Green horse?

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posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#21
Jul 31, 2013
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#21
Depleted said:
I know English is English and Greek isn't English, but I'm wondering (anyway) if it might not be related somehow to what Americans mean by a green horse. My cousins used to say things like, "Watch it. That horse is green." Not knowing jack about horses, I had to ask the obvious question.

A green horse is untrained, wild, not-yet broken.

I'd get into the etymology of the word, but I don't know how, since that's not the usual definition of green.
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i'm having trouble reasoning out "Death" riding an untrained horse.

and, the other horses are all described with colors that seem to be, well, colors.
colors that aren't necessarily natural horsecoat colors. in verse 4, the word describing the color of the "red" horse is "pyrros" which has a pretty clear meaning of being the color of flames - personally i think saying a chestnut or even blood-bay horse is the color of flames is quite a bit of a stretch.

i don't doubt the colors are meant to have meaning. i also don't doubt that "green" has a meaning, too, but my intuition is that chloros probably didn't have the connotation of "noob" that "green" has nowadays..

i'd love to hear that argument tho! wouldn't it be something if it's true?
haha "death is a noob - the Bible says so, Rev. 6:8"

;):confused:
 
O

oldethennew

Banned
#22
Feb 28, 2016
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#22
in Hebrew,
two meanings can mean, 'pestilence and death'...
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#24
#24
Willie-T said:
Off the top of my head, Mark 6:39.......... and just to keep it in the same language of the same author of the same book, Rev. 8:7 and 9:4.
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Ha! Killed my theory at first verse. No logical reason for Jesus to have people sit in wild, unbroken grass. He wanted to feed them, not lose them. lol
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#25
#25
posthuman said:

i'm having trouble reasoning out "Death" riding an untrained horse.

and, the other horses are all described with colors that seem to be, well, colors.
colors that aren't necessarily natural horsecoat colors. in verse 4, the word describing the color of the "red" horse is "pyrros" which has a pretty clear meaning of being the color of flames - personally i think saying a chestnut or even blood-bay horse is the color of flames is quite a bit of a stretch.

i don't doubt the colors are meant to have meaning. i also don't doubt that "green" has a meaning, too, but my intuition is that chloros probably didn't have the connotation of "noob" that "green" has nowadays..

i'd love to hear that argument tho! wouldn't it be something if it's true?
haha "death is a noob - the Bible says so, Rev. 6:8"

;):confused:
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Sorry, that theory held up about as long as rice paper in a hailstorm. lol
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#27
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
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#27
Etheridge Peshitta says this

~Rev 6:8 And I saw a green horse,[Susio Uroko.] and he who sat upon him had the name of Death, and Shiul followed after him. And there was given to him power over the fourth of the earth, to kill with the sword, and with famine, and with death, and with the toothed beast of the earth.

maybe susio uroko is a clue.

The Hebrew to English says a pallid, sickly -looking horse..


 
D

Dreamlogger

Guest
#28
#28
The horse is "chloros", I think, which is pale green, a color which is sometimes seen in a corpse. I had a dream once in which God showed me the faceplate of the rider on that horse! The faceplate was pale green, and a voice said (If I've remembered correctly), "The rider on the pale horse is Death." It wasn't a pretty green, more like the colour of old, dried-out slime, like you might see on a concrete wall. Kind of like the pale green of avocado flesh.
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#29
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
0
#29
Dreamlogger said:
The horse is "chloros", I think, which is pale green, a color which is sometimes seen in a corpse. I had a dream once in which God showed me the faceplate of the rider on that horse! The faceplate was pale green, and a voice said (If I've remembered correctly), "The rider on the pale horse is Death." It wasn't a pretty green, more like the colour of old, dried-out slime, like you might see on a concrete wall. Kind of like the pale green of avocado flesh.
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Does that jibe well with the meanings of the other three places I posted that the same word, Chloros, was used.... two of them in the same book, by the same writer?
 
