Melchizadek

[BeyondET]

The Law of Moses stipulates that only the male descendants of Aaron be commissioned to serve as Jewish priests before the God of Israel and the Jewish nation. This commission is believed in Judaism to be "a covenant of everlasting priesthood" ("Brith HaKehuna") and not eligible for replacement by other tribes of Israel.

Judaic midrash (exegesis) identifies Melchizedek with Shem the son of Noah.[citation needed] Although the Book of Genesis affirms that Melchizedek was "priest of God Most High". (Genesis 14:18), The Midrash and Babylonian Talmud maintain that the priesthood held by Melchizedek, who pre-dated the patriarch Levi by five generations (Melchizedek pre-dates Aaron by six generations; Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Levi, Kehoth, Amram, Aaron) was given in his stead to Abraham who in turn passed it on to his patrilineal descendents, Isaac and then to Jacob. Midrashic literature attributes this transition as a consequence due to Melchizedek preceding the name of Abraham to that of God, such as in the Midrash Rabbah to Genesis. Tractate Nedarim. While some Jewish commentators, such as Chaim ibn Attar, write that Melchizedek gave the priesthood to Abraham willingly.

 

[oldethennew]

This talk about one having no mother or father, can very well be just that, the person didn't have a living mother or father, at the time when God made them a high priest,

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if that isn't a stretch into 'carnal thinking' I don't know what is...

 

[Enoch987]

This is physically possible for Shem and Abraham were contemporaries. In fact Shem did not die until after Isaac married. Shem would have been the oldest Patriarch of his blood line and as with many Patriarchs he would have served as the spiritual leader of the family and would have functioned as a priest in making sacrificial atonement for his people. As far as any of the rest of the speculation as to the manner of being Melchizedek was, the Hebrew writer leaves no room for speculation. He was a man.
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Shem was 450 years when Abram was born. This was 3 years after Noah died. Abram was born third. He was 75 when his dad died at 205 so he was born when Terah was 130 not 70 as the surface reading of Genesis 11 indicates. Shem died at age 600 which was 10 years after Isaac married Rebekah which was 10 years before the twins Esau and Jacob were born.

 

[BeyondET]

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if that isn't a stretch into 'carnal thinking' I don't know what is...

But of coarse that isn't new knews to me haha, I can say many things you would no doubt probably think with your carnal mind as well.

 

[Dino246]

Which men have lived on Earth and had no genealogy? Certainly Melchizadek was no normal human. He had to be Jesus because of his lack of genealogy. No father mother etc. So he was not just a man.

Please read my post #21. There is a difference between no record of genealogy and no genealogy to record.

 

[Denadii]

MATT. 17:9.
And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man,
until The Son of man be risen again from the dead.

the 'transfiguration' was a 'vision' at that time, and visions are always of the 'future', there's no such thing
as a past-vision, that is already history...

Actually, the transfiguration thing was not a vision. It was actual people standing talking. In the present. The then present that is.

 

[BeyondET]

Actually, the transfiguration thing was not a vision. It was actual people standing talking. In the present. The then present that is.

No doubt for sure,

A example of vision then spoken of in the future, would be when Jesus saw Nathanal under a fig tree, later Jesus told Nathanal about the vision that He saw of Nathanal sitting under the fig tree before Jesus spoke of it. True it may have only been a hour or so, could have days before but nonetheless a vision then spoken of after the fact.

 

[BeyondET]

Where that preacher4malice run off too, that man sure loves to stir pots.

Can, can, CAN, doesn't mean it changed to a pronoun, bird brain.

 

[preacher4truth]

Where that preacher4malice run off too, that man sure loves to stir pots.

Can, can, CAN, doesn't mean it changed to a pronoun, bird brain.

You cannot and will not accept refutation, then you resort to the immature name calling as per above. Have done this dance with you in the past, called you on it, and you still continue the same juvenile behavior.

Melchizedec is not an "Order" and not a person as you errantly proclaim from Hebrews 7:17 just as Aaron isn't a symbolic and figurative person, either, being referred to in the same in Hebrews 7:11

Scripture calls Melchizedec him a man, a person, and you've gone not only into twisting the Word to come up with a really weird false teaching, but then resort to name calling one who exposes your error.

Now if you wish to call me malicious for exposing your error, refuting your bad and inconsistent hermeneutic and twisting the Word, then so be it, but the real malice and callow behavior is in your above quoted post where you stoop to name call.

 

[preacher4truth]

It's was a simple punctuation it was nothing more than that, not a pronoun, good god. or G-d or God or GOD.

