-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
David, I know that when you refer to "Oneness" teaching you are probably accurately representing the views of major oneness groups, particularly the UPCI. I'm not, never have been, and never will be part of the UPCI. In part, this is because they distort salvation to require works that amount to jumping through hoops. Obviously, however, I hold to some form of Oneness teaching and belief. Can I ask you to qualify your statements about Oneness teachings to read something more like "some" or "most" oneness believe...(whatever it is you are refering to). Otherwise it is kind of like me saying "trinitarians believe baptism isn't "right" unless done in the Triune name". Some believe this, others, like yourself, believe that the formula is less important than the heart and obedience. Since I'm the most active Oneness adherent on this thread, I want the clarification of "some" so as not to be grouped in with beliefs I don't agree with.
A
distictiveministry you are exactly right. It would be like me saying that all trinitarian believe as the calvinist do simply because calvinist are trinitarian, or atributing all catholic beliefs onto all trinitarians ect.... I am not a part of the UPC either, and I agree with very little of what they teach.
A
You are the Heretic in God's eyes. I would much rather have men call me a heretic than to be judged by God as you will be.
A
Not angry at all, just hoping to jot you out of your pharesitical religion and back into reality with some truth
AoK, I understand your line of reasoning that anything but "orthodoxy" is heresy, but I'll point out for the third for forth time on this thread that my understanding of God's nature is not the same as that which has been "officially" declared heresy by councils or any other group that I'm aware of. From what I've seen my beliefs are not the same as forerunner's, DMurray's, Ricke's or anyone else on CC. Nobody taught me my understanding of scripture, but I study the Word and weigh every teaching to see if it is the same as scripture. I have benefited from Trinitarian teaching and writing because it has highlighted points and issues I may not encounter otherwise. I have benefited from UPCI and other oneness teachings, including Sabellius because they highlight issues for me to study that I otherwise may not have been aware of. When it comes to my beliefs, I'm pretty muich a "free agent", which stinks because I never have full fellowship with other believers, but I've never encountered another teaching that I could truly agree was fully biblical, from start to finish.
I can see how someone who doesn't adhere to historic Christianity could resort to personal attacks of this nature. I mean you can't win an argument, so this is all that remains. God will hold you accountable for your own behavior
Deviating from truth to add heresy, just not to the extent of others who do so, wins you no points here: especially when their biggest heresy is the one you add.
A
You can point it out as many times as you like. If you deny the scriptural revelation of God which scholars today refer to as the doctrine of the Trinity, then you have errored.
This doesn't mean God doesn't love you. This doesn't mean that you aren't authentic in truly believing what you believe. I get that.
What it does mean is you have errored in your epistemology, and it's a BIG one.
This doesn't mean God doesn't love you. This doesn't mean that you aren't authentic in truly believing what you believe. I get that.
What it does mean is you have errored in your epistemology, and it's a BIG one.
AoK, I understand your line of reasoning that anything but "orthodoxy" is heresy, but I'll point out for the third for forth time on this thread that my understanding of God's nature is not the same as that which has been "officially" declared heresy by councils or any other group that I'm aware of. From what I've seen my beliefs are not the same as forerunner's, DMurray's, Ricke's or anyone else on CC. Nobody taught me my understanding of scripture, but I study the Word and weigh every teaching to see if it is the same as scripture. I have benefited from Trinitarian teaching and writing because it has highlighted points and issues I may not encounter otherwise. I have benefited from UPCI and other oneness teachings, including Sabellius because they highlight issues for me to study that I otherwise may not have been aware of. When it comes to my beliefs, I'm pretty muich a "free agent", which stinks because I never have full fellowship with other believers, but I've never encountered another teaching that I could truly agree was fully biblical, from start to finish.
AoK, I understand your line of reasoning that anything but "orthodoxy" is heresy, but I'll point out for the third for forth time on this thread that my understanding of God's nature is not the same as that which has been "officially" declared heresy by councils or any other group that I'm aware of. From what I've seen my beliefs are not the same as forerunner's, DMurray's, Ricke's or anyone else on CC. Nobody taught me my understanding of scripture, but I study the Word and weigh every teaching to see if it is the same as scripture. I have benefited from Trinitarian teaching and writing because it has highlighted points and issues I may not encounter otherwise. I have benefited from UPCI and other oneness teachings, including Sabellius because they highlight issues for me to study that I otherwise may not have been aware of. When it comes to my beliefs, I'm pretty muich a "free agent", which stinks because I never have full fellowship with other believers, but I've never encountered another teaching that I could truly agree was fully biblical, from start to finish.
I believe Jesus to be God the Father Himself manifest in the flesh as a man and the distinction between the two is in the humanity of the Son. How does your view very from my stated view? Just curious
It is simple,there is only one God who is a Holy Spirit.Father is a title for God the Holy Spirit.The Son,is the man Christ Jesus.The Father manifested all His attributes to the Son,the man Christ Jesus,and that means God manifest in flesh.
