Does God love all mankind and does He wish to save everyone

[ForestGreenCook]

My preacher is never wrong because He has been appointed by God to lead His sheep, so he's not some self appointed Bible scholar like most people here claim to be.

The Bible is encrypted so only those who God appoints will be able to break the code, the rest are all deceived by their own supposed intelligence. God uses the foolish things of this world to put to shame the smarties who think they know it all.

90% of Christians are deceived, they are in for a rude shock when Christ tells them to depart into the everlasting lake of fire.

I know that you are a resent convert, biblically, and I must comment to this post. I think it would be good advice to not put your complete faith in any man, preacher or not, without searching the scriptures to prove him. You do know, that a, true christian, is a follower of Christ, and it is my belief that they are all saved eternally. Unlike Roger, I believe that most people on this forum are children of God, and they will all be in heaven. I am excited about your eagerness to studying the scriptures and think that basically your on the right track.

 

[tourist]

My preacher is never wrong because He has been appointed by God to lead His sheep, so he's not some self appointed Bible scholar like most people here claim to be.

The Bible is encrypted so only those who God appoints will be able to break the code, the rest are all deceived by their own supposed intelligence. God uses the foolish things of this world to put to shame the smarties who think they know it all.

90% of Christians are deceived, they are in for a rude shock when Christ tells them to depart into the everlasting lake of fire.

How can a Christian be sent into the everlasting lake of fire? If that's true, than what advantage does the Christian have over the many others who are not Christian?

 

[tourist]

My preacher is never wrong because He has been appointed by God to lead His sheep, so he's not some self appointed Bible scholar like most people here claim to be.

So you are saying that your preacher is perfect? Does he claim never to be wrong because if he does that perception is contrary to scripture and that would either make him a liar or ignorant.

 

[Slayer]

Wow just wow. No longer any doubt.

I suppose your preacher told you he was appointed by God to lead the sheep. Your preacher cannot be wrong according to you but many here who have studied the bible for possibly more years than you and your preacher together are wrong.

You are well on your way to cult-hood. I hope you have the years to grow and mature that you need. What kind of preaching teaches that others who profess Christ because they disagree with Calvinism will be condemned? Calvinism is a recent movement in the history of Christianity. The apostles missed out not to mention all the great preachers prior to the reformation.

For the cause of Chrisat
Roger

Unlike you Arminians who worship Arminius, we only Worship the Father, Son and Holy Ghost. You label us Calvinists because we believe the Word of God as it is written, we don't sweep 90% of the Gospel under the carpet to fit Arminian theology into the Gospel.

 

[Slayer]

How can a Christian be sent into the everlasting lake of fire? If that's true, than what advantage does the Christian have over the many others who are not Christian?

I only use the term "christian" because the reprobate don't like being called reprobate. They prefer to be called Christian so I just accommodate them, but as you can see the end result is all that matters. The lake of fire awaits all hypocrites who call themselves christian.

 

[tourist]

I only use the term "christian" because the reprobate don't like being called reprobate. They prefer to be called Christian so I just accommodate them, but as you can see the end result is all that matters. The lake of fire awaits all hypocrites who call themselves christian.

How exactly do you know that the reprobate prefer to be called Christian? How is being a hypocrite different than other sins that true Christians commit?

 

[Slayer]

!!!

Honestly, I feel really sorry for you..... you have come under such a strong delusion, what man of God would claim this?

Yes I know the truth is hard for you to accept. I do feel sorry for you, all I can do is pray that God would lift the veil of deception from your eyes.

 

[Slayer]

I know that you are a resent convert, biblically, and I must comment to this post. I think it would be good advice to not put your complete faith in any man, preacher or not, without searching the scriptures to prove him. You do know, that a, true christian, is a follower of Christ, and it is my belief that they are all saved eternally. Unlike Roger, I believe that most people on this forum are children of God, and they will all be in heaven. I am excited about your eagerness to studying the scriptures and think that basically your on the right track.

I have read the Bible and I did read the part that says "he who trust in man us cursed" I think this refers to trusting in a man for one's salvation, so never fear. I only trust in the Lord for my salvation and I know it sounds crazy but we all have open Bibles during the sermon in our Church, so it's not like our preacher is preaching the Book of Zeus.

There are around 80 of us sheep, just waiting to pounce on the preacher should he ever dare to add or subtract a single iota from the completed cannon of scripture or preach anything unbiblicall. We are constantly flicking through the Bible and we are overloaded with scriptures, so we need to go home and continue studying the all the relevant scriptures to get the whole message. The messages are so deep and meaningful, they we usually spend the rest of the week digesting the morning and evening messages.

