IS A SAVING FAITH IN JESUS.

Mixing scriptures and metaphors doesn't prove anything but bad hermeneutics.

Yes Jesus is the Word and the Seed of Abraham. However We can look at many parables and see that the "seed" revered to in them doesn't always refer to Jesus Himself.

I can give you a few obvious examples.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
and I said as much....
Read undergrace response to you....it implies differently, especially since she is "agreeing with you"

..
but I agree with you so much that Jesus could not have been talking about the gospel really since it had not been completed yet...
 
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Ariel82

Guest
John 4:35-38
"Do you not say, 'There are yet four months, and then comes the harvest'? Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look on the fields, that they are white for harvest. "Already he who reaps is receiving wages and is gathering fruit for life eternal; so that he who sows and he who reaps may rejoice together. "For in this case the saying is true, 'One sows and another reaps.'
"I sent you to reap that for which you have not labored; others have labored and you have entered into their labor."

Matthew 13:24-30
Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, "The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field. "But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away. "But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.

"The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?' "And he said to them, 'An enemy has done this!' The slaves said to him, 'Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?' "But he said, 'No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them. 'Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn."'"
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
1,386
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No, What we have here is a person who actually believes, What you have is backwards, As John said, The knowledge of having eternal life is the basis for which we continue to believe, ie, it is the assurance of salvation which is the reason we continue to believe,

As someone said earlier, Faith is action, it is not like feelings, which come and go, Faith based on feelings will come and go, and will never sustain itself.

Faith based on action and ASSURANCE (based on hope) Will never fail, Because faith acts.
Is this faith based on action and assurance, the same faith being portrayed in the "FAITH ALONE SAVES" doctrine? Just clarifying bro. Thanks and God bless.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
Is this faith based on action and assurance, the same faith being portrayed in the "FAITH ALONE SAVES" doctrine? Just clarifying bro. Thanks and God bless.
Depends on who you ask, but I believe that this faith "based on action and assurance" is the same faith that as being spoken of when most folks on this thread say "faith alone and NOT BY WORKS" for salvation.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Is this faith based on action and assurance, the same faith being portrayed in the "FAITH ALONE SAVES" doctrine? Just clarifying bro. Thanks and God bless.
Faith means assurance, if you have an assurance, you act,

it is only ly due to lack of faith that we do not respond, or respond with the wrong motive, which is just as bad as not doing it at all
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
No I am fighting it because it's wrong. The only person who can place the Seed in the heart of humanity is God.

We sow the message or the "word of the kingdom". We do NOT sow JESUS himself. That happens when people are given the Holy Spirit, which happens after the MESSAGE or the Gospel has been sowed in fertile soil that brings forth FRUIT. THE FIRST FRUIT IS A SAVING FAITH IN JESUS.

Mixing scriptures and metaphors doesn't prove anything but bad hermeneutics.

Yes Jesus is the Word and the Seed of Abraham. However We can look at many parables and see that the "seed" revered to in them doesn't always refer to Jesus Himself.

I can give you a few obvious examples.
i have to agree with Megiddo, the seed is the word, the word is God the word was with God, that word is jess,

anyone who reads the word is reading the seed,
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
John 4:35-38
"Do you not say, 'There are yet four months, and then comes the harvest'? Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look on the fields, that they are white for harvest. "Already he who reaps is receiving wages and is gathering fruit for life eternal; so that he who sows and he who reaps may rejoice together. "For in this case the saying is true, 'One sows and another reaps.'
"I sent you to reap that for which you have not labored; others have labored and you have entered into their labor."

Matthew 13:24-30
Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, "The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field. "But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away. "But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.

"The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?' "And he said to them, 'An enemy has done this!' The slaves said to him, 'Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?' "But he said, 'No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them. 'Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn."'"

The word, and fake word are sewn together, thus the plant which grows will be good, mixed with bad, and God said let them grace w together,

we see this with a true church and false church in the same area,
 
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Ariel82

Guest
i have to agree with Megiddo, the seed is the word, the word is God the word was with God, that word is jess,

anyone who reads the word is reading the seed,
So you are saying anyone who reads the Bible is reading Jesus?

