word of faith movement

[DevotiontoBible]

Jesus was never omniscient or omnipotent. He was anointed with power and the Holy Ghost-Acts 10:38.

Jesus operated in all 9 gifts of the Holy Spirit, found in 1 Cor 12. You can see every gift being operated in in most of his miracles recorded in the Gospel of John. He did not do miracles with his God Powers, he laid them down as Philippians 2 says he did.

If Jesus did not need faith, then Luke 22:39-44 and Isaiah 53:1-3 are lies and so is Hebrews 5:7-10
[SUP]
7 [/SUP]In the days of His flesh, He offered up both prayers and supplications with loud crying and tears to the One able to save Him from death, and He was heard because of His piety. [SUP]8 [/SUP]Although He was a Son, He learned obedience from the things which He suffered. [SUP]9 [/SUP]And having been made perfect, He became to all those who obey Him the source of eternal salvation, [SUP]10 [/SUP]being designated by God as a high priest according to the order of Melchizedek.

Many of the Psalms and 2 in Particular are David Prophesying Jesus and his anguish and need to have faith and the fact he had faith in his own Father. How could Jesus be the author and finisher of faith if he never needed or had it?

You seem to be pushing that Jesus did everything because he was the son of God and that is simply not true and Acts 10:38 and Luke 4:14 prove it.

You are misinterpreting those. None of those say Jesus did anything by faith. What cancels all of your misinterpretations is that Jesus never stopped being God, not even for a moment:

"Though he was God, "

Philippians 2:6 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/php.2.6.NLT

 

[valleyofdecision]

You are misinterpreting those. None of those say Jesus did anything by faith. What cancels all of your misinterpretations is that Jesus never stopped being God, not even for a moment:

"Though he was God, "

Philippians 2:6 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/php.2.6.NLT

Phil 2:6-7
[SUP]6 [/SUP]who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, [SUP]7 [/SUP]but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

If you are going to pretext we will stop discussing this.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Phil 2:6-7
[SUP]6 [/SUP]who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, [SUP]7 [/SUP]but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

If you are going to pretext we will stop discussing this.

Do you know what "kenosis" means. It doesn't mean Jesus was no longer God. It doesn't mean non-ability of His God attributes of omniscience and omnipotence. If your Jesus stopped being God then you have no savior. You could just as well be believing in Hitler to be your savior, no difference there.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Phil 2:6-7
[SUP]6 [/SUP]who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, [SUP]7 [/SUP]but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

If you are going to pretext we will stop discussing this.

In addition to studying "kenosis" in Phil 2:7, I recommend that you study what the "hypostatic union" of Jesus means.

 

[Speak2Me]

you see, these new prophets REFUSE to obey scripture

the NT states that more than one prophet should speak yet these folks constantly say God told them to say this or that or whatever

the new age self appointed prophets of NAR believe they are the leaders now...in other words follow their prophecies and the Bible is 2nd...an open doorway to hell IMO

the emotions mean aboslutely nothing whatsoever

the season of men being in charge is over?

do these folks read the Bible?

when was God never in charge?

they prophesy by another spirit out of their own spirits...NOT Gods'

sure it sounds all tough and stuff...but when nothing out of the usual happens 2019 will bring in a slew of new end of the age warnings



and they never apologize, try to fathom why they were wrong or why people don't even listen any more

this constant crying wolf type prophecy (it's not actual prophecy) only HARDENS hearts..BECAUSE it is NOT the Holy Spirit

Kinda like the clan that run this thread, right? Their "know everything" attitude, plus their "draw them out & bash 'em", actually acts like the people yer talkin about.

Maybe not their doctrines, but their tactics & strategies lines right up.

 

[valleyofdecision]

In addition to studying "kenosis" in Phil 2:7, I recommend that you study what the "hypostatic union" of Jesus means.

Kenosis means to empty or make void of a certain thing., it means more than the simple explainable of no reputation. Jesus relied on personal faith and the Holy Spirit, he was showing us how to do it here. We differ and thats fine.

The Bible says it plainly for those with ears to hear that Jesus laid down , made void, emptied himself of his God powers and was anointed with the power and Holy Ghost.

Jesus was human and divine. When we read the words Jesus Christ,we know the writer is referring to his humanity, when we read the words Christ Jesus, we know the writer is referring to his divinity.

 

[Speak2Me]

Sorry, folks. Thought I was in another thread.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Kenosis means to empty or make void of a certain thing., it means more than the simple explainable of no reputation. Jesus relied on personal faith and the Holy Spirit, he was showing us how to do it here. We differ and thats fine.

