Why Jesus is NOT coming soon

[Deade]

Didn't say that.
YOUR warning is rediculous. As if evangelizing is some threat to the kingdom.
Your position of sitting on your salvation is pretty awkward.
Read the sins of omission Jesus WARNED about ,since you are a warning centered believer.
Hmmmmm....looks like some are cast out over works.
James says faith with out works is dead.
Read the story of the good Samaritan.
You can not escape it.
You are "saved to do" = work
Not ; "do to be saved"
Religion says "do"....(to be saved)
Jesus says "done" ( doesn't mean sit on salvation)

Trying to herd people into salvation is what the Catholic Church has done down through the ages. The result: Death on a large scale. Europeans that did not conform were slaughtered. Next, the crusades to the Middle East: considered dismal failures but more death. Evangelize Middle and South America, wiping out whole civilizations of indigenous people. God didn't really expect us to turn the world into Christians. He just meant for us to witness about Christ:

Matt. 24:14 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."

A witness is just that. It can be for you or against you. Antichrist got into mainstream Christianity and perverted the gospel and what God was doing with mankind. Mainstream Christianity has no idea of God's plan of salvation.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

I see three gatherings of the wicked.
One is to Armageddon
Another rev 14 ( which is most likely the aforementioned)
Another is wheat and tares,which is AFTER the millineum.

Here's what I see. The REASON His disciples (in Matt24:3) asked Him the specific question regarding "the end [singular] of the age [singular]" (and His response is what follows) is because He had ALREADY spoken with them about that very thing, in Matt13:30,39,40,49-50. I do believe the contexts are the same (determining who goes in to "the age [singular] to come" aka the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom at the time of His Second Coming to the earth, i.e. His "RETURN" [for "RETURN" see Lk12:36-37,38,40,42-44 (see the parallel??) and Lk19:12,15,17,19 (see the parallel??)]). None of this is at the END of the MK [GWTj] (and none of this pertains to our Rapture either, by the way).

 

[Hevosmies]

.

Hi Ahwatukee. Do you believe we will feel sadness if we see our relatives in unglorified bodies perish in the millennium while we are in glorified bodies? Cause that dont sound too fun.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Hi Ahwatukee. Do you believe we will feel sadness if we see our relatives in unglorified bodies perish in the millennium while we are in glorified bodies? Cause that dont sound too fun.

I realize your question is directed at Ahwatukee, but I thought I'd chime in.

The "relatives" [LIVING] who will ENTER that time period, as I see it (and said before), have "eternal life" ["the righteous into life eternal"] (though in mortal bodies) and thus "SHALL NEVER DIE" (John 11:25-26, "I AM the Resurrection AND THE LIFE"). It would be the children born to them, who are not BORN "automatically righteous" but they do not "die" unless/until they rebel (only those who rebel "DIE" in the MK--DEATH will be much more rare, in the MK, as I understand it).

 

[Hevosmies]

I realize your question is directed at Ahwatukee, but I thought I'd chime in.

The "relatives" [LIVING] who will ENTER that time period, as I see it (and said before), have "eternal life" ["the righteous into life eternal"] (though in mortal bodies) and thus "SHALL NEVER DIE" (John 11:25-26). It would be the children born to them, who are not BORN "automatically righteous" but they do not "die" unless/until they rebel (only those who rebel "DIE" in the MK--DEATH will be much more rare, in the MK, as I understand it).

Thanks alot! This makes much sense. I have one question if you dont mind bro?:

Without resurrection glorified bodies, how can they have eternal life? Do they eat from the tree of life like in the garden of Eden?

And further on: Do they ever get glorified bodies? And if so, when? At the second resurrection?

 

[John146]

Hi Ahwatukee. Do you believe we will feel sadness if we see our relatives in unglorified bodies perish in the millennium while we are in glorified bodies? Cause that dont sound too fun.

I would say no, because at that point they are no longer relatives. Our brothers and sisters are in Christ. In Christ we do rejoice.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Hi Ahwatukee. Do you believe we will feel sadness if we see our relatives in unglorified bodies perish in the millennium while we are in glorified bodies? Cause that dont sound too fun.

