The Abomination of Desolation
- Thread starter Tina2018
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
The thing is if you are a 1st century reader and you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, you will think "OK" this is what Jesus was talking about.
And as for the abomination of desolation, in Daniel it is clearly about what is commonly taught in churches, i.e a statue of some false god or something set up in the holy place.
Problem I have with that interpretation is: The TEMPLE is not holy. If the jews build a third temple, it will be blasphemous to sacrifice animals there, will it not? So that is an abomination in itself. In the NT Jesus raised up His body, which was the temple, christians are the temple of the Holy Spirit. NOT some temple built by unbelievers who are still sacrificing animals.
And as for the abomination of desolation, in Daniel it is clearly about what is commonly taught in churches, i.e a statue of some false god or something set up in the holy place.
Problem I have with that interpretation is: The TEMPLE is not holy. If the jews build a third temple, it will be blasphemous to sacrifice animals there, will it not? So that is an abomination in itself. In the NT Jesus raised up His body, which was the temple, christians are the temple of the Holy Spirit. NOT some temple built by unbelievers who are still sacrificing animals.
Alexandrian riots.
jacob and Simon uprising.
Battle of the Medway.
Roman-Bosporan wars.
Battle of Uspe.
Roman-Parthian wars.
Iberian-Armenian wars.
Jewish-Roman wars.
Jerusalem Riot.
Zealot Temple Siege.
Siege of Masada.
Siege of Jerusalem.
..... And dozens of other sieges and conflicts all over the Roman empire.
Google is your friend, not enemy.
jacob and Simon uprising.
Battle of the Medway.
Roman-Bosporan wars.
Battle of Uspe.
Roman-Parthian wars.
Iberian-Armenian wars.
Jewish-Roman wars.
Jerusalem Riot.
Zealot Temple Siege.
Siege of Masada.
Siege of Jerusalem.
..... And dozens of other sieges and conflicts all over the Roman empire.
Google is your friend, not enemy.
Fortunately for me, Bible is a better friend.
Mat 24:6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. These things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.
All that you have listed whether true or not, are not even the beginning of birth pains. The bible should be your friend.
Mat 24:6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. These things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.
All that you have listed whether true or not, are not even the beginning of birth pains. The bible should be your friend.
-
2
- Show all
Mat 24:9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
When reading Daniel chapters 7 through 12, you will see much of the data correlating. I therefore realize these chapters are describing the same series of events and timelines.
The beast with ten horns who destroys whatever stands in its way in Daniel 7:7, I recognize as the Northern kingdom in Daniel 11:40-41 who enters and overflows throughout many nations in the Middle East, including the Holy land.
I then put one and one together and recognize the beast with ten horns is the same as the northern kingdom who is the abomination of desolation.
Daniel 7:7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.
Daniel 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.
The beast with ten horns who destroys whatever stands in its way in Daniel 7:7, I recognize as the Northern kingdom in Daniel 11:40-41 who enters and overflows throughout many nations in the Middle East, including the Holy land.
I then put one and one together and recognize the beast with ten horns is the same as the northern kingdom who is the abomination of desolation.
Daniel 7:7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.
Daniel 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.
Some people will say the abomination of desolation happened in the first century, but it is not true, so it has not come yet.
Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Israel has 70 weeks, or 490 years, to make an end of sins, and to anoint the most holy, who is Jesus, which means Israel as a nation at the end of the 70 weeks has to be in the truth that Jesus is their Messiah.
Which Jesus came unto His own but His own did not receive Him, and God gave Israel as a nation 70 years to come to the truth, but they did not, so God allowed the Roman Empire to overthrow Jerusalem, and scatter the Jews in to the nations, so the 70 weeks could of not happened at that time.
Israel was scattered in the nations so the 70 weeks could of not been fulfilled then.
God said He will bring the Jews out of the nations, and put them back on their land, which Israel became a nation again, but they did not come to the truth as a nation, and not today, so the 70 weeks could of not been fulfilled.
God said He will continue to gather the whole house of Jacob, all 12 tribes back to their land, and leave none of them in the nations anymore, and they shall know the LORD their God from that time forward, and He will not hide His face from them anymore, so Israel as a nation will be in the truth from that time forward, and never stray again(Ezekiel 39:21-29).