The Bible says it plainly for those with ears to hear that Jesus laid down , made void, emptied himself of his God powers and was anointed with the power and Holy Ghost.

Jesus was human and divine. When we read the words Jesus Christ,we know the writer is referring to his humanity, when we read the words Christ Jesus, we know the writer is referring to his divinity.

If Jesus voided His God abilities then Hitler could have died on the cross. It is useless to save anyone. Kenosis means non-use not non-ability. It means Jesus didn't use His God abilities to stay alive. John 19:30 says Jesus "gave up his spirit". The Bible never uses that expression for anyone dying except Jesus. That means He could have kept on living if He wanted even after all that torture. Now read the context of this Phil 2:6-9. Kenosis is referring only to his physical death:

Though he was God, he did not think of equality with God as something to cling to. Instead, he gave up his divine privileges ; he took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When he appeared in human form, he humbled himself in obedience to God and died a criminal’s death on a cross.
Philippians 2:6*-‬8 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/php.2.6-8.NLT

 

[valleyofdecision]

If Jesus voided His God abilities then Hitler could have died on the cross. It is useless to save anyone. Kenosis means non-use not non-ability. It means Jesus didn't use His God abilities to stay alive. John 19:30 says Jesus "gave up his spirit". The Bible never uses that expression for anyone dying except Jesus. That means He could have kept on living if He wanted even after all that torture. Now read the context of this Phil 2:6-9. Kenosis is referring only to his physical death:

Though he was God, he did not think of equality with God as something to cling to. Instead, he gave up his divine privileges ; he took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When he appeared in human form, he humbled himself in obedience to God and died a criminal’s death on a cross.
Philippians 2:6*-‬8 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/php.2.6-8.NLT

No sir Philippians 2:1-8 has zero to do with his death. The exhortation of Philippians 2:1-8 is unity and having the same humility and obedient mind and attitude that Christ had in his life and up tot he ending of his life.

Philippians 2:1-8
Therefore if there is any encouragement in Christ, if there is any consolation of love, if there is any fellowship of the Spirit, if any affection and compassion, [SUP]2 [/SUP]make my joy complete by being of the same mind, maintaining the same love, united in spirit, intent on one purpose. [SUP]3 [/SUP]Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind regard one another as more important than yourselves; [SUP]4 [/SUP]do not merely look out for your own personal interests, but also for the interests of others. [SUP]5 [/SUP]Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus[SUP]6 [/SUP]who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, [SUP]7 [/SUP]but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. [SUP]8 [/SUP]Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.


You are reading into the text and not reading the text and basing your doctrine on something the context of the passage does not support.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

No sir Philippians 2:1-8 has zero to do with his death. The exhortation of Philippians 2:1-8 is unity and having the same humility and obedient mind and attitude that Christ had in his life and up tot he ending of his life.

Philippians 2:1-8
Therefore if there is any encouragement in Christ, if there is any consolation of love, if there is any fellowship of the Spirit, if any affection and compassion, [SUP]2 [/SUP]make my joy complete by being of the same mind, maintaining the same love, united in spirit, intent on one purpose. [SUP]3 [/SUP]Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind regard one another as more important than yourselves; [SUP]4 [/SUP]do not merely look out for your own personal interests, but also for the interests of others. [SUP]5 [/SUP]Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus[SUP]6 [/SUP]who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, [SUP]7 [/SUP]but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. [SUP]8 [/SUP]Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.


You are reading into the text and not reading the text and basing your doctrine on something the context of the passage does not support.

That's bizarre for you to say since v6-8 answer the question of how can God die on the cross. Yes, the larger context is about humility but in the immediate context is about how the holy, omniscient and omnipotent God (who can't die) died as a criminal. You are the one reading into it that Jesus had use faith to do miracles.

 

[valleyofdecision]

That's bizarre for you to say since v6-8 answer the question of how can God die on the cross. Yes, the larger context is about humility but in the immediate context is about how the holy, omniscient and omnipotent God (who can't die) died as a criminal. You are the one reading into it that Jesus had use faith to do miracles.

Jesus did miracles through the power and anointing of the Holy Ghost, Acts 10:38-not through his divine nature. If he did any miracles as God they had legal right to kill him for cause. This is why he told many to go see the High Priest after they were healed. Jesus was under the law and could not tell anyone to abandon the law or he and them could be stoned.

