Calvinism vs. Arminianism?

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ForestGreenCook

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7seasrekeyed said:
but what about Noah? how about Enoch?

Enoch, apparently did not even have to die

Noah was chosen by God to represent a godly race

frankly, it is my opinion that some people have such a fear of hell, such a lack of trust in Christ having accomplished all, they find comfort in believing they have no choice but to be saved

anyway forest, I am not responding any further to you so don't be disappointed. it's not you. it's me. :LOL::LOL::LOL:
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I understand. God speed. If I was trusting in my own efforts to get to heaven, I would certainly have a great fear of hell.
 
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7seasrekeyed

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#802
Calvin never saved me

Jesus saved me

Calvin never died for my sins

Jesus died for my sins

there is only one gospel. I am of the belief and becoming more so, that all the 'isms' are actually heresy
 
Hevosmies

Hevosmies

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ForestGreenCook said:
Rightly divide the word of truth. You fail to understand the difference in the salvation scriptures. Salvation according th Greek is "a deliverance. There is an eternal deliverance pointed out in the scriptures and there is a deliverance we receive here on earth pointed out in the scriptures. When you apply all salvation scriptures to eternal deliverance, the scriptures will not harmonize. I do agree that eternal deliverance is through Christ Jesus alone.
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Can you give me examples of this.
Scriptures of eternal salvation and earthly deliverance (salvation) here
 
trofimus

trofimus

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7seasrekeyed said:
Calvin never saved me

Jesus saved me

Calvin never died for my sins

Jesus died for my sins

there is only one gospel. I am of the belief and becoming more so, that all the 'isms' are actually heresy
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Calvin believed that Jesus died for his sins and saved him.
 
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7seasrekeyed

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#805
trofimus said:
Calvin believed that Jesus died for his sins and saved him.
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if he was saved, that would have been what he would have had to believe

I believe the same. it is the only way to be saved

I am not a Calvinist

I have seen Calvinists on this board state that if you do not believe in the 5 points you are not saved

that, creates a different gospel IMO
 
trofimus

trofimus

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7seasrekeyed said:
I have seen Calvinists on this board state that if you do not believe in the 5 points you are not saved

that, creates a different gospel IMO
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I have seen arminians saying that calvinists are not saved. I have seen charismatics saying that if you do not speak tongues you are not saved. I have seen kjv onlyist saying that if you do not read the KJV you are not saved.

If I had a penny...
 
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ForestGreenCook

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BaptistBibleBeliever said:
What mystery? The majority of man will spend eternity in hell over God's dead body. Christ died for all of them, but most of them don't want heaven. They are having/had too much pleasure on earth. The question marks are directed to your misinformation.
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I have a question. If Christ died for all of them and he said that that he would raise all that he died for up at the last day (John 6:38) why will the majority of them spent eternity in hell. Just wondering, could the scripture be wrong?
 
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ForestGreenCook

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7seasrekeyed said:
if he was saved, that would have been what he would have had to believe

I believe the same. it is the only way to be saved

I am not a Calvinist

I have seen Calvinists on this board state that if you do not believe in the 5 points you are not saved

that, creates a different gospel IMO
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Believing is not the cause of your salvation, but the result of already being saved.
 
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ForestGreenCook

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trofimus said:
I have seen arminians saying that calvinists are not saved. I have seen charismatics saying that if you do not speak tongues you are not saved. I have seen kjv onlyist saying that if you do not read the KJV you are not saved.

If I had a penny...
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None of the above will cause you to be saved.
 
BibleloverBill

BibleloverBill

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Oct 24, 2018
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***The Holy Spirit can help the sincere seeker of God's truths no matter what Bible translation he or she uses.
Daniel, you could not even read orally the original King James Bible Tranlation.
Did you know the reason why King James had it created?
Because of his hatred for John Calvin's notes in the Geneva Bible.
The result was not authorized by God.
There have been 11 editions published since the original
and many theologians have added their comments to them.
The Geneva Bible was the Bible which Queen Elizabeth I encouraged the people in England to buy and study
in her response against the Roman Catholic Church and the Pope.
She was the daughter of King Henry VIII who went against the Pope about the no divorce doctrine
and created the Church of England.
At that time it was forbidden by the Pope and Roman Catholic priests
for any lay member to buy and study the Bible.
The USA Founding Fathers were in the only country that allowed the Bible to be in the homes.

