Not By Works

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Matthew55

Active member
Dec 29, 2018
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Who are the YOU that did good things, and who are "brothers of mine"? Why do you think there is a distinction there?
I thought this was an intersting comment, and so I responded, but have not heard back. Will you please respond to my response to you.
Thank you .
 

Matthew55

Active member
Dec 29, 2018
117
30
28
Prior to my conversion several years ago, while still attending the RCC, I didn't get it. But after my conversion, upon placing my faith (belief, trust, reliance) in Jesus Christ alone for salvation, I get it. Salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9). To believe anything else is to miss salvation.
So why is it that you continue to do good works?
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
13,586
9,104
113
The YOU = whoever Jesus was talking to.
The "brothers of mine" = the poor and the needy.

You can overanalyze a scripture until you have negated the reason it was given. We do this to help us move the scripture closer to the way we believe, even though the scritpure is telling us something we do not believe.

So tell me who you think the YOU is?
So tell me who you think the "borthers of mine" are?

Sure. Here is the passage in question. My remarks in BOLD.

The Son of Man Will Judge the Nations
31 “When the Son of Man comes WHERE IS HE COMING TO? in His glory, and all the [c]holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. I CONTEND HE IS COMING TO EARTH AND SIT ON HIS EARTHLY THRONE IN JERUSALEM 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You? ARE CHRISTIANS TODAY UNAWARE THAT THIS IS WHAT WE ARE TO DO? THESE PEOPLE SEEM COMPLETELY UNAWARE. 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did unto one of the least of these JESUS IS MAKING A DISTINCTION BETWEEN WHO HE IS ADDRESSING, AND HIS BRETHREN, WHY AREN'T THEY ALL HIS BRETHREN? My brethren, you did it to Me. I CONTEND HE WAS REFERRING TO HIS PHYSICAL BRETHREN, THE "YOU", I BELIEVE, ARE THE GENTILES THAT WERE SAVED DURING THE GREAT TRIBULATION, AND AIDED THE JEWS WHO CAME TO BELIEVE IN JESUS DURING THE GREAT TRIBULATION. OTHER BELIEVERS HAD ALREADY BEEN RAPTURED.

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

44 “Then they also will answer [d]Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ 45 Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ 46 And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

I expect a decent amount here to commence in tearing their clothes and sitting in ashes as they bash my assessment.
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,262
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So why is it that you continue to do good works
Ephesians2:8-10
8)
For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God,
9) not by works, so that no one can boast. 10) For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.

It is curious to me as to why do people say if we believe that we are, "saved by grace through faith, and that 'not of yourself', then all that's left to do is "nothing", nobody is saying we should do nothing. We are saved "unto good works", not by "our good works" not to difficult to understand. We are saved through faith alone as was our Father Abraham.

Christian have many good works to show but works cannot save or keep you saved. Works are evidence of salvation not the cause of nor do works keep you saved. God will present us before Him blameless having not a righteousness of our own and eternal salvation has nothing to do with your wonderful good works.

Saved "unto good works", not by, "our good works."

Ephesians2:10: We are God's workmanship created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
typical.

you go on and on about obedience, until someone asks about YOUR obedience to the ultimate standards laid fourth in the Sermon on the mount, then you refuse to discuss it.

0 credibility when you speak of what others do, then refuse to do so about yourself.
See post 81,380.
Looks like you guys don't answer at all.
Very discourteous of @PennEd ....
I guess some can't own up to what the say.

As to me,,,
I answered you.
I'll repeat:
When you ask a SERIOUS question,
I'll give you a serious answer.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
Sure. Here is the passage in question. My remarks in BOLD.

The Son of Man Will Judge the Nations
31 “When the Son of Man comes WHERE IS HE COMING TO? in His glory, and all the [c]holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. I CONTEND HE IS COMING TO EARTH AND SIT ON HIS EARTHLY THRONE IN JERUSALEM 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You? ARE CHRISTIANS TODAY UNAWARE THAT THIS IS WHAT WE ARE TO DO? THESE PEOPLE SEEM COMPLETELY UNAWARE. 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did unto one of the least of these JESUS IS MAKING A DISTINCTION BETWEEN WHO HE IS ADDRESSING, AND HIS BRETHREN, WHY AREN'T THEY ALL HIS BRETHREN? My brethren, you did it to Me. I CONTEND HE WAS REFERRING TO HIS PHYSICAL BRETHREN, THE "YOU", I BELIEVE, ARE THE GENTILES THAT WERE SAVED DURING THE GREAT TRIBULATION, AND AIDED THE JEWS WHO CAME TO BELIEVE IN JESUS DURING THE GREAT TRIBULATION. OTHER BELIEVERS HAD ALREADY BEEN RAPTURED.

