Not By Works

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Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Luke 8:21, “And He answering, said to them, “My mother and My brothers are those who are hearing the Word of Yah and doing it.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Matthew 12:50, “For whoever does the desire of My Father who is in the heavens is My brother and sister and mother.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 12:25-26, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it remains alone. But if it dies, it bears much fruit. He who loves his life shall lose it, and he who hates his life in this world shall preserve it for everlasting life." Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.”[/FONT]
 

Endoscopy

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2017
4,028
400
83
Works do not save, James was not writing about salvic/saving faith

And what you have written here is contradictory...
I suggest you go to biblebateway.com and read James 2 with AMPC. That makes it plainer since it includes other meanings of some words in parentheses. Look at John 3:16 as a great example. After reading James 2 entirely then try to explain how my assertion is wrong. It starts out discussing the law then transitions to faith and works etc.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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Works do not save, James was not writing about salvic/saving faith

And what you have written here is contradictory...
Amen....and the "creed" Jesus that he embraces seemingly is not the Jesus of Galatians as well....the bible is clear....Jesus became a curse for us by taking our sin, becoming sin for us, being hung on a tree and forsaken momentarily by the Heavenly Father.......no surprise he agrees with the working for Catholic....the Presbyterians are just another offspring from the Catholic Chrurch
 
Dec 12, 2013
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I get annoyed with people quoting single verses. It is too easy to make false claims this way. While I agree with your post it would be better to put the verses in context. For example:


Galatians 3 10 to 14 NIV - Jesus cursed

10 For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.” 11 Clearly no one who relies on the law is justified before God, because “the righteous will live by faith.” 12 The law is not based on faith; on the contrary, it says, “The person who does these things will live by them.” 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.” 14 He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.
You get annoyed with single verses from the bible because you place stock in some creed over the bible...the point is valid and I would expect you to disgaree even if the subject was a blue sky with white billowing clouds!
 
Dec 12, 2013
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I suggest you go to biblebateway.com and read James 2 with AMPC. That makes it plainer since it includes other meanings of some words in parentheses. Look at John 3:16 as a great example. After reading James 2 entirely then try to explain how my assertion is wrong. It starts out discussing the law then transitions to faith and works etc.
She has the bible and the Spirit of God....you should try it....it trumps your creed and any other sourceed opinion you peddle....
 
Dec 12, 2013
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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Luke 8:21, “And He answering, said to them, “My mother and My brothers are those who are hearing the Word of Yah and doing it.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Matthew 12:50, “For whoever does the desire of My Father who is in the heavens is My brother and sister and mother.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 12:25-26, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it remains alone. But if it dies, it bears much fruit. He who loves his life shall lose it, and he who hates his life in this world shall preserve it for everlasting life." Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.”[/FONT]
This is the will of the FATHER....that YOU BELIEVE ON HIM WHOM HE HAS SENT.....

Not some law keeping drivel that does nothing but condemn...why? BECAUSE NO MAN KEEPS IT OR CAN KEEP IT AND IT POINTS TO GUILT.....
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,972
4,587
113
There is a difference between sonship and fellowship. You can also be your parents' son without obeying them.

I am not familiar with what you mean by that.

Also I know, is REALLY being Born Again, means you have genuine remorse for your sins and confess it to HIM, repenting of it, and receiving HIS FORGIVENESS FOR YOUR UTTERLY SINFUL Lifestyle. Then out of LOVE FOR HIM, you willingly receive HIM AS LORD, meaning MASTER. Then HE out of His Mercy and Grace will grant that You can be a Adopted son or daughter of GOD.

Any thing less, is the Easy Believism FALSE GOSPEL, that WILL NOT SAVE.


John 1:12-13 (HCSB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] But to all who did receive Him, He gave them the right to be children of God, to those who believe in His name,
[SUP]13 [/SUP] who were born, not of blood, or of the will of the flesh, or of the will of man, but of God.


Obedience is NOT PART OF SALVATION, but it IS PART OF OUR LOVE. The genuine lifestyle of any truly born again Believer.