Are you into the Oneness doctrine, you seem to be coming across that way.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Jesus did miracles through the power and anointing of the Holy Ghost, Acts 10:38-not through his divine nature.

It is not quite as simple as that. The Holy Spirit did miracles through Christ (Mt 12:22-32), God the Father did miracles through Christ (Acts 2:22), and Christ Himself did miracles as the Son of God (God manifest in the flesh) (Lk 11:20). Jesus was AT ALL TIMES fully God and fully sinless Man. And attempting to fathom the nature of Christ and the Godhead is beyond human capability.

 

[valleyofdecision]

It is not quite as simple as that. The Holy Spirit did miracles through Christ (Mt 12:22-32), God the Father did miracles through Christ (Acts 2:22), and Christ Himself did miracles as the Son of God (God manifest in the flesh) (Lk 11:20). Jesus was AT ALL TIMES fully God and fully sinless Man. And attempting to fathom the nature of Christ and the Godhead is beyond human capability.

I do not discount the verses you have used or your theology.

It is as simple as it states, people[not you, I do not know you or even the other guy] complicate it to try to understand it and it is simple really. The simplicity in the answer is found in the person of the Holy Spirit.

I can assure God was not on the cross, nor in the tomb but the man Jesus Christ was. If the Spirit of him that raised Jesus from the dead. God did not raise Jesus, the Holy Spirit did. Jesus entered the wilderness full of the Spirit, but exited in the power of the Spirit. Luke 4. 2 very different things. The Holy Spirit comes upon and goes within.

People say Jesus works on earth now and is in us now. No, he really does not do either of those things. He already finished his work and seats at the right hand making intercession for us. Our bodies are not the Temple of Jesus, but of the Holy Spirit. The ministry of the Holy Spirit has been radically reduced today , because of foolishness abounding in the WOF, Charismatic and Pentecostal camps.

Make no mistake Jesus was divine and human, but in his humanity he performed signs, wonders and miracles through the power and anointing of the Holy Spirit and not by using one ounce of his divinity. If he did use his divinity then he cheated the system.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Jesus did miracles through the power and anointing of the Holy Ghost, Acts 10:38-not through his divine nature. If he did any miracles as God they had legal right to kill him for cause. This is why he told many to go see the High Priest after they were healed. Jesus was under the law and could not tell anyone to abandon the law or he and them could be stoned.

Are you into the Oneness doctrine, you seem to be coming across that way.

No, I am not. I am a Trinitarian. Acts 10:38 doesn't say Jesus did miracles without being God. He always has been God FULLY God:

For in Christ lives all the fullness of God in a human body.
Colossians 2:9 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/col.2.9.NLT

 

[DevotiontoBible]

I can assure God was not on the cross, nor in the tomb but the man Jesus Christ .

You are badly in error. God Himself died on the cross for you:

“So guard yourselves and God’s people. Feed and shepherd God’s flock—his church, purchased with his own blood —over which the Holy Spirit has appointed you as leaders.
Acts of the Apostles 20:28 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/act.20.28.NLT

 

[valleyofdecision]

No, I am not. I am a Trinitarian. Acts 10:38 doesn't say Jesus did miracles without being God. He always has been God FULLY God:

For in Christ lives all the fullness of God in a human body.
Colossians 2:9 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/col.2.9.NLT

This points to his divinity not the power he used in his humanity. Jesus was God and Man. In his humanity he did things through the Holy Spirit. If he did them as God then all will be saved and there would be no enemy, accuser of the brethren or Satan.

This is fruitless and will now stop. Thank you for sharing.

 

[valleyofdecision]

You are badly in error. God Himself died on the cross for you:

“So guard yourselves and God’s people. Feed and shepherd God’s flock—his church, purchased with his own blood —over which the Holy Spirit has appointed you as leaders.
Acts of the Apostles 20:28 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/act.20.28.NLT

Jesus died on the cross not God. again fruitless, stay blessed.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

This points to his divinity not the power he used in his humanity. Jesus was God and Man. In his humanity he did things through the Holy Spirit. If he did them as God then all will be saved and there would be no enemy, accuser of the brethren or Satan.

This is fruitless and will now stop. Thank you for sharing.

Your Jesus is not fully God since he has none of his Godly attributes.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Jesus died on the cross not God. again fruitless, stay blessed.

Acts 20:28 expressly states it was God who shed His own blood.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

This is fruitless and will now stop. Thank you for sharing.

Your Jesus is not adequate to die for anyone because your Jesus was only a man. I feel sorry for someone who trusts in only a man to save them.