Sabbath

[LoveGodForever]

Hi Dave

Nice to see you again. Please forgive me if I cant respond to your posts right away as I can't get online as much as would like to of late due to family and work. I noticed a lot of repetition in your post and I may have to break up my reply into a number of shorter posts to fit them in. For your consideration below.

Originally Posted by LoveGodForever 1. Why would God need to give His Law again when he had already given it to God's people 430 years earlier in the time of Moses?
Why are we Christians taught we are no longer under the Law, but under the law of Liberty?

What does it mean to be under the Law? It can mean a number of things in the New Testament. Here are some of the scriptures.

To be "Under the Law" means to be convicted by the Law of God as a sinner because we do not know what sin is without God’s Law because sin is the transgression of God’s Law and it gives us a knowledge of what sin is and leads us to Jesus (1 John 3:4; Rom 3:20; Rom 7:7; Gal 3:24)

Rom 2:12-13
"All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified."

Rom 3:19
Now we know that what things soever the law says, it says to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Rom 3:9
What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin


To be "Under the works of the Law" means to try and earn your salvation through trying to keep God's Law.

Rom 9:32
Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.

Gal 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Gal 3:2
This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

What is the law of liberty you say we are now under?

Jam 2:8, If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
Jam 2:9, But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
Jam 2:10, For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
Jam 2:11, For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
Jam 2:12, So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

The law of liberty is God’s 10 commandments because the lead the sinner to the Saviour and to the Christian they are no longer commandments but God’s promises as we have faith in His Word. Jesus says;

John 8:31-32, Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
John 8:34, Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
John 8:36, If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

God's Word says that God's Law of Liberty is the 10 commandments. This would include the 7th Day Sabbath which is one of the 10 (Ex 20:8-11)

In Christ Always!

 

[LoveGodForever]

Continued...

Men which teach we are to keep commandments given to the Isralites under the OLD Covenant, or believe the Apostle John who plainly and clearly tells us what HIS COMMANDMENTS are? Do you believe the Apostle John when he tells us what His Commandments are, or do you believe His commandments are something other than what the inspired by God, Holy Ghost filled Apostle just told us His Commandments were? People, believe the Word of God, NOT what men teach.

Who are Israel?

Israel" is only a name given by God himself to represent his people. It has its origin from Gen 32:28 where Jacob wrestled with the Angel and prevailed ...for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. Its meaning is his posterity will rule as God. Jacob had 12 sons representing the 12 tribes of Israel. This is God's people and today anyone the is following Jesus is part of God's spiritual Israel according to God's Word. The same New Covenant is written for God's people who are now spiritual Israel following. Scripture support;

Gal 3:28-29,
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Col 3:11,
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Rom 10:11-13,
For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Rom 2:28-29,
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Jer 31:33-4,
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, says the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Heb 8:10-12,
For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Heb 10:14-17,
For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, this is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; and their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Gal 3:29,
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise

The New Covenant is for Spiritual Israel which represent God’s followers the believers. Jesus, God's Law (10 commandments) through love are the foundation of all the covenants and also the Judgement to come. I do in deed believe God’s Word how about you?

In Christ Always!

 

[LoveGodForever]

[FONT=&quot]Originally Posted by LoveGodForever [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The Sabbath is all through the old and New Testament and Jesus and the disciples kept it. Jesus says he made it for mankind and he is the Lord of the Sabbath. (Gen 2:1-3; Mark 2:27-28 all the others you ignore)[/FONT][FONT=&quot] It does not say he is the Sabbath.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jesus and the Apostles kept all 600+ commandments of Moses. Are you indicating that we also should keep all 640+ commandments of the Old testament too, because Jesus and the Apostles all kept them? Seriously?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot] The change to the New Covenant is the fulfilment of the prophetic laws of Moses which included much of the ceremonial, ecclesiastical laws pertaining to burnt offerings, meat and drink offerings and all the annual Jewish festivals that where prophetic in nature teaching God’s people the plan of salvation and the coming of the New Covenant we have in Jesus.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]God’s Law (10 commandments) had a similar role in the Old Covenant as it does in the New Covenant and that is to point out sin and the standard of God’s righteousness.

