KING JAMES VERSION BIBLE VS. MODERN ENGLISH BIBLES
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I disagree. I think it comes down to what you’ve been taught by people that you respect. It’s hard to give up long held beliefs Mr Dispy.... Not poking fun at you for your beliefs but you should look at the Bible issue from that same point of view.
It would take a whole lot of biblical proof before you would give the dispenstional view.
It would take a whole lot of biblical proof before you would give the dispenstional view.
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Here, I was thinking of you and John when I wrote this on another thread, a few minutes ago.
"Because, like it or not, one thing you may not know, is translators make choices with each and every word, they translate, as to which are better choices. (which is another reason I detest the KJV Only position. Like God came down and wrote with his finger on the KJV tablets, the exact right words! No wait, that was God and Moses, or Joseph Smith and Moroni, or .... but I digress)
Now, I think most translators are pretty honest, if they have made it to a translation committee. And certainly, they are great scholars, better than me, I don't deny.
BUT - they are human beings, with prejudices and they often make choices which reflect not the words, but the prejudices. So, King James thinks women need to be kept under control, especially his wife, make sure the translators understand this, and translate in this way, to reflect this bias. To say nothing of the fact that in the 16th century, everyone thought this. Men were on top, women below, in the role/order thing.
Now, you start 400 years ago with a biased translation. Not just in this, but in many things. That gets passed down to succeeding translations. Now, how do I know this? My Greek prof and his father were both on the ESV translating committee when this revolutionary, straight from the Greek and Hebrew translation was started. They made suggestions worked on the committee through the first chapters of Matt. They got to the Lord's prayer in Matt 6, which has HUGE translational issues on most of the lines. So, the committee came up with a version of the Lord's prayer based on the Greek. They were all very excited, and proud to be on this totally new Bible translation committee.
The publishers/editors came in and looked at what the committee had done with the Lord's prayer, and guess what they said?
"Umm, no! Besides the Greek, we also need to stick to the important traditions developed in earlier translations." What they approved was in the end, a modernized KJV Lord's prayer, no connection to what the Greek said. My prof soon quit, after that."
And in the new directives to post the CC link, even if you wrote it yourself (which I think is a great idea), here is the link.
#513
"Because, like it or not, one thing you may not know, is translators make choices with each and every word, they translate, as to which are better choices. (which is another reason I detest the KJV Only position. Like God came down and wrote with his finger on the KJV tablets, the exact right words! No wait, that was God and Moses, or Joseph Smith and Moroni, or .... but I digress)
Now, I think most translators are pretty honest, if they have made it to a translation committee. And certainly, they are great scholars, better than me, I don't deny.
BUT - they are human beings, with prejudices and they often make choices which reflect not the words, but the prejudices. So, King James thinks women need to be kept under control, especially his wife, make sure the translators understand this, and translate in this way, to reflect this bias. To say nothing of the fact that in the 16th century, everyone thought this. Men were on top, women below, in the role/order thing.
Now, you start 400 years ago with a biased translation. Not just in this, but in many things. That gets passed down to succeeding translations. Now, how do I know this? My Greek prof and his father were both on the ESV translating committee when this revolutionary, straight from the Greek and Hebrew translation was started. They made suggestions worked on the committee through the first chapters of Matt. They got to the Lord's prayer in Matt 6, which has HUGE translational issues on most of the lines. So, the committee came up with a version of the Lord's prayer based on the Greek. They were all very excited, and proud to be on this totally new Bible translation committee.
The publishers/editors came in and looked at what the committee had done with the Lord's prayer, and guess what they said?
"Umm, no! Besides the Greek, we also need to stick to the important traditions developed in earlier translations." What they approved was in the end, a modernized KJV Lord's prayer, no connection to what the Greek said. My prof soon quit, after that."
And in the new directives to post the CC link, even if you wrote it yourself (which I think is a great idea), here is the link.
#513
Soooo, when a doctrine in Scripture goes against what you want, you cry mistranslation based on bias? I guess you don't like 1 Corinthians all that well either.
3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
God - Christ - man - woman
That's the order of authority like it or not. God ordained it not King James.
And btw, a translation can be inspired by God. Just look all throughout Scripture for examples.