Our pastor is a full time pastor on a salary, so he spends the whole week preparing two sermons. He tells us that he is under pressure to have them ready by Sunday morning, because there's so much to research and prepare. He never copies anyone else's sermon, he prepares all of his own sermons.

I can put up a link if you would ever like to hear any of them, you could even email him and ask him questions but I don't think that he's interested in debating anyone because he's just too busy doing Gods work to waste time on futile debates.

I don't know why people here don't believe that god appoints certain men to shepherd flocks, don't you guys believe in the God ordained idea of a Church with elders.

 

[Slayer]

So you are saying that your preacher is perfect? Does he claim never to be wrong because if he does that perception is contrary to scripture and that would either make him a liar or ignorant.

I should have said ''he has never been wrong in the 20 odd years of his preaching", I doubt that he will start preaching a false Gospel now. He has been appointed by God to lead a Church which was ordained by God, so a true man of God will only be wrong if God makes a mistake. He is lead by the Holy Spirit who is "God" and we know that God will never lead His men into error.

I know it's very rare to find a Church that preached the Word of God faithfully, most Churches don't have the courage. They think they will lose half of their members if they preached the whole counsel of God, which is highly offensive to the hypocrites.

 

[notuptome]

Unlike you Arminians who worship Arminius, we only Worship the Father, Son and Holy Ghost. You label us Calvinists because we believe the Word of God as it is written, we don't sweep 90% of the Gospel under the carpet to fit Arminian theology into the Gospel.

Well you did not get that personal bias out of the bible. You are prejudiced against the gospel because you find it offensive. I am a biblical Christian so I'm not Calvinist nor Arminian. I do hold to a soteriology that makes the blood of Christ the sole sufficient instrument in the atonement for mans sin.

Men are saved by grace not by election. I know you are not able to make that distinction because your thinking has been muddied with Calvinism.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Slayer]

Well you did not get that personal bias out of the bible. You are prejudiced against the gospel because you find it offensive. I am a biblical Christian so I'm not Calvinist nor Arminian. I do hold to a soteriology that makes the blood of Christ the sole sufficient instrument in the atonement for mans sin.

Men are saved by grace not by election. I know you are not able to make that distinction because your thinking has been muddied with Calvinism.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Now I see where you're coming from, you have made up a new gospel according to Roger. Just how is a person saved according to your gospel, I'm very curious to know because I have always believed there were only two ways to understand the Gospel of Christ but now you're telling me there's a third way.

OK, let's have it please. The suspense is killing me.

1. Calvin said God saves us.

2. Arminius said man saves himself

3. Rogers says, green Aliens save us please correct me if I'm wrong but I couldn't think of any other possibility

 

[notuptome]

Now I see where you're coming from, you have made up a new gospel according to Roger. Just how is a person saved according to your gospel, I'm very curious to know because I have always believed there were only two ways to understand the Gospel of Christ but now you're telling me there's a third way.

OK, let's have it please. The suspense is killing me.

1. Calvin said God saves us.

2. Arminius said man saves himself

3. Rogers says, green Aliens save us please correct me if I'm wrong but I couldn't think of any other possibility

Well you are entitled to display your ignorance. Lets face it thinking is not your strong suit.

What Calvin is alleged to have said is not gospel. What Arminius is alleged to have said is not gospel. Your arrogance is killing you.

If you knew even a little church history you might gain an insight into the contrast between Calvin and Arminius. Calvinists over the years have hated and taught hate toward Arminius. Armenians in response have hated Calvinists. It is taught that Arminius taught salvation by works and is associated with the Roman Catholic church. There is no argument that the Roman Catholic church teaches that the rites they perform are essential to salvation. Clearly the bible does not teach that one is saved by rites of water baptism and the rest of Roman Catholic teaching. Calvin today is overstated by total depravity becoming total inability. No man can save himself and all men are saved only by Gods grace. This is the continuing argument between two religions that hate each other.

What does God say apart from this ongoing argument? Where does God give us what we need to know regarding salvation? Well the bible gives us all we need to know.

All men are sinners and all men are bound for eternity in hell because of their sin. All men choose to sin as God does not predestine men to sin.

Christ shed His blood on Calvary that men through Him might be saved. The blood of Christ saves completely and needs no additional sacrifice to be complete. The blood of Christ is wholly sufficient to save every soul born into this world. The sacrifice is not limited to a chose few but is available to all. Men choose to sin and men can choose to repent from sin and receive Christ as their Savior. How can men choose? Adam received the knowledge of good and evil when he sinned in the garden. Note that while Eve was deceived Adam choose to sin. This knowledge is why man must choose. Not only is man able to choose but he must choose.