So this cannot be a past prophesy, for Israel would be in the truth today, nor can it be talking about the Babylonian captivity for Israel would of not rejected Christ.
The 70 weeks could of not been fulfilled.
The Bible says Israel is blinded in part until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in, and so all Israel shall be saved(Romans 11:25-29).
Which means Israel as a nation does not acknowledge Jesus although there are still some Jews that do, but Israel as a nation has to turn to Jesus, until salvation is not available to the Gentiles, and so all Israel shall be saved for God will restore the kingdom on earth to the Jews, and Jesus will rule the earth out of Jerusalem fulfilling the law by being the perfect King on earth, which the law must be fulfilled on earth.
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
1Ti 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
God has to end this sin business on earth one day, and the new age movement is the beginning of the end, and will lead the way to the beast kingdom where all the people that do not love God will follow the beast, and when they take the mark of the beast which has to do with technology, then God can end this sin business on earth.
The new age movement interprets the Bible according to the occult, and evolution, and believe people can still evolve, and Jesus is not Lord and Savior, but a good teacher in the evolutionary process and love, and an ascended master, and avatar, but not the final teacher, and do not acknowledge a personal God, but honor the God of forces, or the power of nature as their higher power, and the New Age Christ is the final teacher and will cause them to evolve to be greater, and spiritual(Daniel 8:23-25; Daniel 11:36-38; 2 Thessalonians 2; Revelation 13).
Dan 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
1Th 5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
1Th 5:4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
69 weeks have passed, and the last 7 years is the time that God causes all people that do not love Him to follow the beast kingdom, so He can end this sin business on earth, and brings Israel as a nation to the truth that Jesus is their Messiah fulfilling the 70 weeks.
The man of sin will establish peace in the Middle East, and it will pave the way for all Jews to go to Israel, and they will not be in the nations anymore, which is what the man of sin wants, but God means it for good.
The Jews will rebuild their temple, and go back to animal sacrifices, for they are still blinded in part, with no hassle from the Palestinians, and the Jews will split Jerusalem with the Palestinians.
The Gentile nations will come together and say Peace and safety as they try to establish peace on earth, and the last week, 7 years will begin.
Repentance and salvation is still available to the world for the first three and one half years, and the 6 trumpets are warnings to the world to turn to God as He gives the world a chance to turn to Him, but they do not do it so God gives them the man of sin to rule over them, and deceive all people who do not love Him to follow the beast.
An example is WW1, set up League of Nations, did not turn to God, WW2, set up United Nations, did not turn to God, and that pattern will continue of people trying to solve their problems on earth, and have peace, without God, or at least not in the truth, but in the future they will not acknowledge a personal God, until the war with Islam against the world, the 6th trumpet, which is so terrible that it left the world without hope, and the ten horn kingdom failed at obtaining peace for the world, but they do not turn to God, but they turn to the man of sin, New Age Christ, as the solution to have peace on earth.
During the first three and one half years the world will operate by a ten horn kingdom, the world split in to ten sections with a leader in each section, which an example is America, Canada, and Mexico, as one nation, and a unified religious system based on the new age movement with their false interpretation of the Bible, and all religions interpreted as such, evolution, and people can still evolve, and will stop the preaching of anything taught contrary to it, which is what sparked the war between Islam and the world, for while the Arab governments will come together with the other governments, the people of those nations will say it is an insult to Allah, and feel they must war for they are hindering their religion, and is illegal to spread it.
It will be the time that the world will not endure the truth of the Bible, but want to hear it according to their own lusts, power through nature to evolve, and no personal God, but the exaltation of people, and they will stop the preaching of the Gospel for it is a hate crime to preach it punishable in the international criminal court system, and at the end of the three and one half years, it is the falling away first that is the condition of the world in response to the Gospel, and the transgressors have come to the full.
They do not turn to God at the end of the three and one half years, so God gives the world the New Age Christ to rule over them, and the New Age Christ will step in to the Jews temple, and tell them to stop animal sacrificing, and he is their God and Messiah, and will place the abomination of desolation.