3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
God - Christ - man - woman
That's the order of authority like it or not. God ordained it not King James.
And btw, a translation can be inspired by God. Just look all throughout Scripture for examples.
Isa 14:1-11
For the Lord will have mercy on Jacob, and will yet choose Israel, and set them in their own land: and the strangers shall be joined with them, and they shall cleave to the house of Jacob.
2 And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the Lord for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors.
3 And it shall come to pass in the day that the Lord shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve,
4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
5 The Lord hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers.
6 He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth.
7 The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing.
8 Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us.
9 Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
10 All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?
11 Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee.
KJV
1 For the Lord will have mercy on Jacob, and will yet choose Israel, and set them in their own land: and the strangers shall be joined with them, and they shall cleave to the house of Jacob.
2 And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the Lord for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors.
3 And it shall come to pass in the day that the Lord shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve,
Here the declamation against Babylon begun in Is 13:1 is interrupted with a Juxtaposition in time and place.
With the Assyrian captivity having already happened, Isaiah is here predicting a restoration as he does again in chapter 66.
4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
5 The Lord hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers.
6 He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth.
Here Isaiah predicts the fall of Babylon, as he does in more detail in chapters 44 and 45.
7 The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing.
8 Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us.
Here we have another juxtaposition in time.
This is the peace Beginning with the release from captivity by Cyrus and continuing through the time of Ezra and Nememiah.
9 Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
10 All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?
11 Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee.
The declamation against Babylon is resumed.
Isa 14:12-14
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
KJV
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
Here we have another juxtaposition of time and place and we find a brief declamation against Satan
IMO this is the same event Jesus remarks about in Luke 10:18
18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
KJV
Isa 14:15
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
KJV
This is a transition verse applying to both Satam and the king of Babylon.
Isa 14:16-23
16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;
17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?
18 All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.
19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.
21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.
22 For I will rise up against them, saith the Lord of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith the Lord.
23 I will also make it a possession for the bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it with the besom of destruction, saith the Lord of hosts.
KJV
Here we have the conclusion of the declamation against Babylon.
Isa 14:24-32
24 The Lord of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed, so shall it stand:
25 That I will break the Assyrian in my land, and upon my mountains tread him under foot: then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulders.
26 This is the purpose that is purposed upon the whole earth: and this is the hand that is stretched out upon all the nations.
27 For the Lord of hosts hath purposed, and who shall disannul it? and his hand is stretched out, and who shall turn it back?
28 In the year that king Ahaz died was this burden.
Here Isaiah resumes his theme of verses 1-3 with a brief declamation against Assyria.
29 Rejoice not thou, whole Palestina, because the rod of him that smote thee is broken: for out of the serpent's root shall come forth a cockatrice, and his fruit shall be a fiery flying serpent.
30 And the firstborn of the poor shall feed, and the needy shall lie down in safety: and I will kill thy root with famine, and he shall slay thy remnant.
31 Howl, O gate; cry, O city; thou, whole Palestina, art dissolved: for there shall come from the north a smoke, and none shall be alone in his appointed times.
Here we have another juxtaposition of time and place withadeclamation against Ashkalon and Tyre, who are not even named as such.
32 What shall one then answer the messengers of the nation? That the Lord hath founded Zion, and the poor of his people shall trust in it.
KJV
Words of comfort and promise of restoration after judgement.
Luther—Und seine Eltern gingen alle Jahre gen Jerusalem auf das Osterfest.
Osterfest My skills in German are very limited; but I believe that there is a clear distinction between Osterfest celebration of the resurrection and Oestern the Saxon 'goddess of the East'
The KJV may indeed have gotten the Easter paganization from Tyndale.
Osterfest My skills in German are very limited; but I believe that there is a clear distinction between Osterfest celebration of the resurrection and Oestern the Saxon 'goddess of the East'
The KJV may indeed have gotten the Easter paganization from Tyndale.
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For those who think I hate the KJV. I have...
Dake’s annotated bible in KJV...never use it now
KJV study bible in leather
The KJV bible that Everette Gaddy and Jerry Gaddy had an infomercial about. The Subject bible
A Thomas Nelson ref bible in KJV I abused with highlighters and notes
KJV Thompson Chain
Hebrew/Greek KJV study Bible by Spiros Zohadites(sp?)