Hello Hevosmies,

Well, during the millennial period we will be in our immortal and glorified bodies ruling with Christ. We will be changed, no more sinful nature. We could already be in a state where those previous things will not come to mind. Also, there are a few "ifs" to consider, which is will our loved ones be in Christ and caught up with us? If not will they even make it through the tribulation period? And if our loved ones end up in the millennial kingdom, how and why would they perish, seeing that it will be a time of unprecedented peace? The only rebellion that takes place during the thousand years, will be at the end when Satan is released and all those who are deceived referred to as Gog and Magog, are killed.

But, I believe that after we are caught up in our immortal and glorified bodies that those things may not come to mind. We'll have to wait and see on that one.

 

[Absolutely]

The events of Matt. 24 parallel with Luke 17. This has nothing to do with a rapture.

Luke 17:34-37 "I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together."

This simply points to a mass kill. The vultures feeding on those taken. The people left behind are not righteous, but they will be allowed into the millennial kingdom. God will have 144,000 young virgins with the HS, to not be transformed at Christ's coming. They will be planted into their tribes allotted land (see Eze. 48).

Nope.
Take one of your points and elaborate.
Not one of then actually line up.

 

[Absolutely]

Matt. 23:15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

Just because a man preaches with a Bible in their hands doesn't make them righteous, or sent from God. I am not sitting on salvation, I am "enduring to the end" in Faith and Hope of Salvation. And sharing what He has shown me through His Word. This is why I'm on this forum.

I don't believe in a religion which transgresses the Commandments of God by their own man made traditions. I don't believe the Christ condones creating images of Him in the likeness of some long haired men's hair shampoo model, and then create "Feasts unto the Lord" in worship of this image.

I don't believe the Christ condones rejecting or "Omitting" any of His Father's instructions. So even though this huge religious path is followed by "many", has built gigantic building and churches in His Name, and even though they feed the poor, and do many other wonderful works, all in His Name, this doesn't mean I should reject much of God's Word and follow them or further their religious doctrines, many of which are counter to God's Word..

I fear "many" have been convinced, as was the Mainstream church of Christ's time, that they are free to create their own religion, their own image of God, their own religious "High Days" and "omit" much of the instructions of God.

All prophesied, all warned about, and examples given for us in His Word, for our admonition.

Man is not a threat to His Kingdom, nothing threatens His Kingdom. What can be threatened is my participation in His Kingdom.

Matt. 16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

This has nothing to do with participating in some wealthy religious franchise. As though if I don't choose to belong to this religious franchise or that religious franchise I am somehow barred from His Kingdom.

I absolutely agree our Faith is shown by our Work's. But man's Work is a filthy rag. Only God's Works are Righteousness. Are we not to "believe" in Him?

You are connecting works with salvation.
I am connecting works with serving.

Apples < > Oranges

 

[Absolutely]

Here's what I see. The REASON His disciples (in Matt24:3) asked Him the specific question regarding "the end [singular] of the age [singular]" (and His response is what follows) is because He had ALREADY spoken with them about that very thing, in Matt13:30,39,40,49-50. I do believe the contexts are the same (determining who goes in to "the age [singular] to come" aka the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom at the time of His Second Coming to the earth, i.e. His "RETURN" [for "RETURN" see Lk12:36-37,38,40,42-44 (see the parallel??) and Lk19:12,15,17,19 (see the parallel??)]). None of this is at the END of the MK [GWTj] (and none of this pertains to our Rapture either, by the way).

I think I follow you to a certain point.
Where do you place the new Jerusalem?
LOF?
The " one taken is the wicked" concept, is pretty much debunked, would you not agree?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I realize your question is directed at Ahwatukee, but I thought I'd chime in.

