Historical use of the word Ekklesia

[cinder]

My church is starting a church wide study on "the priorities of Jesus". Just got the small group guide and the first lesson contains the following assertion :

The Greek word for Church is Ekklesia. The meaning is "the called out ones". Ekklesia was a common term in Roman days. The Roman Emperor had his Ekklesia team. They would meet with the emperor regularly to hear his commands. Then they would go into a community and influence the people toward "the Roman way and culture". This was the assimilation process which conquered nations. The goal was to create a united empire.

There's no source listed and in my own brief research I can find no source to corroborate that the word was ever used in such a context. But before I make an idiot out of myself and derail next week's small group discussion, thought I'd ask if anyone has ever heard that interpretation of the word ecclesia before and if they have any reputable sources to back it up (specifically the whole part about the Roman Emperor's task force type of deal).

 

[UnderGrace]

I think there is historical truth to this since the word preceded the time of Christ. The Romans did adopt the word into Latin. In Latin is is "ecclesia"

Ekklesia is not Church.

It is referring to the "called out people" for Christians it is a daring word because it means we are called out of the system.

Here is some help.....

The roots of the word ekklesia go all the way back to the city of Athens in its classical period, which stretched from roughly 550 to 350 BC. Within the city-state ekklesia consisted of all the citizens who had retained their civil rights. The ekklesia's powers were almost unlimited. It elected and dismissed magistrates and directed the policy of the city. It declared war, and it made peace. It negotiated and approved treaties and arranged alliances. It chose generals, assigned troops to different campaigns, raised the necessary money, and dispatched those troops from city to city. It was an assembly in which all members had equal right and duty. As the Roman Empire rose and supplanted the Greeks, the Romans adopted the term into Latin.

https://www.bibletools.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Topical.show/RTD/cgg/ID/2415/Ekklesia.htm

 

[Shamah]

I will give some history in the following post, I want to give the definitions first:

G1577 ἐκκλησία ekklesia (ek-klee-siy'-a) n.
1. (literally) a “calling out.” (see H4744 for usage in Israel).
2. (concretely, of Greece) an assembly of citizens (as called out by the town crier for a specific purpose).
3. (specifically, of Jesus) a called out assembly of the Redeemed of Jesus (Yeshua).
4. (specially, of Jesus) the citizenry of the Redeemed of Jesus whether being on earth or in heaven or both.
5. (of ancient continuity) a called out assembly (of the Redeemed Kinsmen of Yahweh— out of captivity; see Nehemiah 8:8, then Exodus 6:6, Exodus 15:13).
6. (Note #1) (“called out assembly” is first used by context in the Old Covenant in Nehemiah 8:8, Isaiah 1:13, Isaiah 4:5).
7. (Note #2) (some of the Septuagint translators did not recognize and grasp this Hebraic context, and they mistranslated the Hebrew and also frequently misapplied this Greek word elsewhere, obscuring and distorting its meaning and application).
{used only of people, not a location, structure, etc. Of Christ, used only of the Redeemed, not of the unredeemed in their midst}
[from a compound of G1537 and a derivative of G2564]
KJV: assembly, church
Root(s): G1537, G2564
Compare: G1218, G4864
See also: G2822, H4744

H6951 קָהָל qahal (kaw-hawl') n-m.
(usually concretely) a gathering, assemblage.
[from H6950]
KJV: assembly, company, congregation, multitude.
Root(s): H6950
See also: G4864

 

[Shamah]

This is vital info IMO concerning the use of "church or ekklesia" in translation:

Church’ is an unfortunate mistranslation of the Greek word ekklesia — literally meaning called out. The Greek word carries no connotation of a building, but of people. William Tyndale understood this. In his 1525 completed text of the New Testament, there is no church. There is only community. Even under great pressure to translate ekklesia as church, Tyndale resisted.

For the sake of background, the word ekklesia appears in the Greek New Testament about 111 times and is included in 17 of the 27 New Testament books. Of those, it is used most often in Acts (23 times), 1 Corinthians (21 times), Revelation (19 times), 2 Corinthians (9 times), and Ephesians (9 times). After that it appears between one and five times in the other N.T. documents that use it. It is employed by Matthew (who attributes it to Jesus), by Luke (who only uses it in Acts, but never in his Gospel), by Paul in 11 of his writings, by the writer of Hebrews, by James, and by John in 2 of his five contributions to the New Testament (if it is the same “John” who wrote all of those). Another way of looking at is — the only N.T. authors who don’t use it are Mark, Peter, and Jude.