(1) God’s Law point out what sin is and the punishment of sin which is death (Rom 3:20; 1[/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 3:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]).[/FONT][FONT=&quot] It was never a cure for sin. But it was the work of God which is forever and the foundation of the Old Covenant, the New Covenant and the Judgement to come.
(Ex 32:16; Ex 31:18; 31:18; Ex 20:1-22; Deut 10:5; Rom 3:20; 1[/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 3:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]; Rom 6:23; Heb 7:19; Ecc 12:13-14, [/FONT][FONT=&quot]James 2:10-12[/FONT][FONT=&quot], 1[/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 3:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot], Acts 17:31; Ps 111:7-8; Rev 12:17; 14:12; 22:14; 1[/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 3:5-8[/FONT][FONT=&quot]; 1[/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 2:3-4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]; Ecc 3:14)

(2) The laws of Moses however were the prescriptive cure for sin with all the Levitical and ceremonial laws, burnt offerings, annual feast days foretelling the plan of salvation which were connected to Feast days with New Moon sabbaths, food and drink offerings and other Holy days. These where all types pointing to Jesus and the plan of salvation and were nailed to the cross with our sins because they are now fulfilled. Now that Jesus is here we are under the New Covenant. Jesus is our Passover and the lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world and as no longer need to provide burnt offerings when we sin to seek forgiveness.

(Lev 1:1-13; Lev 23:1-44; Num 28:1-31; 29:1-40; Deut 24:10-11; Ex 24:3; Deut 31:24-26; Col 2:16-16; Heb 10:1; Eph 2:14-15; Lev 4; 5; 6; Heb 4:14; 9;10; [/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 1:29[/FONT][FONT=&quot]; [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Hebrew Chapters 8; 9; 10; 2Cor 5:6-7)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is the laws of Moses that are nailed to the cross (Col 2:14) not the 10 commandments (James 2:8-12)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jam 2:8-12 [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]8, If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well: 9, But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. 10, For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. 11, For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.12, So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This includes God’s 7[SUP]th[/SUP] Day Sabbath.

In Christ Always!
[/FONT]

 

[LoveGodForever]

Continued…

i have read the entire Bible front to back over 80 times and sayest thou to me, i do not know the Word? That is like unto a person telling you do not understand that Movie because I have seen it four times to a person who has watched it 80 times. i read the entire Bible 3 times before i was 12 years old. If you were to ask anyone who knows me personally, they would all tell you that they do not know a person who knows the Bible more. If i am bragging it is because you have provoked me to do so. But what better bragging can there be then reading and breathing and eating the Word of God. i Love it, I LIVE IT. What kind of prophet would i be if God did not reveal to me the understanding of the Word of God, which i was born to teach to a people who would reject it?

Ok. So you are a prophet? So out of curiosity what makes you believe you are a prophet?

Isaiah 8:20
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Originally Posted by LoveGodForever Sunday Worship is a teaching and tradition of man.
Sunday Worship, Saturday Worship, Monday Worship, God is pleased if a person Worships PERIOD. ONLY men are concerned which day to Worship. Do you want to know which Day is acceptable to God to worship Him? Pay attention here. Any Day is acceptable with God, Every Day is even better. This generation will fight and argue over which Day is the best day to worship the Lord. EVERY DAY is acceptable with Him.

Absolutely! We must worship God everyday but God has always asked his people to keep the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] Day as a Holy day because it is a memorial of creation. It is a sign that God’s people worship the only true God of creation. Jesus is the Lord of this day and made this day for His people to spend time with him. It is a sign of the true followers of God’s Word (Gen 2:1-3; Ex 20:8-11; Exe 20:20; Mark 2:27-28; James 2:8-12; Rev 14:12)

In Christ Always!

 

[LoveGodForever]

Originally Posted by DiscipleDave Answer me this question. The verses : Exo 34:27 And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel. (Notice this covenant was made SPECIFICALLY to Moses and ISRAEL. NOBODY ELSE) Exo 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments. Answer me this question. What covenant was this referring to? If you answered "Old Covenant" you are correct, if you answered something other than OLD COVENANT, you got the question wrong.