The "relatives" [LIVING] who will ENTER that time period, as I see it (and said before), have "eternal life" ["the righteous into life eternal"] (though in mortal bodies) and thus "SHALL NEVER DIE" (John 11:25-26, "I AM the Resurrection AND THE LIFE"). It would be the children born to them, who are not BORN "automatically righteous" but they do not "die" unless/until they rebel (only those who rebel "DIE" in the MK--DEATH will be much more rare, in the MK, as I understand it).

Mind if I ask where you get this info?

I have eternal life. I can, and will (apart from the return of Christ) Die. What makes them any different?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Thanks alot! This makes much sense. I have one question if you dont mind bro?:

Without resurrection glorified bodies, how can they have eternal life? Do they eat from the tree of life like in the garden of Eden?

And further on: Do they ever get glorified bodies? And if so, when? At the second resurrection?

They get saved just like you and I, and ever person who came before us, By Faith in God.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I think I follow you to a certain point.
Where do you place the new Jerusalem?
LOF?
The " one taken is the wicked" concept, is pretty much debunked, would you not agree?

If I may, the new jerusalem would be after this jerusalem is destroyed, when this heaven and eart are destroyed and a new one takes its place, curious to hear his answer myself.

 

[Absolutely]

Hello Hevosmies,

Well, during the millennial period we will be in our immortal and glorified bodies ruling with Christ. We will be changed, no more sinful nature. We could already be in a state where those previous things will not come to mind. Also, there are a few "ifs" to consider, which is will our loved ones be in Christ and caught up with us? If not will they even make it through the tribulation period? And if our loved ones end up in the millennial kingdom, how and why would they perish, seeing that it will be a time of unprecedented peace? The only rebellion that takes place during the thousand years, will be at the end when Satan is released and all those who are deceived referred to as Gog and Magog, are killed.

But, I believe that after we are caught up in our immortal and glorified bodies that those things may not come to mind. We'll have to wait and see on that one.

I pretty much see it that way with the exception that it says all take the mark. And it is repeated emphatically.
Some who die in the gt. As well as other dead are resurrected after the mil. And will be separated and judged.

Just like there are no stragglers in the gwt judgement, i seriouly doubt there are stragglers to enter the kingdom towards the end of the gt.
Could be,but at this point i do not see it. It is mainly conjecture.
Conjecture is a strange thing. We don't want it challenged.

 

[Absolutely]

If I may, the new jerusalem would be after this jerusalem is destroyed, when this heaven and eart are destroyed and a new one takes its place, curious to hear his answer myself.

I would say so.
The target is the throne of David re established.
Most all events are leading to that.
" things that must happen " leading up to the TOD re established.
This ,among others,is why David is declared the fore runner to Jesus.

To me, that and the bride are just mind boggling amazing components of end times.
If the bible has a heartbeat it is found in 1&2 Samuel.
With the actual beating heat none other that Jesus Christ.

 

[Studyman]

You are connecting works with salvation.
I am connecting works with serving.

Apples < > Oranges

Either way, whether we choose the "works of God" over the works of man, or whether Jesus does the "works of God" for us, through us, we would be doing the "works of God" if He is our Father, just as He did. We are even told to "walk even as He walked". Many preach we don't do the walking, that He walks for us. But either way, the end result would be the same. Yes?

But if it is the Spirit of Christ who is "walking for us" and that we don't have a conscience choice to "Serve God" as you imply, then why do preachers molest little boys. Why is there financial fraud and money schemes in so many Mainstream Christian circles? Is the Christ not perfect? Can He not keep His "servants" from lusting after little boys and girls and crippling them for life? Or is it a choice we all make whether to serve God with our lips, or serve Him with our whole mind?

The undeniable truth of religions in this world is that they say they serve God and that His Spirit is in them. Every single MCC on the planet makes this claim. No matter what they call themselves, Baptists, Catholic, AOG, SDA, LDS, they all say "Lord, Lord. They all pretty much preach the same thing. They all "Transgress the commandments of God" by their own religious traditions, they all "omit" much of the Bible in their doctrines.

How can this be if the Spirit of Christ is truly in them? It can't be my brother.