1 John 4:8 (ESV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love.

1 John 3:14-19 (ESV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brothers. Whoever does not love abides in death.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] By this we know love, that he laid down his life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brothers.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] But if anyone has the world’s goods and sees his brother in need, yet closes his heart against him, how does God’s love abide in him?
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Little children, let us not love in word or talk but in deed and in truth.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] By this we shall know that we are of the truth and reassure our heart before him;


1 John 5:3 (HCSB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For this is what love for God is: to keep His commands. Now His commands are not a burden*,


*When you SAY, "I HAVE TO OBEY GOD", that is a BURDEN.

When you can genuinely say,
"I want to Obey GOD, because I LOVE HIM." It ceases to be a Burden, and becomes an ACT OF LOVE for GOD, and that in turn will be that kind of GODLY LOVE, which will manifest itself to the Brethren.


Romans 5:5-10 (HCSB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] This hope will not disappoint ⌊us⌋, because God’s love has been poured out in our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] For while we were still helpless, at the appointed moment, Christ died for the ungodly.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] For rarely will someone die for a just person—though for a good person perhaps someone might even dare to die.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] But God proves His own love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!


Titus 3:5-8 (HCSB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] He saved us— not by works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] He poured out this ⌊Spirit⌋ on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that having been justified by His grace, we may become heirs with the hope of eternal life.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] This saying is trustworthy. I want you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed God might be careful to devote themselves to good works. These are good and profitable for everyone.


Hopefully YOU CAN SEE, that it is NOT PART OF SALVATION, which happened in a single moment of time, but it is the good works of OUR LOVE, that GOD HAD POURED INTO OUR HEARTS.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
This is the will of the FATHER....that YOU BELIEVE ON HIM WHOM HE HAS SENT.....

Not some law keeping drivel that does nothing but condemn...why? BECAUSE NO MAN KEEPS IT OR CAN KEEP IT AND IT POINTS TO GUILT.....
so that verse must erase this one?

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 14:21, “he who possesses My commands and guards them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I shall love him and manifest Myself to him.”[/FONT]



and why don't we let Scripture intrepret Scripture and see how we do this? AFter all this is the words of the Father:

"the ONE SENT" hmm, how do we KNOW who this is and what that entails?

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 3:23-24, “And this is His command, that we should believe in the Name of His Son יהושע [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Messiah and love one another, as He gave us command. And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”[/FONT][/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 15:12-14, “This is My command, that you love one another, as I have loved you. No one has greater love than this: that one should lay down his life for his friends. You are My friends if you do whatever I command you."
[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 6:28-29,28 So they said to Him, “What should we do to work the works of the Mighty One?” יהושע answered and said to them, “This is the work of the Mighty One, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Acts 7:37-38, “This is the Mosheh who said to the children of Yisra’yl, ‘יהוה [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear.’ This is he who was in the assembly in the wilderness with the Messenger who spoke to him on Mount Sinai, and with our fathers, who received the living Words to give to us.”[/FONT][/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 5:46-47, "For had you believed Mosheh, you would have believed Me, for he wrote about Me*. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?"

*Mosheh wrote:

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, “I (YHWH) will raise up for them a Prophet (Yahshua/Jesus) like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it.”

"listen" is word #8085 - שָׁמַע[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]shama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey[/FONT][/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Acts 3:19-23, “Repent therefore and turn back, for the blotting out of your sins, in order that times of refreshing might come from the presence of the Master, and that He sends יהושע [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Messiah, pre-appointed for you, whom heaven needs to receive until the times of restoration of all matters, of which the Mighty One spoke through the mouth of all His set-apart prophets since of old. For Mosheh truly said to the fathers, ‘[/FONT]יהוה [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you. And it shall be that every being who does not hear that Prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.”[/FONT][/FONT]
 
Dec 12, 2013
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I am not familiar with what you mean by that.

Also I know, is REALLY being Born Again, means you have genuine remorse for your sins and confess it to HIM, repenting of it, and receiving HIS FORGIVENESS FOR YOUR UTTERLY SINFUL Lifestyle. Then out of LOVE FOR HIM, you willingly receive HIM AS LORD, meaning MASTER. Then HE out of His Mercy and Grace will grant that You can be a Adopted son or daughter of GOD.

Any thing less, is the Easy Believism FALSE GOSPEL, that WILL NOT SAVE.


John 1:12-13 (HCSB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] But to all who did receive Him, He gave them the right to be children of God, to those who believe in His name,
[SUP]13 [/SUP] who were born, not of blood, or of the will of the flesh, or of the will of man, but of God.