Absolutely! Great question keep in mind that the context of Ex 34:27-28 is the ceremonial laws of Moses that God asked Him to write in His book (Ex 34:18-27). It is the ceremonial laws of Moses that are no longer required today because they were fulfilled at the cross (Col 2:14). God Law (the 10 commandments) are forever and part of the new Covenant.

The Law of God (10 commandments) is the work of God (Ex 32:16)whatsoever God does is forever nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecc 3:14). God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Ps 19:7). It is the very foundation of the Old and New Covenants and the Judgement to come (Ex 20:1:17, Heb 8:10-12; Exe 36:26-27; Jer 31:33-34).

God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Ex 20:1-22). God’s 10 commandments are the spoken word of God (Ex 20:1-22). God’s Word does not pass away (Matt 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Ps 111:7-8, Rev 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1John 3:5-8, 1John 2:3-4; James 2:8-12 etc.). God’s Law reveals sin to us and the penalty of sin so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Rom 6:23; Rom 3:20; 1John 3:4). It is the great standard of the judgement (Heb 10:26-28; Rom 1:29-32;2:-9;2Cor 5:10; Heb 9:27; Ecc 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1John 3:4, Acts 17:31). God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood as we have faith (Gal 3:24; Rev 1:5). God writes His Law in our hearts so that we become like him and we follow him because we love him (Heb 8:10-12) LOVE is the fulfilling (doing) of God's Law (Rom 13:10). This is why Jesus says to those that love him If you love me keep my commandments (John 14:15) and the 4th commandment (7th Day Sabbath) is one of them. We love Jesus so we follow him.

In Christ Always!

 

[LoveGodForever]

[FONT=&quot]Originally Posted by LoveGodForever [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4. Where is the 3rd commandment in the New Testament that says not to take the Lords name in vain? Because it is not in the New Testament does that now mean we can take God's name in vain? (Serious?)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Answer me this. if i take the Lords Name in vain, am i then going to Hell? What, i can lose my Salvation if i take the Lord's name in vain? If i do NOT keep the Sabbath, what then? Am i Hell bound? Do i then become UNSAVED because i fail to keep the Sabbath? Answer?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]The gift of God is for all. God calls his people to repentance from breaking His Law but never forces anyone to do anything. In times of ignorance God ‘winks at but when I knowledge of the truth comes calls all men everywhere to repentance. From Genesis to revelations the judgements of God have only ever been given to mankind because of unrepentant sin. As it was in the days of Noah and Sodom so shall it be when the son of man cometh. If anyone continues in unrepentant sin is this person saved or lost at His coming? Are they a believer or an unbeliever? Who are saved the believers or the unbelievers? If God asks me as a believer to do something and I do not do it, am I a believer or an unbeliever?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 17:30 [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men everywhere to repent:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1 John 3:4[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Sin is the transgression of God’s Law[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Romans 6:23[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The wages of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life though Christ Jesus our Lord[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Pro 28:13 [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]He that covers his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesses and forsakes them shall have mercy.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Isa 55:6-7, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

The 7th Day Sabbath is one of the 10 commandments given to us by God himself. Jesus asks us to keep it and we should follow the Word of God over the traditions of man. Sunday Worship is a man made tradition and God has not commanded us to keep this day as a Holy day in all of the Bible. Who do we follow God or man?

In Christ!
[/FONT]

 

[LoveGodForever]

i believe God's Word, i just don't believe mens word which teaches things that God's Word does not teach. For example Jesus nor any Apostle EVER taught us Christians to keep the Sabbath. That is what men of the last day teach, trying to add extra burdens to the servants of the Lord.

Then why do you not believe God’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] commandment which is the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] Day Sabbath? Sunday Worship is a teaching and tradition of man over the Word of God. Did you hear what the Catholic Church says about Sunday Worship?

<strong><span style="font-family: &amp;amp">[video=youtube;CrB21mc2fmI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrB21mc2fmI&amp;feature=youtu.be[/video]

Mat 15:3-9,
3, But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? 4, For God commanded, saying, Honor thy father and mother: and, He that curses father or mother, let him die the death. 5, But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou might be profited by me; 6, And honor not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. 7, Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, 8, This people draws nigh unto me with their mouth, and honors me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. 9, But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

What did Jesus and the Apostles teach about the Sabbath in the New Testament?

