Not By Works

[Hizikyah]

Anywhere the law is preached it produces a mind-hardening and a heart-hardening veil. (2 Corinthians 3:14-15

2 Corinthians 3:14-15 3:14, "But their minds were hardened, for to this day, when the old covenant is being read, that same veil remains, not lifted, because in Messiah it is taken away."3:15, "But to this day, when Mosheh is being read, a veil lies on their heart."

Yeah because they at this time it was written were still sacrificing animals.

Hebrews 9:11-12, "But the Messiah came near as a High Priest over the righteous things to come, with the great and more perfect tabernacle not made with hands, that is, not of this creation; Nor through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood He entered the Most Holy Place once, for all, having obtained eternal redemption."

Mat 22:36-40, "Teacher, what is the greatest commandment in the Law? Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might (Deuteronomy 6:5). This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself (Leviticus 19:18). On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

John/Yahanan 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."

Mat 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh – the smallest of the letters – will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

Luke 16:16-17, "The Law and the Prophets were until Yahchanan(John), since that time the Kingdom of YHWH is preached, and every man is pressed to enter it. But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."

 

[dcontroversal]

Paul considered everything the law gained him as “skybalon” which is Greek for “poop”. (Philippians 3:4-8)

1 Timothy

The law is only good if used in the right context. (1 Timothy 1:8) (see next verse for the context)

It was made for the unrighteous but not for the righteous. (1 Timothy 1:9-10

 

[PHart]

If the law worked God would have used it to save us. (Galatians 3:21)

The law was our prison. (Galatians 3:23)

The law makes you a slave like Hagar. (Galatians 4:24

When you are trying to JUSTIFIED by the law.

 

[Hizikyah]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 14:16-21, “And I shall ask the Father, and He shall give you another Helper, to stay with you forever. the Spirit of the Truth, whom the world is unable to receive, because it does not see Him or know Him. But you know Him, for He stays with you and shall be in you. I shall not leave you orphans – I am coming to you. Yet a little while, and the world no longer sees Me, but you shall see Me, because I live, and you shall live. In that day you shall know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you. He who possesses My commands and guards them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I shall love him and manifest Myself to him.”[/FONT]

 

[dcontroversal]

The law is weak, useless and makes nothing perfect. (Hebrews 7:18-19)

God has found fault with it and created a better covenant, enacted on better promises. (Hebrews 8:7-8)

It is obsolete, growing old and ready to vanish. (Hebrews 8:13)

It is only a shadow of good things to come and will never make someone perfect. (Hebrews 10:

 

[Zi]

The curse of the law is that which is described in Deuteronomy. The curses from not following the law.

The law has nothing to do with faith. (Galatians 3:11-12)

The law was a curse that Christ redeemed us from. (Galatians 3:13)

The law functioned in God’s purpose as a temporary covenant from Moses till John the Baptist announced Christ. (Galatians 3:16 & 19, also see… Matthew 11:12-13, Luke 16:16)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The curse of the law is that which is described in Deuteronomy. The curses from not following the law.

Yes, and what is the requirment to not suffer the curse of the law? God good is good enough?

 

[Hizikyah]

Paul considered everything the law gained him as “skybalon” which is Greek for “poop”. (Philippians 3:4-8)

1 Timothy

The law is only good if used in the right context. (1 Timothy 1:8) (see next verse for the context)

It was made for the unrighteous but not for the righteous. (1 Timothy 1:9-10

2 Peter/Kepha 3:15-17, "And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability."

I believe It is those that think Paul taught not to follow the Law of the Creator is what is causing the error...

1 Corinthians 7:19, "For neither circumcision counts for anything nor uncircumcision, but keeping the commandments of God?"

Acts 24:14, "But I confess this to you, that after the way which they call heresy--so I worship the Father of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets."

Romans 7:25, "Thanks be to YHWH, I have deliverance through Yahshua Messiah our King! So then, with this same mind, I myself serve the Law of YHWH, while in the flesh that is yet subject to the law of sin."

Acts 21:24, "Take them, and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads. Then everyone will know that those things they were informed about you (forsaking the Law), were lies, and that you, yourself, walk orderly, and keep the Law."

Romans 7:12, "Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous."

Ephesians 6:2-3, "Honor your father and mother; which is the first commandment with a promise: That it may be well with you, and you may live long on the earth."

 

[dcontroversal]

When you are trying to JUSTIFIED by the law.