It is pointless to argue Calvin against Arminius when we are to witness of what Christ has done for us. We are to tell others how Christ forgave our sin and how Christ will forgive the sins of all who call upon Him. Not by merit or by election but by grace. It broke Gods heart when Adam sinned but God took pity on Adam and Eve and provided an atonement that they could have their sins covered and be restored back to God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[tourist]

I should have said ''he has never been wrong in the 20 odd years of his preaching", I doubt that he will start preaching a false Gospel now. He has been appointed by God to lead a Church which was ordained by God, so a true man of God will only be wrong if God makes a mistake. He is lead by the Holy Spirit who is "God" and we know that God will never lead His men into error.

I know it's very rare to find a Church that preached the Word of God faithfully, most Churches don't have the courage. They think they will lose half of their members if they preached the whole counsel of God, which is highly offensive to the hypocrites.

He may indeed be a man of God and probably is but it is inconceivable that he has never been wrong in 20 years of preaching. God does not make mistakes but people do. I hope that you don't accept everything that he says as being perfectly aligned with the Word of God but rather the bible says that you should test what is being preached as actually being scripturally correct. God does not lead men into error but men lead themselves into error. This church you attend sounds very much like a cult and the pastor is the leader. If he has never been wrong in 20 years of preaching that would certainly be a first in the history of mankind. I have been told that only the pope is infallible but even then that is only when he speaks en cathedra that has only been done twice in the entire history of the Catholic Church, and even then the pope was wrong. Some kind of preacher that you got there, that's for sure.

 

[Slayer]

Well you are entitled to display your ignorance. Lets face it thinking is not your strong suit.

What Calvin is alleged to have said is not gospel. What Arminius is alleged to have said is not gospel. Your arrogance is killing you.

If you knew even a little church history you might gain an insight into the contrast between Calvin and Arminius. Calvinists over the years have hated and taught hate toward Arminius. Armenians in response have hated Calvinists. It is taught that Arminius taught salvation by works and is associated with the Roman Catholic church. There is no argument that the Roman Catholic church teaches that the rites they perform are essential to salvation. Clearly the bible does not teach that one is saved by rites of water baptism and the rest of Roman Catholic teaching. Calvin today is overstated by total depravity becoming total inability. No man can save himself and all men are saved only by Gods grace. This is the continuing argument between two religions that hate each other.

What does God say apart from this ongoing argument? Where does God give us what we need to know regarding salvation? Well the bible gives us all we need to know.

All men are sinners and all men are bound for eternity in hell because of their sin. All men choose to sin as God does not predestine men to sin.

Christ shed His blood on Calvary that men through Him might be saved. The blood of Christ saves completely and needs no additional sacrifice to be complete. The blood of Christ is wholly sufficient to save every soul born into this world. The sacrifice is not limited to a chose few but is available to all. Men choose to sin and men can choose to repent from sin and receive Christ as their Savior. How can men choose? Adam received the knowledge of good and evil when he sinned in the garden. Note that while Eve was deceived Adam choose to sin. This knowledge is why man must choose. Not only is man able to choose but he must choose.

It is pointless to argue Calvin against Arminius when we are to witness of what Christ has done for us. We are to tell others how Christ forgave our sin and how Christ will forgive the sins of all who call upon Him. Not by merit or by election but by grace. It broke Gods heart when Adam sinned but God took pity on Adam and Eve and provided an atonement that they could have their sins covered and be restored back to God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

So you are saying man saves himself by choosing to believe the Gospel, so you are an Armininan after all. It's OK to come out of the closet, there's are plenty of your kind around.

 

[Slayer]

He may indeed be a man of God and probably is but it is inconceivable that he has never been wrong in 20 years of preaching. God does not make mistakes but people do. I hope that you don't accept everything that he says as being perfectly aligned with the Word of God but rather the bible says that you should test what is being preached as actually being scripturally correct. God does not lead men into error but men lead themselves into error. This church you attend sounds very much like a cult and the pastor is the leader. If he has never been wrong in 20 years of preaching that would certainly be a first in the history of mankind. I have been told that only the pope is infallible but even then that is only when he speaks en cathedra that has only been done twice in the entire history of the Catholic Church, and even then the pope was wrong. Some kind of preacher that you got there, that's for sure.

We all have open bibles in my Church, I don't know about your church but everything is transparent in my Church.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Paul in Romans 1 is writing this letter to those that are in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints. Paul says "that I may be comforted together with you by the mutual faith both of you and me". Does not sound like "all natural men" to me. The ones that he is addressing are "all men" of the church at Rome. He even says that their faith is spoken of throughout the whole world, and you are thinking that he is talking to the natural man that cannot understand what he is talking about.