1. It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56)
2. Jesus made the Sabbath for all mankind (Mark 2:27)
3. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath (Mark 2:28)
4. If you do not believe and follow God you cannot enter His Sabbath rest (Hebrews 4)
5. It is one of God’s 10 commandments we break it we are guilty or breaking all (James 2:8-12)
6. Breaking it is sin (1 John 3:4)
7. God’s true followers keep it Holy as God commanded (Rev 14:12; Rev 22:14; Eze 20:20)
8. Jesus is our example and kept the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56John 2:6; Matt 16:24; 1 Cor 11:1; Eph 5:1-21; Pet 2:20-22)
9. The Apostle kept the Sabbath (Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Rev 1:10)

Who should we follow God or man?

 

[LoveGodForever]

Originally Posted by LoveGodForever
My questions to you have not been answered;
i am certain you can't reveal to me one question that you have asked me, that i have not answered.

Ok please show me one scripture from God's Word that answers one question below?

The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?

Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?

Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?

That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?

That tells us to keep the first day in honour of the resurrection of Christ?

Where the first day is ever given any sacred name?

That affirms that any of the apostles ever kept the first day as the Sabbath?

From any apostolic writings that authorizes Sunday observance as the Sabbath of God?

Where we are told not to work on the first day of the week?

That says the seventh day is no longer God's Sabbath day?

That says the seventh day Sabbath is ABOLISHED?

Where the apostles ever taught any convert to keep the first day of the week as a Sabbath?

Where the first day was ever appointed to be kept as the Lord's Day?

Where the first day of the week is ever called the Lord's Day?

That says that the first day of the week was ever sanctified and hallowed as a day of rest?

That says that the Father or the Son (Jesus) rested on the first day of the week?

That says that Jesus, Paul or any other of the apostles taught anyone to observe the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

That calls the seventh day the “Jewish Sabbath” or one text that calls Sunday the “Christian Sabbath”?

Telling man to keep the first day of the week holy or to worship or rest on the first day of the week?

Authorizing anyone to set aside God's Sabbath and observe any other day?

Showing any of the apostles keeping the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

Authorizing someone to set aside the fourth Commandment and observe any other day of the week?

Where any apostle taught us to keep the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

Declaring that the seventh day is no longer the Eternal Sabbath day?

Where Sunday is now appointed to be kept as the New Testament Sabbath or holy day?

I may be away for for a bit... I will come back as I have time.

If you cannot answer any of the above, who should we obey God or man?

In Christ Always!

 

[tourist]

"Remember to keep holy the Sabbath" is the fourth commandment and the only one that says to "Remember". I don't believe that there is any passage in the bible that states to "Forget about the Sabbath". I believe that there are those, myself included at times, who would rather just forget about the Sabbath because following it to avoid inconvenience.

 

[loveme1]

"Remember to keep holy the Sabbath" is the fourth commandment and the only one that says to "Remember". I don't believe that there is any passage in the bible that states to "Forget about the Sabbath". I believe that there are those, myself included at times, who would rather just forget about the Sabbath because following it to avoid inconvenience.

Such an honest post... until grevious becomes delight it is not love.

 

[JohnTalmid]

Really love y'all. Shalom shalom John Talmid

 

[Grandpa]

Ok please show me one scripture from God's Word that answers one question below?

The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?

Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?

Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?

That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?

That tells us to keep the first day in honour of the resurrection of Christ?

Where the first day is ever given any sacred name?

That affirms that any of the apostles ever kept the first day as the Sabbath?

From any apostolic writings that authorizes Sunday observance as the Sabbath of God?

Where we are told not to work on the first day of the week?

That says the seventh day is no longer God's Sabbath day?

That says the seventh day Sabbath is ABOLISHED?

Where the apostles ever taught any convert to keep the first day of the week as a Sabbath?

Where the first day was ever appointed to be kept as the Lord's Day?

Where the first day of the week is ever called the Lord's Day?

That says that the first day of the week was ever sanctified and hallowed as a day of rest?

That says that the Father or the Son (Jesus) rested on the first day of the week?

