The King James Bible
- Thread starter James37
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Do you not hear my words? I would agree, the gospel can be found in most new versions of the Bible. I have never claimed otherwise.
For starters:
Psalms 78:36
KJV - Nevertheless they did flatter him with their mouth, and they lied unto him with their tongues.
NASB - But they deceived Him with their mouth And lied to Him with their tongue.
Was God deceived?
2 Samuel 21:19
KJV - And there was again a battle in Gob with the Philistines, where Elhanan the son of Jaareoregim, a Bethlehemite, slew the brother of Goliath the Gittite, the staff of whose spear was like a weaver's beam.
NASB - There was war with the Philistines again at Gob, and Elhanan the son of Jaare-oregim the Bethlehemite killed Goliath the Gittite, the shaft of whose spear was like a weaver’s beam.
Who killed Goliath? The NASB says Elhanan is one place and David in another. It cannot be trusted.
Psalms 78:36
KJV - Nevertheless they did flatter him with their mouth, and they lied unto him with their tongues.
NASB - But they deceived Him with their mouth And lied to Him with their tongue.
Was God deceived?
2 Samuel 21:19
KJV - And there was again a battle in Gob with the Philistines, where Elhanan the son of Jaareoregim, a Bethlehemite, slew the brother of Goliath the Gittite, the staff of whose spear was like a weaver's beam.
NASB - There was war with the Philistines again at Gob, and Elhanan the son of Jaare-oregim the Bethlehemite killed Goliath the Gittite, the shaft of whose spear was like a weaver’s beam.
Who killed Goliath? The NASB says Elhanan is one place and David in another. It cannot be trusted.
You used the word, "lies". Lies are conscious misrepresentations of the truth. Differences in translation, or sound translations from different sources, are not lies.
Let's try applying your standard of reliability to the KJV:
2 Chron 22:2 Forty and two years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign, and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. His mother's name also was Athaliah the daughter of Omri.
2 Kings 8:26 Two and twenty years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign; and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Athaliah, the daughter of Omri king of Israel.
So how old was Ahaziah? It says 42 in one place and 22 in another. Conclusion? "It cannot be trusted."
Let's try applying your standard of reliability to the KJV:
2 Chron 22:2 Forty and two years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign, and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. His mother's name also was Athaliah the daughter of Omri.
2 Kings 8:26 Two and twenty years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign; and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Athaliah, the daughter of Omri king of Israel.
So how old was Ahaziah? It says 42 in one place and 22 in another. Conclusion? "It cannot be trusted."
It's a long answer, but there's truth to the seeker. The simple solution to this apparent contradiction is that Ahaziah was physically 22 years old when he began to reign, but since God has appointed Jehu to cut off the house of Ahab, as a son of Ahab through marriage, he was 42 years old. The information is all there in the texts, and we will look at it in a moment. We just have to put it together. But it is not an error in the Hebrew texts.
Jehu was appointed by God to cut off the house of Ahab. Ahab was the king of Israel, not of Judah. But Ahaziah was related to Ahab by marriage because his father Jehoram who "walked in the way of the kings of Israel, like as did the house of Ahab: FOR HE HAD THE DAUGHTER OF AHAB TO WIFE: and he wrought that which was evil in the eyes of the LORD" 2 Chronicles 21:6.
Likewise in 2 Kings 8:16-18 we read of Jehoram, the father of Ahaziah, that "he walked in the way of the kings of Israel, AS DID THE HOUSE OF AHAB: FOR THE DAUGHTER OF AHAB WAS HIS WIFE: and he did evil in the sight of the LORD."
And of his son Ahaziah, just a few verses later in 2 Kings 8:26-27 we read: "Two and twenty years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign; and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Athaliah, THE DAUGHTER OF OMRI (father of Ahab) king of Israel. And HE WALKED IN THE WAY OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB, and did evil in the sight of the LORD, AS DID THE HOUSE OF AHAB; FOR HE WAS SON IN LAW OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB." Here we clearly see that Ahaziah is considered by God to be related to the house of Ahab and he walked in the way of the house of Ahab.
In 2 Chronicles 22:7 we read: "And the destruction of Ahaziah was of God by coming to Joram: for when he was come, he went out with Jehoram against JEHU the son of Nimshi, WHOM THE LORD HAD ANOINTED TO CUT OFF THE HOUSE OF AHAB."