No one is justified by the law......A man is justified by Faith without works or the deeds of the law....END OF STORY

 

[PHart]

The strength of sin is the law (1 Corinthians 15:56)

Only for UNREDEEMED people.

For saved people the law no longer has the power to arouse sin. It only does that in UNSAVED people who don't have the Spirit. Through the Spirit we UPHOLD the very commandments which used to incite sin in us.

What we have been released from is the condemnation of the law (not the righteousness of the law) because 1) we have the blood of Christ to forgive ALL transgressions of the law, and 2) the old man who got aroused to sin by the law died on the cross with Jesus.

"...against such things (the fruit of the Spirit-see context) there is no law. 24Now those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires." (Galatians 5:23-24 NASB)

When you walk according to the Spirit there is no law that condemns you. Through the Spirit you have been set free from the condemnation of the law, not from the righteous requirements of the law.

 

[Hizikyah]

The law is weak, useless and makes nothing perfect. (Hebrews 7:18-19)

God has found fault with it and created a better covenant, enacted on better promises. (Hebrews 8:7-8)

It is obsolete, growing old and ready to vanish. (Hebrews 8:13)

It is only a shadow of good things to come and will never make someone perfect. (Hebrews 10:

Hebrews 9:11-12, "But the Messiah came near as a High Priest over the righteous things to come, with the great and more perfect tabernacle not made with hands, that is, not of this creation; Nor through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood He entered the Most Holy Place once, for all, having obtained eternal redemption."

Hebrews 7:23-28, “And indeed, those that became priests were many, because they were prevented by death from continuing, but He, because He remains forever, has an unchangeable priesthood. Therefore He is also able to save completely those who draw near to Yah through Him, ever living to make intercession for them. For it was fitting that we should have such a High Priest – kind, innocent, undefiled, having been separated from sinners, and exalted above the heavens, who does not need, as those high priests, to offer up slaughter offerings day by day, first for His own sins and then for those of the people, for this He did once for all when He offered up Himself. For the Torah appoints as high priests men who have weakness, but the word of the oath which came after the Torah, appoints the Son having been perfected forever.”

Hebrews 7:13-14New International Version (NIV)
13 He of whom these things are said belonged to a different tribe, and no one from that tribe has ever served at the altar. 14 For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, and in regard to that tribe Moses said nothing about priests.

Matt 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no more sea. And I, Yahanan, saw the holy city, YHWH Shammah, coming down from YHWH out of heaven, prepared as brides adorned for their husbands. And I heard a great voice out of heaven, saying: Behold, the tabernacle of YHWH is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they will be His people, and YHWH Himself will be with them, and be their Father.”

 

[Hizikyah]

No one is justified by the law......A man is justified by Faith without works or the deeds of the law....END OF STORY

Rom 331, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin* that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin* still live in it?"

1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; *for sin is the transgression of the Law."

James 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."

James 2:17, "So also belief, if it does not have works, is in itself dead."

James 2:24, "You see, then, that a man is declared right by works, and not by belief alone."

James 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."

James 2:22, "Do you see that the belief was working with his works, and by the works the belief was perfected?"

 

[gb9]

Rom 331, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin* that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin* still live in it?"

1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; *for sin is the transgression of the Law."

James 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."

James 2:17, "So also belief, if it does not have works, is in itself dead."

James 2:24, "You see, then, that a man is declared right by works, and not by belief alone."

James 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."

James 2:22, "Do you see that the belief was working with his works, and by the works the belief was perfected?"

just plucking out verses with no context is NOT real theology.

 

[PHart]

No one is justified by the law......A man is justified by Faith without works or the deeds of the law....END OF STORY

Duh....like we don't know that, as if that's what anyone has been saying here.

This has nothing to do with trying to be justified by the law. The argument is IT'S OKAY TO KEEP THE LAW OF MOSES AS LONG AS YOU'RE NOT TRYING TO BE JUSTIFIED BY IT.

There are believers here who consider 'keep Sabbath' is just as much the work that faith will produce as we think 'do not murder' is the work that faith will produce. They're not talking about being justified by the law. Do you understand? Do you WANT to understand?

 

[Hizikyah]

just plucking out verses with no context is NOT real theology.

lol ok.

Psalm 119:151, “You are near, O יהוה, And all Your commands are truth.”

Psalm 119:160, “The sum of Your word is truth, And all Your righteous right-rulings are forever.”