But Calvin did have some extreme demands and expectations of those in his community and church.
No extremes are good.
Calvin was right about what the Bible says about Divine election, choosing, predestining, and pre-planning. God is not limited by current time and He knows all from the Beginning to the End.
But if God wanted Calvin-like people, He would have created robot like individuals.
Instead He gave humankind free will to either agree with Him or disagree with Him.
And you know many of the good and bad results of such in history even in your own life.
But the extreme free-will emphasizers, usually are those who only emphasize God's Grace
and claim He is always lovng and forgiving.
That is against what the Bible says.
God killed many of His Chosen People in the Old Testament because of their disobedience.
And what does the 2nd half of Romans 1 say?
 
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ForestGreenCook

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trofimus said:
"For many are called, but few chosen."
Mt 22:14

"And someone said to Him, “Lord, if those being saved are few?”
And He said to them, Strive to enter in through the narrow door; for many, I say to you, will seek to enter in, and will not be able."
Lk 13:23

"Enter through the narrow gate for wide is the gate and broad the way leading to destruction, and many are those entering through it. For small is the gate and narrow the way leading to life, and few are those finding it. "
Mt 7:13
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Many are called by the gospel, but few are chosen to be revealed the truth of the doctrine. The wide gate = Many. the strait gate = the few.
 
BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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ForestGreenCook said:
I have a question. If Christ died for all of them and he said that that he would raise all that he died for up at the last day (John 6:38) why will the majority of them spent eternity in hell. Just wondering, could the scripture be wrong?
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When Jesus was hanging on the Cross, just before He gave up the ghost . . . he prayed, 'Father forgive them, for they know not what they do."

That is in keeping with His universal call to come unto me ALL ye that are heavy laden . . .

As to your question - He will raise all at the last day. All of them will spend an eternity in hell for this is the Great White Throne judgment of Revelation 21. Yes, Christ died for ALL of them, but ALL of these particular ones rejected Him of their own free volition. Even God is powerless to convince a man against his will.

God did not create robots, no matter what Jean claims.

Scripture is not wrong - it is Calvinism that is wrong.

God can deliver you from that mess if you will only listen to the Holy Spirit and allow you to convict you about this.
 
BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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ForestGreenCook said:
Many are called by the gospel, but few are chosen to be revealed the truth of the doctrine. The wide gate = Many. the strait gate = the few.
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In both instances this phrase is used is about SERVICE not SALVATION. One to a banquet, the other to work in the field.
 
BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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I believe I have heard that name associated with a cult. I'm thinking that wassisname is referring to a Baptist preacher.
 
Hevosmies

Hevosmies

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ForestGreenCook said:
Believing is not the cause of your salvation, but the result of already being saved.
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......... Anyone reading this?

Is this not the absolute opposite of what the bible teaches? My goodness.

You are ALREADY SAVED, before you believe? Let that sink in guys.

That might fly in Geneva, but in Bible-country we dont give it a pass!
 
BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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Hevosmies said:
Is this not the absolute opposite of what the bible teaches? My goodness.
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Do you know what Charles Wesley, the hymn writer said about Calvinism? This is good!

“Oh Calvinist theology,
Oh horrible decree,
Worthy of the place from which it came,
Forgive their hellish blasphemy,
That they charge to the Lamb.”
 
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ForestGreenCook

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BaptistBibleBeliever said:
When Jesus was hanging on the Cross, just before He gave up the ghost . . . he prayed, 'Father forgive them, for they know not what they do."

That is in keeping with His universal call to come unto me ALL ye that are heavy laden . . .

As to your question - He will raise all at the last day. All of them will spend an eternity in hell for this is the Great White Throne judgment of Revelation 21. Yes, Christ died for ALL of them, but ALL of these particular ones rejected Him of their own free volition. Even God is powerless to convince a man against his will.

God did not create robots, no matter what Jean claims.

Scripture is not wrong - it is Calvinism that is wrong.

God can deliver you from that mess if you will only listen to the Holy Spirit and allow you to convict you about this.
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You did not answer my question. John 6:38 - And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he has given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. My question is; If you claim that his Father gave him all mankind, then why do you say that most will go to hell, when he says he will not lose any, but raise them up at the last day? Can you answer this?
 
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