Capitulation is part of the English language it's not something written in stone and not something that is used in all language.

P4T are you trying to stir the pot with me, seems that way your making no sense.

It was more than a simple punctuation -- you stated Melchizedec is an Order, not a person. Own your own statements. By doing this you made Order a pronoun. What I am seeing as you cannot even tell the truth about what you said and not only twist what you say, but even the Word isn't out of bounds for you.

I've made perfect sense which is why you won't answer my questions -- was Aaron "an Order" too? Your hermeneutic is off base. This is why you will not answer direct questions because they show your error. You've attempted to name Melchizedec an "Order" which is quite absurd and senseless. I'd expect you to own your error but that's above you to do so.

If refuting you is stirring the pot that's sad because it says more about you than me.

 

[BeyondET]

It was more than a simple punctuation -- you stated Melchizedec is an Order, not a person. Own your own statements. By doing this you made Order a pronoun. What I am seeing as you cannot even tell the truth about what you said and not only twist what you say, but even the Word isn't out of bounds for you.

I've made perfect sense which is why you won't answer my questions -- was Aaron "an Order" too? Your hermeneutic is off base. This is why you will not answer direct questions because they show your error. You've attempted to name Melchizedec an "Order" which is quite absurd and senseless. I'd expect you to own your error but that's above you to do so.

If refuting you is stirring the pot that's sad because it says more about you than me.

You are a twister flat out, what you say is not of any truth, caping the word order means nothing, that Does not turned the word into a pronoun, but it is a example of how you twist things to try and attempt another thought, you malice a lot how do I know, you love when someone try's and cut me up, you no doubt got your rocks off on what oldethennew said, I see right through your game you stand out like a sore thumb.

Psalm 110:4 says after the order of Melchizedek

Shem was that man,

 

[preacher4truth]

You are a twister flat out, what you say is not of any truth, caping the word order means nothing, that Does not turned the word into a pronoun, but it is a example of how you twist things to try and attempt another thought, you malice a lot how do I know, you love when someone try's and cut me up, you no doubt got your rocks off on what oldethennew said, I see right through your game you stand out like a sore thumb.

Psalm 110:4 says after the order of Melchizedek

Wow...

Makes me wonder what is going on with you in the evenings as you begin to act this way as the night goes on...

You and your name calling and callow behavior is saddening. You twisted the verse, I called you on it, showed your error by comparing Hebrews 7:11 and 7:17, but you'll have none of it and simply continue to belittle and name call.

Time to file you away friend, we've been on this dance before and you resort to the same name calling nonsense now as you did then. I wish you the best in the future.

 

[Denadii]

You are a twister flat out, what you say is not of any truth, caping the word order means nothing, that Does not turned the word into a pronoun, but it is a example of how you twist things to try and attempt another thought, you malice a lot how do I know, you love when someone try's and cut me up, you no doubt got your rocks off on what oldethennew said, I see right through your game you stand out like a sore thumb.

Psalm 110:4 says after the order of Melchizedek

Shem was that man,

[h=1]Psalm 110:4 (CJB)[/h] [SUP]4 [/SUP]Adonai has sworn it,
and he will never retract —
“You are a cohen forever,
to be compared with Malki-Tzedek.”

 

[BeyondET]

Wow...

Makes me wonder what is going on with you in the evenings as you begin to act this way as the night goes on...

You and your name calling and callow behavior is saddening. You twisted the verse, I called you on it, showed your error by comparing Hebrews 7:11 and 7:17, but you'll have none of it and simply continue to belittle and name call.

Time to file you away friend, we've been on this dance before and you resort to the same name calling nonsense now as you did then. I wish you the best in the future.

Hahha your a funny idiot yea this time I am calling you a name not like before when I didn't call you a name, idiot, that is your mind and how you go off the deep end , you dog out more people than anyone here,

Good file me away, I don't forget so be it, it's your call.

 

[maverich]

sounds like some people on here could use a nap

its not about who he is, its about what he did, he served communion, he fellowshiped, he cared for abraham, and in return, as in most cases, abraham gave him a tenth of his spoils or increases,

side note glad i'm not a baby christian, reading the nasty here would make me an atheist,

 

[BeyondET]

sounds like some people on here could use a nap

its not about who he is, its about what he did, he served communion, he fellowshiped, he cared for abraham, and in return, as in most cases, abraham gave him a tenth of his spoils or increases,

side note glad i'm not a baby christian, reading the nasty here would make me an atheist,

Yup nappy nappy time to ride on out, think It's time for the red robe.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The scripture clearly states that Mechizedek is a Order not a person, and that Order doesn't have a mother or father, it's completely symbolic.