The New Age Christ will deceive all people who do not love God, and when they do follow him repentance and salvation is no longer available to them, and the fulness of the Gentiles have come in, and then God will turn Israel to the truth that Jesus is their Messiah by way of 2 witnesses, and the Jews who know the truth will instruct other Jews, and at the end of the three and one half years Israel as a nation will be in the truth that Jesus is their Messiah.
Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Israel has 70 weeks, or 490 years, to make an end of sins, and to anoint the most holy, who is Jesus, which means Israel as a nation at the end of the 70 weeks has to be in the truth that Jesus is their Messiah.
Which Jesus came unto His own but His own did not receive Him, and God gave Israel as a nation 70 years to come to the truth, but they did not, so God allowed the Roman Empire to overthrow Jerusalem, and scatter the Jews in to the nations, so the 70 weeks could of not happened at that time.
Israel was scattered in the nations so the 70 weeks could of not been fulfilled then.
God said He will bring the Jews out of the nations, and put them back on their land, which Israel became a nation again, but they did not come to the truth as a nation, and not today, so the 70 weeks could of not been fulfilled.
God said He will continue to gather the whole house of Jacob, all 12 tribes back to their land, and leave none of them in the nations anymore, and they shall know the LORD their God from that time forward, and He will not hide His face from them anymore, so Israel as a nation will be in the truth from that time forward, and never stray again(Ezekiel 39:21-29).
So this cannot be a past prophesy, for Israel would be in the truth today, nor can it be talking about the Babylonian captivity for Israel would of not rejected Christ.
The 70 weeks could of not been fulfilled.
The Bible says Israel is blinded in part until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in, and so all Israel shall be saved(Romans 11:25-29).
Which means Israel as a nation does not acknowledge Jesus although there are still some Jews that do, but Israel as a nation has to turn to Jesus, until salvation is not available to the Gentiles, and so all Israel shall be saved for God will restore the kingdom on earth to the Jews, and Jesus will rule the earth out of Jerusalem fulfilling the law by being the perfect King on earth, which the law must be fulfilled on earth.
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
1Ti 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
God has to end this sin business on earth one day, and the new age movement is the beginning of the end, and will lead the way to the beast kingdom where all the people that do not love God will follow the beast, and when they take the mark of the beast which has to do with technology, then God can end this sin business on earth.
The new age movement interprets the Bible according to the occult, and evolution, and believe people can still evolve, and Jesus is not Lord and Savior, but a good teacher in the evolutionary process and love, and an ascended master, and avatar, but not the final teacher, and do not acknowledge a personal God, but honor the God of forces, or the power of nature as their higher power, and the New Age Christ is the final teacher and will cause them to evolve to be greater, and spiritual(Daniel 8:23-25; Daniel 11:36-38; 2 Thessalonians 2; Revelation 13).
Dan 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
1Th 5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
1Th 5:4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
69 weeks have passed, and the last 7 years is the time that God causes all people that do not love Him to follow the beast kingdom, so He can end this sin business on earth, and brings Israel as a nation to the truth that Jesus is their Messiah fulfilling the 70 weeks.
The man of sin will establish peace in the Middle East, and it will pave the way for all Jews to go to Israel, and they will not be in the nations anymore, which is what the man of sin wants, but God means it for good.
The Jews will rebuild their temple, and go back to animal sacrifices, for they are still blinded in part, with no hassle from the Palestinians, and the Jews will split Jerusalem with the Palestinians.
The Gentile nations will come together and say Peace and safety as they try to establish peace on earth, and the last week, 7 years will begin.
Repentance and salvation is still available to the world for the first three and one half years, and the 6 trumpets are warnings to the world to turn to God as He gives the world a chance to turn to Him, but they do not do it so God gives them the man of sin to rule over them, and deceive all people who do not love Him to follow the beast.
An example is WW1, set up League of Nations, did not turn to God, WW2, set up United Nations, did not turn to God, and that pattern will continue of people trying to solve their problems on earth, and have peace, without God, or at least not in the truth, but in the future they will not acknowledge a personal God, until the war with Islam against the world, the 6th trumpet, which is so terrible that it left the world without hope, and the ten horn kingdom failed at obtaining peace for the world, but they do not turn to God, but they turn to the man of sin, New Age Christ, as the solution to have peace on earth.