Obedience is NOT PART OF SALVATION, but it IS PART OF OUR LOVE. The genuine lifestyle of any truly born again Believer.


1 John 4:8 (ESV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love.

1 John 3:14-19 (ESV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brothers. Whoever does not love abides in death.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] By this we know love, that he laid down his life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brothers.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] But if anyone has the world’s goods and sees his brother in need, yet closes his heart against him, how does God’s love abide in him?
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Little children, let us not love in word or talk but in deed and in truth.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] By this we shall know that we are of the truth and reassure our heart before him;


1 John 5:3 (HCSB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For this is what love for God is: to keep His commands. Now His commands are not a burden*,


*When you SAY, "I HAVE TO OBEY GOD", that is a BURDEN.

When you can genuinely say,
"I want to Obey GOD, because I LOVE HIM." It ceases to be a Burden, and becomes an ACT OF LOVE for GOD, and that in turn will be that kind of GODLY LOVE, which will manifest itself to the Brethren.


Romans 5:5-10 (HCSB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] This hope will not disappoint ⌊us⌋, because God’s love has been poured out in our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] For while we were still helpless, at the appointed moment, Christ died for the ungodly.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] For rarely will someone die for a just person—though for a good person perhaps someone might even dare to die.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] But God proves His own love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!


Titus 3:5-8 (HCSB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] He saved us— not by works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] He poured out this ⌊Spirit⌋ on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that having been justified by His grace, we may become heirs with the hope of eternal life.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] This saying is trustworthy. I want you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed God might be careful to devote themselves to good works. These are good and profitable for everyone.


Hopefully YOU CAN SEE, that it is NOT PART OF SALVATION, which happened in a single moment of time, but it is the good works of OUR LOVE, that GOD HAD POURED INTO OUR HEARTS.
Sonship by birth eternally by the new birth from above.

Fellowship based upon walking in the light as he is in the light

The first based upon grace trhough faith alone as a gift
The latter based upon obedience to the word

The first is eternally secure based upon the righteousness of Christ imputed by faith and kept by the power and promises of Christ

The latter can be maintained and or suppessed by faithfulness or a lack thereof.....
 
Dec 12, 2013
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so that verse must erase this one?

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 14:21, “he who possesses My commands and guards them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I shall love him and manifest Myself to him.”[/FONT]



and why don't we let Scripture intrepret Scripture and see how we do this? AFter all this is the words of the Father:

"the ONE SENT" hmm, how do we KNOW who this is and what that entails?

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 3:23-24, “And this is His command, that we should believe in the Name of His Son יהושע [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Messiah and love one another, as He gave us command. And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”[/FONT][/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 15:12-14, “This is My command, that you love one another, as I have loved you. No one has greater love than this: that one should lay down his life for his friends. You are My friends if you do whatever I command you."
[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 6:28-29,28 So they said to Him, “What should we do to work the works of the Mighty One?” יהושע answered and said to them, “This is the work of the Mighty One, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Acts 7:37-38, “This is the Mosheh who said to the children of Yisra’yl, ‘יהוה [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear.’ This is he who was in the assembly in the wilderness with the Messenger who spoke to him on Mount Sinai, and with our fathers, who received the living Words to give to us.”[/FONT][/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 5:46-47, "For had you believed Mosheh, you would have believed Me, for he wrote about Me*. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?"

*Mosheh wrote:

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, “I (YHWH) will raise up for them a Prophet (Yahshua/Jesus) like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it.”

"listen" is word #8085 - שָׁמַע[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]shama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey[/FONT][/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Acts 3:19-23, “Repent therefore and turn back, for the blotting out of your sins, in order that times of refreshing might come from the presence of the Master, and that He sends יהושע [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Messiah, pre-appointed for you, whom heaven needs to receive until the times of restoration of all matters, of which the Mighty One spoke through the mouth of all His set-apart prophets since of old. For Mosheh truly said to the fathers, ‘[/FONT]יהוה [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you. And it shall be that every being who does not hear that Prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.”[/FONT][/FONT]
No one loves God or can love God unless they have ALREADY BEEN BORN FROM ABOVE....wake up ...your applying scripture to salvation that has nothing to do with actually being saved eternally from above by grace through faith and no works attached.....