Yes, the Bible does speak of a priesthood which is "after the order of Melchizedek". But when Scripture speaks about the man himself, that is when it says that he is without father, without mother, without descent.

There is nothing symbolic about this. While Adam was the first man, therefore without father and without mother, he has no bearing on this matter. What Scripture is revealing to us is that the eternal Son of God -- whom we know as Jesus -- prior to His incarnation appeared to Abraham as the King of Salem, and offered him bread and wine. He is the only one who fits that description, since every man since Adam has had a father and mother.

Abraham in turn, gave tithes to Melchizedek, and in doing so he gave tithes figuratively on behalf of Levi. Which proves that the order of Melchizedek is far superior to that of the Levitical priesthood, which has been done away with because of the sacrifice of Christ. First God tore the veil within the Temple which separated the Holy of Holies from the Holy Place. Then He caused the Romans to destroy that Temple utterly in 70 AD. Now the only temple of any consequence is the one in Heaven itself, where the Lord Jesus Christ is the High Priest after the order of Melchizedek (a heavenly priesthood).

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

The scripture clearly states that Mechizedek is a Order not a person, and that Order doesn't have a mother or father, it's completely symbolic.

You are absolutely on the money.

In the time of the Bible, if your genealogy was not written down they said you were without father or mother. This is a Hebrew saying for your genealogy to be unknown

The Bible teach us about Jesus's second coming... and as far as I know His first coming is well documented. So unless we are missing the obvious here, Melchizedek could not have been Jesus walking as a high priest on earth.

God bless

 

[BibleExplorer]

From a Jewish perspective

Melchizedek was believed by the Jews to be Shem. The quote below is from their midrash.

"“And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine; and he was priest of God the Most High” (Genesis 14:18). Once Melchizedek, traditionally identified as Shem, placed the blessing of Abraham before the blessing of the Omnipresent..." (Talmud - Nedarim 32b) (bold emphasis mine)

Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac says in "Rashi on Genesis":

"And the Canaanite was then in the land. They (the Canaanites) were gradually conquering the land of Israel from the descendants of Shem, for it had fallen to the share of Shem when Noah apportioned the earth amongst his sons, for it is said (Genesis 14:18) “And Melchizedek) king of Salem (Jerusalem)”. For this reason the Lord said to Abram (Genesis 12:7) “to thy seed will I give this land” — “I will in some future time return it to thy children who are descendants of Shem” (Rashi on Genesis 12:6:4)

Shem had lived for 98 years before the Flood (Gen. 11:10), then he lived another 502 years. He outlived Abraham by 35 years!

http://i.imgur.com/Vslcvs0.jpg

Abraham was the son of Terah, the son of Nahor, the son of Serug, the son of Reu, the son of Peleg, the son of Eber(for whom the Hebrew language is named), etc... Everyone had their lineage, mother-father-genealogies,

So, the original readers of Hebrews might have understood Heb. 7:3 (without father, without mother, without genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life), with Shem in mind. Born before the flood, he lacked the written geneological line of ancestors from the flood to then current day. And I'm sure that as he repeatedly and continually kept outliving everybody, it would seem as if he had no beginning or end of days/life.

That being said, whether or not Melchizedek was Shem or not, I'm not sure there's enough evidence to say for certain.

 

[BeyondET]

You are absolutely on the money.

In the time of the Bible, if your genealogy was not written down they said you were without father or mother. This is a Hebrew saying for your genealogy to be unknown

The Bible teach us about Jesus's second coming... and as far as I know His first coming is well documented. So unless we are missing the obvious here, Melchizedek could not have been Jesus walking as a high priest on earth.

God bless

Yes I agree, and I find it quite disturbing how some groups have took this and has ran with it, one being the seven day latter saints, they believe that this man was from a another planet pretty much saying a alien from outer space the deception is through the roof, this concept of that Melchizedek thing about not having a genetic father or mother linked to the first man created is a disception.

God hasn't change a thing or His ways, God tossed man and woman out of the garden because of sin, God wiped out the whole earth except for 8 people because of sin, God sent his only son who carried the world sin on his shoulders. how because Jesus was born into the world like every person has since Adam and Eve from the womb of the woman. God isn't going to bypass this sin linage that every person on this earth is affected by, and has always been affected, God did not create a man that bypassed generations upon generations of affected gens. Yes God can create a human anytime He wants too, He can create a billion humans in a blink of an eye, but if He did with Mechizedek that would be bypassing a lot of things He had cursed the ground and man for doing.