During the first three and one half years the world will operate by a ten horn kingdom, the world split in to ten sections with a leader in each section, which an example is America, Canada, and Mexico, as one nation, and a unified religious system based on the new age movement with their false interpretation of the Bible, and all religions interpreted as such, evolution, and people can still evolve, and will stop the preaching of anything taught contrary to it, which is what sparked the war between Islam and the world, for while the Arab governments will come together with the other governments, the people of those nations will say it is an insult to Allah, and feel they must war for they are hindering their religion, and is illegal to spread it.
It will be the time that the world will not endure the truth of the Bible, but want to hear it according to their own lusts, power through nature to evolve, and no personal God, but the exaltation of people, and they will stop the preaching of the Gospel for it is a hate crime to preach it punishable in the international criminal court system, and at the end of the three and one half years, it is the falling away first that is the condition of the world in response to the Gospel, and the transgressors have come to the full.
They do not turn to God at the end of the three and one half years, so God gives the world the New Age Christ to rule over them, and the New Age Christ will step in to the Jews temple, and tell them to stop animal sacrificing, and he is their God and Messiah, and will place the abomination of desolation.
The New Age Christ will deceive all people who do not love God, and when they do follow him repentance and salvation is no longer available to them, and the fulness of the Gentiles have come in, and then God will turn Israel to the truth that Jesus is their Messiah by way of 2 witnesses, and the Jews who know the truth will instruct other Jews, and at the end of the three and one half years Israel as a nation will be in the truth that Jesus is their Messiah.
That is right Noose, the abomination of desolation is a statue or other image that is worshiped.
Matt. 24:15 "When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
"
Maybe it is a statue of Mary, a religious symbol they pray to. Anyhow, like you said, the tribulation all around it is far more than what happened in 70 AD. No time in history have we had the capacity to destroy all flesh. Now we do. Jesus said unless He intervene all flesh will be destroyed.
Matt. 24:22 "And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."
Matt. 24:15 "When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
"Maybe it is a statue of Mary, a religious symbol they pray to. Anyhow, like you said, the tribulation all around it is far more than what happened in 70 AD. No time in history have we had the capacity to destroy all flesh. Now we do. Jesus said unless He intervene all flesh will be destroyed.
Matt. 24:22 "And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."
-
2
- Show all
The even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon represents those with no faith (not little but none) a froward nation .
It a picture of all the nations that have the born again Spirit that will escape the final judgment. The glorious land being the new heavenly Jerusalem the chaste virgin bride of Christ as the mother of us all. Jew and Gentile alike
Deuteronomy 32:20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith.
It a picture of all the nations that have the born again Spirit that will escape the final judgment. The glorious land being the new heavenly Jerusalem the chaste virgin bride of Christ as the mother of us all. Jew and Gentile alike
Deuteronomy 32:20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith.
Good day Trofimus,
The correct term is "the abomination of desolation."
The abomination being set up in the holy place is that idolatrous image that the false prophet will have made in honor of the first beast.
The desolation is the result of the abomination being set up, which is Israel making Jerusalem and Judea desolate and that because they will be fleeing out into the wilderness.
The Desolation
"So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination of desolation, described by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand), then let those in Judea flee to the mountains. Let no one on the housetop come down to retrieve anything from his house. And let no one in the field return for his cloak."
"The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.
"The woman was given the two wings of a great eagle, so that she might fly to the place prepared for her in the wilderness, where she would be taken care of for a time, times and half a time, out of the serpent’s reach."
When Israel sees that idolatrous image, the abomination, sitting in the holy place, their fleeing out into the wilderness is the desolation.
The correct term is "the abomination of desolation."
The abomination being set up in the holy place is that idolatrous image that the false prophet will have made in honor of the first beast.
The desolation is the result of the abomination being set up, which is Israel making Jerusalem and Judea desolate and that because they will be fleeing out into the wilderness.
The Desolation
"So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination of desolation, described by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand), then let those in Judea flee to the mountains. Let no one on the housetop come down to retrieve anything from his house. And let no one in the field return for his cloak."
"The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.
"The woman was given the two wings of a great eagle, so that she might fly to the place prepared for her in the wilderness, where she would be taken care of for a time, times and half a time, out of the serpent’s reach."
When Israel sees that idolatrous image, the abomination, sitting in the holy place, their fleeing out into the wilderness is the desolation.