So — Mr. Tyndale had 111 chances to use the word “Church” when he came to this word in the Greek manuscripts, and he chose to use that word a total of ZERO times, and to use congregation instead

Eventually, Tyndale was betrayed by Henry Phillips to the imperial authorities, seized in Antwerp in 1535, and held in the castle of Vilvoorde (Filford) near Brussels. He was tried on a charge of heresy in 1536 and was condemned to be burned to death, despite Thomas Cromwell's intercession on his behalf. Tyndale "was strangled to death while tied at the stake, and then his dead body was burned". His final words, spoken "at the stake with a fervent zeal, and a loud voice", were reported as "Lord! Open the King of England's eyes." The traditional date of commemoration is 6 October, but records of Tyndale's imprisonment suggest that the actual date of his execution might have been some weeks earlier. Foxe gives 6 October as the date of commemoration (left-hand date column), but gives no date of death (right-hand date column). Biographer David Daniell states the date of death only as "one of the first days of October 1536".

Within four years, four English translations of the Bible were published in England at the King's behest, including Henry's official Great Bible. All were based on Tyndale's work.

 

[Shamah]

Some history on the actual word:

Smith's Bible Dictionary


1. The derivation of the word is generally said to be from the Greek kuriakon (kuriakon) "belonging to the Lord." But the derivation has been too hastily assumed. It is probably connected with kirk , the Latin circus, circulus, the Greek kuklos (kuklos) because the congregations were gathered in circles.

2. Ecclesia (ekklesia) the Greek word for church, originally meant an assembly called out by the magistrate, or by legitimate authority. It was in this last sense that the word was adapted and applied by the writers of the New Testament to the Christian congregation. In the one Gospel of St. Matthew the church is spoken of no less than thirty-six times as "the kingdom." Other descriptions or titles are hardly found in the evangelists. It is Christ’s household, (Matthew 10:25) the salt and light of the world, (Matt 5:13; Matt 5:15) Christ’s flock, (Matthew 26:31; John 10:15) its members are the branches growing on Christ the Vine, John 15; but the general description of it, not metaphorical but direct, is that it is a kingdom, (Matthew 16:19) From the Gospel then we learn that Christ was about to establish his heavenly kingdom on earth, which was to be the substitute for the Jewish Church and kingdom, now doomed to destruction (Matthew 21:43) The day of Pentecost is the birthday of the Christian church. Before they had been individual followers Jesus; now they became his mystical body, animated by his spirit. On the evening of the day of Pentecost, the 3140 members of which the Church consisted were -- (1) Apostles; (2) previous Disciples; (3) Converts. In (Acts 2:41) we have indirectly exhibited the essential conditions of church communion. They are (1) Baptism, baptism implying on the part of the recipient repentance and faith; (2) Apostolic Doctrine; (3) Fellowship with the Apostles; (4) The Lord’s Supper; (5) Public Worship. The real Church consists of all who belong to the Lord Jesus Christ as his disciples, and are one in love, in character, in hope, in Christ as the head of all, though as the body of Christ it consists of many parts.

church (n.) Old English cirice, circe "church, public place of worship; Christians collectively," from West Germanic *kirika (cf. Old Saxon kirika, Old Norse kirkja, Old Frisian zerke, Middle Dutch kerke, Dutch kerk, Old High German kirihha, German Kirche), probably [see note in OED] from Greek kyriake (oikia), kyriakon doma "Lord's (house)," from kyrios "ruler, lord," from PIE root *keue- "to swell" ("swollen," hence "strong, powerful"); see cumulus. Phonetic spelling from c.1200, established by 16c. For vowel evolution, see bury. As an adjective from 1570s.

Circe (n.) Enchantress of the isle of Aea who transformed into swine those who drank from her cup ("Odyssey"), late 14c., from Latin Circe, from Greek Kirke. Related: Circean.

 

[Splagna]

I think there is historical truth to this since the word preceded the time of Christ. The Romans did adopt the word into Latin. In Latin is is "ecclesia"

Ekklesia is not Church.

It is referring to the "called out people" for Christians it is a daring word because it means we are called out of the system.

Here is some help.....