Jesus isn't his own unique person?

I believe there is power in the Word of God Who is Jesus.

I believe the Bible contains messages from God but the Bible itself..,the words themselves are not Jesus anymore Than a letter written by you is still a part of YOU.

The power is not in the Bible but in the person of Jesus,

The power of a written decree is not in the paper or the words used to write it, but in the King who issued it.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
So you are saying anyone who reads the Bible is reading Jesus?

Jesus isn't his own unique person?

I believe there is power in the Word of God Who is Jesus.

I believe the Bible contains messages from God but the Bible itself..,the words themselves are not Jesus anymore Than a letter written by you is still a part of YOU.

The power is not in the Bible but in the person of Jesus,
john 1:1, in the beginning was the word, the word was god, the word was with god,

te whole of the Bible talks about Jesus, so whenever you read the word, whatever your reading, you are reading about Jesus,
 
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Ariel82

Guest
john 1:1, in the beginning was the word, the word was god, the word was with god,

te whole of the Bible talks about Jesus, so whenever you read the word, whatever your reading, you are reading about Jesus,
Yes we are reading about Jesus but that is not the same as saying the Bible IS Jesus. Or the seed we plant into others hearts by our words is us planting "Jesus" into their hearts.

We plant words ABOUT JESUS, which is the Gospel.

Only God can plant Jesus via the Holy spirit and cause people to be born again.
 

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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You are reading the word of God. the word that proceeded out of his mouth. That same word that came from his mouth became flesh among mankind. His word or words are his only begotten Son.. None other can take their word and make it flesh the way God did.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
The point is if people sow the Word (meaning Jesus) into others lives and not the GOSPEL.... Then the parable would be corrupted.

How does Satan steal Jesus from people hearts?

How does the world choke out Jesus from people's lives?

How does rocky ground give shallow roots to Jesus?

Is Satan, the world and rocky ground more powerful than Jesus?

No. Once Jesus is placed in a believer's heart, all of those things are rooted out and destroyed. They are spiritual strongholds that need to be torn down.

The parable is about the GOSPEL being spread to the world. Some will reject the gospel (Satan steals their understanding and blinds them). Some will nominally accept but have no true roots (stony ground). Some will accept but be doubleminded and value the world more than God's promises (thorny ground). A few will accept and bear fruit. The first fruit is being born again of the Holy spirit by confessing with one's mouth a saving faith in the Gospel.

Romans 8
23 Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies.
 
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Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
1,099
41
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I can tell the difference between a saved person and one that is not. When I got saved years ago, I ask God for one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, and he gave it to me. that gift was the gift of discernment . And it never fool me or let me down. My heart cries out to God that many on this site be saved.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
I can tell the difference between a saved person and one that is not. When I got saved years ago, I ask God for one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, and he gave it to me. that gift was the gift of discernment . And it never fool me or let me down. My heart cries out to God that many on this site be saved.
That could be useful...would you like to share your list of saved?
 
Jun 5, 2017
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The point is if people sow the Word (meaning Jesus) into others lives and not the GOSPEL.... Then the parable would be corrupted.
How does Satan steal Jesus from people hearts?
How does the world choke out Jesus from people's lives?
How does rocky ground give shallow roots to Jesus?
Is Satan, the world and rocky ground more powerful than Jesus?
No. Once Jesus is placed in a believer's heart, all of those things are rooted out and destroyed. They are spiritual strongholds that need to be torn down. The parable is about the GOSPEL being spread to the world. Some will reject the gospel (Satan steals their understanding and blinds them). Some will nominally accept but have no true roots (stony ground). Some will accept but be doubleminded and value the world more than God's promises (thorny ground). A few will accept and bear fruit. The first fruit is being born again of the Holy spirit by confessing with one's mouth a saving faith in the Gospel.
Hi Ariel,

I think the problem may be in your definition of what you think the Gospel is. Can you tell me what is your definition of "the Gospel"