Father,Son,and Holy Ghost,are not 3 persons os a trinity but the 3 relationship God has with His children.
Father-parent of the saints.
Son-God's visible relationship with the saints.
Holy Spirit-God's invisible relationship with the saints.
The Son is God working visibly among mankind.
The Holy Spirit is God working invisibly among mankind.
When we mention Holy Spirit we are saying what God is,a Holy Spirit.
When we say Holy Spirit we are saying God's invisble relationship with the saints.
When we say Holy Spirit we are saying God working invisibly among people.
When we mention Son we are saying God in a visible manifestation to mankind.
When we say Son we are saying God's visible relationship with mankind,and the throne in heaven is the throne of both God and the Lamb,God in the glorified body of His Son,the man Christ Jesus.
When we say Son we are saying God working visibly among mankind.
Jesus is the name of the Father,Son,and Holy Ghost,which Jesus told us to baptize in His name,for He is the one true God who created all things,appeared in a visible manifestation,and dwells in the saints by His Spirit.
The book of Luke says baptism is to be preached in Jesus' name.
Jesus did not tell us to baptize in the titles but in the name which is Jesus,so that we will not make a trinity out of the titles,by letting us know that He is the one true God who created all things,appeared in flesh,and dwells in the saints.
The Bible says there is only one God,the Father,and one visible manifestation of God the Father,the Lord Jesus Christ.
The Bible says one God and Father of all,who is above all,and throug all,and in all.
There is only one God who is a Holy Spirit.Father is a title for God the Holy Spirit.The Son is the man Christ Jesus.
The Son is God the Father working visibly.
The Holy Spirit is God the Father working invisibly.
Matt
Father,Son,and Holy Ghost,are not 3 persons os a trinity but the 3 relationship God has with His children.
Father-parent of the saints.
Son-God's visible relationship with the saints.
Holy Spirit-God's invisible relationship with the saints.
The Son is God working visibly among mankind.
The Holy Spirit is God working invisibly among mankind.
When we mention Holy Spirit we are saying what God is,a Holy Spirit.
When we say Holy Spirit we are saying God's invisble relationship with the saints.
When we say Holy Spirit we are saying God working invisibly among people.
When we mention Son we are saying God in a visible manifestation to mankind.
When we say Son we are saying God's visible relationship with mankind,and the throne in heaven is the throne of both God and the Lamb,God in the glorified body of His Son,the man Christ Jesus.
When we say Son we are saying God working visibly among mankind.
Jesus is the name of the Father,Son,and Holy Ghost,which Jesus told us to baptize in His name,for He is the one true God who created all things,appeared in a visible manifestation,and dwells in the saints by His Spirit.
The book of Luke says baptism is to be preached in Jesus' name.
Jesus did not tell us to baptize in the titles but in the name which is Jesus,so that we will not make a trinity out of the titles,by letting us know that He is the one true God who created all things,appeared in flesh,and dwells in the saints.
The Bible says there is only one God,the Father,and one visible manifestation of God the Father,the Lord Jesus Christ.
The Bible says one God and Father of all,who is above all,and throug all,and in all.
There is only one God who is a Holy Spirit.Father is a title for God the Holy Spirit.The Son is the man Christ Jesus.
The Son is God the Father working visibly.
The Holy Spirit is God the Father working invisibly.
Matt
Are you a monarchial modalist?
#1 The Father is God, Jesus is God, The Holy Spirit is God.
#2 However Jesus Christ is also the Father and the Father is the Holy Spirit.
#3 In other words there is one God the Father, who came in a body (the Son) and who is the Eternal Spirit (the Holy Spirit). So we teach that the Father came in the flesh as Jesus, and is a Spirit ''The Holy Spirit''.
#4 So it is similar to the Trinity doctrine in that we have 3 who are one, but Oneness doctrine says that the 3 ''persons'' are not separate, but actually the same 1, who is God.
Modalism generally is explained as God appearing in three modes, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. I reject modalism because it usually is defined as three modes consecutively, as in He was the Father, THEN the Son, THEN (and now) the Holy Spirit.
I rather believe what I now understand you to believe, that God is Father AND Son AND Spirit, but we reject Trinitarian beliefs where they say the Father is not the Son, the Son is not the Spirit, and the Spirit is not the Father.
I rather believe what I now understand you to believe, that God is Father AND Son AND Spirit, but we reject Trinitarian beliefs where they say the Father is not the Son, the Son is not the Spirit, and the Spirit is not the Father.
Modalism generally is explained as God appearing in three modes, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. I reject modalism because it usually is defined as three modes consecutively, as in He was the Father, THEN the Son, THEN (and now) the Holy Spirit.
I rather believe what I now understand you to believe, that God is Father AND Son AND Spirit, but we reject Trinitarian beliefs where they say the Father is not the Son, the Son is not the Spirit, and the Spirit is not the Father.