The roots of the word ekklesia go all the way back to the city of Athens in its classical period, which stretched from roughly 550 to 350 BC. Within the city-state ekklesia consisted of all the citizens who had retained their civil rights. The ekklesia's powers were almost unlimited. It elected and dismissed magistrates and directed the policy of the city. It declared war, and it made peace. It negotiated and approved treaties and arranged alliances. It chose generals, assigned troops to different campaigns, raised the necessary money, and dispatched those troops from city to city. It was an assembly in which all members had equal right and duty. As the Roman Empire rose and supplanted the Greeks, the Romans adopted the term into Latin.

https://www.bibletools.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Topical.show/RTD/cgg/ID/2415/Ekklesia.htm

Great source. The people of a town meeting as an assembly (ekklesia) can be found in Acts 19:32, 39f. The OP’s quote I'm having problems with is, "The Roman Emperor had his Ekklesia team." I’d like to see a source for that. For a quick review of Rome’s method of assimilating conquered people see Wikipedia.

"The called out ones" definition for ekklesia appears to come from the word’s use regarding Israel and not Rome. Ekklesia is used referring to Israel (LXX Deuteronomy 31:30) and Acts 7:38. Israel was called out from the other nations to be God’s people (Romans 9:4) and when they assembled they were an ekklesia of the called out ones. This concept was then transferred to the Christians

 

[Shamah]

Great source. The people of a town meeting as an assembly (ekklesia) can be found in Acts 19:32, 39f. The OP’s quote I'm having problems with is, "The Roman Emperor had his Ekklesia team." I’d like to see a source for that. For a quick review of Rome’s method of assimilating conquered people see Wikipedia.

"The called out ones" definition for ekklesia appears to come from the word’s use regarding Israel and not Rome. Ekklesia is used referring to Israel (LXX Deuteronomy 31:30) and Acts 7:38. Israel was called out from the other nations to be God’s people (Romans 9:4) and when they assembled they were an ekklesia of the called out ones. This concept was then transferred to the Christians

This is from the Biblical Cyclopedia:

"(2) that the Roman Church (and the Romanic languages after it) adopted the Greek word ἐκκλησία, not κυριακόν, from its Greek teachers. His conclusion, after dropping the first derivation, is that “it is difficult to say what is to be substituted. There was probably some word which, in the the old heathen places of religious assembly, and this word, having taken different forms in different dialects, was adopted by the Christian missionaries. It was probably connected with the Latin circus, circulus"

 

[SpoonJuly]

There is one very important characteristic of the "called out assemble" that is ignored by most.
It was local. It was visible. All members could meet in one place.
So when using the word ekklesia to refer to all the saved as "the church" it is misusing the original meaning of the word.
Ekklesia is proper when referring to the local assemble, LOCAL CHURCH.
When referring to all the saved, it would be more correct to call them the family of God, the children of God, but not THE CHURCH.

 

[Ahwatukee]

My church is starting a church wide study on "the priorities of Jesus". Just got the small group guide and the first lesson contains the following assertion :

The Greek word for Church is Ekklesia. The meaning is "the called out ones". Ekklesia was a common term in Roman days. The Roman Emperor had his Ekklesia team. They would meet with the emperor regularly to hear his commands. Then they would go into a community and influence the people toward "the Roman way and culture". This was the assimilation process which conquered nations. The goal was to create a united empire.

There's no source listed and in my own brief research I can find no source to corroborate that the word was ever used in such a context. But before I make an idiot out of myself and derail next week's small group discussion, thought I'd ask if anyone has ever heard that interpretation of the word ecclesia before and if they have any reputable sources to back it up (specifically the whole part about the Roman Emperor's task force type of deal).

Hello Cinder,

The "Ekklesia" is a specific group of "called out ones beginning from Jesus ministry and more specifically on the day of Pentecost." Jesus said, "I will build my Ekklesia and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it." The word "build" is in the future tense, as in not yet built. Today the church is still in the process of being built and will come to a close when the Lord appears and calls up His church, dead and living.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Ekklesia is proper when referring to the local assemble, LOCAL CHURCH.
When referring to all the saved, it would be more correct to call them the family of God, the children of God, but not THE CHURCH.

According to Scripture ekklesia means BOTH the local assembly (church) as well as the whole Body of Christ (all redeemed Jews and Gentiles), also called "the Church". Please note:

For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named... Unto him be glory in the church* (ekklesia) by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen. (Eph 3:14,15,21)

Strong's Concordance
ekklésia: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Original Word: ἐκκλησία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: ekklésia
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-klay-see'-ah)
Short Definition: an assembly, congregation, church
Definition: an assembly, congregation, church; the Church, the whole body of Christian believers.