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

44 “Then they also will answer [d]Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ 45 Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ 46 And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

I expect a decent amount here to commence in tearing their clothes and sitting in ashes as they bash my assessment.
What do you think we are to do today?
What is it you think we're unaware of?
 
Oct 31, 2015
2,290
588
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so, using actual greek words and their definitions is an " ad hominem ".

well, since most of the New Testament is written in greek, maybe we should consider this language and its meanings..

again, you have no authority over Scripture, to do with as you will. this is what you are doing when you ignore the actual definitions of words, and just apply your own opinions.

submit your self to the authority of Scripture, and accept what it says, instead of trying to force your belief system over it.

Try submitting yourself to the Lord to obey Him and His doctrine without twisting and redefining His word.




JPT
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
13,586
9,104
113
See post 81,380.
Looks like you guys don't answer at all.
Very discourteous of @PennEd ....
I guess some can't own up to what the say.

As to me,,,
I answered you.
I'll repeat:
When you ask a SERIOUS question,
I'll give you a serious answer.
Not sure if you're still hanging out in Italy Fran, but some of us actually have jobs, and can't be snarky all day long.

You saw I did answer Mathews question but you felt the need to insult anyway.

You treat people poorly. Do you ever ask yourself what the heck am I doing here?


It doesn't bother you in rhe slightest that you sin every second you are here, unless you asked the owner if you could return?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Not sure if you're still hanging out in Italy Fran, but some of us actually have jobs, and can't be snarky all day long.

You saw I did answer Mathews question but you felt the need to insult anyway.

You treat people poorly. Do you ever ask yourself what the heck am I doing here?


It doesn't bother you in rhe slightest that you sin every second you are here, unless you asked the owner if you could return?
Sometimes i think it is all A game to them.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Faith only works through obedience.


Faith all by itself is dead and can not save.




JLB
You have it backwords

Obedience only works through faith,

A dead faith will not be obedient. (Although it may appear obdient, as the religious person appears to have works)
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Yes I agree.


However faith without the action of obedience is dead, and can not save, or heal, or produce the intended divine result given by God.




JPT
Wrong

Faith saves

Mere belief or a dead faith does not

True faith will always be accompanied by works

Fake faith or dead faith will not.
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
You have it backwords

Obedience only works through faith,

A dead faith will not be obedient. (Although it may appear obdient, as the religious person appears to have works)
Here is the problem EG....
You say obedience only works through faith.

Please note:
Everybody on this thread is a born again Christian.
We're talking about born again Christians.

Of course we have to have faith FIRST.
The question is:
Do good works have to follow or is it an option we have?
James said:
FAITH WITHOUT WORKS is DEAD.

See.....he's speaking to people that HAVE FAITH.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
12,328
6,696
113
See post 81,380.
Looks like you guys don't answer at all.
Very discourteous of @PennEd ....
I guess some can't own up to what the say.

As to me,,,
I answered you.
I'll repeat:
When you ask a SERIOUS question,
I'll give you a serious answer.
how 'bout this=

since you are not going to answer my question, then stop demanding others answer yours.

fairness. honesty. these are things called Christian values .

look them up sometimes, might be helpful...
 

GodsGrace101

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2018
2,225
517
113
Not sure if you're still hanging out in Italy Fran, but some of us actually have jobs, and can't be snarky all day long.

You saw I did answer Mathews question but you felt the need to insult anyway.

You treat people poorly. Do you ever ask yourself what the heck am I doing here?


It doesn't bother you in rhe slightest that you sin every second you are here, unless you asked the owner if you could return?
The kettle calling the pot black.

Anyway,,, THIS is snarky:

PennEd says:
No. I'm good. Thanks for asking though.

Discourteous
Sarcastic


And if you're going to call me an unpleasant verb, please post my comment,
just as I did in your case.


Thanks.