1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”

 

[Hizikyah]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hebrews 10:16, "“This is the covenant that I shall make with them after those days, says [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], giving My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I shall write them.”[/FONT]

 

[PHart]

The law is only good if used in the right context. (1 Timothy 1:8) (see next verse for the context)

It was made for the unrighteous but not for the righteous. (1 Timothy 1:9-10

No, it was made for the righteous, too:

"...from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 2:15-17 NASB)

What scriptures do you think he was talking about?

 

[LoveGodForever]

Galatians 5:1-4 (HCSB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Christ has liberated us to be free. Stand firm then and don’t submit again to a yoke of slavery.
[SUP]2 [/SUP] Take note! I, Paul, tell you that if you get yourselves circumcised, Christ will not benefit you at all.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Again I testify to every man who gets himself circumcised that he is obligated to keep the entire law.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] You who are trying to be justified by the law are alienated from Christ; you have fallen from grace.

You seem to be saying that if I do not get my self circumcised I have fallen from Grace. Do you know the difference between the Law of God and the laws of Moses that were a Shadow of things to come?

[FONT=&quot]Romans 2:28-29, [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly;[/FONT][FONT=&quot] neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.[/FONT]

 

[LoveGodForever]

GOD IS NOT FINISHED WITH ISRAEL, and Gentile Believers ARE NOT ISRAEL. The concept that we become spiritual Israelites because we have the faith of Abraham purely is FALSE DOCTRINE FROM A FALSE PROPHET. ABRAHAM was NOT an Israelite, he was from UR of the CHALDEES. If you want to think you become a spiritual Chaldean because you have the Faith of Abraham, go ahead, but I will believe GOD:

Genesis 17:5 (CSBBible)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Your name will no longer be Abram; your name will be Abraham, for I will make you the father of many nations.

Romans 12:3 (NIV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For by the grace given me I say to every one of you: Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but rather think of yourself with sober judgment, in accordance with the measure of faith God has given you.

Love the scriptures but your interpretation above is not from the bible.

Let's see who God's Word describes as being Israel................

Well that interpretation is not according to God’s Word and there is no scripture to support your view. Let’s talk scripture……..
[FONT=&quot]Who are Israel according to God’s Word?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Israel" [/FONT][FONT=&quot]is only a name given by God himself to represent his people. It has its origin from Gen 32:28 where Jacob wrestled with the Angel and prevailed ...for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. Its meaning is his posterity will rule as God. Jacob had 12 sons representing the 12 tribes of Israel. This is God's people and today anyone who is following Jesus is part of God's spiritual Israel according to God's Word. The same New Covenant is written for God's people who are now spiritual Israel following. Scripture support;[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Let’s talk more scripture…………[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Let God be true and every man a liar that thou might be justified in thy sayings, and might overcome when thou art judged.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He says not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, and to thy seed, which is Christ[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now who is Abraham’s seed? [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus and if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Galatians 3:28-29, [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]There is neither Jew nor Greek[/FONT][FONT=&quot], there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Colossians 3:11,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Where there is neither Greek nor Jew,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Romans 10:11-13,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For the scripture says, whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Romans 2:28-29, [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly;[/FONT][FONT=&quot] neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 31:33-4,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; after those days, says the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Heb 8:10-12,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Heb 10:14-17,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, this is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; and their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Gal 3:29, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The New Covenant is for Spiritual Israel which represent God’s followers the believers. If you are not a part of spiritual Israel you are not part of the New Covenant (Heb 8:10-12). I believe God’s Word VCO, how about you?

Who should we obey God or man? Sunday worship is a teaching and tradition of man over the Word of God breaking God's commandments. God's Word tells us that if we break God's commandments by following man made traditions we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)




[/FONT]

 

[LoveGodForever]

Originally Posted by LoveGodForever: Also where in all of God's Word does it command us that God's 4th commandment has been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday Holy in place of God's Sabbath commandment that Jesus and the apostles followed because they love God? MMD Replied: Colossians 2:16-17 tells us that the Sabbath day is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant. You can try to twist the meaning of Colossians 2:16-17 to teach otherwise, just as SDA's do, but it's in vain. You seem to miss the significance of the first day of the week (Sunday) in the New Testament for the Church.

Friend there is no twisting of the scriptures on my part. Colossians 2:16 has already been addressed with all the scriptures in post # 39356 that you still have not replied to. If you do not know how to answer the scriptures sent to you then it should be a warning to you that you a building on sifting sand. I am still hoping that you just did not see post # 39356 because I am looking for a reply from you as I have much more to share.