 

[Ahwatukee]

According to Scripture ekklesia means BOTH the local assembly (church) as well as the whole Body of Christ (all redeemed Jews and Gentiles), also called "the Church". Please note:
For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named... Unto him be glory in the church* (ekklesia) by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen. (Eph 3:14,15,21)

Strong's Concordance
ekklésia: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Original Word: ἐκκλησία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: ekklésia
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-klay-see'-ah)
Short Definition: an assembly, congregation, church
Definition: an assembly, congregation, church; the Church, the whole body of Christian believers.

If that were true, then why would Jesus say "I will build my church," which is in the future tense? And if the OT saints belonged to the church, why wouldn't they be resurrected at the same time the church is when the Lord appears? In addition to this, neither are the great tribulation saints referred to as the ekklesia. They belong to Christ, but not to the church. Neither do the 144,000 belong to the church.

 

[cinder]

The [part of] the OP’s quote I'm having problems with is, "The Roman Emperor had his Ekklesia team." I’d like to see a source for that.

Me too, hence the thread asking if anyone knew of such a source or where this idea might have come from.

Thanks for all the responses so far everyone, it's interesting reading.

 

[SpoonJuly]

According to Scripture ekklesia means BOTH the local assembly (church) as well as the whole Body of Christ (all redeemed Jews and Gentiles), also called "the Church". Please note:
For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named... Unto him be glory in the church* (ekklesia) by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen. (Eph 3:14,15,21)

Strong's Concordance
ekklésia: an assembly, a (religious) congregation
Original Word: ἐκκλησία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: ekklésia
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-klay-see'-ah)
Short Definition: an assembly, congregation, church
Definition: an assembly, congregation, church; the Church, the whole body of Christian believers.

The Scriptures you offered do not prove my post to be wrong.
The definition given in Strong's as THE CHURCH violates the original meaning of the word.
And yes, glory is to be given to Him in the Ekklesia, LOCAL CHURCH.
Paul addressed LOCAL CHURCHES.
In revelation, Jesus addressed seven LOCAL CHURCHES, not THE CHURCH.
Just as there are saved folks who do not always live a Christian life, there are saved folks who are children of God but have never been part of a LOCAL CHURCH. There are many on this forum.
I like to stay with the original meaning of words, not definitions added by men.

 

[Nehemiah6]

If that were true, then why would Jesus say "I will build my church," which is in the future tense?

The Church became a reality on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 2), when about 3,000 Jews were saved. So it was yet future before the resurrection and the ascension of Christ. And Gentiles were added later (but not much later. Acts 10).

And if the OT saints belonged to the church, why wouldn't they be resurrected at the same time the church is when the Lord appears?

The OT saints became "the spirits of just men made perfect" after the Resurrection of Christ (Heb 12:22-24). But since there is only ONE resurrection of the just (which coincides with the Rapture) then both OT and NT saints who died will be resurrected together at the coming of Christ for His saints.

In addition to this, neither are the great tribulation saints referred to as the ekklesia. They belong to Christ, but not to the church. Neither do the 144,000 belong to the church.

Correct. These two groups are not a part of the Church.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I like to stay with the original meaning of words, not definitions added by men.

Well the original meaning of "the Church" as opposed to churches is given here:

EPHESIANS 5
23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

There is absolutely no way that this passage can be simply limited to the Ephesian assembly, since we know from many other passages that the Church is the Body (as shown here), the Bride (as shown here). and the Building of Christ (as shown elsewhere in Ephesians).

 

[UnderGrace]

Great source. The people of a town meeting as an assembly (ekklesia) can be found in Acts 19:32, 39f. The OP’s quote I'm having problems with is, "The Roman Emperor had his Ekklesia team." I’d like to see a source for that. For a quick review of Rome’s method of assimilating conquered people see Wikipedia.

"The called out ones" definition for ekklesia appears to come from the word’s use regarding Israel and not Rome. Ekklesia is used referring to Israel (LXX Deuteronomy 31:30) and Acts 7:38. Israel was called out from the other nations to be God’s people (Romans 9:4) and when they assembled they were an ekklesia of the called out ones. This concept was then transferred to the Christians

While the word "ecclesia" does appear in letters written in ancient Rome in reference to the political assembly.

Ecdicus, domine, Amisenorum civitatis petebat apud me a Iulio Pisone denariorum circiter quadraginta milia donata ei publice ante viginti annos bule et ecclesia consentiente, utebaturque mandatis tuis, quibus eius modi donationes vetantur.

Translation:

The solicitor to the treasury of the city of Amisus laid a claim, Sir, before me against Julius Piso of about 40,000 denarii, which were given him by the public above twenty years ago, with the consent of the general council and assembly of the city

Pliny Book 10, Letter 110 (English)

“gathering of those summoned”

I have found no evidence of the Roman Emperor having his "Ecclesia Team", I sense it modern speak for the "political body" (assembly) like the one in Athens.