D

Dreamlogger

Guest
#30
#30
I think John was just using the word to mean "green". Some translators have decided to use the word "pale" in this spot, and "green" in the other two spots. So the real question is, "Why was the horse green? How is that a reference to death?" So the sickly green of some corpses is the right green in this spot, even though it's a different green than the one we see in leaves and grass (which, by the way, contain chlorophyll).
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#31
Feb 7, 2015
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#31
The reader who perseveres through the analyses which many of us have espoused here may naturally ask, ‘How much of all this did the congregations of the Seven Churches comprehend, when the apocalyptic pastoral of their archbishop was read out to them?

The answer is, no doubt, that of the schematic analysis to which we resort, they understood nothing, because they were listening to the Apocalypse of St. John, and not to the lucubrations (geek speak) of the present writers.

They were men of his own generation, they constantly heard the Old Testament in their assemblies, and were trained by the preacher (who might be St. John himself) to interpret it by certain conventions. And so, without intellectual analysis, they would receive the symbols simply for what they were. They would understand what they would understand, and that would be as much as they had time to digest.

We love to butcher it all up so much more.
 
Innerfire89

Innerfire89

Senior Member
#32
Aug 23, 2017
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#32
Choloros can also mean yellowish green or ashen, ashen is an adjective meaning ashy like from a fire or a living thing that looks ill or or frightened. Being that subject is a horse that is being described it makes sense to me that one of these definition fit.
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#34
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
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#34
Innerfire89 said:
Choloros can also mean yellowish green or ashen, ashen is an adjective meaning ashy like from a fire or a living thing that looks ill or or frightened. Being that subject is a horse that is being described it makes sense to me that one of these definition fit.
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That is the entire point. He said "green", and I think he meant GREEN. Yet the KJV translators felt they had to change the word so that it would sound like the believable color of a real horse................ while they have no trouble, at all, in all the rest of those ten headed and seven horned beasts, etc. being exactly what John said he saw.

Why could he not have simply seen a GREEN horse?
 
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Depleted

Guest
#36
#36
Innerfire89 said:
Choloros can also mean yellowish green or ashen, ashen is an adjective meaning ashy like from a fire or a living thing that looks ill or or frightened. Being that subject is a horse that is being described it makes sense to me that one of these definition fit.
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Ashen is gray. Ashy is gray. When I was waiting on hubby getting treated in the ER, a nurse told me that when she first saw him, she knew it was very bad because he looked gray. (Meanwhile, I hadn't noticed that at all. :() When frightened the cliche is "you look as white as a sheet." Not green. Not even gray. :confused:
 
Corbinscam

Corbinscam

Senior Member
#37
Jul 17, 2016
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#37
I'd never looked at this....interesting.
I also find it interesting that people look at it and say "Well since a pale horse is common and more normal that must be what he meant". Since when was anything about Revelation common and normal. Why must we assume what we think makes the most sense is the obvious answer?
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#38
Jul 31, 2013
37,426
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#38
I only see "ashen" given as a legitimate usage of chloros on sites that are dedicated to promoting the kjv, and it seems they are getting this from concordances not dictionaries..?

Which would be assuming the conclusion to use it as proof of itself, a logical fallacy.
 
Corbinscam

Corbinscam

Senior Member
#39
Jul 17, 2016
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#39
posthuman said:
I only see "ashen" given as a legitimate usage of chloros on sites that are dedicated to promoting the kjv, and it seems they are getting this from concordances not dictionaries..?

Which would be assuming the conclusion to use it as proof of itself, a logical fallacy.
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That's what I'm seeing too. Since kjv can't be wrong or have error this must be right :p
 
Innerfire89

Innerfire89

Senior Member
#40
Aug 23, 2017
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#40
Depleted said:
Ashen is gray. Ashy is gray. When I was waiting on hubby getting treated in the ER, a nurse told me that when she first saw him, she knew it was very bad because he looked gray. (Meanwhile, I hadn't noticed that at all. :() When frightened the cliche is "you look as white as a sheet." Not green. Not even gray. :confused:
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I should've been clearer, chloros can mean yellowish green or it can mean ashen. I didn't mean that ashen and yellowish green are the same thing
 
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