To repeat, Ahaziah was son-in-law of the house of Ahab. 2 Kings 8:26 -27 "Two and twenty years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign: and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Athaliah, THE DAUGHTER (grand-daughter) OF OMRI KING OF ISRAEL. And HE WALKED IN THE WAY OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB, and did evil in the sight of the LORD, as did the house of Ahab: FOR HE WAS THE SON IN LAW OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB." Ahaziah is counted as a son-in-law to Ahab, even though it was his father who had married into the house of Ahab, and not Ahaziah himself.
Ahaziah was thus related by marriage to the house of Ahab through the marriage of his father with Athaliah the daughter of Ahab.
When it says in 2 Chronicles 22:2 that Ahaziah was 42 years old when he began to reign, this refers to his age as the last member of the reigning dynasty of the house of Ahab. Ahaziah could not have been 42 years old biologically, because his father was only 40 years old when Ahaziah became king (See 2 Chron. 21:20 - 2 Chron. 22:2 ). "Jehoram (the father of Ahaziah) was thirty and two years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem eight years, and departed without being desired...and the inhabitants of Jerusalem made Ahaziah his youngest son king in his stead...Forty and two years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign". For a man to become a father at the age of 18 is very likely, but for a son to be born two years earlier than his father is not.
The house of Ahab began, of course, with Ahab who reigned for 22 years and his son Jehoram was in his twelfth and final year at the time Ahaziah began to reign. 22 + 12 = 34. This would be the house of Ahab on the king's of Israel side.
When we look at the house of Ahab on the king's of Judah side and we come up with an additional 8 years reign as king on the part of Jehoram, Ahaziah's father. Jehoram "walked in the way of the kings of Israel, LIKE AS DID THE HOUSE OF AHAB: FOR HE HAD THE DAUGHTER OF AHAB TO WIFE: and he wrought that which was evil in the eyes of the LORD" 2 Chronicles 21:6.
22 + 12 + 8 = 42. This is the age of Ahaziah as a the youngest and most recent member of the extended reign of the house of Ahab over both Israel and Judah.
The central issue in all this is simply - How long was the combined reign of "the house of Ahab" over the two kingdoms of Israel and Judah? The answer is 42 years when Ahaziah began to reign. There is no error in either the Hebrew texts nor in all the Reformation bibles and many others even in modern times that tell us that Ahaziah was 42 years old when he began to reign.
Ahaziah was 42 years old as the final member of the house of Ahab, but only 22 years old physically as a son of Jehoram.
Jehu was appointed by God to cut off the house of Ahab. Ahab was the king of Israel, not of Judah. But Ahaziah was related to Ahab by marriage because his father Jehoram who "walked in the way of the kings of Israel, like as did the house of Ahab: FOR HE HAD THE DAUGHTER OF AHAB TO WIFE: and he wrought that which was evil in the eyes of the LORD" 2 Chronicles 21:6.
Likewise in 2 Kings 8:16-18 we read of Jehoram, the father of Ahaziah, that "he walked in the way of the kings of Israel, AS DID THE HOUSE OF AHAB: FOR THE DAUGHTER OF AHAB WAS HIS WIFE: and he did evil in the sight of the LORD."
And of his son Ahaziah, just a few verses later in 2 Kings 8:26-27 we read: "Two and twenty years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign; and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Athaliah, THE DAUGHTER OF OMRI (father of Ahab) king of Israel. And HE WALKED IN THE WAY OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB, and did evil in the sight of the LORD, AS DID THE HOUSE OF AHAB; FOR HE WAS SON IN LAW OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB." Here we clearly see that Ahaziah is considered by God to be related to the house of Ahab and he walked in the way of the house of Ahab.
In 2 Chronicles 22:7 we read: "And the destruction of Ahaziah was of God by coming to Joram: for when he was come, he went out with Jehoram against JEHU the son of Nimshi, WHOM THE LORD HAD ANOINTED TO CUT OFF THE HOUSE OF AHAB."
To repeat, Ahaziah was son-in-law of the house of Ahab. 2 Kings 8:26 -27 "Two and twenty years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign: and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Athaliah, THE DAUGHTER (grand-daughter) OF OMRI KING OF ISRAEL. And HE WALKED IN THE WAY OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB, and did evil in the sight of the LORD, as did the house of Ahab: FOR HE WAS THE SON IN LAW OF THE HOUSE OF AHAB." Ahaziah is counted as a son-in-law to Ahab, even though it was his father who had married into the house of Ahab, and not Ahaziah himself.