That says that Jesus, Paul or any other of the apostles taught anyone to observe the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

That calls the seventh day the “Jewish Sabbath” or one text that calls Sunday the “Christian Sabbath”?

Telling man to keep the first day of the week holy or to worship or rest on the first day of the week?

Authorizing anyone to set aside God's Sabbath and observe any other day?

Showing any of the apostles keeping the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

Authorizing someone to set aside the fourth Commandment and observe any other day of the week?

Where any apostle taught us to keep the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

Declaring that the seventh day is no longer the Eternal Sabbath day?

Where Sunday is now appointed to be kept as the New Testament Sabbath or holy day?

I may be away for for a bit... I will come back as I have time.

If you cannot answer any of the above, who should we obey God or man?

In Christ Always!

Galatians 3:2-3
[FONT=&quot]2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Galatians 3:10-12
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Galatians 3:24-25
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Romans 8:3-4
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Hebrews 7:11-12
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

Hebrews 7:15-16
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

Hebrews 7:18-19
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

Hebrews 4:3-4
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

Hebrews 4:10-11
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Romans 3:20-22
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Romans 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Matthew 11:25-30
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]26 Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

2 Corinthians 3:13-16
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]13 And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.[/FONT]

 

[LoveGodForever]

Galatians 3:2-3
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Galatians 3:10-12

10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Galatians 3:24-25

24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Romans 8:3-4

3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Hebrews 7:11-12

11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

Hebrews 7:15-16

15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

Hebrews 7:18-19

18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

Hebrews 4:3-4

3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

Hebrews 4:10-11

10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Romans 3:20-22

20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Romans 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Matthew 11:25-30

25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.
26 Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight.
27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

2 Corinthians 3:13-16

13 And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:
14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Grandpa,

All those wonderful scripture and none of them answered one question. Maybe you need to re-read the questions again.

Ok please show me one scripture from God's Word that answers one question below?

The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?

Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?

Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?

That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?

That tells us to keep the first day in honour of the resurrection of Christ?

Where the first day is ever given any sacred name?

That affirms that any of the apostles ever kept the first day as the Sabbath?

From any apostolic writings that authorizes Sunday observance as the Sabbath of God?

Where we are told not to work on the first day of the week?

That says the seventh day is no longer God's Sabbath day?

That says the seventh day Sabbath is ABOLISHED?

Where the apostles ever taught any convert to keep the first day of the week as a Sabbath?

Where the first day was ever appointed to be kept as the Lord's Day?

Where the first day of the week is ever called the Lord's Day?

That says that the first day of the week was ever sanctified and hallowed as a day of rest?

That says that the Father or the Son (Jesus) rested on the first day of the week?

That says that Jesus, Paul or any other of the apostles taught anyone to observe the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

That calls the seventh day the “Jewish Sabbath” or one text that calls Sunday the “Christian Sabbath”?

Telling man to keep the first day of the week holy or to worship or rest on the first day of the week?

Authorizing anyone to set aside God's Sabbath and observe any other day?

Showing any of the apostles keeping the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

Authorizing someone to set aside the fourth Commandment and observe any other day of the week?

Where any apostle taught us to keep the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

Declaring that the seventh day is no longer the Eternal Sabbath day?

Where Sunday is now appointed to be kept as the New Testament Sabbath or holy day?

I may be away for for a bit... I will come back as I have time.

If you cannot answer any of the above, who should we obey God or man?

In Christ Always!

 

[sparkman]

Here are my two cents as an Adventist. When people claim that if we want to keep the Sabbath, we have to do so in a certain way other than what was expressed in the 10 commandments. The 10 Commandments say that during the Sabbath we are not to work and Isa 58:13 tells us more of what should not be done during the Sabbath, but it also says that Sabbath should be a delight: If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words: Sabbath is a day of rest from the things we do during the week, like buying selling, working for money, or other secular persuits. The Sabbath is a day that we can spend time with God and his people without worrying about things that would stress us during the week. We can definitely seek God all week, that is not what we Adventists say, we just say that God does have a holy day and that he sanctified it from the foundation of the Earth according to Genesis 2:1-3. Sunday or any other day is not the holy day of God and to believe so is error. Worshiping on Sunday is a tradition, not a biblical mandate. Jesus condemned the Pharisees for trepassing the commandment of God by their tradition. Jesus also say that those who keeps man's commandments are worshiping him in vain in Matt. 15:9 and Mark 7:7. If you are convinced that you do not need to keep the Sabbath, then ok, but I will do the safe thing and follow Jesus and keep the Sabbath.