So since by their works we know the Spirit of Christ is not in them, it seems perfectly understandable how this same Christ, who warned through out the entire Bible of deception, told us at the end of His Word to "come out of her My People".

Not a popular message as the Prophets, Stephen and the Christ Himself showed us. The truth seldom is.

 

[Absolutely]

" beating heart"

 

[Absolutely]

Either way, whether we choose the "works of God" over the works of man, or whether Jesus does the "works of God" for us, through us, we would be doing the "works of God" if He is our Father, just as He did. We are even told to "walk even as He walked". Many preach we don't do the walking, that He walks for us. But either way, the end result would be the same. Yes?

But if it is the Spirit of Christ who is "walking for us" and that we don't have a conscience choice to "Serve God" as you imply, then why do preachers molest little boys. Why is there financial fraud and money schemes in so many Mainstream Christian circles? Is the Christ not perfect? Can He not keep His "servants" from lusting after little boys and girls and crippling them for life? Or is it a choice we all make whether to serve God with our lips, or serve Him with our whole mind?

The undeniable truth of religions in this world is that they say they serve God and that His Spirit is in them. Every single MCC on the planet makes this claim. No matter what they call themselves, Baptists, Catholic, AOG, SDA, LDS, they all say "Lord, Lord. They all pretty much preach the same thing. They all "Transgress the commandments of God" by their own religious traditions, they all "omit" much of the Bible in their doctrines.

How can this be if the Spirit of Christ is truly in them? It can't be my brother.

So since by their works we know the Spirit of Christ is not in them, it seems perfectly understandable how this same Christ, who warned through out the entire Bible of deception, told us at the end of His Word to "come out of her My People".

Not a popular message as the Prophets, Stephen and the Christ Himself showed us. The truth seldom is.

Now I am really going to cut to the heart of the matter.
Preach the truth in love.
Love the people,but hate false doctrine.
But before anything, ANYTHING AT ALL.
Jesus COMANDED the church " tarry in Jerusalem till you are endued with power"
The nt was writted by Holy Ghost baptised men to Holy Gost Baptised believers.
They preached the Gospel WITH SIGNS AND WONDERS FOLLOWING.
But oh no.
Us much better modern pseudo saints have such a better way.
We water down the very power and equipping BY THE BAPTISM OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, And have the new improved " gospel" of mental salvation.

The church is. For the most part " improved" beyond the original.
We declare with " power" we need not any of Jesus power.

That is beyond worrying about cults.
What rings their bell is our love for them,and signs and wonders.
That is EXACTLY how Jesus and the early church operated.

I have " straightened out " many of them ( jehove witnesses) with zero results ( that I know of).

Years ago I was witnessing to a oneness neighbor. He only wanted to argue. He left.
I asked God what was going on. He said " don't give doctrine when you witness,give them Jesus"


I wondered for a long time how I could do that practically.

I see it now.

Give them a living encounter.

 

[Ahwatukee]

I pretty much see it that way with the exception that it says all take the mark. And it is repeated emphatically.

Good day Absolutely,

"And the second beast required all people small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark—the name of the beast or the number of his name.

As you can see from the scripture above, it does not say "all receive the mark. It states that without the mark no one will be able to buy or sell. We know from scripture that not everyone will receive the mark, namely the great tribulation saints as revealed below:

"And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or hands. And they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

So, according to the scripture above, the great tribulation saints will have not worshiped the beast, his image, nor received his mark. In another scripture regarding them, it states that "they did not have love their loves so much as to resist death."

 

[Deade]

Nope.
Take one of your points and elaborate.
Not one of then actually line up.

The parallels in Matt. 24 and Luke 17 are self explanatory and are generally accepted by most bible scholars. If they don't line up for you, maybe your lines are askew.

The sealing of the 144,000 virgins are a common sense solution. Think about it: Why is God being careful to pick out these youngsters with other saints dying all around them. Why would He not just let them die and be transformed at His coming? God is obviously saving flesh and blood humans from destruction for His special purpose. According to this scripture, they have the Holy Spirit.

Rev. 14:3-5 "And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God."