IT IS NOT THAT WE LOVED HIM, BUT THAT HE LOVED US AND GAVE HIMSELF FOR US!

THE word of God is spiritual in nature and origin...NO MAN CAN UNDERSTAND THE WORD, must less keep or obey it UNLESS they have already been born from above by the spirit of GOD!
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
No one loves God or can love God unless they have ALREADY BEEN BORN FROM ABOVE....wake up ...your applying scripture to salvation that has nothing to do with actually being saved eternally from above by grace through faith and no works attached.....

IT IS NOT THAT WE LOVED HIM, BUT THAT HE LOVED US AND GAVE HIMSELF FOR US!

THE word of God is spiritual in nature and origin...NO MAN CAN UNDERSTAND THE WORD, must less keep or obey it UNLESS they have already been born from above by the spirit of GOD!
yet why do you constantly fight against any promotion of obedience to His words? while making statements against thingsI have never said as if I had?

As I asked you before quote a single post of mine that I teach a false doctrine or one even worthy of rebuke or oppisition, and explain why...
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 4:19, “We love Him because He first loved us.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy." [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”[/FONT]
 

Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
3,570
516
113
This is the will of the FATHER....that YOU BELIEVE ON HIM WHOM HE HAS SENT.....

Not some law keeping drivel that does nothing but condemn...why? BECAUSE NO MAN KEEPS IT OR CAN KEEP IT AND IT POINTS TO GUILT.....
Luke 1:5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Genesis 26:5, “Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my (H8451) Laws.”[/FONT]
 
N

NoNameMcgee

Guest
IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS​

Isaiah 53:11 - He shall see of the travail of his soul, [and] shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
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romans 3

19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
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Romans 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous

-------------

2 Corinthians 5:21 - For he hath made him [to be] sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

------------

Philippians 3:9 - And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

------------------

Galatians 2:16 - Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

___________

we are saved by grace through faith....


and when we (born again sons and daughters of God)
are judged

we will also be judged by the same standard as EVERYONE

the difference between the saved
and unsaved

is the unsaved have their own righteousness that they will be judged by

those covered by the sacrifice of Jesus will be judged by His in regards to salvation...

-------------------


TO ALL WHO BELIEVE​

Acts 13:39
39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses

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John 3:15-17
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

--------------


BEING BORN FROM ABOVE PRODUCES SONS, NOT PRETENDERS WHO STOP BELIEVING​



hebrews 10


35 Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.

36 For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.

37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.

38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
_____________


john 6


28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?

29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

___________


1 John 2:19
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us
 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
107
63
Genesis 26:5, “Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my (H8451) Laws.”
Completely meaningless...
What exactly are the charges, commandments, statutes and laws referred to here?
They cannot be the Torah...
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
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Isaiah 54:17 “No weapon formed against you shall prosper, and every tongue which rises against you in judgment you shall prove wrong. This is the inheritance of the servants of יהוה, and their righteousness from Me,” declares יהוה."



Jeremiah 23:5-6, “See, the days are coming,” declares יהוה, “when I shall raise for Dawiḏ a Branch of righteousness, and a Sovereign shall reign and act wisely, and shall do right-ruling and righteousness in the earth. In His days Yehuḏah shall be saved, and Yisra’ĕl dwell safely. And this is His Name whereby He shall be called: ‘יהוה our Righteousness.’


Does that erase this:


Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”



John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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Completely meaningless...
What exactly are the charges, commandments, statutes and laws referred to here?
They cannot be the Torah...
not completely even if you are correct, as it shows doing what He said...

also that word H8451 is indeed Torah, and Noah had clean food laws.... fact is we do not know, but I do know

1 YHWH does not change

2 Many passages pre Moses show it possible, inculding the book of Job, the oldest book written...
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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1 John 2:19
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us
do these "not of us"

preach for or against doing wha the Messiah said?

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 14:23-24, “[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”

OHHH! and the same guy who wrote the verse you posted also wrote this:

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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2 John 1:9-11, “Everyone who is transgressing and not staying in the teaching of Messiah does not possess YHWH The one who stays in the teaching of Messiah possesses both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house nor greet him, for he who greets him shares in his wicked works.”[/FONT]

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