The Romans did adopt and adapt Greek political ways.

 

[Shamah]

Me too, hence the thread asking if anyone knew of such a source or where this idea might have come from.

Thanks for all the responses so far everyone, it's interesting reading.

The Romans persecuted believers

from the apostles, this is a must read on the topic

https://archive.org/details/foxesbookofmarty00fox

for the better part of the next 1700 years...

 

[SpoonJuly]

Well the original meaning of "the Church" as opposed to churches is given here:

EPHESIANS 5
23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

There is absolutely no way that this passage can be simply limited to the Ephesian assembly, since we know from many other passages that the Church is the Body (as shown here), the Bride (as shown here). and the Building of Christ (as shown elsewhere in Ephesians).

And each of these Scriptures can and do refer to each and every LOCAL CHURCH.
When Jesus was on earth, His presence was limited to where His fleshly body was.
He could not be in two places at the same time.
Each local church is His Body in the local community it ministers.

 

[UnderGrace]

Me too, hence the thread asking if anyone knew of such a source or where this idea might have come from.

Thanks for all the responses so far everyone, it's interesting reading.

Roman Emperor having his "Ecclesia Team

I really think this is are reference to the Roman assembly, but you can let us know.

 

[Shamah]

While the word "ecclesia" does appear in letters written in ancient Rome in reference to the political assembly.

Ecdicus, domine, Amisenorum civitatis petebat apud me a Iulio Pisone denariorum circiter quadraginta milia donata ei publice ante viginti annos bule et ecclesia consentiente, utebaturque mandatis tuis, quibus eius modi donationes vetantur.

Translation:

The solicitor to the treasury of the city of Amisus laid a claim, Sir, before me against Julius Piso of about 40,000 denarii, which were given him by the public above twenty years ago, with the consent of the general council and assembly of the city

Pliny Book 10, Letter 110 (English)

“gathering of those summoned”

I have found no evidence of the Roman Emperor having his "Ecclesia Team", I sense it modern speak for the "political body" (assembly) like the one in Athens.

The Romans did adopt and adapt Greek political ways.

I agree with what you provide here, and want to add some info...
These were not any kind of "missionary teams" these were councils held by the Emperors, bishops, etc. The rulers essentially.

Here are a few passages showing a little detail of who was there and what was going on:

Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, Vol. 2, by Edward Gibbon


"When Caecilian was invited to an assembly of bishops, Purpurius said to his brethren, or rather to his accomplices, "Let him come hither to receive our imposition of hands, and we will break his head by way of penance." Optat. l. i. c. 19.

8 The councils of Arles, of Nice, and of Trent, confirmed the wise and moderate practice of the church of Rome. The Donatists, however, had the advantage of maintaining the sentiment of Cyprian, and of a considerable part of the primitive church.

The ecclesiastical government of Constantine cannot be justified from the reproach of levity and weakness. But the credulous monarch, unskilled in the stratagems of theological warfare, might be deceived by the modest and specious professions of the heretics, whose sentiments he never perfectly understood; and while he protected Arius, and persecuted Athanasius, he still considered the council of Nice as the bulwark of the Christian faith, and the peculiar glory of his own reign.

The synod of Tyre was conducted by Eusebius of Caesarea, with more passion, and with less art, than his learning and experience might promise; his numerous faction repeated the names of homicide and tyrant; and their clamors were encouraged by the seeming patience of Athanasius, who expected the decisive moment to produce Arsenius alive and unhurt in the midst of the assembly. The nature of the other charges did not admit of such clear and satisfactory replies; yet the archbishop was able to prove, that in the village, where he was accused of breaking a consecrated chalice, neither church nor altar nor chalice could really exist. The Arians, who had secretly determined the guilt and condemnation of their enemy, attempted, however, to disguise their injustice by the imitation of judicial forms: the synod appointed an episcopal commission of six delegates to collect evidence on the spot; and this measure which was vigorously opposed by the Egyptian bishops, opened new scenes of violence and perjury.

See Eusebius in Vit. Constantin. l. ii. c. 56, 60. In the sermon to the assembly of saints, which the emperor pronounced when he was mature in years and piety, he declares to the idolaters (c. xii.) that they are permitted to offer sacrifices, and to exercise every part of their religious worship."

Basically men sit around and declare what is or is not acceptable to the Most High....