Another Thomas Nelson ref bible in itty bitty print
And I am thinking I have some more KJV’s I am forgetting about.
Dake’s annotated bible in KJV...never use it now
KJV study bible in leather
The KJV bible that Everette Gaddy and Jerry Gaddy had an infomercial about. The Subject bible
A Thomas Nelson ref bible in KJV I abused with highlighters and notes
KJV Thompson Chain
Hebrew/Greek KJV study Bible by Spiros Zohadites(sp?)
Another Thomas Nelson ref bible in itty bitty print
And I am thinking I have some more KJV’s I am forgetting about.
It was about this time that King Herod arrested some who belonged to the church, intending to persecute them. He had James, the brother of John, put to death with the sword. When he saw that this met with approval among the Jews, he proceeded to seize Peter also. This happened during the Festival of Unleavened Bread. After arresting him, he put him in prison, handing him over to be guarded by four squads of four soldiers each. Herod intended to bring him out for public trial after the Passover.[Pascha, not Eostre][Acts 12:1-4]
Passover is the correct word used, not Easter. It was unbelieving Jews who were observing/keeping the Passover. They rejected the Christ, not believing He was their Messiah. They wouldn’t observe the day of His resurrection, seeing they didn’t believe He was the prophesied Messiah.
After Peter is freed from jail...
Then Peter came to himself and said, “Now I know without a doubt that the Lord has sent his angel and rescued me from Herod’s clutches and from everything the Jewish people were hoping would happen.”[vs 11]
Further proof it was unbelieving Jews observing/keeping the Passover, not celebrating His resurrection.
Passover is the correct word used, not Easter. It was unbelieving Jews who were observing/keeping the Passover. They rejected the Christ, not believing He was their Messiah. They wouldn’t observe the day of His resurrection, seeing they didn’t believe He was the prophesied Messiah.
After Peter is freed from jail...
Then Peter came to himself and said, “Now I know without a doubt that the Lord has sent his angel and rescued me from Herod’s clutches and from everything the Jewish people were hoping would happen.”[vs 11]
Further proof it was unbelieving Jews observing/keeping the Passover, not celebrating His resurrection.
1 Now about that time Herod the king stretched forth his hands to vex certain of the church.
2 And he killed James the brother of John with the sword.
3 And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also. (Then were the days of unleavened bread.)
4 And when he had apprehended him, he put him in prison, and delivered him to four quaternions of soldiers to keep him; intending after Easter to bring him forth to the people.
5 Peter therefore was kept in prison: but prayer was made without ceasing of the church unto God for him.
Jews celebrated the Passover. Herod was not concerned about that. Herod was concerned about the thousands that Peter had converted to Jesus. These Christians would be celebrating Easter, the resurrection of Jesus Christ, our Passover.
The word "passover" does occur in 1 Corinthians 5:7 "...For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us." and in Hebrews 11:28 - "Through faith he kept the passover, and the sprinkling of blood, lest he that destroyed the firstborn should touch them." But in both cases the verses are referring to a time and an event PREVIOUS TO the Resurrection of our Lord. Acts 12:4 is the only time the word paska is used when it refers to a time and an event that occurs AFTER the Resurrection.
2 And he killed James the brother of John with the sword.
3 And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also. (Then were the days of unleavened bread.)
4 And when he had apprehended him, he put him in prison, and delivered him to four quaternions of soldiers to keep him; intending after Easter to bring him forth to the people.
5 Peter therefore was kept in prison: but prayer was made without ceasing of the church unto God for him.
Jews celebrated the Passover. Herod was not concerned about that. Herod was concerned about the thousands that Peter had converted to Jesus. These Christians would be celebrating Easter, the resurrection of Jesus Christ, our Passover.
The word "passover" does occur in 1 Corinthians 5:7 "...For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us." and in Hebrews 11:28 - "Through faith he kept the passover, and the sprinkling of blood, lest he that destroyed the firstborn should touch them." But in both cases the verses are referring to a time and an event PREVIOUS TO the Resurrection of our Lord. Acts 12:4 is the only time the word paska is used when it refers to a time and an event that occurs AFTER the Resurrection.