Days and meats are things individuals can have differences on. However, most Sabbathkeepers claim that those who don't keep the Sabbath are either under the Mark of the Beast or will be in the end times.

Additionally, the claim is often made that the Roman Catholic Church is the Great Whore of Babylon mentioned in Revelation 17, and that Protestants are the "daughters" of this Prostitute. So, there is a slanderous element within many Sabbathkeeper organizations concerning non-observers. Some hide it better.

As an Armstrongite, that was my view. I considered non-Sabbathkeepers to be unbelievers. Some other organizations consider non-Sabbathkeepers to be believers, but ignorant and deceived ones.

My position, as an ex Sabbathkeeper, is that Colossians 2:16-17, as well as Romans 14, make days and meats irrelevant. Many of the NT believers were slaves who could rest on no day, and Sabbath-keeping and eating unclean meats were never mentioned as sins in Paul's epistles in any of the sin lists. Faith in Jesus and his atoning sacrifice is the relevant thing. I feel no more sensitivity to the Sabbath as I do to physical circumcision. Both are part of the Mosaic Covenant, and I'm not a part of it.

Additionally, there are few sound organizations that observe the Sabbath...some Messianic Jews observe Sabbaths and Festivals, and are sound (Jews for Jesus), but there are none around here. Armstrongites (the group I was affiliated with) believe they are going to become God in the resurrection. SDAs adopt non-biblical dietary restrictions and their health care facilities perform elective abortions. Many Messianic groups deny the full deity of Jesus Christ, the Trinity, and the writings of Paul. I'll stick with my Evangelical Free church....they know more about salvation and sound theology than "lawkeeper" groups, and have evidenced apparent spiritual fruits to me.

By the way, if I was going to observe the Sabbath, I'd observe the festivals and clean meat laws too..but none of those things are relevant since the Mosaic covenant is not in effect (Acts 15, Galatians 3-4, II Corinthians 3, Romans 7:1-6, Ephesians 2:13-15, Hebrews 7-8).

 

[sparkman]

Days and meats are things individuals can have differences on. However, most Sabbathkeepers claim that those who don't keep the Sabbath are either under the Mark of the Beast or will be in the end times.

Additionally, the claim is often made that the Roman Catholic Church is the Great Whore of Babylon mentioned in Revelation 17, and that Protestants are the "daughters" of this Prostitute. So, there is a slanderous element within many Sabbathkeeper organizations concerning non-observers. Some hide it better.

As an Armstrongite, that was my view. I considered non-Sabbathkeepers to be unbelievers. Some other organizations consider non-Sabbathkeepers to be believers, but ignorant and deceived ones.

My position, as an ex Sabbathkeeper, is that Colossians 2:16-17, as well as Romans 14, make days and meats irrelevant. Many of the NT believers were slaves who could rest on no day, and Sabbath-keeping and eating unclean meats were never mentioned as sins in Paul's epistles in any of the sin lists. Faith in Jesus and his atoning sacrifice is the relevant thing. I feel no more sensitivity to the Sabbath as I do to physical circumcision. Both are part of the Mosaic Covenant, and I'm not a part of it.

Additionally, there are few sound organizations that observe the Sabbath...some Messianic Jews observe Sabbaths and Festivals, and are sound (Jews for Jesus), but there are none around here. Armstrongites (the group I was affiliated with) believe they are going to become God in the resurrection. SDAs adopt non-biblical dietary restrictions and their health care facilities perform elective abortions. Many Messianic groups deny the full deity of Jesus Christ, the Trinity, and the writings of Paul. I'll stick with my Evangelical Free church....they know more about salvation and sound theology than "lawkeeper" groups, and have evidenced apparent spiritual fruits to me.