Ahaziah was thus related by marriage to the house of Ahab through the marriage of his father with Athaliah the daughter of Ahab.
When it says in 2 Chronicles 22:2 that Ahaziah was 42 years old when he began to reign, this refers to his age as the last member of the reigning dynasty of the house of Ahab. Ahaziah could not have been 42 years old biologically, because his father was only 40 years old when Ahaziah became king (See 2 Chron. 21:20 - 2 Chron. 22:2 ). "Jehoram (the father of Ahaziah) was thirty and two years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem eight years, and departed without being desired...and the inhabitants of Jerusalem made Ahaziah his youngest son king in his stead...Forty and two years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign". For a man to become a father at the age of 18 is very likely, but for a son to be born two years earlier than his father is not.
The house of Ahab began, of course, with Ahab who reigned for 22 years and his son Jehoram was in his twelfth and final year at the time Ahaziah began to reign. 22 + 12 = 34. This would be the house of Ahab on the king's of Israel side.
When we look at the house of Ahab on the king's of Judah side and we come up with an additional 8 years reign as king on the part of Jehoram, Ahaziah's father. Jehoram "walked in the way of the kings of Israel, LIKE AS DID THE HOUSE OF AHAB: FOR HE HAD THE DAUGHTER OF AHAB TO WIFE: and he wrought that which was evil in the eyes of the LORD" 2 Chronicles 21:6.
22 + 12 + 8 = 42. This is the age of Ahaziah as a the youngest and most recent member of the extended reign of the house of Ahab over both Israel and Judah.
The central issue in all this is simply - How long was the combined reign of "the house of Ahab" over the two kingdoms of Israel and Judah? The answer is 42 years when Ahaziah began to reign. There is no error in either the Hebrew texts nor in all the Reformation bibles and many others even in modern times that tell us that Ahaziah was 42 years old when he began to reign.
Ahaziah was 42 years old as the final member of the house of Ahab, but only 22 years old physically as a son of Jehoram.
I suspected you'd present this convoluted and unsatisfying answer. You go to great lengths to justify your preferred version, and make no effort to understand similar issues in other versions. That is not intellectual integrity.
The text directly states both that Ahaziah was 22 and that he was 42. It doesn't say that it had been 42 years since anything. One of the statements is, using your word, a "lie". You don't get a free pass on this.
When you see that you have reasoned yourself into an inescapable box, perhaps you will realize that your dogmatism is not working.
The text directly states both that Ahaziah was 22 and that he was 42. It doesn't say that it had been 42 years since anything. One of the statements is, using your word, a "lie". You don't get a free pass on this.
When you see that you have reasoned yourself into an inescapable box, perhaps you will realize that your dogmatism is not working.
You're not seeking truth. Did you not read? You have to take into consideration how the line of Ahab was cutoff. When it says in 2 Chronicles 22:2 that Ahaziah was 42 years old when he began to reign, this refers to his age as the last member of the reigning dynasty of the house of Ahab. That is truth my friend, like it or not.
No amount of studious convolution will make "Forty and two years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign," consistent with "Two and twenty years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign". The statement are direct and clear, and you are claiming that they say something other than what they plainly state.
You use one standard by which to measure the KJV, and another standard to measure other translations.
"Divers weights, and divers measures, both of them are alike abomination to the Lord." - Prov. 20:10
You use one standard by which to measure the KJV, and another standard to measure other translations.
"Divers weights, and divers measures, both of them are alike abomination to the Lord." - Prov. 20:10
Read the footnote. A footnote is far more accessible than the convolutions you offer in support of the KJV's "lies" (again, your word).
You still don't grasp the meaning of "lying".
You still don't see that the KJV "lies" just as blatantly.
You are using a double standard in assessment of the text.
You are using a double standard of reliability.
You are using a double standard of behaviour as you accuse me of not reading what you post, and you patently ignore what I have posted.
You are welcome to continue your bleating about other translations, but be aware that your intellectual dishonesty is plainly evident.
You still don't grasp the meaning of "lying".
You still don't see that the KJV "lies" just as blatantly.
You are using a double standard in assessment of the text.
You are using a double standard of reliability.
You are using a double standard of behaviour as you accuse me of not reading what you post, and you patently ignore what I have posted.
You are welcome to continue your bleating about other translations, but be aware that your intellectual dishonesty is plainly evident.