Paul writes to the believers in the church and Paul tells the believers about the wrath of God revealed against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness (Rom 1:18).

Rom 1:18 does not describe the believers to whom Paul wrote the letter. Rom 1:18 describes unbelievers who suppress the truth in unrighteousness.

That you want Rom 1:18 to describe "disobedient believers" does not make it so. You change the very Word of God in your desperate attempt to prop up a manmade doctrine.

1 Cor 2:11, The natural man knoweth the things of man by the spirit of man that is in him, and the spiritual man knoweth the things of the Spirit by the Spirit of God that is in him.

The "spiritual things" spoken of in 1 Cor 2 relate to the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the world unto our glory (1 Cor 2:7).

The "spiritual things" spoken of in 1 Cor 2 do not relate to the natural, physical realm of the creation spoken of in Rom 1:20-21 which is easily observed by natural man.

What is so hard to understand about that?

Your dogma has twisted Scripture into a pretzel. Once we unwind your error, Scripture speaks eloquently and tells us in Rom 1:18-32 that those who suppress the truth in unrighteousness are without excuse.

 

[notuptome]

So you are saying man saves himself by choosing to believe the Gospel, so you are an Armininan after all. It's OK to come out of the closet, there's are plenty of your kind around.

To be blunt that is what you are saying about me not what I am saying. Choosing to make a choice which God has obligated me to make is not saving myself. It is throwing myself onto the mercy of God and receiving the salvation God has offered to a man unworthy of the least of His favor.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[ForestGreenCook]

I have read the Bible and I did read the part that says "he who trust in man us cursed" I think this refers to trusting in a man for one's salvation, so never fear. I only trust in the Lord for my salvation and I know it sounds crazy but we all have open Bibles during the sermon in our Church, so it's not like our preacher is preaching the Book of Zeus.

There are around 80 of us sheep, just waiting to pounce on the preacher should he ever dare to add or subtract a single iota from the completed cannon of scripture or preach anything unbiblicall. We are constantly flicking through the Bible and we are overloaded with scriptures, so we need to go home and continue studying the all the relevant scriptures to get the whole message. The messages are so deep and meaningful, they we usually spend the rest of the week digesting the morning and evening messages.

Our pastor is a full time pastor on a salary, so he spends the whole week preparing two sermons. He tells us that he is under pressure to have them ready by Sunday morning, because there's so much to research and prepare. He never copies anyone else's sermon, he prepares all of his own sermons.

I can put up a link if you would ever like to hear any of them, you could even email him and ask him questions but I don't think that he's interested in debating anyone because he's just too busy doing Gods work to waste time on futile debates.

I don't know why people here don't believe that god appoints certain men to shepherd flocks, don't you guys believe in the God ordained idea of a Church with elders.

The church that I attend, The Primitive Baptist, also call their preachers elders instead of Reverend. We believe they are called of God to preach. They do not learn scripture from going to any kind of teaching institutions, They never take a prepared script to the stand with them. Most of them work at secular jobs until they retire and preach while doing so. They diligently study the scriptures and are led by the Spirit when they are in the stand. Sometimes they don't know, when they enter the stand, what their subject will be. We preach two preachers back to back and sometimes the second preacher will continue on the subject of the first preacher.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

To be blunt that is what you are saying about me not what I am saying. Choosing to make a choice which God has obligated me to make is not saving myself. It is throwing myself onto the mercy of God and receiving the salvation God has offered to a man unworthy of the least of His favor.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

If God offers and waits for man to respond, then it is not by grace. It is by the works of man. Sorry I butted in, Slayer.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Paul writes to the believers in the church and Paul tells the believers about the wrath of God revealed against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness (Rom 1:18).

Rom 1:18 does not describe the believers to whom Paul wrote the letter. Rom 1:18 describes unbelievers who suppress the truth in unrighteousness.

That you want Rom 1:18 to describe "disobedient believers" does not make it so. You change the very Word of God in your desperate attempt to prop up a manmade doctrine.





The "spiritual things" spoken of in 1 Cor 2 relate to the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the world unto our glory (1 Cor 2:7).

The "spiritual things" spoken of in 1 Cor 2 do not relate to the natural, physical realm of the creation spoken of in Rom 1:20-21 which is easily observed by natural man.





Your dogma has twisted Scripture into a pretzel. Once we unwind your error, Scripture speaks eloquently and tells us in Rom 1:18-32 that those who suppress the truth in unrighteousness are without excuse.

I have explained Romans one many times, and it would be futile to explain it one more time! You will never see the true doctrine of Christ until you rightly divide the truth, and that would include dividing the salvation (deliverance) scriptures.