By the way, if I was going to observe the Sabbath, I'd observe the festivals and clean meat laws too..but none of those things are relevant since the Mosaic covenant is not in effect (Acts 15, Galatians 3-4, II Corinthians 3, Romans 7:1-6, Ephesians 2:13-15, Hebrews 7-8).

I should also add that the above groups often rely on extra-biblical sources of revelation. Hebrew Roots/Torah observers/Messianics often rely on Jewish writings. Seventh Day Adventists consider Ellen G. White's writings to be authoritative, or at least many of them do. I have met very few that will reject her as a prophetess. Sylven, a chatter who passed away recently, was one of the few exceptions.

I'm also concerned that SDAs don't really believe the Trinity. I understand from multiple sources that they consider the Trinity doctrine to be "Roman Catholic". They say they believe in a Trinity, but not the "Roman Catholic Trinity". The Roman Catholic Trinity is the same as the evangelical doctrine of the Trinity. There is one God yet three Persons, each co-essential and co-eternal. If I'm not mistaken, SDAs deny the co-essentiality of the three Persons. If so, then they have no coherent explanation of unity with Christ that believers enjoy. Since the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are co-essential, this is perfectly coherent with the evangelical doctrine of the Trinity. Jesus dwells in the believer through the Holy Spirit, and this is coherent with the evangelical doctrine of the Trinity.

Maybe there are differences of opinion in this regard, but I asked a SDA pastor about the Trinity doctrine, and he told me that he didn't believe in the "Roman Catholic Trinity". From other ex SDAs I get the idea that it is co-essentiality that they have an issue with, and they are basically tri-theists...and the major issue is understanding co-essentiality.

 

[Snoozy]

another issue that only comes up when not rightly dividing the word of truth.
sabbath is for israel. not to the church. case closed.

Colossians 2:16

 

[Snoozy]

the people who promote and obsess over sabbath keeping are usually fake israelites from the synagogue of satan or they are replacement theology folks from the SDA cult.

 

[LoveGodForever]

Some interesting scripture for those that do not know it....

Mat 22:29,
Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

Mat 15:3-9,
3, But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? 4, For God commanded, saying, Honor thy father and mother: and, He that curses father or mother, let him die the death. 5, But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou might be profited by me; 6, And honor not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. 7, Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, 8, This people draws nigh unto me with their mouth, and honor me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. 9, But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Hebrews 6:4-8,
4, For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost 5, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. 7, For the earth which drinks in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and brings forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: 8, But that which bears thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Hebrews 10:26-27,
For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Isaiah 55:6,
6, Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: 7, Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

John 12:47-48,
47, And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
48, He that rejects me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judges him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

 

[Snoozy]

Some interesting scripture for those that do not know it....

Mat 22:29,
Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

Mat 15:3-9,
3, But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? 4, For God commanded, saying, Honor thy father and mother: and, He that curses father or mother, let him die the death. 5, But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou might be profited by me; 6, And honor not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. 7, Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, 8, This people draws nigh unto me with their mouth, and honor me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. 9, But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Hebrews 6:4-8,
4, For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost 5, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. 7, For the earth which drinks in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and brings forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: 8, But that which bears thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Hebrews 10:26-27,
For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Isaiah 55:6,
6, Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: 7, Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

John 12:47-48,
47, And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
48, He that rejects me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judges him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

these got nothing to do with the sabbath. are u trying to say people who dont keep the sabbath arent saved? edited: i clicked on the link in your signature and u are in the sda garbage cult so now i know what to expect, which is trash teachings and strange ideas. salvation isnt in Jesus' blood but now its in keeping the israeli sabbath? u are not israel. u are a fake israelite who belongs to the sda cult wake up and leave. its a works based salvation its trash. salvation based upon keeping the sabbath is not the gospel.

 

[loveme1]

another issue that only comes up when not rightly dividing the word of truth.
sabbath is for israel. not to the church. case closed.

Colossians 2:16

If that is your belief then continue but for those willing the case is far from closed... and may they in their liberty under Grace love and obey His Teachings.

I know not how this Truth is so rejected but judge not.. knowing that Truth is either believed or rejected yet should never be a reason to pick up stones.. because that is taught against in the Law of Faith... Law of Love..