Others noticed patterns when words and phrases counted in the King James Bible such as:
Jesus Christ = 7x7x4
book* = 7x7x4
word of God = 7x7 (any case)
Jehovah* = 7 (* is a wildcard)
baptiz* = 77 (all forms of the word baptize)
church = 77
Holy Spirit = 7
This is a small sample of the words and phrases in the King James Bible that are multiples of 7. There is a video called "The King James Code Volume 7" that discusses this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQM-eMKnY2E&t=21s
In June I began to document the number of times words and phrases occurred in the King James Bible along with the number of verses the words and phrases occur in. I noticed a predominant pattern of 1, 7, 19, 37 ,61, 91, 127 and later found out that this is called the centered hexagonal number sequence. It was interesting but it wasn't until external events beginning with Hurricane Irma and eventually the wildfires in California that the significance of the number 37 was revealed to me. Unknown to me at that time, others had found patterns in the Greek and Hebrew connected with this number and the related number 73. 37 was the key number in the patterns in the King James Bible. No man or woman showed me this. You will not find a website or a youtube video (except the 2 that I have made) on the patterns that I have presented on this thread and the other thread specifically about the number 37 I started.
What God showed me is that the patterns are specific to the verse that contains the words and phrases from a fixed reference point. The pattern in Mark 1:1 is from Mark 1:1 to the end of the Bible. Matthew 1:1's pattern is counted in the entire New Testament. John 1:1 is counted from John 1:1 to the end of the Bible and from Genesis 1:1 to John 1:1. Revelation 22:2 (which I have not posted yet) is counted from both Genesis 1:1 and Matthew 1:1. No man or woman showed me this and God allowed me to use this pattern and structure to find Pi in the King James Bible.
1 Kings 7:23
"ten" = 111th occurrence of word in the 106th verse
"ten" divided by 111/106 is equal to 9.549549549549547 and "thirty" divided by this adjusted value yields 3.141509433962265 or better known as 333/106 or (37x9)/106.
1 Kings 7:24
"round about" = 106th occurrence and "round" in this same phrase is the 111th occurrence of this word.
"thirty" x (111/106) divided by the diameter "ten" equals 3.14159.....or 333/106.
If you can find a website or youtube video on this please let me know because I want to know what else God has showed them. Until then your posts are empty and lack any substance or evidence to validate what you are trying to convey.
Jesus Christ = 7x7x4
book* = 7x7x4
word of God = 7x7 (any case)
Jehovah* = 7 (* is a wildcard)
baptiz* = 77 (all forms of the word baptize)
church = 77
Holy Spirit = 7
This is a small sample of the words and phrases in the King James Bible that are multiples of 7. There is a video called "The King James Code Volume 7" that discusses this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQM-eMKnY2E&t=21s
In June I began to document the number of times words and phrases occurred in the King James Bible along with the number of verses the words and phrases occur in. I noticed a predominant pattern of 1, 7, 19, 37 ,61, 91, 127 and later found out that this is called the centered hexagonal number sequence. It was interesting but it wasn't until external events beginning with Hurricane Irma and eventually the wildfires in California that the significance of the number 37 was revealed to me. Unknown to me at that time, others had found patterns in the Greek and Hebrew connected with this number and the related number 73. 37 was the key number in the patterns in the King James Bible. No man or woman showed me this. You will not find a website or a youtube video (except the 2 that I have made) on the patterns that I have presented on this thread and the other thread specifically about the number 37 I started.
What God showed me is that the patterns are specific to the verse that contains the words and phrases from a fixed reference point. The pattern in Mark 1:1 is from Mark 1:1 to the end of the Bible. Matthew 1:1's pattern is counted in the entire New Testament. John 1:1 is counted from John 1:1 to the end of the Bible and from Genesis 1:1 to John 1:1. Revelation 22:2 (which I have not posted yet) is counted from both Genesis 1:1 and Matthew 1:1. No man or woman showed me this and God allowed me to use this pattern and structure to find Pi in the King James Bible.
1 Kings 7:23
"ten" = 111th occurrence of word in the 106th verse
"ten" divided by 111/106 is equal to 9.549549549549547 and "thirty" divided by this adjusted value yields 3.141509433962265 or better known as 333/106 or (37x9)/106.
1 Kings 7:24
"round about" = 106th occurrence and "round" in this same phrase is the 111th occurrence of this word.
"thirty" x (111/106) divided by the diameter "ten" equals 3.14159.....or 333/106.
If you can find a website or youtube video on this please let me know because I want to know what else God has showed them. Until then your posts are empty and lack any substance or evidence to validate what you are trying to convey.
